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Title: No jobs for US citizens without Homeland Security approval
Source: Press Esc
URL Source: http://pressesc.com/01180202266_eevs
Published: May 27, 2007
Author: IFP Canada
Post Date: 2007-05-27 14:42:23 by Zipporah
Keywords: None
Views: 2818
Comments: 124

No jobs for US citizens without Homeland Security approval

Submitted by Canada IFP on Sat, 2007-05-26 18:00. | |

US citizens who apply for a job will need prior approval from Department of Homeland Security under the terms immigration bill passed by the Senate this week.

American Civil Liberties Union pointed out that the DHS's Employment Eligibility Verification System (EEVS) is error plagued and if the department makes a mistake in determining work eligibility, there will be virtually no way to challenge the error or recover lost wages due to the bill’s prohibitions on judicial review.

Even current employees will need to obtain eligibility approval from the DHS Within 60 days of the Immigration Reform Act of 2006 becoming law.

"EEVS would be a financial and bureaucratic nightmare for both businesses and workers," said Timothy Sparapani, ACLU Legislative Counsel. "Under this already flawed program no one would be able to work in the U.S. without DHS approval - creating a ‘No Work List’ similar to the government’s ‘No Fly List.’ We need immigration reform, but not at this cost."

The act allocates US$400 million for the implementation of the EEVS, but the Congressional Budgeting Office estimates the system to cost in excess of a billion dollars.

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#84. To: Tauzero (#81)

Knowledge is not free,

You got that right, Taz. Now go read 82 and 83, and tell me what else is new on this green earth.

The Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.

richard9151  posted on  2007-05-30   11:01:42 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#85. To: richard9151 (#83)

anscetral (Mexican) lands (in the USA)

Hmmm...still no answer to my #79? I'm not surprised....

Jethro Tull  posted on  2007-05-30   11:23:37 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#86. To: richard9151 (#83) (Edited)

My wife is a teacher in Mèxico, Jethro, of ... MATHMATICS!! Get that? And, she is very good at it. In fact, she is one of the very few people I have met in my life that is as quick with numbers as I am. My nephew just graduated from the University. One of my nieces just graduated as an engineer about three years ago. One of my sisters-in-laws is a teacher, as are two of my brothers- in-laws. HERE IS A SHOCKER FOR YOU, JETHRO! THEY HAVE LOTS AND LOTS OF SCHOOLS IN MÈXICO!!

HEY PONCHO. I WOULDN'T BRAG ABOUT YOUR CONNECTION TO THE MEXICAN SCHOOL SYSTEM :)

MEXICO'S EDUCATION SYSTEM RANKS LAST AMONG MEMBERS OF ORGANIZATION FOR ECONOMIC COOPERATION AND DEVELOPMENT.

From: SourceMex Economic News & Analysis on Mexico

 | Date: September 22, 2004

 | More results for: mexico's school system

Mexico continues to lag behind other semi-industrialized and industrialized nations in the quality of its education, a factor that some analysts say has contributed to the country's stunted economic development.

In a report published in mid-September, the Organization for Economic Cooperation and Development (OECD) ranked Mexico's educational system last among 28 member countries in the quality of education.

All OECD countries except Mexico made advances in improving their educational systems between 1995 and 2003. The report noted that South Korea, a country that had rankings similar to Mexico a generation ago, has vaulted to the top because of the reforms to education implemented in that country. South Korea has been able to develop a highly skilled work force, which produces some of the world's most popular cars and electronics. In contrast, Mexico's work force is made up largely of assembly workers and other manual laborers.

The report acknowledged that Mexico has boosted educational expenditures since 1995 by 36% at the primary and secondary levels and by 22% for higher education. Even with these increases, the amount spent by the Mexican government for each student has declined by 10%. The OECD said the Mexican government spends about US$1,357 per student at the primary level, roughly one- fourth of the average expenditure for all OECD members for the same purpose.

"If Mexico uses itself as a point of reference, then educational expenditures have indeed increased since 1995," said Andreas Schleicher, who heads the OECD's education-monitoring division. "At the international level, the picture is radically different."

About 97% of the new money spent by the government on education since 1995 has been devoted to increasing teacher salaries, a testament to the strength of Mexico's teachers union (Sindicato Nacional de Trabajadores de la Educacion, SNTE).

While experts agree that improving the quality and the number of teachers is a crucial element of education, the government has failed to take other actions that would enhance education, such as constructing new schools and improving infrastructure, curriculum development, and student retention.

"The trend in Mexico's education expenditures is not typical of the other OECD member countries," said the report.

Expenditures low on infrastructure, student retention

The lack of expenditures on infrastructure is also affecting the quality of public education. Some communities do not have enough school buildings to accommodate the number of students who want an education, forcing local educational authorities to use split schedules. This limits the day at public elementary schools to four hours, compared with six or more hours at private institutions.

In some rural and inner- city communities, students have to attend school in crumbling buildings that often lack basic plumbing and leak during heavy rains.

In many cases, public-school students have to pay extra fees to cover the cost of paper, pencils, and other supplies. To cover the cost of paper, one school in Mexico state was charging students 4 pesos (US$0.35) to take a monthly exam.

President Vicente Fox's administration has sought to address the problem partially by expanding an anti-poverty program that pays some parents every month they keep their children in school. But this only benefits a handful of families, since many do not meet the poverty qualifications for participation in the program.

The Mexican government on occasion receives grants or loans from multilateral organizations to improve education. In July of this year, the World Bank approved a US$300 million loan to support Mexico's basic-education- development program, which provides extra support to education for disadvantaged groups, such as children living in rural or marginal urban areas, and handicapped, migrant, and indigenous children. The loan is the third and final phase of the Basic Education Development Program, which the World Bank has been supporting in Mexico since its inception in 1991.

Mexican students fare poorly in aptitude tests

One measure of Mexico's progress--or lack of progress--in education is the aptitude levels of students. In a standardized global evaluation test called the Program for International Student Assessment (PISA), Mexican ninth graders placed 34th among the 41 nations participating in the exam and last among the 28 OECD member nations. The same OECD study ranked Mexico last among member countries on the reading ability of 15-year-old youths. Only 6.9% of Mexican students surveyed had a high reading ability, compared with the median of 31.2% for the OECD members.

The poor ranking in education has been an embarrassment for Mexico, which is attempting to portray itself as an emerging industrialized country. The reality is that Mexican education still displays patterns of many lesser-developed countries, such as a high dropout rate at the primary level, particularly in rural areas. About 10% of students drop out of the educational system before completing middle school to take an unskilled job to help support their families.

"There is a bottleneck in the system," Eduardo Velez Bustillo, education section manager for Latin America for the World Bank, told the Los Angeles Times. "Quality is bad at every level, but middle school is a crisis point because that's where the demand is highest."

