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Title: The Idolatry of Judeo-Christianity
Source: Rense.com
URL Source: http://www.rense.com/general76/hdun.htm
Published: May 19, 2007
Author: Patrick Grimm
Post Date: 2007-05-19 08:49:00 by Zoroaster
Keywords: None
Views: 232
Comments: 15

Zionist Watch: The Works and Musings of Patrick Grimm Welcome to Zionist Watch, a forum dedicated to keeping a critical and watchful eye focused on Zionists and their activities, both in America and abroad. This site will discuss Zionism, its agenda and its dangers to the entire world. Sometimes humorous, often irreverent, but always poignant, Zionist Watch is a place where the taboos of our controlled media are giddily discarded. Enjoy. ---- "In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

Thursday, May 17, 2007 The Idolatry of Judeo-Christianity

By Patrick Grimm

The death of the Reverend Jerry Falwell gives us a moment to contemplate that sinister movement within Protestant evangelicalism deemed "Zionist" and to reflect on the deconstruction it has wrought on true Christianity. Falwell, Hagee and other clerics have whole-heartedly supported this movement and given it both moral and financial backing. This is the sad reality of modern evangelical and fundamentalist thought, or in this case, lack of thought or genuine reflection.

But is Zionism and its backing by the Christian Right, both by leaders and laypersons, where it really begins? No, I would say that it is decidedly not where it begins. I think this skewering and obscuring of true biblical truth begins with a little event I have coined "the coming of Judeo-Christianity." What is Judeo-Christianity exactly? One internet blogger puts it best when he breaks down the tenets of this relatively new movement. Here is the first one. He states:

Here are some of the key characteristics of it:

God’s Chosen People. Judeo-Christians first and foremost acknowledge that God’s Chosen are not those who He has elected from the beginning of time to share eternity with him but are those who claim to be the blood descendants of the Hebrews – modern day Jews. Modern day Jews, be they Orthodox, Reformed, Liberal, or as Atheistic as Madeline Murray O’Hare, have Judeo-Christians wrapped around their fingers. Judeo-Christians think God will curse those who oppose followers of the Talmud; a book exclusively for Jewry which claims God’s Son is boiling in excrement. If ever a group has been characterized by members who have committed the unpardonable sin – blaspheming the Holy Ghost – it is Jewry. Yet Judeo-Christians not only do not oppose Jewry, they think they walk on water. They even take them as their primary identity – Judeo. Authentic Christianity acknowledges that God’s Chosen people are the Elect; those He has chosen to save from damnation by his sovereign, and to us mysterious, will, through the sacrifice of his son." [1]

Judeo-Christians have tied themselves to today's anti-Christ politically organized Jews. The fact that these Jews were labeled in the Bible as enemies of the Gospel, and the fact that their forebears were the very ones who beat and killed early Christians, is conveniently omitted from the historical purview of Judeo-Christians. Jerry Falwell, in his groveling before this united front of radical Jews, made sure never to condemn their founding of the homosexual movement, their disproportionate bad faith efforts in the abortion slaughter, or the fact that Jews operate most Communist front groups in this nation, including the American Civil Liberties Union (founded by one Gentile and four Jewish attorneys) and the Anti-Defamation League. But he opposed all of these movements at the same time that he paid the piper of Jewry, and was rewarded handsomely when he received a Lear jet from Israeli Jewish supremacist Likudite terror lord, Menachem Begin. [2] Talk about double-minded! The Bible states that "A double minded man is unstable in all his ways." [3] It is this double-mindedness, this scattered scope, this foolish inconsistency that has marked Christian Zionism and Judeo-Christian political jockeying for the last three decades.

Another writer details the mindset behind this kind of thinking when she states:

"It is long past time to examine the most basic and misunderstood premise that fires the huge religious sub-set that calls itself 'Judeo-Christianity.' Whether its celebrity Christian leaders admit it or not, the crux of Judeo-Christianity is the conscious practice, if not the stated belief, that eternal life, or spiritual salvation, is somehow attached to the worldwide political agenda known as Zionism. Into the Judeo-Christian's subconscious has been implanted the belief that 'the love for Israel and Jews worldwide characterizes all true Christians.' (See: A Letter from Sherry)

Some who hold this Judeo-Christian view of the Middle East think of themselves as 'dispensationalists' or as pre- or post-millennialists, but we simply use the expression Judeo-Christian, as we have throughout this series." [4]

This belief, this assertion by Judeo-Christianity that "the love for Israel and Jews worldwide characterizes all true Christians" is in a word, anathema to true faith. The first duty of all believers, Jerry Falwell and John Hagee notwithstanding, is to love Jesus Christ and do His will above all else. That historically has characterized all "true Christians." To bind ourselves to anything bigger than this is to miss the glorious message of the Gospel and the sacrifice on Golgotha. We should not love one group (Jews) disproportionately to the rest of humanity. We should be known for our love and charity, but as one Australian Christian states, and this is pertinent when applied to Jewish anti-Christian activism and chicanery "Love is not a carpet under which to sweep people's sin. Rather it is a light which can reveal sin and lead a sinner to God's love, mercy, and grace." [5]

Oh, how indulgent Falwell, Hagee, Robertson and all the rest have been toward the crimes of the Jews. Jerry, John and Pat are ever ready to keep mute and silent about Jewish wrongs, and what have they received from the Jewish community for their silence, their complicity and all the money they have poured into the Israeli apartheid state, which even now has driven most Palestinian Christians from their homes and destroyed their places of worship? [6] I dare say they have received little more than bones and thin gruel. They have also been portrayed as buffoons, haters and bigots by the Jewish media apparatus, in spite of the blessings they issue forth from the pulpit regarding Israel and its land grab. As Clare Boothe Luce reminded us "No good deed goes unpunished." [7]

But here is the biggest fallacy, the blundering "cognitive dissonance" that is Judeo-Christianity. The New Testament teaches Christians to "love God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind." [8] But this is the opposite of what today's Zionized Christian misleaders teach us. They literally tell their congregation that to speak ill of any Jew, any Jewish behavior or misbehavior, or to tell the truth about the dastardly deeds and sinfulness of the rogue state of Israel will bring an immediate curse from God. This is John Hagee's exact view and this is blasphemy. This is the elevation of one group, unbelieving and Christ-hating Jews, to a position of semi-worship by Gentile followers of Jesus. This is an elevation that is undeserved and actually works in opposition to the message of the Gospel. It also goes against common sense. No group, race, ethnicity or heritage is above criticism. Or at least that used to be the way America worked.

