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Dead Constitution
See other Dead Constitution Articles

Title: No jobs for US citizens without Homeland Security approval
Source: Press Esc
URL Source: http://pressesc.com/01180202266_eevs
Published: May 27, 2007
Author: IFP Canada
Post Date: 2007-05-27 14:42:23 by Zipporah
Keywords: None
Views: 1998
Comments: 124

No jobs for US citizens without Homeland Security approval

Submitted by Canada IFP on Sat, 2007-05-26 18:00. | |

US citizens who apply for a job will need prior approval from Department of Homeland Security under the terms immigration bill passed by the Senate this week.

American Civil Liberties Union pointed out that the DHS's Employment Eligibility Verification System (EEVS) is error plagued and if the department makes a mistake in determining work eligibility, there will be virtually no way to challenge the error or recover lost wages due to the bill’s prohibitions on judicial review.

Even current employees will need to obtain eligibility approval from the DHS Within 60 days of the Immigration Reform Act of 2006 becoming law.

"EEVS would be a financial and bureaucratic nightmare for both businesses and workers," said Timothy Sparapani, ACLU Legislative Counsel. "Under this already flawed program no one would be able to work in the U.S. without DHS approval - creating a ‘No Work List’ similar to the government’s ‘No Fly List.’ We need immigration reform, but not at this cost."

The act allocates US$400 million for the implementation of the EEVS, but the Congressional Budgeting Office estimates the system to cost in excess of a billion dollars.

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#47. To: richard9151 (#45)

You mean, kind of like they have already left the good ole US of A?

Are u speaking in code? Translation please.

Jethro Tull  posted on  2007-05-28   20:11:22 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#48. To: BTP Holdings (#39)

and the Sheriff's to activate the Posse Comitatus

They've all become little tools of the federal government. They're picking out their retirement fishing poles and could care less about the state of the nation or their obligations.

Jethro Tull  posted on  2007-05-28   20:17:26 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#49. To: lodwick (#36)

Unless they get the stupid http://www.freedomship.com going on, same here.

Being as their last "news" update was over two years ago and they no longer seem to have any graphics on their website I'm afraid it looks like the "Freedom ship" is, pardon the pun, "dead in the water".

Gold and silver are real money, paper is but a promise.

Elliott Jackalope  posted on  2007-05-28   20:33:13 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#50. To: Elliott Jackalope (#49)

"...I'm afraid it looks like the "Freedom ship" is, pardon the pun, "dead in the water".

DOA they may be.

Dr.Ron Paul for President

Lod  posted on  2007-05-29   8:19:21 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#51. To: richard9151 (#30)

That being said, the elite down here have a very justifiable fear of the peasants in this country.

Indeed. White hispanics shouldn't trust those with more Indian blood.

Don't waste your pucker on some all-thing sucker.

Tauzero  posted on  2007-05-29   12:51:25 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#52. To: willyone, Jethro Tull (#18)

I guess I am saying your story is bullshit.

Of course it is, and it's utterly transparent. It's the complement of open borders, an oblique approach. If you buy it, you'll be more receptive to open borders.

Don't waste your pucker on some all-thing sucker.

Tauzero  posted on  2007-05-29   13:47:08 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#53. To: richard9151 (#10)

As the police explained to him, they could not do that, as Mèxican law forbade them from entering into the man`s home without a court order obtained legally, and based on eyewitness testimony.

What a dufus. And to think, this fool is part of the problem of violation of substantive rights here.

I've heard countless stories, and seen them on shows like COPS, where they police act so far outside their authority and without a warrant it is simply unbelievable.

Jerks like him are the ones who cheer on the cops in those situations.

He should be thrown in the stocks on the public square so folks can humiliate him for being an enabler of the police state.

"When bad men combine, the good must associate; else they will fall, one by one." Edmund Burke

BTP Holdings  posted on  2007-05-29   13:54:57 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#54. To: Tauzero, all (#52) (Edited)

It's the complement of open borders, an oblique approach. If you buy it, you'll be more receptive to open borders.

Good point. The glory of the Mexican nation is absurd, especially for white Americans. I have no idea what color Richard is, but living in Mexico isn't utopia. If it were, the current invasion we're experiencing would be flowing in the opposite direction. Just Google Mexico and violent crime and the stories are endless.

Jethro Tull  posted on  2007-05-29   13:56:57 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#55. To: Jethro Tull, Tauzero, willyone, all (#54)

The glory of the Mexican nation is absurd, especially for white Americans.

