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Title: Does Beheading Hurt? Yup!
Source:
The Independent
URL Source: http://news.independent.co.uk/uk/this_britain/article324061.ece
Published: Sep 29, 2007
Author: Unknown
Post Date: 2007-09-29 11:42:50 by YertleTurtle
Keywords: None
Views: 281
Comments: 4
Yes. A medical study in 1983 concluded that no matter how efficient the method of execution, a few seconds of pain is inevitable when losing one's head. The guillotine, considered one of the more "humane" methods, relies on severing the brain and spinal cord after cutting the surrounding tissues. Even so, at least two to three seconds of intense pain cannot be avoided. There are many accounts of the heads of executed people continuing to show movement or expression long after the final blow. One particularly gruesome experiment in 1905 involved a French physician who called out the name of the condemned man in the seconds after decapitation. The response was for the eyelids over the severed head to slowly lift up and then the pupils focused on the doctor before then slowly closing again. The doctor claimed that when he repeated the dead man's name, the same actions took place. It was only at the third attempt that the head gave no response. The exact of amount of pain of course relies on the proficiency of the executioner. When Mary Queen of Scots was beheaded in 1587, the axeman took three attempts to sever the head and even then had to finish the job with a knife.
Poster Comment: No wonder I don't like doctors.
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#1. To: YertleTurtle (#0)
like the Mother Goose Nursery Rhyme: I do not like thee, Doctor Fell, Ron Paul for President - Join a Ron Paul Meetup group today!
"Hello, hello there! Do you know your head's been cut off?" "Huh, what?" "Yep, your head's sitting on a plate. So, how's it going?" "Oh, Lord, just leave me alone, will you? You're a doctor, go find someone else to torture."
"He is a very shallow critic who cannot see an eternal rebel in the heart of a conservative." - G.K. Chesterton
Seems I've heard before that the head can remain conscious for up to 10 seconds after decapitaiton. Sick.
Law Enforcement Against Prohibition FOX'S BOOK OF MARTYRS CHAPTER XI An Account of the Persecutions in the Netherlands "...George Scherter, a minister of Salzburg, was apprehended and committed to prison for instructing his flock in the knowledge of the Gospel. While he was in confinement he wrote a confession of his faith; soon after which he was condemned, first to be beheaded, and afterward to be burnt to ashes. On his way to the place of execution he said to the spectators, "That you may know I die a true Christian, I will give you a sign." This was indeed verified in a most singular manner; for after his head was cut off, the body lying a short space of time with the belly to the ground, it suddenly turned upon the back, when the right foot crossed over t he left, as did also the right arm over the left: and in this manner it remained until it was committed to the flames....." www.ccel.org/f/foxe/martyrs/fox111.htm oh, why stop there.... "...covert shipment of 100,000 Guillotines to a Montana site over 4 years ago...and the subsequent appearance of those same guillotines across America at MILITARY bases! (I had 4 other eye-witnesses/informers ALL in active-or formerly in- military intelligence positions.... www.theforbiddenknowledge...uillotines_in_montana.htm "D. Reid Revelation Beheading Prophecy - Guillotines Already in USA Sun Apr 17, 2005 15:17 Revelation Beheading Prophecy - Guillotines Already in USA "And I saw thrones, and they that sat on them. And judgment was given to them, and to the souls of the ones having been beheaded because of the witness of Jesus, and because of the Word of God, and who had not worshipped the beast nor its image, and had not received the mark on their forehead and on their hand. Revelation 20:4 Actually Woody, there were news stories concerning these "Guillotines" all over the place. National news...but I can't remember EXACTLY where I heard it. The fact that it WAS announced is a matter of history now Woody, I have had several people E-Mail me concerning this news since I made this prediction several years ago. In or around 1991, a convoy of military transport vehicles, manned by a group of marines, transported close to 100,000 units of SOMETHING...in CRATES...headed for a supposedely "closed" military base in Montana. This was a SECRET mission. As part of the crew was the son of a family friend of, one of my oldest Seattle friends (also a client). When they reached their drop-off point the drivers were BLINDFOLDED and taken to a holding facility. This young man was a little disturbed by the whole charade (oh those impetuous youth) and, determined to get a close look, asked the Seargent-at-arms if he could relieve himself. After being escorted to the head, the seargent waited out of sight of the door. This man then took a peek out a nearby window to see what the big deal was. What he saw shocked him! He came back and afterward