Judeo-Christianity is a strange cult, a curious alliance, exemplified in the names of queer-sounding (and I mean strange) political groups with names like the International Fellowship of Christians and Jews. On their website you can read the tribute paid to Jerry Falwell by a Christ-denying Jew, Rabbi Eckstein, who praises the reverend for his slavish support of Israel and for coming to speak at the rabbi's synagogue, a place of worship which holds to a Talmudic hatred of the Lord Jesus Christ. [9]

Their Jewish Talmud teaches that Jesus Christ is now being punished in hell in boiling semen for his sins, and will be for all eternity. Elizabeth Dilling, a Gentile scholar of Judaism, writes in her notes that the Talmud states that "Jesus 'committed bestiality,' 'corrupted the people,' is 'turned into hell.' [9] The Talmud is also clear that Jesus is "in hell where His punishment is 'boiling in hot semen.' [10] You can read more of Dilling's exegesis of the Jewish opinion of Christ here. [11] The point is, these are some of the people Falwell and the other Judeo-Christians broke bread with. It's a despicable reality of the unholy alliance between Christianity and Judaism/Zionism. The fact that Falwell encouraged this alliance is even more heartbreaking. To wish godspeed to the sick sycophants of Talmudic Jewry would have to be classified as a grievous sin, but one that Judeo-Christianity and its figureheads have engaged in with all the relish and abandon of a cheap street whore who loves her tawdry work.

On the occasion of Jerry Falwell's death, I would be remiss if I did not at least note that the renowned televangelist did take biblical positions on abortion, homosexuality, and the death and resurrection of Christ. Falwell also worked to provide a home and a free education for young girls who became pregnant and decided not to have an abortion. We can at least be gracious and give a little credit where credit is due. These are good Christian deeds, and Falwell should be commended for them.

But on the polarizing subject of the Gospel of Judeo-Christianity, Israel, Zionism and Jews, Falwell was wrong, dead wrong, and his contributions to this debate were malignant and harmful, though I believe that Falwell was as confused and deceived as millions of other Christians. I won't, however, give him a pass, because he was an educated man who was old enough to know better, but I won't demonize him either.

To shake ourselves loose from the noose constructed by the falsities of the thoroughly American ideology of Judeo-Christianity, we must first ask whose agenda this ideology serves. The answer to this query is patently obvious. It serves the Ecksteins, the Judeophiles, Israel, Likud and Zionist theocrats and Zionistic expansion. It surely doesn't serve Christ, the Gospel, the Church or American and Palestinian Christians. It only fattens the wallets of both Gentile and Jewish opportunists, providing an endless money supply to our Jewish enemies and the Elmer Gantry evangelists who dominate the sphere of religious broadcasting.

In a sane world, Judeo-Christianity would wither on the vine. But that is not the world we live in. Only with truth-telling and cold bulls-eye accuracy in our words can we break the power of the Big Lie that has seized hold of countless churches, ministers and parishoners. When Judeo-Christianity topples from its place of reverence in America, only then can we illuminate our people with the truth. When that truth finally takes hold, then the false idol of Jewish Supremacism will tumble from its place of prominence and all the idolators eyes will snap open at last. May it come sooner rather than later.

[1] http://fallenfreedom.blogspot.com/2006/06/what-is-this-thing-called-judeo.html [2] http://www.cmep.org/Alerts/2004March31.htm [3] James 1:8 King James Version [4] http://www.whtt.org/articles/010411pw.htm [5] http://members.datafast.net.au/sggram/f371.htm [6] http://www.davidduke.com/general/2121_2121.html#more-2121 [7] http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/quotes/c/clarebooth125511.html [8] Matthew 22:37 New American Standard Bible [9] (Talmud Sanhedrin 105a; Exhibit 106 and Exhibit 107) [10] (Talmud, Gittin 57a; Exhibit 202)

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#1. To: Red Jones (#0)

you were saying how Falwell and his ilk seem to have been promoted in order to give Christianity a bad name...

For the record, there was nothing Christ-like about Falwell.

http://freedom4um.com/cgi-bin/readart.cgi?ArtNum=52548&Disp

"Guard against the impostures of pretended patriotism." ~George Washington

robin  posted on  2007-05-19   12:01:12 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#2. To: Zoroaster (#0)

Absolutely spot-on article - thanks for the post.

Dr.Ron Paul for President

Lod  posted on  2007-05-19   12:53:55 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#3. To: robin (#1)

For the record, there was nothing Christ-like about Falwell.

Organized religion is a business.

Cynicom  posted on  2007-05-19   13:09:25 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#4. To: Zoroaster (#0)

[…] or to tell the truth about the dastardly deeds and sinfulness of the rogue state of Israel will bring an immediate curse from God. This is John Hagee's exact view and this is blasphemy.

John Hagee. There are times I wish I was back in the Wild West, where charlatans like Hagee would be properly and publicly tarred and feathered, carried out of town on a rail, and then left out in the desert to die.

karelian  posted on  2007-05-19   16:14:30 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#5. To: Zoroaster (#0)

There is a hell-of-a-lot more secular zionists than christian zionists.

Secular zionists are victim cult ideologues, also known as Holocaust believers. Secular zionists are chicken-hawks that regularly spout trash-talk about the dire need for "social justice" and "compassionate conservative" laws that are necessarily enforced by an all-powerful central government.

It is not christian zionists that have control of the US government. The US government is controlled by SECULAR zionists.

Secular zionists are the vast majority of voters in the US.

The finger-pointing by secular zionists at christian zionists is a ridiculous case of the pot calling the kettle black.

The christian zionist at least takes some responsibility for current mideast wars, wars that are designed, not coincidentally, to impose an american-style victim-cult political infrastructure onto foreign nations hostile to the US or Israel.

All christian zionists, and most gentile secular zionists, are useful idiots that worship jewish culture, a culture that includes secular (victim cult) and religious (bible mythology) aspects.

Googolplex  posted on  2007-05-19   18:06:40 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#6. To: robin (#1) (Edited)

For the record, there was nothing Christ-like about Falwell.

There isn't much 'Christ-like' about most 'professing' Christians. :-(

Remember...G-d saved more animals than people on the ark. www.siameserescue.org

who knows what evil  posted on  2007-05-19   18:11:58 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#7. To: Zoroaster (#0)

In a sane world, Judeo-Christianity would wither on the vine. But that is not the world we live in. Only with truth-telling and cold bulls-eye accuracy in our words can we break the power of the Big Lie that has seized hold of countless churches, ministers and parishoners. When Judeo-Christianity topples from its place of reverence in America, only then can we illuminate our people with the truth. When that truth finally takes hold, then the false idol of Jewish Supremacism will tumble from its place of prominence and all the idolators eyes will snap open at last. May it come sooner rather than later.

great article!...Thanks....worth printing and passing out at the local Christian Zionist houses of idolatry.

http://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/Eze/Eze017.html#9

http://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/Gal/Gal005.html#1

http://www.blueletterbible.org/tsk_b/Gal/5/1.html

AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt  posted on  2007-05-19   18:27:41 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#8. To: who knows what evil (#6)

But most of us recognize and acknowledge our failings, we don't celebrate them on national television.

