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Dead Constitution
See other Dead Constitution Articles

Title: Are Ed and Elaine Brown Dead?
Source: Keene Free Press
URL Source: http://www.keenefreepress.com/mambo ... ent&task=view&id=630&Itemid=36
Published: Oct 6, 2007
Author: Kat Kanning
Post Date: 2007-10-07 12:39:01 by JiminyC
Keywords: None
Views: 3032
Comments: 258

Are Ed and Elaine Brown dead? We don't know - the government won't tell where they are, so we cannot verify their condition. If Ed and Elaine had been hurt during their arrest, it would be in the government's interest to withhold this information, since they obviously fear a violent reaction to the arrest from Brown supporters. Until the government chooses to divulge information on the Brown's whereabouts, we will be unable to verify their condition and will have to assume the worst.

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Begin Trace Mode for Comment # 193.

#56. To: all (#0) (Edited)

When dealing with something like the Browns, it is important to recognize that more than one issue is in play, and therefore, we should attempt to delineate among those issues.

For some, this is a taxpayer protest issue.

For some, this is an issue of IRS and government excess.

For some, this is simply the government doing its job.

The evidence seems to suggest that the Browns were not classic tax protestors, but classic tax evaders. Most tax evaders acknowledge their wrong, negotiate a deal, pay a penalty and back taxes, and avoid criminal prosecution or sanctions. The percentage of federal prisoners who are in prison for taxes is truly small. Without addressing whether the income tax is legit, we do know that the Browns actively misrepresented their income in filings with the IRS. This is much different from tax protest. This is tax evasion.

Classic tax protestors refuse to acknowledge that the IRS and that the taxes sought are legitimate. I'm not going to attempt to address that notion, because there's not much to discuss. Whether the income tax is legitimate is a question that has been answered by those who are in a position to indict, prosecute and imprison dissenters. The courts, the IRS, the prosecutors, and most importantly, the public at large, accept the income tax and the right of the government to enforce it.

When someone like the Browns hides income, then files false information, then espouses tax protestor status, then talks of not being taken alive, they open themselves up for maximum grief and government retribution.

I do not like it when our government uses its muscle against citizens. However, when citizens openly challenge the government, they must recognize that there are ways to challenge the government that have legal and social acceptance, and those that do not. We have an accepted way. It's in the court house and in the court of public opinion. It is not playing at tax protestor, talking big, and drawing in a line in the dirt with the federal government.

I am appalled at the way the IRS and our government sometimes behave. I am also appalled at the way some pit bulls attack people. One should understand when and how to interact with the IRS and pit bulls, and also know when and how not to.

Paul Revere  posted on  2007-10-08   4:03:52 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

Certain criteria are expected of everyone in a free and transparent society which expects financial support from the citizens.

An honest response to the simple question "what law makes me liable for or subject to the income tax"; a question that has been asked by many people numerous times would be a good place to start.

While I remain ignorant of the Brown's particulars I question the methods being utilized by most government agencies that promote continued misconceptions on the part of citizens that have asked for clarification.

Further, confiscation of personal property, bank accounts, computer hard drives, and other materials necessary to litigate the issues prior to litigation deprive the citizen (individual) of due process and equal protection under the law. There is an articuable bias towards the IRS being demonstrated in most tax cases to such an extent that these hearings/trials operate as summary judgments independent of the evidence.

Simply put, we're instructed from childhood about how free we are, how we are the government, and how superior our system is to others that aren't predicated upon a written constitution which serves as the foundation for all other laws, regulations and codes. Our educational process doesn't include much effort towards our legal knowledge by the time we reach legal majority. More accurately stated we know nothing of the law or court procedures after completion of 12th Grade, yet we're bound to operate within the laws, which are plentiful. Even trained lawyers specialize in limited areas because there are so many categories to be addressed.

A system that demands the participation of everyone regardless of their intelligence or education level should be a simplified one to be fair and in the case of the IRS Code it doesn't appear that even the creators comprehend it.

Lastly, when the system of law doesn't appear to square with the fundamental (constitutional) law, and an individual with an alleged right to redress requests an answer to this discrepancy, incarceration, confiscation and litigation do not contribute much to the notion of honest and transparent government.

Our government forgives billions of dollars in debt annually, mostly that of foreigners while at the same time it pulls out all of the stops to prosecute its own citizens. Forgive me for calling a spade a spade, but regardless of the hidden principles upon which tax laws rely upon to justify collection, the people that operate to enforce them act contrary to all commonly accepted behavior conducive to a civilized society.

Ed and Elaine are just 2 more casualties of the federal notion of FREEDOM. I'm of the opinion that this behavior on the part of the IRS will continue until a violent revolution takes place because there appears to be no shortage of assholes who will do anything to obtain a pay check and the IRS has managed to hire a sufficient number of them.