related this to his mother. This is how I first came into this information. What this young man saw was a crate being emptied of it's contents...and those contents...a FULL SIZED GUILLOTINE, Woody! This was no oversizzed cheese slicer! But the sordid story gets DEEPER. This is a CONSPIRACY Woody, because it has been ORCHESTRATED to look like a natural "evolution" of capital punishment from gas, lethal injection and electrocution TO the USE OF GUILLOTINES...but it is NOT. We are being set up!" TO READ THE REST OF THIS REVEALING ARTICLE CLICK ON THIS LINK: groups.yahoo.com/group/wisepeople/message/1983 Guillotine Update "[Many people] Since 1996, have been consistently investigating, confirming and reporting that there are thousands of prisoner boxcars with shackles, manufactured out of Portland, OR, by GUNDERSON STEEL FABRICATION (and other separate boxcar manufacturing companies / operations located nationwide.) I have interviewed many eye-witnesses to these prisoner boxcars. There are several varieties of prisoner boxcars, ranging from all new, metal, modern versions higher than average boxcars to refurbished older boxcars. Some have the modern guillotines (imported from Japan and China) installed in them, others do not. But ALL have shackles installed to restrain prisoners. One variety of prisoner boxcars has been imported from China, in the form of 40 foot cargo containers, with shackles installed and a modern guillotine at the head of each one. Their TRUE intentions are easily concealed from public scrutiny and have no windows. For all practical purposes, they appear to be normal Chinese cargo containers (like HANJIN, COSCO, etc.) that can be piggybacked on train flatbeds or trucks. It has been reported to me that originally 20,000 of these prisoner cargo containers were ordered from China. These were ordered under secret contract through one cooperating Congressman who met with officials in China. (And you WONDER why NWO supporters like Clinton and Bush Sr. and Jr. have had "love affairs" with China??? China, through supplying these prisoner boxcars, has just enabled them to more speedily terminate the hated resisters of their NewWorld Order!) Some prisoner boxcars have been observed in Montana, at one point near Columbia Falls in the Glacier area. Personal friends taking a missionary journey across America stumbled upon them during a picture-taking expedition in the forest near Columbia Falls. My friend Marie recounted, "We were following the railroad tracks into the forest, so that we would not get lost and could find out way out. We were surprised as we followed them deeper into the woods to discover boxcars, looking out of place and all painted black. Suspicious, we decided to look inside one if we could. We saw one that had a door partially open. We struggled to slide it open all the way, and when our eyes adjusted to the dark interior, what we saw shocked us. There were rows of shackles installed in the boxcar. My friend Rose pointed to the end of the boxcar and I said, 'Rose, what IS that?'" "She replied, 'Why, Marie, don't you SEE what that is??? IT IS A GUILLOTINE!' " I also met with Lee, a metal worker who admitted that there had been a "boxcar with shackles" operation in Glasgow, MT that employed summer youth workers one year to help weld shackles into boxcars. From there, they were shipped west, through Cut Bank and on to remote areas around Glacier to remain concealed until the hour of martial law takeover and their deployment. (These are the older boxcars that have been refurbished and painted black.) One eye-witness from the Cut Bank Indian reservation personally observed these boxcars as they slowly passed through his reservation, noting the doors on some still open and the shackles plainly in view. Disturbed about what he saw, he reported this to a Montana Christian intecessors' group, which reported this to me in person in Bozeman, MT. Truckers also know some deadly secrets of the New World Order agenda for America. In the course of traveling thousands of miles across America to research this subject, I have interviewed many truckers and their contacts. They have admitted to me personally that they or their trucker buddies have delivered shipments of the MODERN GUILLOTINES, manufactured in China and Japan, and unloaded on the loading docks of San Diego and other west coast ports of entry. Guillotine shipments have been going on in earnest for many years now, and eyewitness sightings have increased. Military sources have admitted helping unload such deadly cargoes at military facilities, to be stored in warehouse for the hour of NWO/UN takeover. Personal friends I have interviewed in Washington State have seen the guillotines in the back of one truck. Two state troopers pulled over a truck on the highway these eyewitnesses were traveling on. They were detained by this. They watched as the trucker led the troopers to the back of the truck and broke the seal and opened the doors to disclose the contents. "We were shocked to see that the truck was filled from front to back with nothing but