"Guard against the impostures of pretended patriotism." ~George Washington

robin  posted on  2007-05-19   18:29:56 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#9. To: Zoroaster (#0)

The very idea of “Judeo-Christianity” is a fallacy concocted right after WW II to foster unity between American Christians and Jews, after couple of million Jews were killed by European Christians. The Germans did most of the work, while the French gave a Gallic shrug, and the Scandinavians said ho-hum, who gives a shit.

As a historical fact, to a lot of Judaic theologians (Rabbis, I guess) the whole notion of “Judeo-Christian” anything was absurd. Look it up!

Few of you will jump up and proclaim “Jesus was a Jew” to which I’ll retort “Luther was a catholic.” – and so it goes.

karelian  posted on  2007-05-19   18:44:52 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#10. To: karelian (#9)

http://www.godlikeprod uctions.com/bbs/message.php? messageid=388071&mpage=1&showdate=5/19/07&forum=1 WHY JUEDO-CHRISTIANS SUPPORT WAR Solve et Coagula User ID: 238886 5/19/2007 3:46 AM Report abusive post WHY JUDEO-CHRISTIANS SUPPORT WAR Quote

WHY JUDEO-CHRISTIANS SUPPORT WAR C. E. Carlson

The French author, Alexis de Tocqueville, wrote Democracy in America when he traveled here in the first third of the 19th Century. In ringing tones he sang the praises of America's invulnerable strength and spirit. He attributed its greatness to its citizens' sense of morality... even with the abundant church attendances he observed in America. De Tocqueville wrote in French and is credited with this familiar quote: AMERICA IS GREAT BECAUSE SHE IS GOOD, AND IF AMERICA EVER CEASES TO BE GOOD, SHE WILL CEASE TO BE GREAT.

De Tocqueville could see the power of America, but he could not have known in 1830 that she was soon to be under an attack aimed at its churches and the very sense of morality that he extolled.

First, there was a War Between the States, which scarred the powerful young nation in its strapping youth. A worse attack on America was to commence near the turn of the 20th century. This was the onset of an attack on American Christianity that continues unabated against the traditional, Christ-following church. This attack, which author Gordon Ginn calls "The final Apostasy," began with a small very wealthy and determined European political movement. It had a dream, and the American churches stood in its way.

The World Zionist movement, as its Jewish founders called themselves, had plans to acquire a homeland for all Jews worldwide, even though most were far from homeless, and many did not want another home. Not any land would do. World Zionists wanted a specific property that American Christians called "the Holy Land." But if these Zionists read "Democracy in America" or any of the journals of any of America's churches, which no doubt they did, they could not help but know that Jerusalem was not theirs to have. As self-proclaimed Jews, they were, according to the Christian New Testament, the persecutors of Christ and most of his early followers, and the engineers of his crucifixion. America's traditional churches in the 19th Century would never stand for a Jewish occupation of Jesus' homeland.

World Zionist leaders initiated a program to change America and its religious orientation. One of the tools used to accomplish this goal was an obscure and malleable Civil War veteran named Cyrus I. Schofield. A much larger tool was a venerable, world respected European book publisher--The Oxford University Press.

The scheme was to alter the Christian view of Zionism by creating and promoting a pro-Zionist subculture within Christianity. Scofield's role was to re-write the King James Version of the Bible by inserting Zionist-friendly notes in the margins, between verses and chapters, and on the bottoms of the pages. The Oxford University Press used Scofield, a pastor by then, as the Editor, probably because it needed such as man for a front. The revised bible was called the Scofield Reference Bible, and with limitless advertising and promotion, it became a best-selling "bible" in America and has remained so for 90 years.

The Scofield Reference Bible was not to be just another translation, subverting minor passages a little at a time. No, Scofield produced a revolutionary book that radically changed the context of the King James Version. It was designed to create a subculture around a new worship icon, the modern State of Israel, a state that did not yet exist, but which was already on the drawing boards of the committed, well-funded authors of World Zionism.

Scofield's support came from a movement that took root around the turn of the century, supposedly motivated by disillusionment over what it considered the stagnation of the mainline American churches. Some of these "reformers" were later to serve on Scofield's Editorial Committee.

Scofield imitated a chain of past heretics and rapturists, most of whose credibility fizzled over their faulty end times prophesies. His mentor was one John Nelson Darby from Scotland, who was associated with the Plymouth Brethren and who made no less than six evangelical trips to the US selling what is today called "Darbyism." It is from Darby that Scofield is thought to have learned his Christian Zionist theology, which he later planted in the footnotes of the Scofield Reference Bible. It is possible that Scofield's interest in Darbyism was shared by Oxford University Press, for Darby was known to Oxford University. A History of The Plymouth Brethern By William Blair Neatby, M.A.

The Oxford University Press owned "The Scofield Reference Bible" from the beginning, as indicated by its copyright, and Scofield stated he received handsome royalties from Oxford. Oxford's advertisers and promoters succeeded in making Scofield's bible, with its Christian Zionist footnotes, a standard for interpreting scripture in Judeo-Christian churches, seminaries, and Bible study groups. It has been published in at least four editions since its introduction in 1908 and remains one of the largest selling Bibles ever.

The Scofield Reference Bible and its several clones is all but worshiped in the ranks of celebrity Christians, beginning with the first media icon, evangelist Billy Graham. Of particular importance to the Zionist penetration of American Christian churches has been the fast growth of national bible study organizations, such as Bible Study Fellowship and Precept Ministries. These draw millions of students from not only evangelical fundamentalist churches, but also from Catholic and mainline Protestant churches and non-church contacts. These invariably teach forms of "dispensationalism," which draw their theory, to various degrees, from the notes in the Oxford Bible.

Among more traditional churches that encourage, and in some cases recommend, the use of the Scofield Reference Bible is the huge Southern Baptist Convention of America, whose capture is World Zionism's crowning achievement. Our report on Southern Baptist Zionism, entitled "The Cause of the Conflict: Fixing Blame.

