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Neocon Nuttery
See other Neocon Nuttery Articles

Title: The Genesis of the Smears (JOHN COLE ASKS ABOUT FREEPER ICUWHATUDO)
Source: John Cole's Balloon Juice
URL Source: http://www.balloon-juice.com/?p=8849
Published: Oct 11, 2007
Author: John Cole
Post Date: 2007-10-11 14:47:37 by aristeides
Keywords: None
Views: 2466
Comments: 176

The Genesis of the Smears

By: John Cole October 11, 2007 at 12:53 pm

Appears to have been an aide to Mitch McConnell, according to the Communists at ThinkProgress:

ThinkProgress has obtained an email that congressional sources tell us was sent to reporters by Sen. McConnell’s communications director Don Stewart.

On Monday morning, Don Stewart sent an email with the following text to reporters:

Seen the latest blogswarm? Apparently, there’s more to the story on the kid (Graeme Frost) that did the Dems’ radio response on SCHIP. Bloggers have done a little digging and turned up that the Dad owns his own business (and the building it’s in), seems to have some commercial rental income and Graeme and a sister go to a private school that, according to its website, costs about $20k a year ‹for each kid‹ despite the news profiles reporting a family income of only $45k for the Frosts. Could the Dems really have done that bad of a job vetting this family?

In the email, Stewart attacks Democrats for allegedly doing a bad job “vetting this family.” That effort to blame Democrats for the smear campaign seems to have swayed some reporters, as CNN this morning claimed that the real story is that “the Democrats didn’t do as much of a vetting as they could have done.”

What is so surprising about all of this is not that all of the stuff in the leaked email has turned out to be completely false- that is just amusing. What is surprising is THE SPEED with which the “citizen journalists” ran with this, and echoed everything the leaked email did- just like good little soldiers. It was viral in no time.

I would not be surprised if Malkin, Limbaugh, and some folks at the NRO were not in the coterie of ‘reporters’ this was emailed to, nor would I be surprised if they got it from a friend of a friend (despite pretending to be different from the beltway crowd, all of the above are insiders to the Washington game, despite their protests otherwise). I’d like to know a little more about the freeper who ran with this in the first place, giving Michelle and others their “in” to run with the story without having to be the ones to take the blame for doing it. Who is icuwhatudo? What is her/his real identity? How is this person connected to the McConnell aide or the reporters who received this list. Or was it just a coincidence? If I prided myself in being a citizen journalist, those are the questions I would be asking.

And does anyone have any pictures of his living room?

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Begin Trace Mode for Comment # 113.

#2. To: All (#0)

from USAToday

Bloggers said the house was worth more than $400,000. It turns out it was bought for $55,000 in 1991 in a Baltimore neighborhood where "there were drug dealers and prostitutes on our street," Bonnie Frost said. Halsey Frost, a woodworker, did most of the renovations, which are "still not done," Bonnie said.

Bloggers said Graeme and Gemma go to private Park School, where tuition costs about $20,000. Graeme gets a scholarship, while Gemma's brain injuries were so severe that the city pays to educate her at a school for children with disabilities, the couple say.

From Daily Kos: They web published the home address of SCHIP family - what you can do

robin  posted on  2007-10-11   14:59:17 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

So let me get this straight:

a. Are the Frosts not owners of a greatly appreciated home ( let's set aside Bonnie's desire to have more renovations done and the fact that she has concrete counters that are as expensive as granite) on which they could have taken out a second mortgage for $20,0000 to fund a tax deductible Health Savings Account and to buy a high deductible health insurance policy for the past 4 years?

b. Are the Frosts not owners of commercial property worth $160,000 which brings in rental income, which also has enough cash equity in it to allow the Frosts to sell and make a profit to supplement their "meager" middle class life style?

c. If the Frosts had lived in a state that has a means test for folks that qualify for tapping SCHIP funds, do you believe the Frosts would have passed?

d. If you were running a private school in Baltimore with its well documented poverty and crime and visible minority children living in dire circumstances, would you give the Frosts' not 1 but 2 children access to the small number of free ride scholarships at your school? Are the Frosts' children living in "special challenging" circumstances that they are needy for a "leg up?"

e. Did Mr. and Mrs. Frost decide to thrust themselves and theiir family into the public stage or did the big bad reich wing evil bloggers seek the anonymous Frosts family and drag them out to front and center stage?

scrapper2  posted on  2007-10-11   15:18:29 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

second mortgage for $20,0000 to fund a tax deductible Health Savings Account

Second mortgages come with a monthly payment, and you are assuming they could find private insurance. With such serious preexisting conditions it is very doubtful the Frosts would find a private health care provider for any price. And if they did, the insurance company probably wouldn't pay for all the necessary therapy. This happened to a middle-class family I know with one autistic child.