Mexico's poor educational results have brought an outcry from the business community. It is urging President Fox's government to overhaul the entire system, which offers students little more than basic skills like reading, writing, and arithmetic. Business leaders say Mexico is still unable to compete with better-trained work forces in other countries and has to settle for low-skilled assembly jobs.

On average, Mexicans attain only a seventh-grade education, and just two of every 10 students receive a college education.

"A country without education is a country that won't develop, and our system is even worse than people say," said Isaac Katz, an economics professor at the Instituto Tecnologico Autonomo de Mexico (ITAM). "No one is responsible for quality, results aren't measured, and parents have no voice."

Poor educational system hurts Mexico's competitive position

Some analysts worry that the lack of an educated work force in the long run will keep Mexico from attracting the type of high-value foreign investment that the economy needs. "I see a significant deterioration in competitiveness in Mexico's future," said Eduardo Andere, a professor of international studies at the ITAM. "In social terms, that means more poverty, more insecurity, and more inequality."

Despite the pleas from experts and business leaders, the Fox government has failed to produce any innovative plans for education and has proposed meager increases in expenditures for primary and secondary education in 2005. In its budget proposal for 2005, the Fox government requested about 300.6 billion pesos (US$26.3 billion) for primary and secondary education, an increase of only 1.1% from the amount approved in the 2004 budget.

"Once again, the executive branch fails to comply with a mandate from Congress to increase resources for education, with the goal of eventually reaching funding equivalent to 8% of GDP in 2006," said a statement from the education committee (Comision de Educacion) in the Chamber of Deputies.

Furthermore, the committee criticized the Fox government for proposing to channel some of the increased expenditures in education to "unnecessary bureaucratic costs," such as a higher budget for public relations for the Secretaria de Educacion Publica (SEP).

The full Chamber of Deputies is expected to consider an increase in funding for education, but even the legislative branch may not be able to boost federal allocations by the 87 billion pesos (US$7.6 billion) needed this year to comply with the goals established by Congress to meet the target of 8% of GDP. Education funding will be competing with other social programs, even though Mexico continues to enjoy a windfall from higher-than- expected oil-export revenues. Those additional revenues have been earmarked for allocation to state governments and payments of the domestic and foreign debt.

Responding to the criticisms, Public Education Secretary Reyes Tamez Guerra said the Fox government is not in a position to meet the congressional goals unless the Chamber of Deputies and the Senate approve comprehensive tax reforms to allow the government to increase revenues. He said the lack of revenues also blocked Mexico from matching the expenditures of other developing countries like South Korea, Chile, Poland, and Hungary.

"We have to continue efforts to boost investment [in education]," said Tamez Guerra. "But we will not be able to catch up to the other countries as long as our GDP remains stagnant and as long as we lack structural reforms to allow us to boost revenues."

Expenditures also lag for higher education

The debate about funding levels also extends to higher education, where Mexico devotes less than half the average funding levels for OECD countries. OECD statistics show the government's funding for public higher education amounts to about US$4,000 per student, compared with the average of US$10,000 for OECD countries. This is despite the heavily subsidized college tuition at the Universidad Nacional Autonoma de Mexico (UNAM) and other public universities. A government effort to raise tuition and fees slightly in 1999 was met with a massive demonstration (see SourceMex, 1999-06-02 and 2000-01-26).

In its 2005 budget plan, the Fox government has proposed minor reductions in expenditures for higher education. The plan would reduce funding to public colleges and universities to the equivalent of 0.48% of GDP, compared with about 0.50% of GDP in 2004. Expenditures for research in science and technology, which are separate from the higher-education budget, would decline to 0.35% of GDP, compared with 0.38% of GDP last year.

"I cannot remain silent when the government each year reduces rather than increases the budgets for research and development and science and technology," UNAM rector Juan Ramon de la Fuente said during a meeting with Tamez Guerra and Public Health Secretary Julio Frenk Mora.

The UNAM rector has received the support of the Instituto Politecnio Nacional (IPN) and the Asociacion Nacional de Universidades e Instituciones de Educacion Superior (ANUIES). ANUIES president Jorge Luis Ibarra Mendivil said the government has to increase expenditures for higher education by about 55 billion pesos (US$4.8 billion) this year to meet the needs of colleges and universities.

"The federal budget lacks resources to expand enrollment or to improve the quality of education," said Ibarra Mendivil. "The lack of funding also affects our strategy to implement structural changes to pensions and retirements [for university employees]," he added. [Note: Peso-dollar conversions in this article are based on the Interbank rate in effect on Sept. 22, reported at 11.40 pesos per US$1.00] (Sources: The Dallas Morning News, 11/19/02; Reforma, 09/17/03; The Washington Post, 11/24/03; World Bank press release, 07/01/04; El Financiero, Agencia de noticias Proceso, 09/14/04, 09/21/04; Notimex, Los Angeles Times, 09/21/04; La Jornada, 09/15/04, 09/22/04; El Universal, 09/15/04, 09/21/04, 09/22/04; La Cronica de Hoy, 09/22/04)

Jethro Tull  posted on  2007-05-30   11:40:15 ET  (1 image) Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#87. To: richard9151 (#84)

IT WILL BE EASY TO CLOSE OUR BORDERS TO THOSE MEX HORDES.

Yes it will be, if that's what we want, and we are willing to accept the consequences.

The people of Mèxico, hard as you find it to believe, are just people who want to eat, and live, and make little babies,

Of course they are.

they are not your enemy.

They can prove that by leaving. Nothing less will suffice. But it's really beside the point. Mexicans ruin areas for white Americans not because they want to, but because of who they are.

AND EVERY OTHER CAPITAL CITY UNDER THE CONTROL OF THE NEW WORLD ORDER.

But of course.

I admire the steps that Mèxico takes that ensure that anyone entering into Mèxico and planning to stay has a means of supporting themselves. Very intelligent.

Indeed. I also approve of their use of the military in this regard ( except for the rapes and robbery.) I disapprove of the aid the Mexican government gives to Mexicans who want to move north.

But hey, it is just a Mèxican plot, right?

A confluence of interests, rather.

HERE IS A SHOCKER FOR YOU, JETHRO! THEY HAVE LOTS AND LOTS OF SCHOOLS IN MÈXICO!!

Which can only do a small amount of good, in light of the lower average IQ of Mexicans, shorter time preference, and higher impulsiveness. Mexico is not poor and backwards because of corruption and false leadership. Mexico is poor, backwards, and corrupt because of Mexicans.

The same is true of America's ills. But they are our ills.

Don't waste your pucker on some all-thing sucker.

Tauzero  posted on  2007-05-30   11:42:00 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#88. To: robin (#70)

I'm glad to hear it, but the same is not true anywhere near the border.