Scofield, whose work is largely believed to be the product of Darby and others, wisely chose not to change the text of the King James Edition. Instead, he added hundreds of easy-to-read footnotes at the bottom of about half of the pages, and as the Old English grammar of the KJE becomes increasingly difficult for progressive generations of readers, students become increasingly dependent on the modern language footnotes.

Scofield's notes weave parts of the Old and New Testaments together as though all were written at the same time by the same people. This is a favorite device of modern dispensationalists who essentially weigh all scripture against the unspoken and preposterous theory that the older it is, the more authoritative. In many cases the Oxford references prove to be puzzling rabbit trails leading nowhere, simply diversions. Scofield's borrowed ideas were later popularized under the labels and definitions that have evolved into common usage today-- "pre-millennialism," "dispensationalism," "Judeo-Christianity," and most recently the highly political movement openly called "Christian Zionism."

Thanks to the work of a few dedicated researchers, much of the questionable personal history of Cyrus I. Scofield is available. It reveals he was not a Bible scholar as one might expect, but a political animal with the charm and talent for self-promotion of a Bill Clinton. Scofield's background reveals a criminal history, a deserted wife, a wrecked family, and a penchant for self- serving lies. He was exactly the sort of man the World Zionists might hire to bend Christian thought--a controllable man and one capable of carrying the secret to his grave. (See The Incredible Scofield and His Book by Joseph M. Canfield).

Other researchers have examined Scofield's eschatology and exposed his original work as apostate and heretic to traditional Christian views. Among these is a massive work by Stephen Sizer entitled Christian Zionism, Its History, Theology and Politics, Christ Church Vicarage, Virginia Water, GU25 4LD, England

We Hold These Truths is grateful to these dedicated researchers. Our own examination of the Oxford Bible has gone in another direction, focusing not on what Scofield wrote, but on some of the many additions and deletions The Oxford University Press has continued to make to Scofield Reference Bible since his death in 1921. These alterations have further radicalized the Scofield Bible into a manual for the Christian worship of the State of Israel beyond what Schofield would have dreamed of. This un-Christian anti-Arab theology has permitted the theft of Palestine and 54 years of death and destruction against the Palestinians, with hardly a complaint from the Judeo-Christian mass media evangelists or most other American church leaders. We thank God for the exceptions.

It is no exaggeration to say that the 1967 Oxford 4th Edition deifies--makes a God of--the State of Israel, a state that did not even exist when Scofield wrote the original footnotes in 1908. This writer believes that, had it not been for misguided anti-Arab race hatred promoted by Christian Zionist leaders in America, neither the Gulf War nor the Israeli war against the Palestinians would have occurred, and a million or more people who have perished would be alive today.

What proof does WHTT have to incriminate World Zionism in a scheme to control Christianity? For proof we offer the words themselves that were planted in the 1967 Edition, 20 years after the State of Israel was created in 1947, and 46 years after Scofield's death. The words tell us that those who control the Oxford Press recreated a bible to misguide Christians and sell flaming Zionism in the churches of America.

There is little reason to believe that Scofield knew or cared much about the Zionist movement, but at some point, he became involved in a close and secret relationship with Samuel Untermeyer, a New York lawyer whose firm still exists today and one of the wealthiest and most powerful World Zionists in America. Untermeyer controlled the unbreakable thread that connected him with Scofield. They shared a password and a common watering hole--and it appears that Untermeyer may have been the one who provided the money that Scofield himself lacked. Scofield's success as an international bible editor without portfolio and his lavish living in Europe could only have been accomplished with financial aid and international influence.

Continue to read: [link to http://christianparty.net] total time

Life is a tragedy to those who feel, and a comedy to those who think.

Zoroaster  posted on  2007-05-20   6:45:47 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#11. To: karelian, Zoroaster (#9)

As a historical fact, to a lot of Judaic theologians (Rabbis, I guess) the whole notion of “Judeo-Christian” anything was absurd. Look it up!

Few of you will jump up and proclaim “Jesus was a Jew” to which I’ll retort “Luther was a catholic.” – and so it goes.

I agree with what you say, but it is another myth that 'Jesus was a Jew'. Here is the last half of an article by Dr. Lorraine Day, 'Who is Israel? Who is the church?' BOTH parts are important to understand:

"....Jews and Gentiles: What do the terms mean?

Let's stop right here and discuss the terms "Jew" and "Gentile." I'm sure you will be astonished to learn that NEITHER of these terms EVER appears in the Bible, in the original Scriptures. These are actually propaganda words placed there by the translators to support their own preconceived theological ideas.

Let me give you the documentation for this statement.

The word "JEW" NEVER appears in the Original Scriptures

The word "Jew."

Look in a Concordance, Strong's Concordance is a popular, commonly used one. The word "Jew" (#2453 in the Greek) is actually short for the word Judean, or more accurately Ioudas, pronounced ee-oo-dah-yos. The letter "J" is not present in the New Testament Greek alphabet. The English alphabet had no "J" prior to the 14th century, and it wasn't predominantly used until the 17th century.

Since the word "Jew" is an English concoction that did not exist at the time of the writing of the New Testament, we know that it actually is the word "Judean."

The King James Bible in 1611, for example, used the word Iudea, not our present "Judea", and it was pronounced you-dee-a.

So the word "Jew" is short for the word "Judean", meaning a resident of a particular area - Judea, the southern part of Canaan, later known as Palestine. Jerusalem was in Judea, and the temple was in Jerusalem. The word "Jew" did NOT mean an ethnic background.

The English word Jew evolved phonetically from the prefix 'Iou, from the Greek word 'Ioudas which means Judean.

Judea is the same as Judah, and Judah was the tribe of Israel that inhabited that geographical area when the twelve tribes conquered the inhabitants of Canaan about 1400 B.C. The Tribe of Judah was the largest of the twelve and the most influential. God said that the Messiah would come through that Tribe.

The word "Judean" (later shortened to "Jew) MEANS - those who had knowledge of the God of heaven.

[my note: Did the 'Jews' know God? speaking to the Scribes and Pharisees: Jhn 8:19 Then said they unto him, Where is thy Father? Jesus answered, Ye neither know me, nor my Father: if ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also. http://www.blueletterbible.org/tsk_b/Jhn/8/19.html ]

In addition, study of the Scriptures, particularly the Old Testament, makes it clear that the designation "Judean" or "Ioudas" refers to those who had a knowledge of the God of heaven, as opposed to those who had NO knowledge of the God of heaven or those who worshiped pagan gods, referred to as the "Nations."

The word "Gentiles."