No body said anything about glory; if Americans, of whatever color, come down here, the first thing they must do is CONTRACT to pay the taxes. Mèxicans are not stupid; they do not extend the rights of their citizens to all johnny-come- latelys.

No body said anything about utopia. I said, there is a LOT more freedom here than there is in the states. A LOT MORE. With a lot less interference from the police, and part of that is that the Mèxicans know very well that they need tourists from the states, and bad stories about how tourists, and any Americans are injured/robbed down here, hurt the tourist trade. Badly.

And the invasion into the United States is by people who have been chased off of their anscetral lands, where they have lived and rasied families for generations, because of NAFTA and the improtation of garbage food from the states.

As to crime rates, pretty hard for anyone living in the US to knock crime in some other courtry. Course, I understand that you two live here, so you probably understand a lot more than I do.... NOT!

And by the way, my eyes are blue.....

The Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.

richard9151  posted on  2007-05-29   16:47:37 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#56. To: BTP Holdings (#53)

What a dufus. And to think, this fool is part of the problem of violation of substantive rights here.

You are correct, and the contradictions in his beliefs never even enter into his thinking.

It is kind of like Jethro trying to start an argument with me based on his belief that perhaps Mèxico's biggest problem is simply that they do not tax their citizens enough! Do you ever wonder if such people ever think before they write/speak?

The Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.

richard9151  posted on  2007-05-29   17:09:01 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#57. To: Tauzero, willyone, Jethro Tull, all (#52)

I guess I am saying your story is bullshit.

Of course it is, and it's utterly transparent.

What is it with you guys; pure racism, or just ignorance? Or, is it just that, hey!, those suckers in Mèxico mus be dum cause they don even unerstan plain english!

Here are two rules for you all to think about;

Rule number 1; all people every where are just about equal in intelligence. They may think a little different because of the form of their language, but just because they don`t understand English is not an excuse to treat them as dumb. On the other hand, people who get most of their info and beliefs from the major media in the United States, and accept it as gospel, well, they can certainly be rated as lacking in basic common sense, even if not actually rated as stupid. And that, frankly, is where most of what you clowns think you know about Mèxico comes from; the TV/radio/newspapers in the Untied States.

Rule number 2; Generally speaking, people do not cut off their own noses to spite their faces. They just don't do it! And given that Mèxicans are not stupid (HEY! TRILLION DOLLAR ECONOMY LAST YEAR!), then anyone with a lick of sense would understand that the average Mèxican DOES NOT HATE NOR PICK ON THE AVERAGE AMERICAN WHEN THAT AMERICAN VISITS MÈXICO. Why do you suppose that is? Cause that American is bringing m-o-n-e-y to Mèxico! And if the Mèxicans cause trouble for the Americans, then the m-o-n-e-y flow across the border dries up. What is truly interesting about this is that the average Mèxican is much, much better than the average United States citizen is in separating the actions of the government from the actions of the average citizen (of whatever nation).

In point of fact, what the average Mèxican has learned, long ago, IS DO NOT CAUSE PROBLEMS FOR THE AMERICANS OR WE POLICE WILL LAND ON YOU WITH 6 OR 8 FEET! And the police do not cause problems for the average Americans either, cause their jobs depend on keeping the hotel and other large business owners happy....... or someone else gets their job. And anyone with a lick of sense, who had any idea of just how much building is going on in what is called the free zone, that (about) 25 mile wide strip just inside the Mèxican/US border, would understand this without needing to be hit over the head with it.

But hey! What do I know. There is only, roughly, 8,000 Americans here in this small town (not all permenant resisdents), with hundreds more planning on moving here to fill up all of the hundereds of new homes under construction, so, I must be about the only one who thinks as I do..... donchaknow.

The Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.

richard9151  posted on  2007-05-29   17:33:17 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#58. To: richard9151, all (#55)

And the invasion into the United States is by people who have been chased off of their anscetral lands, where they have lived and rasied families for generations

Are you saying the open border invasion of America by Mexicans is justified because California, and Texas as examples, are actually Mexican anscetral lands?

Jethro Tull  posted on  2007-05-29   18:16:16 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#59. To: Tauzero, willyone, robin, BTP Holdings, IndieTX, Americans for Closed Borders, ALL (#58)

Ping to the above.

Jethro Tull  posted on  2007-05-29   18:18:19 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#60. To: Jethro Tull (#58)

Are you saying the open border invasion of America by Mexicans is justified because California, and Texas as examples, are actually Mexican anscetral lands?

That's a lie.

Native Americans of CA chased Mexicans back to Mexico many times.