It is on THIS side of the border, Robin (with the exception of New Larado). Has to be or the tourism would dry up. Also, I should have mentioned that there are nearly 8,000 Americans that live here, some permenently, and some part time. But, in addition to that, we have hundreds and thousands of visitors on a regular basis, and many, many of those are blonde and blue-eyed women. In the ten years that I have been here, there has not been a serious problem for the Americans here; no one killed, and only a couple of robberies, and those were of rooms and cars, not hold-ups of people.

Mexico City That is an entirely different story; 22 million people living cheek by jowl; not a pretty site, and not a pretty city. With some of the worst air of any city in the world.

suggested that a single woman would probably not like Mexico. Yeah, I read it and I answered it and I agreed. IF that single woman was looking for a Mèxican husband. There are large numbers of single white women down here, but they do not mix with the Mèxicans; just with the gringos (from quite a number of different countries).

And day of the week, Robin, there are dozens to hundreds of Americans and others walking around in the town, shopping, drinking, using the beaches, eating, and all without problems. Most of them drive here (about 98%), again without problems. And on the big weekends, that number swells to well past 15,000 to as high as 25,000. All rooms booked and every beach covered with campers. I do not think that would continue if there were any serious problems, Robin, so once again I would suggest that you pay a lot less attention to the major media in the US, and stop listening to the lies.

The Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.

richard9151  posted on  2007-05-31   2:55:19 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#89. To: Jethro Tull (#86)

"The trend in Mexico's education expenditures is not typical of the other OECD member countries," said the report.

This is true. Education in Mèxico concentrates on the basics, and does not include the indoctrination demanded and used in Europe and the US (as has been posted on 4um in at least 4 different posts). The schools are not baby sitters, and the schools do not interfere with the families as they do in the US. And there is a lot of pressure coming from the US to change this and begin true indoctrination, as I am sure you are in favor of, Jethro.

People who wish, such as ourselves, to have the children go to higher education centers, have to pay for it, as is proper. I once again salute México.

The Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.

richard9151  posted on  2007-05-31   3:03:10 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#90. To: Tauzero (#87)

They can prove that by leaving.

And why would they leave when your pols are paying them to stay?

Which can only do a small amount of good, in light of the lower average IQ of Mexicans, shorter time preference, and higher impulsiveness. Mexico is not poor and backwards because of corruption and false leadership. Mexico is poor, backwards, and corrupt because of Mexicans.

Don't read much do you, Taz. Trillion dollar enconomy; 26th largest in the world, which puts it above several eastern European (white) nations and a whole host of others. Amazing, when you admit to having no personel experience, that you can come to such stupid conclusions. Lower IQ indeed. Compared to what? And don't tell me Americans, cause I got a lot of different opinions about that! Uh, based on personel experience and observations, by the way. And to prove it, all I have to look at is the last 30 elections in the US.

disapprove of the aid the Mexican government gives to Mexicans who want to move north. Please do not make stupid statements. I live here, and I watch the poor ride the rails, sitting on top of the railroad cars until they can get near to the border. I see them, with shabby backpacks, panhandle for food in the bario, including at my home, and walking along the highway, heading north. So sit in your chair, watch the TV, but stop with the stupidity.

I also approve of their use of the military in this regard And what, pray tell, would that be? I mean, I only live here, so fill me in? There are only 8,000 or so Americans here on a regular basis, and on any given weekend, another 1,000 to 2,500 cars with up to another 5,000 plus people will DRIVE here, so, please, bring me up to speed on all of this military BS cause I am dying to know! The only place we see the Mèxican military down here is in the treaty mandated drug check points set up BELOW the free zone, and between the various states, such as between Baja California and Sonora. But hey, I just live here, so please, fill me in.

The Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.

richard9151  posted on  2007-05-31   3:18:22 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#91. To: Tauzero, Jethro Tull, christine, robin, all (#87)

Indeed. I also approve of their use of the military in this regard

I was going to leave this alone.... I really was, but what the hey!

I find it amusing, actually, that any United States citizen would dare to speak ill of the military of any other nation. Really, I do!

How many nations has the United States invaded in the last 60 years, Taz? (30 elections, get it?) And compared to that, how many nations has the military of Mèxico invaded?

How many nations does the United States occupy with troops today, Taz? And, of course, how many nations have Mèxican troops in them?

Over the last 60 years, how many rapes, murders and robberies have been committed by United States troops world-wide, Taz? I mean, Mai Lai and Aba Garib are now household words AROUND THE WORLD, so what would you think? 10,000? Nah. Way more! 40,000? Ummm, probably more..... Maybe 100,000... ummmm? And probably many, many more than that if we can believe the info that has been written about Viet Nam and now Iraq, in dozens of books, can be believed. And, I might add, that I certainly do believe it.

And who are those troops, Taz? Mèxicans? Ummm, nope. They come from some other so-called third world nation? Nope (well, maybe a few with the new citizen-shit bait being used for `volunteers'). No, I would think that about 99.9% of them, esp. those that cause the problems, are good ole Americans. Yep. Pretty sure that is the case.

But this is where I really enjoy your rantings! in light of the lower average IQ of Mexicans,

Let us just look at this a little bit, shall we?

90% of all Mèxicans live debt free. AND, most Mèxicans DO NOT have bank accounts. Now you probably believe both of those things are really, really weird, Taz, which goes to show who has the higher IQ; you, or the average Mèxican.

EVERY drug store in Mèxico carries natural cures and herbs, Taz. and they sell a lot of it, to the Mèxicans. All they sell to the gringos who come here is more and more drugs. Ummmmmm, wonder who is smarter.......

The Mèxican government DOES NOT permit legal, lic. marriages in the churches in Mèxico. And, the people here understand that if they did, that would be a subversion of the churches and a denial of separation of church and state. And, it would permit the federal government of Mèxico to interfere in the families much more than they do now. In the states, where you live, Taz, NO ONE will get married without that state issued lic., which, of course, gives the states rights to the children under the terms of the marriage contract by and between the husband, wife, and the state. Now, care to tell me who is smarter, you and the average Aemrican, or the average Mèxican?

The average Mèxican DOES NOT pay an income tax here. Why? Because they do not AND WILL NOT enter into contracts with the federal government of Mèxico. Most Mèxicans, without even knowing that Social Security comes from England, will not sign up for a number. Now, who is smarter, the average Mèxican, or the average American?