Now look up the word "Nations" in the Greek (#1484) and the Hebrew (#1471). Now look up the word "Gentiles." You will see that the numbers are identical to the word "Nations" both in the Greek (#1484) and in the Hebrew (#1471).

This shows that the Bible translators used the word "Gentiles" at their own arbitrary discretion, when it would have a theological or sociological impact, rather than using the word "Nations" in every instance, as unbiased translation would dictate. There is NO instance in the Bible, where the word "Gentiles" is appropriate. The word should ALWAYS be "Nations."

The Hebrew word (#1471) translated "Nations" or sometimes "Gentiles", is the word "goy" or "goyim", a present-day derogatory term used by Jews to describe non-Jews, and means a troop of lowly animals, such as cattle, or a heathen people.

Isa 37:12 "Have the gods of the nations delivered them..."

Ps 96:5 "For all the gods of the nations are idols..."

Isa 9:1 "...Galilee of the nations."

Again: The Scriptural meanings of the two terms are the following:

Judeans (mistranslated "Jews" in the Bible): Those who were aware of, or who worshiped, the God of heaven. (Even though often they had wandered far from the God of heaven they were supposed to know.)

Nations (mistranslated "Gentiles" in the Bible): Those who did NOT know, nor worship, the God of heaven, but instead worshiped pagan idols.

Neither term was a designation of ethnicity or blood line. Both terms were defined in relation to their religion - their worship which, in general, correlated with their geographical location.

The center of the worship of the God of heaven in the entire inhabited world, was Jerusalem which was in the region of Judea. Everywhere else was referred to as "the Nations."

"There were no nations until after the flood. God did not "select" Israel and Judah (and the Pharisees) because of their superiority to other nations, God "created" them for one purpose, to be His bondslaves, so that through that nation all the other nations should come to know Him. The idea that Israel was a magnificently developed type of nation is a mistaken one. Israel was a despised, and a despisable nation, continually turning away from God into idolatry." Complete works of Oswald Chambers; Discovery House Publishers pg 1317

Was Jesus a Jew?

Jesus was born in Bethlehem of Judea, so He was a Judean by birth location (NOT a "Jew" by genetics), but he lived his life in Nazareth, in "Galilee of the Nations (Gentiles)" so He was a Nazarene. Isa 9:1

Jesus was a child of the Holy Spirit (Luke 1:34,35). He had no lineage from His stepfather, Joseph. Yes, His earthly parents, both His earthly mother and His earthly father, were from the line of David. David was an Israelite, He lived in Israel in the area of Judah, but did that make him "Jewish" genetically?

The prophecy of Jesus' lineage through His earthly parents was given so those who were searching the Scriptures and watching for the Messiah would be able to identify Him appropriately when He came. Even then, the greatest scholars and the wisest in the synagogues STILL did NOT recognize the Messiah.

Many claim that Jesus had to have had genes from His mother, Mary, or He wouldn't have been able to fulfill the prediction of the Scriptures - - to be "tempted in all points like as we are, yet without sin." (Heb 4:15) Yet Adam and Eve were created by God, with no genes from an earthly mother or father, and they were not only "susceptible" to sin - - - they ACTUALLY sinned!

So Jesus did NOT have to have earthly genes in order to be susceptible to sin. But when He was tempted, He overcame!

There is an additional compelling reason why Jesus had NO earthly genes from either of His earthly parents, including NO genes from His earthly mother, Mary. He could NOT have had ANY of Mary's human genes, because if He had, it would have been a case of the creature (a human being - Mary) CREATING the CREATOR (God in the human form of Jesus), it would be a case of humanity CREATING God! That could NOT be! Jesus had NO genes from a human parent. He was "born of the Holy Spirit." Matt 1:18

Jesus was placed in Mary's womb to grow in her body, to symbolize Jesus coming from "outside" of us, from "outside" of this world to come into us and become One with us. Jesus came into this world to become One with humanity, to live in us.

"Christ in you, the hope of glory!" Col 1:27

"Let this mind be in you which is in Christ Jesus." Phil 2:5

Paul said, "I died, yet I live, but not I, but Christ lives in me." Gal 2:20

Is Salvation "OF the Jews?"

Is "Salvation of the Jews" as the King James Bible translates John 4:22? The prepositions in the Greek are far more specific. The Greek word used here is "Ek" (#1537) which means "origin."

Since Jesus was born in Judea and since He identifies Himself as the "Saviour of ALL mankind" (1 Tim 4:10), the phrase should be translated, **** "Salvation is OUT OF Judea." (John 4:22) Salvation is found ONLY in Jesus, Who was born (came OUT OF) Judea!

It's ALL ABOUT JESUS - NOT about Israel or the "Jews!"

Look at Matt 2:6 "And thus Bethlehem, in the land of Judah, art not the least among the princes of Judah; for OUT OF ("Ek" #1537) thee shall come a Governor, that shall rule my people Israel."

Micah 5:2 "And thou, Bethlehem, house of Ephratha, art few in number to be reckoned among the thousands of Judah; yet OUT OF ("Ek" #1537) thee shall one come forth to me, to be a ruler of Israel; and His goings forth were from the beginning, even from eternity." (From the Greek O.T.)

Heb 7:14 "For it is manifest that OUT OF ("Ek" #1537) Judah has sprung our Lord..."

Jesus NEVER identified Himself as a Jew

In fact, He was ALWAYS at odds with Jewry.

Jesus was taunted, baited and hated by the Jewish Rabbis because. He taught a TOTALLY DIFFERENT religion from what the Pharisees and Rabbis taught. Christ's message was the ANTITHESIS of that day's Jewish religion.

Jesus NEVER identified Himself with the "Jews." He always referred to them as separate from Him.

John 7:1 "After these things Jesus walked in Galilee; for He would not walk in Jewry (Judea), because the Jews sought to kill Him."

Luke 11:47, 48 "Woe unto you! for you build the sepulchres of the prophets, and YOUR fathers killed them."

John 6:58 "I am the Bread which came down from heaven; YOUR fathers ate manna and are dead."

John 8:56 "YOUR father Abraham rejoiced to see My day; and he saw it and was glad."

Mk 7:9 "And He said unto them, Full well, you reject the commandment of God, that you may keep YOUR OWN tradition."

Matt: 15:3, 6 "Why do you also transgress the commandment of God by YOUR tradition?...."Thus you have made the commandment of God of none effect by YOUR traditions."

The designation "Judean" (shortened in the King James Version to "Jew), was NOT a genetic designation, it was a religious and cultural designation. Jesus was the ANTITHESIS of EVERYTHING Judean or "Jewish!"

Jesus was definitely NOT a Jew!