"Guard against the impostures of pretended patriotism." ~George Washington

robin  posted on  2007-05-29   18:20:16 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#61. To: robin (#60)

Yep. I think Mr. Mexico is taking the same immigration position as Morris Dees.

Jethro Tull  posted on  2007-05-29   18:23:13 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#62. To: richard9151 (#55)

I said, there is a LOT more freedom here than there is in the states. A LOT MORE

Do you carry a gun?

Jethro Tull  posted on  2007-05-29   18:25:33 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#63. To: robin (#60)

Robin is correct in 60 in her history. I wish so much that young Americans were taught that in school. They indoctrinated with poison against our country, and so are the Mexicans.

There were a lot of violent conflicts between the Mexicans and natives of Arizona. In both Texas & in California they had revolutions in the 1830's where the Mexican government was chased out. and then they had the Mexican- American war in late 1840's. At the time when Mexican-American war ended around 1846 and all those western states were surrendered by Mexico only about 5% of who were then Mexicans lived north of today's border. and a lot of those 5% were more loyal to America than to Mexico - witness the revolutions in California & Texas where ethnic Mexicans fought against Mexico. Today it is like 40% of the ethnic Mexicans that live in our country I personally think. A lot of them have blended in with the Americans. The reality is that there's been a huge migration north and they're not natives.

Galatians 3:29 And if ye [be] Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

Red Jones  posted on  2007-05-29   18:27:51 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#64. To: Jethro Tull, robin (#58)

Are you saying the open border invasion of America by Mexicans is justified because California, and Texas as examples, are actually Mexican anscetral lands?

Are you really that dense, Jethro? When did NAFTA take effect, Jethro, and when did the importation of farm-factory produced food into Mèxico from the states start, Jethro? Perhaps if you can answer those two questions, you can start to put a date as to when the so-called invasion from Mèxico actually became a problem.

The Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.

richard9151  posted on  2007-05-29   18:31:14 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#65. To: Jethro Tull (#62)

Do you carry a gun?

No. Do you? And if you do, why do you? Does walking the streets in your beautiful US scare the bejesus out of you so that you need to carry a gun to feel safe? If you do, I feel sorry for you, cause I can go outside anytime of the day or night here, walk around, go have a beer, anything I want, AND SO CAN MY WIFE, in perfect safty.

The Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.

richard9151  posted on  2007-05-29   18:34:14 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#66. To: richard9151 (#65)

If your wife or daughter were blonde and blue-eyed would that still be true?

"Guard against the impostures of pretended patriotism." ~George Washington

robin  posted on  2007-05-29   18:37:30 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#67. To: Red Jones, robin (#63)

Robin is correct in 60 in her history. I wish so much that young Americans were taught that in school. They indoctrinated with poison against our country, and so are the Mexicans.

Kind of like Americans are indoctrinated with hatred against Mèxico, and Mèxicans, right?

To bad a few more Americans do not wake up and understand that someone is doing the indoctrination on both sides of the border. There are actually many more Mèxicans aware that what they are being taught ain`t the truth than there are Americans.

The Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.

richard9151  posted on  2007-05-29   18:37:47 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#68. To: robin (#66)

If your wife or daughter were blonde and blue-eyed would that still be true?

Absolutely, Robin. Go up and read number 57.

Many many Americans party hearty down here day and night. Walk around, go into the Cantinas, shop and eat, visit the beach. Very, very few problems. A lot fewer than you would see in the states, I wager.

The Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.

richard9151  posted on  2007-05-29   18:40:33 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#69. To: richard9151 (#64)

And the invasion into the United States is by people who have been chased off of their anscetral lands, where they have lived and rasied families for generations

These are your words. Please explain.

Jethro Tull  posted on  2007-05-29   18:41:16 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#70. To: richard9151 (#68)

I'm glad to hear it, but the same is not true anywhere near the border. And I doubt if it is true in Mexico City either. But the tourist towns are likely safer.

However, a recent article posted here, written by an ex-pat in Mexico, suggested that a single woman would probably not like Mexico.

"Guard against the impostures of pretended patriotism." ~George Washington

robin  posted on  2007-05-29   18:42:41 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#71. To: Jethro Tull, robin, all (#61)

Yep. I think Mr. Mexico is taking the same immigration position as Morris Dees.

No stupid comments, Jethro, as is your normal mode of operation. Quotes. Tell me where I have said anything at all about immigration. Open borders. About allowing more Mèxicans into the states.

Quotes, Jethro. I post everything on 4um in the open, so I assume you have proof of your BS, right?

The Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.

richard9151  posted on  2007-05-29   18:43:14 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#72. To: richard9151 (#65)

No. Do you?