Now, I could continue this for quite some time, but why? I do not believe that you are smart enough to understand how propaganda is used to keep your attention on manufactured problems, and off of what is really going on, so why bother? Oh, and Taz, you can take this to the bank; my IQ has been poked, prodded and measured 4 different times, and I will guarentee that I am smarter than you. And, I have a lot more experience with Mèxicans, with law research, and with Americans and what they believe, think and do than the average joe, and the average Mèxican is more aware of what is actually going on in the world, where most of the problems originate that have bothered Mèxico and the world for the last 100 years (the United States, if you are wondering), and about what is important in their lives, which is their families, than does the average American. By a very wide margin.

But hey, I just speak the lingo and live here, so what do I know, right?

The Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.

richard9151  posted on  2007-05-31   12:32:57 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#92. To: richard9151 (#91)

And compared to that, how many nations has the military of Mèxico invaded?

could that be because they're not an empire, but instead a poor nation whose military cannot afford such? there's no doubt, and no one is disagreeing with you on this, the US government and its puppetmasters is ruthless.

christine  posted on  2007-05-31   12:39:20 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#93. To: richard9151 (#89)

The Mexican educational system is not only of poor quality but it is also a subsidiary of the transnationals. This despite your spin.

Four Mexican Universities Benefit from $283 Million CAD/CAM/CAE System Donation.

From: PR Newswire | Date: August 13, 2001

MEXICO CITY, Mexico, Aug. 13 /PRNewswire/

Mexican President Vincente Fox was among the top dignitaries and industry executives gathered today at the GM de Mexico headquarters in Mexico City to celebrate the over $283 million donation of CAD/CAM/CAE equipment to four Mexican universities by General Motors Corp., UGS, Sun Microsystems and EDS.

This corporate alliance initiative, titled Partners for the Advancement of CAD/CAM/CAE Education (PACE), was formed in 1999 to help provide future engineers from key institutions the education and experience desired by each of the partnering corporations.

The $283,604,618 PACE donation was disbursed between four universities: the Instituto Tecnologico Autonomo de Mexico (ITAM), $32,005,014; Universidad Iberoamericana (UIA), $31,780,514; Instituto Tecnologico y de Estudios Superiores de Monterrey - Campus Estado de Mexico (ITESM-Estado de Mexico), $116,646,040; and the Instituto Tecnologico y de Estudios Superiores de Monterrey - Campus Monterrey (ITESM-Monterrey), $103,173,050.

Jethro Tull  posted on  2007-05-31   12:49:38 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#94. To: christine (#92)

could that be because they're not an empire, but instead a poor nation whose military cannot afford such?

Christine, I already posted the info on the Mèxican enconomy; trillion dollars last year, and 26th largest in the world.

The difference, Christine, is that the Mèxican government is prevented from taxing here by their Constitution, unlike in the United States. That has put a very tight limit on how much money the Mèxican government can borrow from the banksters in the US, and, a very strict limit on how much military they can afford.

The Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.

richard9151  posted on  2007-05-31   12:56:55 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#95. To: richard9151, Speedy Gonzalez, ALL (#89)

This is true. Education in Mèxico concentrates on the basics, and does not include the indoctrination demanded and used in Europe and the US - Richard9151

Richard, you say Mexican schools concentrate on basics. If true, please explain how Mexico ranked 34th in science and reading and 35th in math, from a pool of 43 nations. Are the students dopey, or are the teachers unqualified? Perhaps a mix of the two??

EDUCATION: DESPITE HEAVY FUNDING, MEXICO'S SCHOOLS GET LOW MARKS

From: Inter Press Service English News Wire

 | Date: October 7, 2004

 | Author: Diego Cevallos

 | More results for: mexico's school system


Inter Press Service English News Wire

10-07-2004

MEXICO CITY, Oct. 7, 2004 (IPS/GIN) -- The 33-student class
taught by Alejandra Avendaño, a Mexican schoolteacher, includes
children from four different grade levels, who are not benefiting
from the experience.

Although Mexico spends more on education as a proportion of
gross domestic product (GDP) than the average of the industrialised
nations grouped in the Organisation for Economic Cooperation and
Development (OECD), Avendaño's school cannot afford to hire another
teacher or purchase new teaching materials.

"If we had more funding for teachers and materials, the children
would be better educated, but this is what we are given by the
authorities," complains Avendaño, 38, who teaches at a
"multi-grade" school in a rural area of the state of Mexico, near
the capital.

Last year, Mexico earmarked 5.9 percent of GDP to education,
0.03 percent more than the average spent on education by the 30
OECD member states. One out of four of Mexico's primary schools are
multi-grade, where educators simultaneously teach students of
different levels.

"If there are more funds for education, as the government
claims, why don't they provide us with another teacher and new
materials," quips Avendaño.

OECD studies indicate that Mexico spends 93.6 percent of its
educational budget on administration and bureaucracy, a proportion
almost 13 percent higher than the average in the OECD,
of which
Mexico is the only Latin American member.

In absolute terms, Mexico spends an annual average of 1,357
dollars on every primary school student, a quarter of the OECD
average, and 4,341 dollars on each higher education student, half
of the OECD average.

The conservative government of Vicente Fox, which inherited an
educational system that had already made great strides in
quantitative terms, maintains that it is working hard to make
spending on education more efficient and improve the performance
of students, one of the big challenges it faces today.

Nevertheless, the budget for 2005 that parliament is to pass
before the end of the year indicates no significant changes aimed
at cutting spending on bureaucracy and improving educational
standards.

The Institutional Revolutionary Party (PRI), which governed
Mexico from 1929 to 2000, used to boast of its achievements in the
area of education. Yet it was reluctant to admit that the expansion
of coverage was not accompanied by improvements in the quality of
teaching.

While the party was in power, Mexico's illiteracy rate plunged
from 70 to 10 percent, and the average years of formal education
climbed to the second year of high school.

However, little was known about the quality of teaching until
studies began to reveal in 2000 that Mexico was actually earning
a failing grade.

The last PRI administration, the government of Ernesto Zedillo
(1994-2000), hushed up the low score Mexico had earned in an
assessment carried out in 40 countries by the International
Association for the Evaluation of Educational Achievement.
In the 1995 study, Mexican students in the third and fourth
years of primary school and the first and second years of secondary
school ranked lowest in math and science.

One of the most recent studies was carried out last year in 43
countries by the OECD and the United Nations Educational,
Scientific and Cultural Organisation (UNESCO), measuring the
academic performance of 15-year-olds.

The Mexican students ranked 34th in science and reading and 35th
in math.
Although Mexico performed better than the other Latin
American countries studied, it hardly earned a passing grade,
according to Andreas Schleicher, director of the Indicators and
="

" achieve="achieve" analysis="Analysis" directorate="Directorate" division="Division" education.

="Education.