Galilee was an Ethnic "Melting Pot"

The area of Galilee had been conquered by foreign invaders twice and each time the majority of the population were killed or taken prisoner to the conqueror's homeland. The area was then repopulated with people transported in from the conquering nation.

The first conqueror was Assyria, which came against the Northern Kingdom of Israel in 722 B.C. Samaria was captured and its people exiled, bringing the northern Kingdom to an end. The area was then repopulated with people from the conquering Kingdom.

2 Kings 17:5,6,17,18 "Then the king of Assyria came up throughout all the land, and went up to Samaria, and besieged it three years. In the ninth year of Hosea, the king of Assyria took Samaria, and carried Israel away into Assyria, and placed them in Halah and in Habor by the river of Gozan, and in the cities of the Medes...

The Lord was "provoked to anger because Israel "caused their sons and their daughters to pass through the fire, and used divination and enchantments... Therefore the Lord was very angry with Israel, and removed them out of His sight; there was NONE left but the tribe of Judah ONLY."

2 Kings 17:24 "And the king of Assyria brought men from Babylon, and from Cuthah, and from Ava, and from Hamath, and from Sepharvaim, and placed them in the cities of Samaria instead of the children of Israel: and they possessed Samaria, and dwelt in the cities thereof."

The second time was by Nebuchadnezzar, King of Babylon, in 586 B.C.,when Daniel and his three friends were taken into captivity along with thousands of others. The area of Israel was ravished and became almost a wasteland.

2 Kings 24:1,2,14,15 "In his days, Nebuchadnezzar, king of Babylon came up, and Jehoiakim became his servant three years; then he turned and rebelled against him. And the Lord sent against him (Jehoiakim) bands of the Syrians, and bands of the Moabites, and bands of the children of Ammon, and sent them against Judah to destroy it, according to the Word of the Lord, which he spake by his servants the prophets.

"And he carried away ALL Jerusalem, and all the princes, and all the mighty men of valour, even ten thousand captives, and all the craftsmen and smiths; none remained, save the poorest sort of the people of the land."

2 Kings 25:11 "Now the rest of the people that were left in the city, and the fugitives that fell away to the king of Babylon, with the remnant of the multitude, did Nebuzaradan, the captain of the guard, carry away."

So Judah, as well as Galilee, had been repopulated with non-Jews.

In addition, we are told repeatedly in the Bible that when the Israelites came into the land of Canaan, they inter-married with the Canaanites, rebelling against the Lord's directions not to do that.

Also, Rahab, the (NON-Jew) Canaanite prostitute, was an ancestor of Jesus. Rahab was Boaz' mother. (Matt 1:5) Boaz married Ruth and they were the grandparents of Jesse, the father of King David, through whose line Jesus came. (Rahab was King David's great grandmother! Rahab was NOT "Jewish!")

One more thing, when the Israelites initially left Egypt, when they were an infant nation, they were already a MIXED MULTITUDE! Ex 12:38 says, "And the children of Israel journeyed from Rameses to Succoth, about six hundred thousand on foot that were men, beside children. And a MIXED MULTITUDE went up also with them;..."

It's abundantly clear that there was no ethnically pure "Jewish" heritage in Israel hundreds of years BEFORE Jesus was born, much less when He arrived. Even MORE so today, with all the intermarrying, there is really no such thing as a "Jew" by heredity, only by social culture.

This is dramatically confirmed by Arthur Koestler, a "Jew", in his amazing book, The Thirteenth Tribe. Koestler reveals that approximately 80% of all the "Jews" in the world today, the Ashkenazim "Jews", are really Khazars, originating from Khazaria, an area that later became Russia. The vast majority of "Jews" in the world today, have NO semitic blood in them. They are "Gentiles", if you will.

In his book, Koestler "traces the history of the ancient Khazar Empire, a major but almost forgotten power in Eastern Europe, which in the Dark Ages became converted to Judaism. Khazaria, which flourished from the seventh to the eleventh century, was finally wiped out by the forces of Genghis Khan, but evidence indicates that the Khazars themselves migrated to Poland and formed the cradle of Western Jewry. . ."

"The Khazars found themselves in a precarious position between the two major world powers: the Eastern Roman Empire in Byzantium and the triumphant followers of Mohammed. As Mr. Koestler points out, the Khazars were the Third World of their day, and they chose a surprising method of resisting both the Western pressure to become Christian and the Eastern to adopt Islam. Rejecting both, they converted to Judaism. . . The story of the Khazar Empire, as it slowly emerges from the past, begins to look like the most cruel hoax which history has ever perpetrated. Alas, "anti-Semitism" can no longer be "anti-Semitism" if the "victims" are NOT "Semitic" - - - if the "Jews" are NOT "Jewish"!

Under his chapter heading RACE AND MYTH, author Koestler states: "The Jews of our times fall into two main divisions: Sephardim and Ashkenazim. The Sephardim are descendants of the Jews who since antiquity had lived in Spain (in Hebrew Sepharad) until they were expelled at the end of the fifteenth century and settled in the countries bordering on the Mediterranean, the Balkans, and to a lesser extent in Western Europe. They spoke a Spanish-Hebrew dialect, Ladino, and preserved their own traditions and religious rites. In the 1960s, the number of Sephardim was estimated at 5000,000.

"The Ashkenazim, at the same period, numbered about eleven million. Thus, in common parlance, Jew is practically synonymous with Ashkenazi Jew....Summing up a very old and bitter controversy in a laconic paragraph, Raphael Patai wrote:2

"The findings of physical anthropology show that, contrary to popular view, there is no Jewish race. Anthropometric measurements of Jewish groups in many parts of the world indicate that they differ greatly from one another with respect to all the important physical characteristics - stature, weight, skin color, cephalic index, facial index, blood groups, etc."

According to Koestler, a "Jew" himself, as well as other "Jewish" authors, there is no such thing as a Jewish race. There is no such thing as a Jewish ethnicity. There IS a Jewish culture - a way they look at the world, a way they treat others who they consider Non-Jews, a way they raise their children to think of themselves, a way of doing business - a Jewish culture, but NOT a Jewish race.

There is NO evidence that any "Jews" can trace their ancestry to Abraham.

Blessing Abraham's "Heirs"

Christians base their support of the present-day State of Israel and the present-day "Jews" on Genesis 12:1-3,

"Now the Lord had said unto Abram, Get thee out of thy country, and from they kindred, and from thy father's house, unto a land that I will show thee:

"And I will make of thee a great nation, and I will bless thee, and make thy name great; and thou shalt be a blessing:

"And I will bless them that bless thee, and curse him that curseth thee: and in thee shall all families of the earth be blessed." (Not just "Jewish" families).