Yes, I carry. Do you? Does the Mexican govt. allow you to?

Jethro Tull  posted on  2007-05-29   18:45:43 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#73. To: richard9151, Jethro Tull, robin, willyone (#55)

Course, I understand that you two live here, so you probably understand a lot more than I do.... NOT!

George Carlin had a nice joke about some parents trying to get a kid to eat some food that was "good for him."

Carlin in slow, superior voce: "How do you know you don't like it if you've never even tried?"

Carlin as not-to-be-tricked kid: "It came to me in a dream!"

Richard's correct I don't understand what it's like in a knowledge-by-acquaintance way. Is such knowledge-by-acquaintance necessary before analysis and decision? Why should I want such acquaintance?

There are only two ways for me to gain such knowledge-by-acquaintance. Either move there myself, or invite Mexicans to my neighborhood. So once again we have an oblique approach.

Don't waste your pucker on some all-thing sucker.

Tauzero  posted on  2007-05-29   18:48:20 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#74. To: Tauzero (#73)

Either move there myself, or invite Mexicans to my neighborhood. So once again we have an oblique approach.

laughing sideways ;)

"Guard against the impostures of pretended patriotism." ~George Washington

robin  posted on  2007-05-29   18:51:33 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#75. To: richard9151 (#71)

Tell me where I have said anything at all about immigration. Open borders. About allowing more Mèxicans into the states.

It's all in #58; your quote and my question. Answer please....

Jethro Tull  posted on  2007-05-29   18:52:32 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#76. To: Jethro Tull (#69)

These are your words. Please explain.

Cute, Jethro, and right up your alley, as usual. Just quote a part of the message, right?

Here is the part I posted in number 55 above; andyone who wishes can go up there and read it in full;

And the invasion into the United States is by people who have been chased off of their anscetral lands, where they have lived and rasied families for generations, because of NAFTA and the importation of garbage food from the states.

Now, what part of that relates to California and Texas in the 1840s? Did they have NAFTA then? How about factory farms? Big item in the southwest in the 1840s, right?

But just to clear up any problems with your understanding (impossible!), what happened with NAFTA is that the border between Mèxico and the US was opened completely for food, and the US began shipping all of the excess food THAT THEY WERE HAVING TROUBLE SELLING IN OTHER NATIONS because of various things (such as genetic tampering) into Mèxico, where thousands of families began to find that they could no longer support their families on the land that had been in their families for generations.

Little pieces of land, Jethro, usually less than 25 acres; land that they still worked with mules and horses for draft animals. Poor people, Jethro, who sold one or two hogs a year, maybe a hundred bushels of corn and various other food stuffs like chilis and melons. Just enough for money to buy clothing, coffee, cigerattes, some salt and etc. Enough to live on, Jethro, and all of a sudden, in just one year, it all changed with NAFTA, and if you care enough, you can find the info about this on the web.

Those families were driven off of the land, just as 25 million families have been driven off of the land in the US. And they had two choices; into the cities and compete for work that they were not trained for, or, head for the border to the north.

To bad, Jethro, you do not understand the dynamics of what is being done to your own country, much less to others.

The Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.

richard9151  posted on  2007-05-29   18:57:52 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#77. To: Tauzero (#73)

Richard's correct I don't understand what it's like in a knowledge-by-acquaintance way. Is such knowledge-by-acquaintance necessary before analysis and decision? Why should I want such acquaintance?

There are only two ways for me to gain such knowledge-by-acquaintance. Either move there myself, or invite Mexicans to my neighborhood. So once again we have an oblique approach.

Oh absolutely! ABSOLUTELY!! It makes much more sense to watch the evening news, listen to a couple of talking heads on TV, maybe Rushy Baby for some REAL TRUTH, read the Wall Street Journal, and then, then, you will have all of the information that you could possibly use!

Don`t we just see it all now... that redwhiteandblue rainbow over those golden shores....... ITS THE ONLY PLACE WORTH LIVING ON EARTH!

Well, good luck. Hope you enjoy the furture, cause you sure demonstrate where the problems come from; ignorance and intolerance. You do not know, you admit you do not know, and you still will make decisions as if you know. Ummmmm, sounds just like voters in the United States....

The Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.

richard9151  posted on  2007-05-29   19:06:07 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#78. To: Jethro Tull (#75)

Tell me where I have said anything at all about immigration. Open borders. About allowing more Mèxicans into the states. It's all in #58; your quote and my question. Answer please....

