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Religion
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Title: ROMANS 13 - THE TWO MINUTE REBUTTAL
Source: [None]
URL Source: http://romans13.embassyofheaven.com/2minute.htm
Published: Sep 22, 2007
Author: Embassy of Heaven
Post Date: 2007-09-22 22:15:01 by AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt
Keywords: Christianity, Resistance
Views: 1435
Comments: 69

The Two Minute Rebuttal

Romans 13

Let's say Apostle Paul was telling the Church, "Be subject to the secular government," which at that time was the Roman Empire. And he was also saying, "Rome is not a terror to good works, but to the evil. The Roman centurion does not swing his sword in vain. Therefore, do good and you shall have praise of the same."

I pose only one question, Why was Apostle Paul beheaded by a Roman Centurion if he was preaching, "Be subject to Rome"? The Roman government would have no cause to behead him.

On the other hand, if Paul was beheaded because he was an "evildoer," why is an "evildoer" writing in our Holy Book? We better purge him out of there. We better clean up the Holy Scriptures. We better remove Romans 13 because it was written by an "evildoer."

No, I don't believe for a minute that Paul was telling the Church to be subject to the Roman Empire. Nor do I believe Paul was an evildoer. Paul was beheaded for promoting a rival government. It has to be. The secular authorities killed him because he was establishing another government, the Kingdom of Heaven.

Paul would be a hypocrite if he were saying to obey the secular authorities in Romans 13. It is inconsistent with his other writings. In Romans 12, Paul tells us, "do not be conformed to this world" (Romans 12:2). Obeying the secular authorities certainly means conforming to the world. In 2 Corinthians, Chapter 6:14-17, Paul says, "Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers, for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? . . . Come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you." We cannot cut our ties with the world and still be subject to them. "We ought to obey God rather than men" (Acts 5:29).

What is the study of the Holy Bible from beginning to end? It is God's people rebelling against Him and seeking to be like the Kingdoms of this world. Again and again, they are brought into harsh slavery because of their disobedience. Chasing after the Kingdoms of this world leads to death. Only the Kingdom of Heaven is an everlasting government.

Christ's government is here right now. It is His government that every soul is to be subject to. Turn away from sin and come out from the governments of the world. "Be subject unto the higher powers within Ecclesia, within Christ's government." (See Hebrews 13:7 and 13:17).

http://romans13.embassyofheaven.com/2minute.htm

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Begin Trace Mode for Comment # 31.

#17. To: AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt (#0)

Great post. Additionally, people ALWAYS read the first part of the passage and leave off the rest. The remaining part of the scripture tells us what type of ruler it is we are to follow...one that does GODS work and is a terror to evil.

3 For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to evil. Do you want to be unafraid of the authority? Do what is good, and you will have praise from the same. 4 For he is God’s minister to you for good. But if you do evil, be afraid; for he does not bear the sword in vain; for he is God’s minister, an avenger to execute wrath on him who practices evil.

The rulers we are supposed to follow as Christians, and represenatives in this government are completely different...I don't believe GOD wants us folowing rulers that think it's OK to murder 50 million babies, teach our children the wonders of the "gay" lifestlye, ingage and adultry, lies, murder without conscience, have removed GOD from every vestage of our government, have killed over 1 million innocent Iraq men, women and children, lied us into wars for the enrichment of the "military industrial complex", done experiments on unsuspecting portions of our population without there knowledge...you get the picture. NO...I firmly believe that we are about to experiance GOD's judgement for the very reason we DIDN'T stand up against these things.

Freedomsnotfree  posted on  2007-09-23   13:09:08 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#21. To: Freedomsnotfree (#17)

he rulers we are supposed to follow as Christians, and represenatives in this government are completely different...I don't believe GOD wants us folowing rulers that think it's OK to murder 50 million babies, teach our children the wonders of the "gay" lifestlye, ingage and adultry, lies, murder without conscience, have removed GOD from every vestage of our government, have killed over 1 million innocent Iraq men, women and children, lied us into wars for the enrichment of the "military industrial complex", done experiments on unsuspecting portions of our population without there knowledge...you get the picture.

absolutely agree.

NO...I firmly believe that we are about to experiance GOD's judgement for the very reason we DIDN'T stand up against these things.

Some DID stand up against these things, but things seem to have gotten out of hand. God foresaw this as well, and I believe He will step in, one way or the other:

Deu 32:36 For the LORD shall judge his people, and repent himself for his servants, when he seeth that [their] power is gone, and [there is] none shut up, or left. [unsure what this last phrase means]

Deu 32:37 And he shall say, Where [are] their gods, [their] rock in whom they trusted,

Deu 32:38 Which did eat the fat of their sacrifices, [and] drank the wine of their drink offerings? let them rise up and help you, [and] be your protection.

Deu 32:39 See now that I, [even] I, [am] he, and [there is] no god with me: I kill, and I make alive; I wound, and I heal: neither [is there any] that can deliver out of my hand.

Deu 32:40 For I lift up my hand to heaven, and say, I live for ever.