This is interpreted by many Christians to mean that God will bless those who bless the Jews and curse those who curse the Jews. Nothing could be further from the truth. We have just shown that Abraham's "seed" are those who follow Christ! The Jews, in general, and the Jewish religion HATE Christ!

First of all, the present day "Jews" CANNOT trace their ancestry to Abraham as has just been shown.

In addition, the Bible clearly states that being the "offspring of Abraham" is based on spiritual, NOT physical, factors.

In Romans 2:17,25,26,28,29,, Paul points out that someone who is "called a Jew" because he is a physical descendant of Abraham, and yet who lives as a breaker of God's law, "is NOT a Jew."

Romans 9:7 "Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall by seed be called." Abraham had two sons. The first, Ishmael, was born after the flesh. He was a son of "unbelief." Abraham didn't believe that God could give a son to his wife, Sarah, and himself in their very old age.

The second son was Isaac, who was born when Abraham had faith in God's promise (Gen 16:1-3, 15; 21:1-3; Rom 4:18-21) In Galatians 4:22-31, Paul reveals that Ishmael represents unbelieving Jews, while Isaac represents both Jews and Non-Jews who have faith!

In Romans 9:8, Paul concludes by saying, "That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are NOT the children of God; but the children of the promise ARE COUNTED for the seed."

But Galatians 3:16 says: "Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He does not say, 'And to seeds, as of many, but as of ONE,' And to your Seed,' who is Christ."

Again Paul says in Galatians 3:29 "And if you are Christ's, then YOU ARE Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise."

So CLEARLY what God is talking about when He says, "I will bless them that bless thee, and curse him that curseth thee" are the TRUE FOLLOWERS OF CHRIST, those who have an intimate relationship with Jesus - THESE are the "True Children of Abraham!" NOT the residents of present-day Israel - - who hate Jesus!

Another text often quoted is Matt 25:40 where Jesus says, "And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me," claiming that Jesus is referring to His "Jewish" brethren.

Jesus is GOD. God is NOT Jewish. Jesus wasn't, and isn't, Jewish. Here Jesus, as a human being, is speaking of His brothers (and sisters) of the human race. Paul, considered to be a Jew of ALL Jews, writes to the "Gentiles" in the books of Romans, Corinthinians, Galatians, Ephesians, Colossians and the other epistles, and over 100 times refers to them as his "brethren." That DOESN'T mean they were "Jewish." They were his brethren in Christ.

Jesus explains this plainly in Matt 12:46-50: "While He talked to the people, behold, His mother and His brethren stood without, desiring to speak with Him.

"Then one said unto Him, Behold, thy mother and thy brethren stand without, desiring to speak with thee.

"But He answered and said unto him that told him, 'Who is my mother? and who are my brethren?

'And he stretched forth his hand toward his disciples, and said, 'Behold my mother an my brethren!

"For whosoever shall do the will of My Father which is in heaven, the SAME is My brother, and sister, and mother."

The present-day State of Israel is populated by a group of people who are NOT the descendants of Abraham and have NO right to the area of Palestine based on Bible promises nor any factor, other than their indiscriminate use of military force.

I have found no such evidence regarding the Arab population, including the Palestinians. It appears that they may well be able to trace their lineage back to Ishmael and thus to Abraham, Ishmael's father, who was a descendant of Shem, Noah's son. A descendant of Shem is a Shemite or semite.

They (the Palestinians) then are the TRUE semites - and ANY words or actions against THEM (the Palestinians), must be considered Anti-semitism! It would follow then that the State of Israel and the "Jews" around the world are guilty of the most intense and abhorent anti-semitism against the Palestinians.

Who was the FIRST Jew?

If there is a Jewish race, with "Jewish genes", then WHO was the first "Jew"?

Abraham is often called the "father of the Jewish race," but Abraham was NOT a Jew! He was a Chaldean, from Ur of the Chaldees in the area of Babylon. So was Abraham's wife, Sarah.

Abraham was a "Hebrew" which is NOT synonymous with the word "Jew." The word "Hebrew" means "to pass or to cross over." Abraham "crossed over" the River Euphrates to get to the land of Canaan, but in doing so, his genes DID NOT change into "Jewish genes." Abraham was NOT Jewish! He was a Chaldean, from the area of Babylon!

Abraham had two sons, Ishmael and Isaac but neither one could have "Jewish genes" since neither Abraham nor the mothers of the two sons were "Jewish."

Isacc's sons were Jacob and Esau - and NEITHER one was "Jewish." If they were, then when did their "genes" suddenly become Jewish?

Esau became the father of the Edomites - they were definitely NOT Jewish!

Jacob and his sons went down into Egypt, then came out in the Exodus to the wilderness and on to Canaan, 40 years later. But their genes didn't change into Jewish genes along the way.

In fact, the group that came out of Egypt, the Israelites, were called, in the Bible, a MIXED MULTITUDE, meaning that there were others in the group BESIDES the offspring of Jacob.

Then when the Israelites reached the Land of Caanan they intermarried, against God's explicit command, with the pagans who were NON-Israelites, . Obviously, THAT didn't suddenly make them "Jewish."

SO - - - who was the FIRST Jew?

And HOW did ANYONE ever become "Jewish" genetically?

CONCLUSION: There is NO SUCH THING as a Jewish race! There is only a Jewish culture, the culture of the Talmud!

THE PRESENT-DAY"JUDAIZING" OF THE CHRISTIAN CHURCH

Over the recent years, there has been a progressive "Judaizing" of the Christian church with claims made that Christianity originated out of Judaism and that Christians owe their religion to the Jews - not only their religion, but their Messiah, Jesus Christ, who, it is claimed, was (is?) Jewish.

We have already addressed the issue of Jesus' ethnic background. Jesus is God! God is NOT Jewish! Jesus wasn't, nor is He now, "Jewish."

As for the question of the origin of the Christian church, Christianity is the absolute antithesis of Judaism. Judaism is Talmudism, the Talmud being the written-down traditions of the Pharisees, the VERY THING Jesus constantly denounced. (Mark 7:6-8) Everything Jesus taught was diametrically opposed to what was taught by the Pharisees, Rabbis and scribes. That's why they were constantly plotting to kill Jesus.

So Christianity did not originate from Judaism. Christianity was a CLEAN BREAK from EVERYTHING Judaism stood for. Christianity owes NOTHING of its beginnings to Judaism.