You still have not told me, Jethro, where are the quotes BY ME about open borders, immigration into the US, permitting more Mèxicans in, and etc.

And just quotes, Jethro. No nonsense like you normally post.

The Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.

richard9151  posted on  2007-05-29   19:07:53 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#79. To: richard9151 (#76) (Edited)

anscetral (Mexican) lands (in the USA)

I assume you believe in sovereign national borders for both America and Mexico. Right? Further, I assume you oppose the current unfettered illegal Mexican immigration into America by this uneducated brown horde. Right?

On which side of the border are these anscetral Mexican lands you speak of? Please identify their geographical location and, if they are located in the USA, please identify the right of Mexican title to the land. Thanks.

Jethro Tull  posted on  2007-05-29   19:14:27 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#80. To: richard9151 (#78)

And the invasion into the United States is by people who have been chased off of their anscetral lands, where they have lived and rasied families for generations, because of NAFTA and the improtation of garbage food from the states.

Your above quote is from #55. You call it an invasion. I agree.

Jethro Tull  posted on  2007-05-29   19:16:25 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#81. To: richard9151 (#77)

Oh absolutely! ABSOLUTELY!! It makes much more sense to watch the evening news, listen to a couple of talking heads on TV, maybe Rushy Baby for some REAL TRUTH, read the Wall Street Journal, and then, then, you will have all of the information that you could possibly use!

Actually I go more by the reports of my world-traveling sister. Her business of many years is small group scuba/diving tours, which she leads personally ( but I suspect she and/or her husband sometimes moonlight as mules, and I know she's greased a few palms.)

ITS THE ONLY PLACE WORTH LIVING ON EARTH!

Well, I think so, but that's just me. And I hate the coasts. I'll always be a cheesehead. Unfortunately lots of Mexicans think the U.S. is good, too. They'll eventually ruin what they came for, but in the meantime I can certainly understand the "get while the gettin's good" approach.

You do not know, you admit you do not know

Knowledge is not free, especially the kind you insist upon as a form of credential before discussion. That insistence is nothing more (or less) than begging the very question under consideration, as I'm sure you'll realize, if you think about it.

Don't waste your pucker on some all-thing sucker.

Tauzero  posted on  2007-05-29   19:29:03 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#82. To: Jethro Tull (#79)

Jethro, your ignorance is beyond belief. Not to mention your blind hatred.

You and Taz have it all figured out; 2 plus 2`plus 2 is ... wait! Wait! I GOT IT! 5! It has to be!

The problem is that Federal Reserve of Mèxico! THAT'S IT!!! It's those dumb Mèxicans that have created our unpayable debt!!!

And it's those, what is it, Jethro, 10 brigades of Mèxican troops serving in Iraq, right? THAT'S THE PROBLEM! If Mèxico had not sucked us into this war, everything would be just dandy!!

And the chemicals in out air and water, like, ya know, flouride, there has to exist proof that this is a MÊXICAN plot!!!

And we all know that it has been the Mèxican government that instituted the plan back in the 30s that has forced 25 million Americans off of their family farms. YOU BET!!!

IT'S ALL A MÈXICAN PLOT!! EVERY BIT OF IT!!

AND; we have been so successful in closing our borders to drugs, why, it is obvious to anyone with a lick of sense that IT WILL BE EASY TO CLOSE OUR BORDERS TO THOSE MEX HORDES. Esp. now that the same type of programs that chased all of those Americans off of their farms, why, now the Mex government is using it against their own people!

Why don't you and Taz wake up, Jethro. The people of Mèxico, hard as you find it to believe, are just people who want to eat, and live, and make little babies, and, they are not your enemy. Get the propaganda out of your head, cause it rots everything when you let it inside!

The enemy is in Washington, DC, and in London (twice! Britian and The City!), Paris, Berlin, Rome (twice again! The Vatican), New York, Tel Aviv, Mèxico City, AND EVERY OTHER CAPITAL CITY UNDER THE CONTROL OF THE NEW WORLD ORDER.

Course, that does not let you strut around with your gun and play like a big tough guy, right? Gotta find someone smaller, mayhap weaker than you to play against. Got a surprise for you, Jethro, this ain`t a game to anyone but you and those who think like you and ignore facts.

The Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.

richard9151  posted on  2007-05-30   10:47:07 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#83. To: Jethro Tull (#79)

I assume you believe in sovereign national borders for both America and Mexico. Right?