guillotines!" Satisfied, the troopers then left. These people in the car behind the truck came out to talk with the trucker. He was terrified over what his truck contained: it was a sealed shipment. He had not been informed of his deadly cargo! The eyewitnesses recounted, "He was so shocked he turned in his truck and his papers and refused to even deliver his shipment and simply walked away..." (These eyewitnesses are solid Christians living in Spokane, WA.) This is the end-time hour in which we live, friends. And in order to have mass beheading terminations of so many Christian resisters of the NWO, you must have the tools with which to do it. Bible prophecy, even that of negative implications for Christians, will be fulfilled regardless of whether we like it or not. And the guillotines ARE HERE!" Source: web004.webspace4you.ch/~s...docs/200301_schuffert.htm GUILLOTINES CAN LOOK DIFFERENTLY. THE MAIN THING TO LOOK FOR IS THE BLADE THAT COMES DOWN. IF THE PHOTO OF A GUILLOTINE ABOVE IS NOT VISIBLE, TO SEE ONE CLICK ON THE LINK BELOW. www.surfingtheapocalypse....-bin/forum.cgi?read=69297 While some people are in denial that there could be beheadings of people in the U.S.A., it could happen. Think about all of the drastic changes that have occurred just since the 9/11 attacks. Even before those attacks there was proposed legislation to start using guillotines for death penalty executions. With the way the court system is set up and run now, it is entirely possible for innocent people, such as Christians and Patriots, to be framed for crimes that have the death penalty and then the court process to be corrupt to result in a guilty verdict. Christians and Patriots should be especially interested in the court system being wisely reformed. I'm running a court reforms movement. Would you like to participate? A first step would be to join the yahoo group I moderate, which is named Wise People. There are other ways to help too, such as spreading the word about this court reforms movement. The educational websites are listed below in the e-mail signature." www.apfn.net/messageboard...05/discussion.cgi.16.html -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Georgia: Bill to replace electric chair with guillotine www.theforbiddenknowledge...orgia_bill_guillotine.htm USATODAY.com - ***** Supreme Court considers pain of lethal injection A majority of the Supreme Court justices expressed concern Wednesday about whether condemned inmates experience excruciating pain during lethal injections. asp.usatoday.com/community/utils/idmap/13526938.story America's New Government Church Noahide Law regulations call for the decapitation of practicing Christians ...... Why a devout Catholic like Justice **** Scalia would promote Talmud-based law is not clear. ....Jewish Law, www.jlaw.com/Commentary/SupremeChutzpah.html cached at ... www.come-and-hear.com/editor/america_1.html Death Penalty and Talmud Law, Part 1: Sentence and Execution Noahide Law regulations require that idolaters (such as Christians) be put to death [by decapitation]...... "Interest of the Amici Curiae": www.jlaw.com/Briefs/capital1.html ... www.come-and-hear.com/editor/capunish_1.html : ".... **** In 1991, Congress declared the Talmud's Noahide Laws were the basis "upon which our great Nation was founded." Noahide Law regulations require that idolaters (such as Christians) be put to death. See America's New Government Church......" ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- "....Jewish Law - Legal Briefs - US Supreme Court ("Bryan v. Moore2") C. Decapitation and Strangulation Were Intended To Be Quick and Relatively Painless Forms of Execution. The Mishna (Sanhedrin 52b) describes execution by decapitation – which was invoked primarily for murderers – as the same form of capital punishment that was used at the time by civil rulers under the Roman legal system. The condemned person’s trachea and esophagus were severed with a sharp sword so that he would die instantly. When one rabbi of the Mishna suggested that it was too demeaning to the accused to be executed in a standing position because his body would slump to the floor and that, instead, his head should be positioned on a wooden chopping-block and removed with an ax, the majority of the rabbis responded that this was impermissible because it could result in even greater mutilation. This discussion on the subject of decapitation reveals again how conscious the rabbis were of the obligations (1) to impose rapid death, (2) to minimize pain, and (3) to avoid mutilation. In actual administration of this form of execution, they sought to achieve these objectives. The discussion of this form of execution was again concluded with the previously cited observation, attributed to one Rabbi Nachman, quoting Rabba the son of Avuha: "Scripture states, ‘You shall love your fellow as yourself’ so that you must choose for him a humane death." This admonition is repeated in the Talmudic tractates Pesachim (75a) and Ketubot (37a)......" www.jlaw.com/Briefs/capital2.html ....In 1999, the US Supreme Court accepted a death penalty brief