I have been asked at times to explain withdrawal from the system to people that have become interested in the subject. I usually refuse because it's not a simple silver bullet sort of solution that is easily understood, nor does it make life simple. It becomes a way of life not enjoyed by the timid. I did it strictly because I determined the SSN fit all of the requirements of the Mark of the Beast that is described in the Bible. There are a lot of other reasons to be sure, but not many that instill the intestinal fortitude necessary to take on the federal government.

I determined that the penalty for accepting the Mark outweighed anything the government could do to me. So, my decision to withdraw completely from their system had little to do with the potential repurcussions government might impose, but upon the penalty God will impose.

Most people are able to convince themselves that my determination re. the Mark is in error especially when they come under pressure or decide the inconvenience is ludicrous. I don't blame them for their decision and subsequently I generally reject requests to proselytize the withdrawal process. I think anyone serious enough to withdraw must have the conviction and will to carry it out independent of me. I might add that it must be a spiritual conviction that supercedes all concerns one might have regarding freedom, materialism or life itself. The guys on the other side of the equation play for keeps, they've shown themselves to be callous murdering thugs and to underestimate them is fatal. To assist someone else in taking such a position is a responsiblity that I am not inclined to take mainly because people usually have the wrong motivation to begin with and secondly they usually do a half assed job of it and remain "in" the system.

My fervent hope is that the system will implode and afford the opportunity for people to opt out of any replacement system.

noone222  posted on  2007-10-08   7:55:11 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

You don't disagree with my post. You state that you have chosen to take your own path, with the risk to you that carries.

I think you're painfully wrong about several things, chiefly these two:

1. Your following anything said in the Bible, as if it matters to this issue. I don't believe the Bible is anything more than a collection of stories, legends, half truths, and dogma. Christianity and what it has "accomplished" through group think is more vile than the income tax.

2. Your allusions to the need for some violent overthrow of the system. We have a political system, and if you want to change the law, we have a way to address that. I'm a libertarian, not an anarchist, and certainly not a revolutionary. I favor massive reform of the taxing system, as I've stated in other posts, but I believe in effecting those changes through accepted political methods.

You follow an ancient text written by goatherders or stolen from Mesopotamia pagans, while speaking of others being brainwashed by tales told them since childhood. We live in this world, not the one you've constructed in your head, which only works as long as you - like the Browns - can avoid detection.

Paul Revere  posted on  2007-10-08   9:59:10 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

You're right, I don't disagree with your original post in the least. I do disagree with several things in this latest post though, but am not interested in addressing them here. The point I'd like to make above all is that the system itself is never inconvenienced even when it is stampeding rough shod over innocent people that are trying to comply with a set of policies that the policy makers themselves are unable to comprehend.

The system employed today does not meet the standards of lawful application that were etched into the constitution, and the responses from agencies responsible for implementing or enforcing the policies are non-existent except when litigated wherein no one knows any more after litigation than they did prior to it.

noone222  posted on  2007-10-08   13:39:21 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

You're right, I don't disagree with your original post in the least. I do disagree with several things in this latest post though, but am not interested in addressing them here. The point I'd like to make above all is that the system itself is never inconvenienced even when it is stampeding rough shod over innocent people that are trying to comply with a set of policies that the policy makers themselves are unable to comprehend.

The system employed today does not meet the standards of lawful application that were etched into the constitution, and the responses from agencies responsible for implementing or enforcing the policies are non-existent except when litigated wherein no one knows any more after litigation than they did prior to it.

I agree with your post.

We are being ruled by people who do whatever they want, and they justify it by criminalizing any who disagree. If someone asks a police officer why he's tasing another person, the questioner is not merely a citizen concerned about police abuse. He's a criminal interfering with an officer while said officer is making an arrest, probably for convulsing without a license.

Nowhere is this more prevalent than with the IRS when they target a person they consider a tax protestor.

The problem is that the public in general doesn't like the IRS or paying the income tax, but they also don't like it when someone else ignores the system they feel bound to follow. For this reason, tax protestors do not have widespread support. They have a very narrow vein of support, and that is only among those who understand the arguments made.

I think only by redirecting the populace away from the current system, and towards either a flat tax or a federal sales tax can we hope to end the current system. You can't do it with anything less than strong popular support. That means we need an idea that is so strong, it overwhelms the corporate lackeys who create, regulate and enforce the current tax system.

Paul Revere  posted on  2007-10-08   14:25:15 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

I think only by redirecting the populace away from the current system, and towards either a flat tax or a federal sales tax can we hope to end the current system.

A consumption tax is constitutional as long as it doesn't invade the privacy of the purchaser by attempting to require government I.D. to track the purchases for some reason or another, such as if a limit were set according to income or wage level by which a cut-off would take place.

The reason a consumption tax is legit is because one could decide not to make the purchase if one didn't want to pay the tax.

noone222  posted on  2007-10-08   21:29:23 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

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