ABSOLUTELY! I admire the steps that Mèxico takes that ensure that anyone entering into Mèxico and planning to stay has a means of supporting themselves. Very intelligent.

you oppose the current unfettered illegal Mexican immigration into America What unfettered immigration?! The laws have been passed and are on the books which welcome these people in... PASSED BY YOUR POLITICIANS! Giving them free medical care, free schooling, free benefits, and their has been posts done on 4um showing how businesses send buses TO THE BORDER TO PICK UP THE WORKERS AND CARRY THEM INTO THE HEARTLAND OF AMERICA! But hey, it is just a Mèxican plot, right?

uneducated brown horde. Jeez, Jethro, does nothing shame you? You let your stupidity shine right on through... no matter what? What constitutes uneducated to you, Jethro, they do not speakum the english? Is that it? My wife is a teacher in Mèxico, Jethro, of ... MATHMATICS!! Get that? And, she is very good at it. In fact, she is one of the very few people I have met in my life that is as quick with numbers as I am. My nephew just graduated from the University. One of my nieces just graduated as an engineer about three years ago. One of my sisters-in-laws is a teacher, as are two of my brothers- in-laws. HERE IS A SHOCKER FOR YOU, JETHRO! THEY HAVE LOTS AND LOTS OF SCHOOLS IN MÈXICO!!

And how about if we discuss, instead, the ancestral lands of the American farmers that have been chased off of their lands. It is more to the point, cause the Zionist learned a long time ago that the way to control people is to control their food. So, today, Jethro, you live in the big ol US of A; one of the few countries in the world that can no longer feed itself. BUT HEY! IT IS ALL A MÈXICAN PLOT!!

The Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.

richard9151  posted on  2007-05-30   10:59:37 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#84. To: Tauzero (#81)

Knowledge is not free,

You got that right, Taz. Now go read 82 and 83, and tell me what else is new on this green earth.

The Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.

richard9151  posted on  2007-05-30   11:01:42 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#85. To: richard9151 (#83)

anscetral (Mexican) lands (in the USA)

Hmmm...still no answer to my #79? I'm not surprised....

Jethro Tull  posted on  2007-05-30   11:23:37 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#86. To: richard9151 (#83) (Edited)

My wife is a teacher in Mèxico, Jethro, of ... MATHMATICS!! Get that? And, she is very good at it. In fact, she is one of the very few people I have met in my life that is as quick with numbers as I am. My nephew just graduated from the University. One of my nieces just graduated as an engineer about three years ago. One of my sisters-in-laws is a teacher, as are two of my brothers- in-laws. HERE IS A SHOCKER FOR YOU, JETHRO! THEY HAVE LOTS AND LOTS OF SCHOOLS IN MÈXICO!!

HEY PONCHO. I WOULDN'T BRAG ABOUT YOUR CONNECTION TO THE MEXICAN SCHOOL SYSTEM :)

MEXICO'S EDUCATION SYSTEM RANKS LAST AMONG MEMBERS OF ORGANIZATION FOR ECONOMIC COOPERATION AND DEVELOPMENT.

From: SourceMex Economic News & Analysis on Mexico

 | Date: September 22, 2004

 | More results for: mexico's school system

Mexico continues to lag behind other semi-industrialized and industrialized nations in the quality of its education, a factor that some analysts say has contributed to the country's stunted economic development.

In a report published in mid-September, the Organization for Economic Cooperation and Development (OECD) ranked Mexico's educational system last among 28 member countries in the quality of education.

All OECD countries except Mexico made advances in improving their educational systems between 1995 and 2003. The report noted that South Korea, a country that had rankings similar to Mexico a generation ago, has vaulted to the top because of the reforms to education implemented in that country. South Korea has been able to develop a highly skilled work force, which produces some of the world's most popular cars and electronics. In contrast, Mexico's work force is made up largely of assembly workers and other manual laborers.

The report acknowledged that Mexico has boosted educational expenditures since 1995 by 36% at the primary and secondary levels and by 22% for higher education. Even with these increases, the amount spent by the Mexican government for each student has declined by 10%. The OECD said the Mexican government spends about US$1,357 per student at the primary level, roughly one- fourth of the average expenditure for all OECD members for the same purpose.

"If Mexico uses itself as a point of reference, then educational expenditures have indeed increased since 1995," said Andreas Schleicher, who heads the OECD's education-monitoring division. "At the international level, the picture is radically different."

About 97% of the new money spent by the government on education since 1995 has been devoted to increasing teacher salaries, a testament to the strength of Mexico's teachers union (Sindicato Nacional de Trabajadores de la Educacion, SNTE).

While experts agree that improving the quality and the number of teachers is a crucial element of education, the government has failed to take other actions that would enhance education, such as constructing new schools and improving infrastructure, curriculum development, and student retention.