" for="for" if="if" in neglecting what is most important in education -- the students, in
particular the youngest ones", says Alejandra Avendaño.
Experts on education say children studying in multi-grade
schools, such as the one in which Avendaño works, perform poorly
in reading comprehension and solving mathematical problems, since
they do not receive enough attention from their teachers.
In Mexico, a country of 102 million, about 30 million children
and adolescents attend school, half of them at primary level. They
are taught by 1.5 million teachers, most of them members of trade
unions, who earn an average of 12,000 dollars a year.

The trade unions have close ties with the PRI, as do labour
organisations in other sectors, which helped the party stay in
power in the past.

Fox, the first non-PRI president in seven decades, preferred to
get on well with the teachers' unions and not confront their
leaders who, according to dissident groups of teachers, are
corrupt.

Jethro Tull  posted on  2007-05-31   13:06:27 ET  (1 image) Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#96. To: Jethro Tull (#93)

Mexican President Vincente Fox

It is really, really too bad, Jethro, that you have so little understanding of basic facts. For instance, do you suppose that this so-called 'gift' of money comes without strings? Kind of like how the Rockefellers gifted 100s of millions of dollars to the univercities in the US? Too bad you do not read and study a little, instead of getting all of your info from the tele.

As to Vincente Fox, he was president of Mèxico for one reason, and one reason only; his proposed new program for Mèxico included massive new taxes that the PRI political party, in power in Mèxico for more than 70 years, WOULD NEVER permit. BUT, Fox has a plan.

What was that plan, Jethro? Do you know? I mean, you know everything, right? So, what was the plan?

What, give up? OK. Here it is in a nutshell; Fox's plan was to REBATE the new taxes to the poorest people in Mèxico. That was how he was going to sell the plan. BUT, to do this, all of the poor had to come into federal government offices AND SIGN UP FOR THE REBATES!

That means, Jethro, that the people of Mèxico had to do what they had always refused to do; enter into contracts with the federal government in order to get their benefits.... Now, Jethro, does that sound a little familiar to you, like, you know, what you all do in the states?

And within in a generation, Mèxico would have been just like the states, drowning in new taxes.... as I have posted before, Jethro, ACCUMLATIVE TAXES IN THE US NOW EXCEED 85%; and this is according to the budget report to Congress by the president of the United States, not my guessing.

Oh, and guess what, Jethro? Fox could not do it; his plan fell flat and the people, and their representatives, shot all of the new taxes down.

The Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.

richard9151  posted on  2007-05-31   13:07:35 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#97. To: Jethro Tull (#95)

"If we had more funding for teachers and materials, the children would be better educated, but this is what we are given by the authorities," complains Avendaño, 38, who teaches at a "multi-grade" school in a rural area of the state of Mexico, near the capital.

As has been posted on 4um before, Jethro, more spending on education DOES NOT mean better education. It means more centralized control and more indoctrination of students, and not much more.

Of course, I understand that you know much more about it than I do. Of course, my wife, the math teacher, just had one of her students win first place in math for the State of Sonora, and will shortly being going with the student to the national competition. But hey, what do I know.

What I do know is that there are problems in education in Mèxico, but those are small problems compared to what is going on in the states in the schools. And, as I have mentioned, this has been posted on 4um numerous times; the problems in US schools.

The Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.

richard9151  posted on  2007-05-31   13:13:08 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#98. To: richard9151, christine, The numerous Peso bailouts by American taxpayers (#94)

The Mexican economy. How many times has America bailed out the Peso? I'm thinking three....