based wholly on Talmud law. The advocates say the Talmud has a better way. Does it?...." "...This is the first in a 4-part series on the Death Penalty and Talmud Law. Supreme Court Considers Talmudic Law In December 1999, the United States Supreme Court set a precedent by accepting for consideration an amicus curiae brief in a death penalty case (Bryan v. Moore). Aside from mentioning the Eighth Amendment of the US Constitution in passing, the brief was based wholly on Talmud law. The Jewish Journal reports: A man who will argue before the U.S. Supreme Court next year that his planned execution in Florida's electric chair constitutes "cruel and unusual punishment" can point to a 2,000-year-old Jewish law when he pleads his case. A friend-of-the court brief filed last week in the Supreme Court by the National Jewish Commission on Law and Public Affairs, which advocates the position of the Orthodox community, and the American Section of the International Association of Jewish Lawyers and Jurists, backs Anthony Bryan's position. In citing only Jewish law and excluding any reference to previous Supreme Court decisions, the brief is believed to mark a first for America's highest court. The brief, written by the father-daughter team of Nathan and Alyza Lewin and reviewed by former Israeli Supreme Court Justice Menachem Elon, delves into the biblical and talmudic texts relating to execution in Jewish law. — The Jewish Journal (7) The Brief in a Nutshell A copy of the brief is available at the Jewish Law website. (9) Lawyers Nathan and Alyza Lewin make it clear that their clients (two Jewish law advocacy groups) are not arguing for the return of Talmud execution methods, such as stoning. Rather, the advocates say that the humanitarianism of Talmud law should serve as our exemplar. In a nutshell, the brief states that the Talmud Sages wanted the death penalty: * To be as quick as possible * To be as painless as possible * To cause as little disfigurement as possible * To preserve the dignity of the condemned * To be within the framework of Biblical texts In addition, the brief states that: * Capital punishment was rarely imposed because Talmudic justice comprises stringent rules regarding the admissibility and sufficiency of evidence: o A court of at least 23 judges must be satisfied that a capital crime has occurred o Two witnesses must see and testify to the crime o The witness must be subjected to detailed and searching interrogation * Rarely did capital cases meet the prescribed legal standard In the concluding paragraph of the brief, the advocates return to the theme of Talmud humanitarianism: ***** CONCLUSION: If execution by the electric chair, as administered in Florida, results in unnecessary pain and disfigurement, it would be unacceptable under the principles underlying the traditional Jewish legal system applied 2000 years ago, and should also be unacceptable under the Eighth Amendment today....." [note: I'd have to check it out, but I think Noahide Law does not require 2 witnesses, but only one "righteous" witness, to be determined by the Pharisees] ....."Along with Justices Ginsburg and Breyer, Justice Scalia attended the Kosher dinner held at the Supreme Court building on November 5, 2002, to mark the founding if the Washington-based National Institute for Judaic Law. See US v. Talmud Law. In 1993 a death penalty case (Herrera v. Collins) Scalia wrote that a condemned man awaiting execution did not have a right to another trial even if new evidence showed he was actually innocent of the crime. Scalia reasoned that because the condemned man's original trial had been free from procedural error, he'd have to die anyway, guilty or not. "There is no basis in text, tradition, or even in contemporary practice (if that were enough), for finding in the Constitution a right to demand judicial consideration of newly discovered evidence of innocence brought forward after conviction......" ".... — Babylonian Talmud, Tractate Sanhedrin 52b Soncino 1961 Edition, page 356 — Decapitated With Sword or Axe MISHNAH. EXECUTION BY THE SWORD WAS PERFORMED THUS: THE CONDEMNED MAN WAS DECAPITATED BY THE SWORD, AS IS DONE BY THE CIVIL AUTHORITIES. R. JUDAH SAID: THIS IS A HIDEOUS DISFIGUREMENT; BUT HIS HEAD WAS LAID ON A BLOCK AND SEVERED WITH AN AXE. THEY REPLIED, NO DEATH IS MORE DISFIGURING THAN THIS. — Babylonian Talmud, Tractate Sanhedrin, 52b Soncino 1961 Edition, page 354 It is noteworthy that decapitation — the most disfiguring form of execution in opinion of the rabbis — is mandated for non-Jews who break the rabbinical Noahide Laws (see Sanhedrin 56a). For more information on the Noahide Laws, see America's New Government Church......" [On hanging....] "...How were the bodies hanged? MISHNAH. HOW IS HE HANGED? — THE POST IS SUNK INTO THE GROUND WITH A [CROSS-] PIECE BRANCHING OFF [AT THE TOP]. AND HE BRINGS HIS HANDS TOGETHER ONE OVER THE OTHER AND HANGS HIM UP [THEREBY]. R. JOSE SAID: THE POST IS LEANED AGAINST THE WALL, AND HE HANGS HIM UP AFTER THE FASHION OF BUTCHERS … — Babylonian Talmud, Tractate Sanhedrin 46a Soncino 1961 