"The trend in Mexico's education expenditures is not typical of the other OECD member countries," said the report.

Expenditures low on infrastructure, student retention

The lack of expenditures on infrastructure is also affecting the quality of public education. Some communities do not have enough school buildings to accommodate the number of students who want an education, forcing local educational authorities to use split schedules. This limits the day at public elementary schools to four hours, compared with six or more hours at private institutions.

In some rural and inner- city communities, students have to attend school in crumbling buildings that often lack basic plumbing and leak during heavy rains.

In many cases, public-school students have to pay extra fees to cover the cost of paper, pencils, and other supplies. To cover the cost of paper, one school in Mexico state was charging students 4 pesos (US$0.35) to take a monthly exam.

President Vicente Fox's administration has sought to address the problem partially by expanding an anti-poverty program that pays some parents every month they keep their children in school. But this only benefits a handful of families, since many do not meet the poverty qualifications for participation in the program.

The Mexican government on occasion receives grants or loans from multilateral organizations to improve education. In July of this year, the World Bank approved a US$300 million loan to support Mexico's basic-education- development program, which provides extra support to education for disadvantaged groups, such as children living in rural or marginal urban areas, and handicapped, migrant, and indigenous children. The loan is the third and final phase of the Basic Education Development Program, which the World Bank has been supporting in Mexico since its inception in 1991.

Mexican students fare poorly in aptitude tests

One measure of Mexico's progress--or lack of progress--in education is the aptitude levels of students. In a standardized global evaluation test called the Program for International Student Assessment (PISA), Mexican ninth graders placed 34th among the 41 nations participating in the exam and last among the 28 OECD member nations. The same OECD study ranked Mexico last among member countries on the reading ability of 15-year-old youths. Only 6.9% of Mexican students surveyed had a high reading ability, compared with the median of 31.2% for the OECD members.

The poor ranking in education has been an embarrassment for Mexico, which is attempting to portray itself as an emerging industrialized country. The reality is that Mexican education still displays patterns of many lesser-developed countries, such as a high dropout rate at the primary level, particularly in rural areas. About 10% of students drop out of the educational system before completing middle school to take an unskilled job to help support their families.

"There is a bottleneck in the system," Eduardo Velez Bustillo, education section manager for Latin America for the World Bank, told the Los Angeles Times. "Quality is bad at every level, but middle school is a crisis point because that's where the demand is highest."

Mexico's poor educational results have brought an outcry from the business community. It is urging President Fox's government to overhaul the entire system, which offers students little more than basic skills like reading, writing, and arithmetic. Business leaders say Mexico is still unable to compete with better-trained work forces in other countries and has to settle for low-skilled assembly jobs.

On average, Mexicans attain only a seventh-grade education, and just two of every 10 students receive a college education.

"A country without education is a country that won't develop, and our system is even worse than people say," said Isaac Katz, an economics professor at the Instituto Tecnologico Autonomo de Mexico (ITAM). "No one is responsible for quality, results aren't measured, and parents have no voice."

Poor educational system hurts Mexico's competitive position

Some analysts worry that the lack of an educated work force in the long run will keep Mexico from attracting the type of high-value foreign investment that the economy needs. "I see a significant deterioration in competitiveness in Mexico's future," said Eduardo Andere, a professor of international studies at the ITAM. "In social terms, that means more poverty, more insecurity, and more inequality."

Despite the pleas from experts and business leaders, the Fox government has failed to produce any innovative plans for education and has proposed meager increases in expenditures for primary and secondary education in 2005. In its budget proposal for 2005, the Fox government requested about 300.6 billion pesos (US$26.3 billion) for primary and secondary education, an increase of only 1.1% from the amount approved in the 2004 budget.

"Once again, the executive branch fails to comply with a mandate from Congress to increase resources for education, with the goal of eventually reaching funding equivalent to 8% of GDP in 2006," said a statement from the education committee (Comision de Educacion) in the Chamber of Deputies.

Furthermore, the committee criticized the Fox government for proposing to channel some of the increased expenditures in education to "unnecessary bureaucratic costs," such as a higher budget for public relations for the Secretaria de Educacion Publica (SEP).

The full Chamber of Deputies is expected to consider an increase in funding for education, but even the legislative branch may not be able to boost federal allocations by the 87 billion pesos (US$7.6 billion) needed this year to comply with the goals established by Congress to meet the target of 8% of GDP. Education funding will be competing with other social programs, even though Mexico continues to enjoy a windfall from higher-than- expected oil-export revenues. Those additional revenues have been earmarked for allocation to state governments and payments of the domestic and foreign debt.