***** There is NO SUCH THING as "Judeo-Christian" anything! Judaism and Christianity are ABSOLUTE OPPOSITES!

God doesn't play favorites. He is "the Saviour of ALL mankind." (l Tim 4:10) He came to "seek and to save that which was lost" (Luke 19:10) which means EVERYONE, since everyone is lost at one time or another, irrespective of their ethnic or cultural background.

Paul writes that "there is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female; for you are ALL ONE in Christ Jesus." Gal 3:28

God loves EVERYBODY the same!

IN CONCLUSION:

1) The "Israel" of the New Testament is composed of the TRUE FOLLOWERS of Christ. It is NOT the literal Israel in Palestine.

2) There is no such thing as a "Jew" in the New Testament. The word is Judean and refers to those, of whatever nationality, who worship the God of heaven, most of whom in Bible times lived in the area of Judea.

3) The word "Gentiles" does NOT appear in the original Scriptures. It is a mistranslation of the word "Nations" meaning those who do not worship the God of heaven.

4) The modern word "Jew" is not a racial or ethnic designation. It refers to a culture or religion.

5) Jesus was (is) NOT a "Jew." Jesus is God! God is NOT Jewish!

6) The promise to Abraham, "And I will bless them that bless thee and curse him that curseth thee" does NOT apply to the Jews! It applies to blessing or cursing the TRUE followers of Christ - the "seed of Abraham." (Rom 2:17-29, 9:8)

7) The majority, if not all of, the "Jews" in the world today are NOT semitic, nor can they trace their ancestry to Abraham. They are "Gentile" Khazars, so they have no right to the area of Palestine based on ANY Biblical promises!

8) There is NO such thing as a Jewish race, ONLY a Jewish culture - the culture of the Talmud.

9) Christianity does NOT have its roots in Judaism. Christianity was in Christ's time, and is today, the ANTITHESIS of Judaism!

This study reveals the following:

1) In the Old Testament, a man named Jacob is given a SPIRITUAL name, "Israel."

2) The HEIRS of Israel (Jacob) are ALSO called "Israel." And the "heirs" of Israel along with others become the NATION of Israel.

3) The Nation of Israel is called several names by God, including

a) My son, My firstborn

b) a "vine"

c) a "servant"

d) the "seed of Abraham"

e) "My son" that God "brought out of Egypt."

4) In the New Testament, a Divine Man, Christ, is given a SPIRITUAL name, "Israel."

5) The "HEIRS" (Children - followers) of Christ are ALSO called "Israel."

6) Christ is called by God:

a) My Son

b) a "vine"

c) a "servant"

d) the "seed of Abraham"

e) "My Son: that God "brought out of Egypt."

Christ SUCCEEDS everywhere that Israel Failed.

Christ and His HEIRS (Children - followers) are NOW the SPIRITUAL Israel, REPLACING the literal Israel of the Old Testament!

1 Coverpiece of: The Thirteenth Tribe, by Arthur Koestler, Random House, N.Y., 1976

2 Enc. Brit. (1973), Vol XII, p. 1054

For more information on this subject, read:

Exploding the Israel Deception, by Steve Wohlberg, published by Amazing Discoveries, 7051 McCart Ave, Fort Worth, Texas 76133.

Israel: Our Duty Our Dilemma, by Theodore Winston Pike, published by Big Sky Press, P.O. Box 203, Oregon City, OR 97045

The Other Israel, (a video). A National Prayer Network Productions, P.O. Box 203 Oregon City, OR 97045

The Lion Out of Judah, by Gordon Ginn, Ph.D., published by Smyrna Publications, P.O. Box 493101, Redding CA 96049

Strong Delusion, by Gordon Ginn, Ph.D., published by Smyrna Publications, P.O. Box 493101, Redding, CA 96049

© Lorraine Day, M.D. 2006. All Rights Reserved.

http://www.goodnewsaboutgod.com/studies/israel2.htm

AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt  posted on  2007-05-20   13:40:20 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#12. To: Zoroaster (#11)

p.s....this morning I just heard one of the biggest churches around DC, populated I am sure, with some of the biggest names in ZOG, put out the apostate view that the church is not Israel, is not a nation, has no civil role, and that God still has a 'chosen people', and that is why the nation of 'Israel' has been created in the Middle East. The battle is heating up.

Mat 21:43 Therefore say I unto you, The kingdom of God shall be taken from you, and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof.

http://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/Mat/Mat021.html#43

http://www.blueletterbible.org/tsk_b/Mat/21/43.html

===============================================================

Gal 3:29 — And if ye [be] Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

Rom 9:6 Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they [are] not all Israel, which are of Israel:

Rom 9:7 Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, [are they] all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called.

Rom 9:8 That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these [are] not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.

http://www.blueletterbible.org/tsk_b/Gal/3/29.html

1Pe 2:9 But ye [are] a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light:

Rev 5:9 And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;

Rev 5:10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.

http://www.blueletterbible.org/tsk_b/Rev/5/10.html

AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt  posted on  2007-05-20   14:11:26 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#13. To: Zoroaster (#10)

Thank you for a very interesting reply. As a retired engineer I can probably dazzle the bejeezus out of the average layman with esoteric airspace lingo, but only as an expert witness.

However, in a typical debate on religious matters I am out to sea. I have never mastered, or even tried to master American Religious Shortspeak, where whatever hypothesis you might offer, immediately elicits a pithy, biblical sounding adage, followed by a name and couple of numerals. That, to me stifles the conversation. Your reply blessedly was devoid of such minutiae.

I took the time this Sunday, as usual, not to go to church, so I’ll take the time to study the document referenced.

karelian  posted on  2007-05-20   15:34:18 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#14. To: AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt (#12)

FYI - here's a nice link I found.

http://www.knoxseminary.org/Prospective/Faculty/WittenbergDoor/index.html

Galatians 3:29 And if ye [be] Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

Red Jones  posted on  2007-05-25   10:15:15 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#15. To: Zoroaster and others (#10)

The Scofield Reference Bible was not to be just another translation, subverting minor passages a little at a time. No, Scofield produced a revolutionary book that radically changed the context of the King James Version. It was designed to create a subculture around a new worship icon, the modern State of Israel, a state that did not yet exist, but which was already on the drawing boards of the committed, well-funded authors of World Zionism.

One Oliver B. Green (C 1950/60's) quoted often from the Scofield Bible. If I am correct, I think most of the Baptist churches used/use this version as well. In more recent times they have gone to the NIV which is just as bad. John MacArthur's NKJV is good if you can discern the false innuendoes and doctrine in the commentaries, but until we have a better choice, my choice is the KJV.

lostball  posted on  2007-07-23   23:32:30 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


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