Edition, page 304 Those already dead can feel no pain, so hanging a dead man's body "after the fashion of butchers" cannot be deemed cruel. However, we might expect his body would become even more disfigured by a post-mortem hanging; certainly a post-mortem hanging would do nothing to preserve the dignity of the deceased. To the modern mind, the only conceivable purpose for this "hanging" would be to shame the corpse and thereby ***** frighten the general public into conforming behavior....." www.come-and-hear.com/editor/capunish_1.html =================================================================== The Brain Death Controversy in Jewish Law Rabbi Yitzchok A. Breitowitz "....The rapid, and near universal, acceptance of neurological criteria of death is probably attributable to three factors. First, moving the time of death to an earlier point ***** facilitates organ transplants, and indeed makes such transplants possible. Organs, especially hearts and livers, are suitable for transplantation only if they are removed at a time when blood is still circulating. *****Once cardiac arrest stops circulation, rapid tissue degeneration makes the organ unsuitable for such use. Given the increasing success of these operations and the relative uselessness (from a secular standpoint!) of sustaining "brain dead" patients on respirators, there is a natural temptation to redefine death so that organs become available to serve higher ends. It is no coincidence that the movement towards acceptance of "brain death" coincided with the development of cyclosporine and other anti-rejection drugs. Additional considerations involve triage and allocation of scarce medical resource. It is extraordinarily expensive (in terms of equipment and labor) to maintain patients on respirators and other life support and using these resources for "brain dead" patients prevents their deployment for those who stand a better chance of recovery. Yet a third impetus towards redefinition is an understandable desire to spare families the agony and anguish of watching a loved one experience a protracted death. For whatever the reason, the current definition of "death" is now a composite one death is deemed to occur when there is either irreversible cessation of circulatory and respiratory functions (the "old" definition) or irreversible cessation of all functions of the entire brain including the brain stem.5...... ... Briefly stated, the Mishnah in Oholot establishes the dual propositions that, first, ****physical decapitation of an animal is a conclusive indicator of death and second, some degree of subsequent movement is nit incompatible with a finding of death provided that such movement qualifies as spastic in nature (pirchis be'alma) like the twitching of the "severed tail of a lizard." The Talmud in Yoma 85a, detailing with a person trapped under a building, rules that a determination of respiratory failure establishes death without the need to continue to uncover the debris to check heartbeat. Proponents of "brain death" argue that a dysfunctional brain-stem is equivalent to a decapitated one (physiological decapitation), that destruction of the brain-stem inevitably means inability to spontaneously respire (meeting the criterion in Yoma) and that subsequent "movement," whether the Lazarus Reflex or the heartbeat, falls into category of pirchus since such movement is not coordinated from a "central root and point of origin,"14 ie., the brain. The counter-arguments are: first, physiological dysfunction is not the equivalent of anatomical decapitation. The only phenomenon short of actual decapitation that might similarly qualify is total liquefaction (lysis) of the brain, something that probably does not occur until well after cardiac arrest..... www.jlaw.com/Articles/brain.html [iow, 2 or 3 seconds of intense pain vs. the electric chair and lethal injections means that decapitation is the only way to properly and humanely cull the herd with the most profit [the "herd"...i.e., us useless eaters, soon to be without jobs and many boomers about to overwhelm "social security"] and with a side benefit of producing "conforming behavior" in the rebels!! The Bush family, once again, should make out like bandits, German-born George (Scherff) Sr. having signed the law into effect, with jr. ballyhooing it every year, and having bought up a lot of TRANSPLANT HOSPITALS...it's a win, win situation for them, and a lose, lose your head situation for us, IF it should come to that.] Was there ever a more demented or evil group of people. Rightly so did Jesus call them the Synagogue of Satan.
The reason why I cannot tell;
But this I know, and know full well,
I do not like thee, Doctor Fell.
#2. To: robin (#1)
(Edited)
#3. To: YertleTurtle (#0)
"There is no 'legitimate' Corporation by virtue of it's very legal definition and purpose."
-- IndieTx
#4. To: YertleTurtle (#0)
related story....
Please cite the statute or law, and source and document your >>information or its all hot air, Dorian. What guillotines? Got >>any pictures?
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