Responding to the criticisms, Public Education Secretary Reyes Tamez Guerra said the Fox government is not in a position to meet the congressional goals unless the Chamber of Deputies and the Senate approve comprehensive tax reforms to allow the government to increase revenues. He said the lack of revenues also blocked Mexico from matching the expenditures of other developing countries like South Korea, Chile, Poland, and Hungary.

"We have to continue efforts to boost investment [in education]," said Tamez Guerra. "But we will not be able to catch up to the other countries as long as our GDP remains stagnant and as long as we lack structural reforms to allow us to boost revenues."

Expenditures also lag for higher education

The debate about funding levels also extends to higher education, where Mexico devotes less than half the average funding levels for OECD countries. OECD statistics show the government's funding for public higher education amounts to about US$4,000 per student, compared with the average of US$10,000 for OECD countries. This is despite the heavily subsidized college tuition at the Universidad Nacional Autonoma de Mexico (UNAM) and other public universities. A government effort to raise tuition and fees slightly in 1999 was met with a massive demonstration (see SourceMex, 1999-06-02 and 2000-01-26).

In its 2005 budget plan, the Fox government has proposed minor reductions in expenditures for higher education. The plan would reduce funding to public colleges and universities to the equivalent of 0.48% of GDP, compared with about 0.50% of GDP in 2004. Expenditures for research in science and technology, which are separate from the higher-education budget, would decline to 0.35% of GDP, compared with 0.38% of GDP last year.

"I cannot remain silent when the government each year reduces rather than increases the budgets for research and development and science and technology," UNAM rector Juan Ramon de la Fuente said during a meeting with Tamez Guerra and Public Health Secretary Julio Frenk Mora.

The UNAM rector has received the support of the Instituto Politecnio Nacional (IPN) and the Asociacion Nacional de Universidades e Instituciones de Educacion Superior (ANUIES). ANUIES president Jorge Luis Ibarra Mendivil said the government has to increase expenditures for higher education by about 55 billion pesos (US$4.8 billion) this year to meet the needs of colleges and universities.

"The federal budget lacks resources to expand enrollment or to improve the quality of education," said Ibarra Mendivil. "The lack of funding also affects our strategy to implement structural changes to pensions and retirements [for university employees]," he added. [Note: Peso-dollar conversions in this article are based on the Interbank rate in effect on Sept. 22, reported at 11.40 pesos per US$1.00] (Sources: The Dallas Morning News, 11/19/02; Reforma, 09/17/03; The Washington Post, 11/24/03; World Bank press release, 07/01/04; El Financiero, Agencia de noticias Proceso, 09/14/04, 09/21/04; Notimex, Los Angeles Times, 09/21/04; La Jornada, 09/15/04, 09/22/04; El Universal, 09/15/04, 09/21/04, 09/22/04; La Cronica de Hoy, 09/22/04)

Jethro Tull  posted on  2007-05-30   11:40:15 ET  (1 image) Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#87. To: richard9151 (#84)

IT WILL BE EASY TO CLOSE OUR BORDERS TO THOSE MEX HORDES.

Yes it will be, if that's what we want, and we are willing to accept the consequences.

The people of Mèxico, hard as you find it to believe, are just people who want to eat, and live, and make little babies,

Of course they are.

they are not your enemy.

They can prove that by leaving. Nothing less will suffice. But it's really beside the point. Mexicans ruin areas for white Americans not because they want to, but because of who they are.

AND EVERY OTHER CAPITAL CITY UNDER THE CONTROL OF THE NEW WORLD ORDER.

But of course.

I admire the steps that Mèxico takes that ensure that anyone entering into Mèxico and planning to stay has a means of supporting themselves. Very intelligent.

Indeed. I also approve of their use of the military in this regard ( except for the rapes and robbery.) I disapprove of the aid the Mexican government gives to Mexicans who want to move north.

But hey, it is just a Mèxican plot, right?

A confluence of interests, rather.

HERE IS A SHOCKER FOR YOU, JETHRO! THEY HAVE LOTS AND LOTS OF SCHOOLS IN MÈXICO!!

Which can only do a small amount of good, in light of the lower average IQ of Mexicans, shorter time preference, and higher impulsiveness. Mexico is not poor and backwards because of corruption and false leadership. Mexico is poor, backwards, and corrupt because of Mexicans.

The same is true of America's ills. But they are our ills.

Don't waste your pucker on some all-thing sucker.

Tauzero  posted on  2007-05-30   11:42:00 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  



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