Mexican bailout preserves slavery. (Legal Research International Chief Financial Officer Christopher Whalen)(includes related articles on Mexican debt and economic conditions, North American Free Trade Agreement, and Canadian economic policy)(Picking Up the Pieces of the Peso)(Interview)  
Canadian Dimension; Apr 1, 1995; Mokhiber, Russell Whalen, Christopher Moody, Kim Sale, Tim; 4,078 Words ... billion in Mexican dollar reserves ... once risky Mexican stocks and ... devaluation of the peso. By seeking ... goods, the Mexican economy is ... collapse of the peso in Mexico ... devaluation of the peso turn to LRI ... that the Mexican model was ... kept the peso pegged ...
In the peso we trust? (disagreement in Washington, D.C., over the proposed bailout of the rapidly-falling Mexican peso) (Editorial)  
The Nation; Feb 6, 1995; 237 Words The aftershocks from the tumble of the Mexican peso are finally hitting Washington, reopening ... of a whatever it takes $40 billion bailout package, supported by the Fed and the ... Leach--who is secretly drafting the bailout legislation--and Senator Bob Dole, may ... largesse. Add the right to organize ...
Mexican Peso Falls Amid Predictions of U.S. Bailout Defeat  
The Washington Post; Jan 31, 1995; Tod Robberson; 876 Words ... market index plunged, and the peso's value fell to an all-time ... Congress. The beleaguered peso dropped at least 9 percent ... are his qualifications," a Mexican official said, apparently referring ... continue keeping their holdings in peso-denominated bonds or prefer ... nervous all the way around," a ...
Mexican Sugar Bailout Could Cost Up To 30 Billion Pesos: Government.  
Internet Securities; Sep 5, 2001; 142 Words ... will be doled out to creditors and investors. Grupo Azucero Mexicano (BMV:GAM) and Consorcio Azucarero Escorpion (Caze) announced ... Euromoney Institutional Investor Company. SUBJECT CODE: Ag News Provided by COMTEX (
>http://www.comtexnews.com)
Contract with Mexico. (bailout after devalued peso) (Editorial)  
National Review; Feb 6, 1995; 604 Words ... Republican Mexican bailout. The Mexicans' devaluation of the peso was a disaster ... rate of the Mexican monetary base ... S.-taxpayer bailout of up to $40 ... oppose this bailout. Whatever tough-soundi ... persuade the Mexican authorities ... economy, the Mexican ...
Peso strengthens after $20bn bailout  
The Independent - London; Feb 22, 1995; phil Davison in Miami; 527 Words ... rescue package for the Mexican economy, the first stage ... 50bn international bailout. The peso strengthened in anticipation ... for the beleaguered Mexican President, Ernesto Zedillo ... Guillermo Ortiz, the Mexican Finance Minister, signed ... signing, the leading Mexican daily El ...
Adventures in the zone of twilight: separation of powers and national economic security in the Mexican bailout.  
Yale Law Journal; Mar 1, 1996; Covey, Russell Dean; 19,931 Words ... and covert bailouts. The Mexican bailout, in Block ... an overt bailout because it ... 968. Covert bailouts, in contrast ... prop up the peso would have ... of covert bailout. (6.) In ... large-scale public bailouts. Only one ... rescue of the Mexican economy ... and loan ...
On the Trail Of the Elusive Peso Bailout // Saga Could Be Embarrassing  
Chicago Sun-Times; Mar 16, 1995; ROBERT NOVAK; 697 Words ... administration to set off the Mexican fiasco but do amount to a paper ... the Dec. 20 devaluation of the peso, senior Treasury officials were tracking the Mexican currency on a nearly daily basis ... devaluation that set off the Mexican agony. There are signs they were misled by their Mexican ...
A retrospective on the Mexican bailout.  
The Cato Journal; Jan 1, 2002; Vasquez, Ian; 2,577 Words ... collapsing peso, led to a ... crisis. The bailout, moreover ... ordinary Mexicans, and they ... collapse of the Mexican peso approached ... forthcoming IMF bailout. The Mexican economy ... legacy of the Mexican bailout. (1) See ... the 1994- 95 peso crisis, see ...
The fall of the peso and the Mexican "miracle." (includes related articles)(NAFTA Disaster)(Cover Story)  
Multinational Monitor; Apr 1, 1995; Wheat, Andrew; 4,417 Words ... make good on Mexican government ... is not a bailout of the Mexican peso or the Mexican economy. It is a bailout of U.S. banks ... short-term Mexican debt, including ... billion of peso-denominated ... is also a bailout of the Mexican government ... dollars to the ...
Dollar drain.(United States finances Mexican bailout)  
The Nation; Jul 10, 1995; Todd, Walker F.; 948 Words ... United States bailout of the Mexican financial ... May 22, the Mexican authorities ... May 31, the Mexican authorities ... have the Mexicans done with ... billion the Mexicans had borrowed ... obligations of the Mexican treasury ... debt of the Mexican government ... from the ...
A Bailout Of Political Proportions; Paybacks Could Benefit Mexican Millionaires  
The Washington Post; Aug 7, 1998; John Ward Anderson; 1,575 Words ... botched 1994 peso devaluation ... billion bank bailout that is evolving ... the bank bailout amounts to ... Mexico's bank bailout agency, the ... held by the bailout agency ... December 1994 peso devaluation ... the entire bailout. "This is ... the bank bailout fully as ... over by the ...
The Mexican debtors' revolt. (debtors battle with banks)(includes related articles on the Barzonistas and US bailout loans)   
Multinational Monitor; Jun 1, 1996; Wheat, Andrew; 3,216 Words ... Leon. We Mexicans don't earn ... 1996, the Mexican Bankers Association ... like many Mexican banking figures ... every 100 Mexican debtors had ... standards, Mexican banks have ... March 1996, Mexican Bankers ... time of the peso crisis in ... worth of bad Mexican loans, ...
Mexican holdup.(US bailout of Mexico)   
National Review; Feb 20, 1995; 452 Words ... Administration's new Mexican bailout plan looks like ... to support the Mexican peso and cover Mexico ... controls imposed on Mexican workers and businesses ... reversing recent Mexican tax hikes. Without such changes, a bailout (however organized ... future folly by the ...
Spitting into the wind. (US support of Mexican peso)(The Computerized Trader)  
Futures (Cedar Falls, Iowa); May 1, 1995; Burke, Gibbons; 738 Words ... free-falling Mexican peso with $20 billion to forestall a Mexican government default ... obligations. Will the Mexican bailout make Nick Leeson ... Barrington, Ill., the Mexican peso may be in a ... intent of the bailout was to stabilize ... decline of the peso, and give ...
IMF Ties Peso Crisis To Mexican Investors; Report Now Disputes Foreign Role in Collapse  
The Washington Post; Aug 21, 1995; Clay Chandler; 1,397 Words ... Suggests the peso's collapse ... dynamics of the peso's crash ... flight in the peso's collapse ... surge in Mexican investors ... 20, when Mexican officials ... value of the peso against the ... but from Mexican residents ... spiral in Mexican financial ... impossible for the ...
SHARP DECLINE IN PESO SPARKS NEW CONCERNS ABOUT STABILITY OF MEXICAN ECONOMY  
SourceMex Economic News & Analysis on Mexico; Nov 15, 1995; 1,031 Words ... devaluation of the peso in December ... shore up the peso. According to ... bolster the peso. Among the leading ... value of the peso to speculative ... swings in the peso to help everybody ... instability of the peso is the result ... direction of the Mexican economy. Analysts ... which ...
Mexican banks pay back small part of 1990s bailout, but questions remain  
AP Worldstream; Jun 27, 2005; TOM BARKLEY; 516 Words ... 06-27-2005 Dateline: MEXICO CITY Mexican banks paid the government back 1 ... million) in loans related to the bank bailout of the 1990s, but it is unclear ... US$70 billion (euro56.5 billion) bailout, which followed the so-called Tequila ... transfer program, which was part of the bailout. IPAB said ...
Rescue missions impossible: lessons of the Mexican bailout. (I.M.F.'s renegotiation of Mexican foreign debt)  
The Nation; Oct 6, 1984; Lernoux, Penny; 1,767 Words ... debt. The Mexican bailout is frequently ... As for the Mexican rescue operation ... claims, the bailout was plagued ... background to the Mexican bailout has been ... Kraft in The Mexican Rescue, a ... 1982, the Mexican government ... posture, the Mexican bailout, ...
Clinton's Peso Bailout Plan Causing a Bipartisan Hunker-Down  
The Washington Post; Jan 29, 1995; Helen Dewar; Kevin Merida; 922 Words ... about bailing out the Mexican peso. Nor were Democrats ... face in dealing with peso politics. "A lot of ... going to bail out the Mexicans and they say, `Huh ... parties is that the peso plan taps into sensitive ... international bankers and Mexican politicians. What keeps ... snowballing ...

Jethro Tull  posted on  2007-05-31   13:15:35 ET  (20 images) Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#99. To: richard9151 (#97)

Of course, my wife, the math teacher......

See above, re; the math skills of the little brown ones your wife teaches. Now, please answer the question. Are the kids dopey, or are Mexican teachers unqualified? Perhaps both??

Jethro Tull  posted on  2007-05-31   13:20:09 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#100. To: Jethro Tull (#98)

How many times has America bailed out the Peso?

Who cares, Jethro? It is YOUR politicians doing the bailing, Jethro, and they would not be doing so if it were not for the corruption coming from Washington, DC, in support of the corporate interest of the US in Mèxico, which, I may add, has held down Mèxico for the last 100 years, just as it has all of Central America and most all of South America!

There have been dozens of books written on the subjects, Jethro, detailing how Washington, DC, has interferred constantly in the internal politics of Mèxico, and how corporate America has control of most of the manufacturing and corporate farming in Mèxico. So, since they have created the problems, why should they not bail it out?

Oh, and by the way, Jethro, the bail-outs GO DIRECTLY TO BANKS IN THE US, esp. the Rockefeller banks in New York. Just guarenteeing those loans, docha know.

The Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.

richard9151  posted on  2007-05-31   13:24:26 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#101. To: Jethro Tull (#99)

the little brown ones

Jethro, your racism knows no bounds, does it. Got a lot of personel experience with those little brown ones, do you, Jethro? Got personel experience for your comments, Jethro? Or, are you just repeating the fear mongering from the major media in the states, Jethro?

Ummm, which is it, Jethro?

The Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.

richard9151  posted on  2007-05-31   13:27:13 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#102. To: richard9151 (#100)

Who cares, Jethro?

I do. The Mexican economy is bought and paid for by the American taxpayer as a gift to the transnationals. As repeated often, some cultures simply can't function w/o assistance. You have chosen to surround yourself by a prime example of such a culture :)

Jethro Tull  posted on  2007-05-31   13:27:52 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#103. To: richard9151 (#101)

Jethro, your racism knows no bounds, does it.

Racism? No way. Bush #41 refers to his Mexican grandson (Jeb's BOY) as "the little brown one".

Jethro Tull  posted on  2007-05-31   13:29:33 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#104. To: richard9151 (#100) (Edited)

which, I may add, has held down Mèxico for the last 100 years, just as it has all of Central America and most all of South America!

And being a nation(s) of unarmed surfs, you all have no option but to bend over and take their globalism up your can. OTOH, America has more than 70 million gun owners. If but 10% become pissed off enought, the nation is ours again. That's a ray of hope that you and your amigos haven't got - and never will.

Jethro Tull  posted on  2007-05-31   13:34:28 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#105. To: Jethro Tull (#102)

some cultures simply can't function w/o assistance.

Read a lot of books on this subject, have you, Jethro? Maybe if you would, you would not be so stupid as to make such remarks. The point of everyone of those books, including Confessions of an Economic Hit Man, as an example, show that it is not assistance by any stretch of the imagination; it is pure theft. AND; it is always done in such a way as to keep such cultures as fragmented, broken down and poor as possible.

Now I know, it is difficult to read, but you should try it; go here first; http://www.le xrex.com/enlightened/articles/warisaracket.htm

WAR IS A RACKET

by Two-Time Congressional Medal of Honor Recipient:

Major General Smedley D. Butler, USMC [Retired]

He will tell you all about it; about how the corruption comes directly from the US, travels to all of those cute little countries, kills the people thereof who will not submit, and then steals everything worth stealing. All paid for by that great taxpayer in the sky; the United States citizen.

But hey, don't take his word for it, try the famous book, The Ugly American as well! Another excellent trip through the mentality you so love... the American way of doing business, world wide!

And hey, if you need more references, I have read dozens of books on the subject, so will be more than glad to add a few more to the mix.

The Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.

richard9151  posted on  2007-05-31   13:38:41 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#106. To: Jethro Tull (#104)

That's a ray of hope that you and your amigos haven't got - and never will.

There is more guns down here than you would ever believe, Jethro, but the hope here comes from the thought that maybe, someday, America will wake up, but I do not believe it for one moment.

Too many people just like you in America, Jethro, so that is a hope died aborning.

The Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.

richard9151  posted on  2007-05-31   13:41:00 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#107. To: richard9151 (#105)

show that it is not assistance by any stretch of the imagination; it is pure theft. AND; it is always done in such a way as to keep such cultures as fragmented, broken down and poor as possible.

As I said, Mexico has been bought and paid for by the American taxpayer for the benefit of multinationals. I'm glad you agree.

Jethro Tull  posted on  2007-05-31   13:48:26 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#108. To: richard9151 (#106)

There is more guns down here than you would ever believe, Jethro,

Perhaps in the hands of government goons and the narco terrorists, but you aren't allowed to own or possess a weapon. Correct?

Jethro Tull  posted on  2007-05-31   13:50:56 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#109. To: richard9151 (#90)

And why would they leave when your pols are paying them to stay?

Indeed. We don't stop our pols for the same reasons we don't stop the Mexicans. When we have the guts to do the one, we will do the other.

Don't read much do you

Sure is hard to please some people. On FR I was a dreaded "book reader." :/

Trillion dollar enconomy; 26th largest in the world, which puts it above several eastern European (white) nations and a whole host of others.

Per capita? If you're worried about GDP (no reason you have to be), surely it is per capita GDP that matters more.

Lower IQ indeed.

Indeed. 92 or so, higher than the average black American IQ, much higher than the average black African IQ, but lower than the average American or white IQ, which are in turn lower than the average asian or jewish IQs. (Though the asian IQ is bifurcated, which slightly complicates the picture.)

Of course you would never stoop to taking a bribe. Could you sell me a deeply out-of-the-money option?

Tauzero  posted on  2007-05-31   15:30:04 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#110. To: richard9151 (#91)

I find it amusing, actually, that any United States citizen would dare to speak ill of the military of any other nation.

But I wasn't.

Of course you would never stoop to taking a bribe. Could you sell me a deeply out-of-the-money option?

Tauzero  posted on  2007-05-31   15:39:16 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#111. To: richard9151 (#91)

But hey, I just speak the lingo and live here

Heart is where the home is.

Of course you would never stoop to taking a bribe. Could you sell me a deeply out-of-the-money option?

Tauzero  posted on  2007-05-31   15:46:38 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#112. To: Jethro Tull (#108)

but you aren't allowed to own or possess a weapon. Correct?

I am a guest in this nation. And no guest in the United States is permitted too either.

Perhaps in the hands of government goons and the narco terrorists,

In the hands of the average Mèxican, Jethro. I have a number of friends who have guns, and they ain't goons or narcos.

The Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.

richard9151  posted on  2007-05-31   18:14:01 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#113. To: richard9151 (#112) (Edited)

I am a guest in this nation. And no guest in the United States is permitted too either.

I'll ask again. Can a Mexican citizen own a gun with the permission and authority of the Mexican govt?

Jethro Tull  posted on  2007-05-31   18:25:59 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#114. To: richard9151 (#64)

Perhaps if you can answer those two questions, you can start to put a date as to when the so-called invasion from Mèxico actually became a problem.

Was it a problem before Reagan's Amnistia?