Deu 32:41 If I whet my glittering sword, and mine hand take hold on judgment; I will render vengeance to mine enemies, and will reward them that hate me.

Deu 32:42 I will make mine arrows drunk with blood, and my sword shall devour flesh; [and that] with the blood of the slain and of the captives, from the beginning of revenges upon the enemy.

Deu 32:43 Rejoice, O ye nations, [with] his people: for he will avenge the blood of his servants, and will render vengeance to his adversaries, and will be merciful unto his land, [and] to his people.

Some passages in the Bible do seem to indicate judgment on us. However, I see many more passages that would indicate rather than judgment [after all, we HAVE been afflicted for over 400 years at this point: Genesis 15:13-14/Gal. 3:29] DELIVERANCE from this yoke.....at least for those who bear the seal of God, and are not busy worshipping the Beast.

Eze 9:3 ¶ And the glory of the God of Israel was gone up from the cherub, whereupon he was, to the threshold of the house. And he called to the man clothed with linen, which [had] the writer's inkhorn by his side;

Eze 9:4 And the LORD said unto him, Go through the midst of the city, through the midst of Jerusalem, and set a mark upon the foreheads of the men that sigh and that cry for all the abominations that be done in the midst thereof.

Eze 9:5 And to the others he said in mine hearing, Go ye after him through the city, and smite: let not your eye spare, neither have ye pity:

Eze 9:6 Slay utterly old [and] young, both maids, and little children, and women: but come not near any man upon whom [is] the mark; and begin at my sanctuary. Then they began at the ancient men which [were] before the house.

Eze 9:7 And he said unto them, Defile the house, and fill the courts with the slain: go ye forth. And they went forth, and slew in the city.

http://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/Eze/Eze009.html#4

http://www.blueletterbible.org/tsk_b/Eze/9/4.html

Mat 13:41 The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity;

http://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/Mat/Mat013.html#41

There was a passage I was looking for, couldn't find, and then I had another that connected to a lot of related verses that would have been helpful to post here, but I must have deleted it. I need to take a break today, so I can't spend much time right now trying to find it again, but here is one I have not used before, and it is along the same lines:

Zep 3:14 ¶ Sing, O daughter of Zion; shout, O Israel; be glad and rejoice with all the heart, O daughter of Jerusalem.

Zep 3:15 The LORD hath taken away thy judgments, he hath cast out thine enemy: the king of Israel, [even] the LORD, [is] in the midst of thee: thou shalt not see evil any more.

Zep 3:16 In that day it shall be said to Jerusalem, Fear thou not: [and to] Zion, Let not thine hands be slack.

Zep 3:17 The LORD thy God in the midst of thee [is] mighty; he will save, he will rejoice over thee with joy; he will rest in his love, he will joy over thee with singing.

Zep 3:18 I will gather [them that are] sorrowful for the solemn assembly, [who] are of thee, [to whom] the reproach of it [was] a burden.

Zep 3:19 Behold, at that time I will undo all that afflict thee: and I will save her that halteth, and gather her that was driven out; and I will get them praise and fame in every land where they have been put to shame.

Zep 3:20 At that time will I bring you [again], even in the time that I gather you: for I will make you a name and a praise among all people of the earth, when I turn back your captivity before your eyes, saith the LORD.

http://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/Zep/Zep003.html#11

Thank you for your input.

AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt  posted on  2007-09-23   14:14:50 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#30. To: AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt (#21)

Throughout the entire old testament GOD judged his people because of the corrupt leaders they allowed to rule over them. Whether the leaders were corrupt and lead the people astray or whether the people became corrupt and tolerated corrupt leaders the outcome was always the same...judgement.

I believe this land was a gift from GOD to his people. Those who initially settled this new land did so for the advancement and glory of Jesus Christ. Our legal system was based on the old testament and our moral conduct was founded on the 10 commandments. Our monatary system was biblical...based on silver and gold. We have taken this gift of freedom, abundance and this GOD given land and sold it to mammon. Government is the GOD today and commercialism is our ruler. I firmly believe GOD will judge this nation severly, we are no different than his children in the past, and GOD doesn't change. Will he intervene at some point? He tells us he will, but make no mistake, there will be a price for our indifferance.

We are seeing prophecy being fulfilled before our eyes...ever wonder how you have been shown the times we live in while others have no idea. 2 Thess 10 tells us that "for those who have not received the love of the truth, GOD would send them a strong delusion that they would believe the lie". Stay strong in the faith and thanks for your help spreading the good news of peace and salvation through our LORD and savior, Jesus the Christ.

Freedomsnotfree  posted on  2007-09-23   16:36:05 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#31. To: Freedomsnotfree (#30)

2 Thess 10 tells us that "for those who have not received the love of the truth, GOD would send them a strong delusion that they would believe the lie"

... and those who think they hold the truth.. have been given the delusion and they have believed.

Zipporah  posted on  2007-09-23   16:38:25 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


Replies to Comment # 31.

#33. To: Zipporah (#31)

can't disagree with that statement...look at bush. Thats we should always turn toward GODS word for clarification and instruction.

Freedomsnotfree  posted on  2007-09-23 16:44:44 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


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