What North American Union? STOP the North American Union!
~~~~~> Have you seen THIS yet? TIME IS RUNNING OUT!

FOH  posted on  2008-04-16   18:47:09 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#115. To: FOH (#114)

Was it a problem before Reagan's Amnistia?

No. The actual genisis of the problem started in 1965 with the changes in immigration law, as I have posted before. But the problem with Mèxicans really kicked into high gear with the advent of NAFTA and the forced opening of the border (going south) to factory produced food, spec. corn and pork. And it is important to note that even before NAFTA was passed, the terms of the agreements were being observed, so the real problems began late in the 80s, early in the 90s.

The poorest of the poor in México, who had lived on the same land for generations raising their families all of a sudden found that they could no longer make enough to buy any essentials, cause most of what those poor raised and sold were corn and pork.

But that was planned, cause the rich (from both México and the US) needed a lot more workers in the new factories being built in México, almost all of which were moved from the US to México.

But about the time that came to be, China got most favored nation status, and all of a sudden those factories for México began moving to China, and what about all of those new 'workers?' The least educated in México, where were they to go, cause there is no work in México either. And since no one was interested in enforcing existing laws in the US, and numerous laws were passed saying that ANYONE was entitled to entitlments if they were within the US, well, what would YOU have done?

When a man who is honestly mistaken hears the truth, he will either quit being mistaken or cease to be honest. ++++++++++ Attention, Shrub; A life of evil is ultimately a life of wretchedness.

richard9151  posted on  2008-04-16   20:23:04 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#116. To: richard9151 (#115)

The poorest of the poor in México, who had lived on the same land for generations raising their families all of a sudden found that they could no longer make enough to buy any essentials, cause most of what those poor raised and sold were corn and pork.

I think you're correct according to what I've read. I read that 25 million Mexicans were pushed off theland that they had occupied for generations as a result of what you said. and it is important to understand that while the Mexican government allowed the US produced food into their markets with no tariffs the US produced food is subsidized very heavily by the taxpayers. So that Mexican farmers working on a smaller scale with no subsidies had no chance to compete. I've read that for those crops 40% of the US farmers' revenue is from the government.

Revelation 6:6 And I heard a voice in the midst of the four beasts say, A measure of wheat for a penny, and three measures of barley for a penny; and [see] thou hurt not the oil and the wine.

Red Jones  posted on  2008-04-16   22:07:48 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#117. To: FOH (#114)

Was it a problem before Reagan's Amnistia?

there was a lot of illegal immigration from Mexico prior to the amnesty in 1986. The biggest problem with what happened in 1986 was that the government made it legal tohire illegal people if only the employer photo-copied the documents that would prove they're legal, and if the documents looked real, then the employer was perfectly legal to hire them. I read in a Wall Street Journal article back in 1986 that it was well-known this would only lead to a big black market in fake documents. and that is exactly what happened. It was the Senate Republican leadership that insisted the employers should not be forced to validate the documents before hiring. Others in the House (dominated by Democrats at the time) wanted to force employers to check legality of each new hire. The President was on the side of the House Democrats. But Senate Republicans would not allow such a bill to be passed. So they compromised and did it the way the Senate republicans wanted. Reagan who was in his senile stage by then was very easily influenced/controlled by those around him & went along.

They told us in 1986 they were going to fix the illegal immigrant problem and what they actually did was make it much worse. and then as Richard said NAFTA pushed 25 million mexicans off the land due to the subsidies of US food that were brought into Mexico without tariffs. They had to come up here.

The same thing is happening today, the leadership is making the Americans think they want to deal with the immigration problem. But legislation that Republicans (including Bush) supported in 2006 would increase immigration massively. Now they're trying to go for these indentured servant programs. They call them guest-worker programs. But anytime a person's existence in a country depends on the good will of the employer, then that means he is an indentured servant. The indentured servant system was first introduced in the early 1600's and was a pre-cursor to slavery.

Revelation 6:6 And I heard a voice in the midst of the four beasts say, A measure of wheat for a penny, and three measures of barley for a penny; and [see] thou hurt not the oil and the wine.

Red Jones  posted on  2008-04-16   22:14:36 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#118. To: Red Jones, FOH, *Agriculture-Environment* (#116)

the US produced food is subsidized very heavily by the taxpayers. So that Mexican farmers working on a smaller scale with no subsidies had no chance to compete. I've read that for those crops 40% of the US farmers' revenue is from the government.

You have stated it perfectly. What is being done in México now is a repeat of what happened within the United States before, when millions of family farms were destroyed through government planning. And most Americans were not and are not aware of what happened.

Today, America can no longer feed itself, and shortly México will be in the same boat. That is not a good boat to be in.

When a man who is honestly mistaken hears the truth, he will either quit being mistaken or cease to be honest. ++++++++++ Attention, Shrub; A life of evil is ultimately a life of wretchedness.

richard9151  posted on  2008-04-16   22:41:30 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#119. To: richard9151 (#55)

And the invasion into the United States is by people who have been chased off of their anscetral lands, where they have lived and rasied families for generations, because of NAFTA and the improtation of garbage food from the states.

This this the position you still cling to ?


"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams


Rotara  posted on  2009-03-14   22:50:47 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#120. To: Rotara (#119)

This this the position you still cling to ?

And why would I not? In Mexico, because of NAFTA and the importation of factory farmed pork and corn, nearly 20 million hereditary farmers; i.e., people who had for generations lived on the same piece of land and farmed it, have been forced off of their land because they can no longer make a living. 100% of those farmers were/are native Indians of Mexico. There are more than 280 recognized separate Indian tribes in Mexico.

The vast majority of the people, i.e., illegal aliens, who have moved to the US to work, with the full knowledge and cooperation of the various governments within the United States (evidenced by the blunt failure of those same governments to enforce existing laws against hiring illegals), are from these displaced people.

Now, what is not to understand?

Daniel 2:44 “And in the days of those kings the God of heaven will set up a kingdom that will never be brought to ruin. And the kingdom itself will not be passed on to any other people. It will crush and put an end to all these kingdoms, and it itself will stand to times indefinite;.

richard9151  posted on  2009-03-15   0:53:55 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#121. To: richard9151 (#120)

illegal aliens, who have moved to the US to work,

Here's the byproduct of some of their work. Victims all.

Jethro Tull  posted on  2009-03-15   9:56:23 ET  (1 image) Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#122. To: Jethro Tull (#121)

Here's the byproduct of some of their work.

And I wonder how long people like you will ignore the basic part of the problem?

with the full knowledge and cooperation of the various governments within the United States (evidenced by the blunt failure of those same governments to enforce existing laws against hiring illegals),

Amazing how thick you can be, Jethro. Your hatred is so amazing, it is no wonder you have no use for the Bible.

Daniel 2:44 “And in the days of those kings the God of heaven will set up a kingdom that will never be brought to ruin. And the kingdom itself will not be passed on to any other people. It will crush and put an end to all these kingdoms, and it itself will stand to times indefinite;.

richard9151  posted on  2009-03-15   11:36:24 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#123. To: richard9151 (#122)

Your hatred is so amazing, it is no wonder you have no use for the Bible.

And which version of the bible would that be, senor?

Jethro Tull  posted on  2009-03-15   12:01:32 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#124. To: Zipporah (#0)

Where the hell are you?

Old Friend  posted on  2009-03-15   12:26:22 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


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