Scholarships are awarded for a variety of reasons. It sounds like the Frosts were grateful and willing to share how the SCHIP program helped them, but they are no longer giving interviews because of the GOP hate machine.

robin  posted on  2007-10-11   16:15:45 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

a. Second mortgages come with a monthly payment, and you are assuming they could find private insurance. With such serious preexisting conditions it is very doubtful the Frosts would find a private health care provider for any price. And if they did, the insurance company probably wouldn't pay for all the necessary therapy. This happened to a middle-class family I know with one autistic child.

b. Scholarships are awarded for a variety of reasons. It sounds like the Frosts were grateful and willing to share how the SCHIP program helped them, but they are no longer giving interviews because of the GOP hate machine.

a. I'm not sure what you are talking about. What "pre-existing" condition did any of the Frost Family members have prior to their auto accident that prevented Mr. and Mrs. Frost from buying a health insurance policy for the family? Once you have a health insurance policy in place, they can't refuse to cover medical issues that come as a result of a car accident. That's why responsible people buy health insurance policies especially when they head a family with minor dependents - to protevct against catastrophic health eventualities that would drain a family's assets otherwise.

Your friend's austic child is not relevant to the discussion about why I believe that the Frosts were irresponsible in the way they did not prepare their family in 2003 against an out-of-the-blue health emergency, which unfortunately subsequently happened.

Monthly payments for second mortgages that amount to $20,000 are peanuts - I've been there so I know of what I speak - in 2003, the Frosts would have been given an excellent rate because of the equity in their highly appreciated residence as well as the equity they had in their commercial property.

b. Scholarships in private schools are generally given to minority children living in dire straights who deserve a leg up - basically scholarships represent a way for a private school to "give back" to their community to help disadvantaged children in their midst whose financial circumstances are very different from their full pay student parent body. The Frosts should have better scruples than to apply for this type of scholarship because it deprived 2 children who were truly needy.

As for why the Frosts will no longer give interviews - they thrust themselves into the kitchen but they did not like the fires. Maybe they should have thought about the risks of grabbing a microphone and taking center stage before they did what they did. Hindset is 20/20 vision.

With regards to the "GOP hate machine" - oh yes, righhhht, for sure, most definitely - the "problem" is the GOP not the Dems who used a child to promote their agenda and it's not the Frosts who scammed a system meant for impoverished children because they consciously took risks with their children's future and lost when Fate stepped in.

Lalalalalala...

scrapper2  posted on  2007-10-11   20:13:19 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

The idea that when someone doesn't have health insurance before a catastrophic illness that they are then doomed for the rest of their lives, unable to ever acquire any, is not a very productive notion for society as a whole. It certainly is not compassionate.

Many Americans had health insurance while employed, but after losing their jobs, and COBRA runs out, they are without any, until they find another employer who has good health insurance benefits.

The point of my friend's experience with an autistic child was to show you that even with current health insurance, companies refuse claims regularly. As was also explained well in the film, "The Rainmaker".
Government intervention has its place. Taking the time to sue a health insurance company often ends up with a dead patient before a positive answer is given. Our nation's current health care system is inadequate and getting worse due to rising unemployment due to offshoring and outsourcing.

As I already posted, there are all kinds of scholarships.

You are very eager to defend the GOP hate machine. Why is that?

Health care as enjoyed in Europe is quite good and economically efficient.

robin  posted on  2007-10-11   20:29:11 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

COBRA

And who can afford COBRA?

Zipporah  posted on  2007-10-11   20:35:35 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

And who can afford COBRA?

No one unemployed, that's for sure.

The deceptiveness going on by a certain poster got on my last nerve. He's just spewing the Bush/Rush line, amplifying the hate machine's usual spew.

We have a society for one reason: to make life better for our citizens. We are the only country left in the industrialized world that doesn't have national health care. We may have the BEST health care, but if 40 percent of your citizens can't afford it, what the hell is the value of that?

Scrapper's constant drumbeat to demonize the victim strikes me as disingenuous. He's spinning like crazy. He seems to know what the family paid for its counter tops. My brother, just as an example, gets free Vermont marble from a quarry. They end up with chunks they can't sell wholesale, they're too small, so they are happy to have him tote them away in his F-250. He uses these scraps to put together patios, walkways, counter tops, etc. To claim they cost $20,000 is just ignorant and SPINNING. He's a GOP mole, IMO. I wonder how much he gets paid. As most of you know, the GOP pays people to haunt various political sites to spew the GOP line. He's here an awful lot.

Mekons4  posted on  2007-10-11   22:31:00 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

He's a GOP mole, IMO. I wonder how much he gets paid. As most of you know, the GOP pays people to haunt various political sites to spew the GOP line. He's here an awful lot.

He posts the same kind of lengthy posts with more information than you would think a solitary individual could come up with in the short time between his posts that BAC did.

In BAC's case, I strongly suspected some organization was providing him with his posts.

aristeides  posted on  2007-10-12   13:55:17 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

ghostdogtxn  posted on  2007-10-12   16:00:06 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

I can understand disagreeing on an issue like health care.

I can't understand joining in the attack on the Frosts.

aristeides  posted on  2007-10-12   16:05:27 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

ghostdogtxn  posted on  2007-10-12   16:14:47 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

But you know, this is a funny place. Once you get stuck in a position or an opinion, it's hard to back off of it. That's what I meant by "nobody apologizes". I think in this case Scrapper2 jumped to a conclusion and has been fighting a rear-guard action to defend that original leap of faith, and IMO, beyond the point where it's become indefensible.

Ghost and christine, thanks for votes of confidence to assure everyone that I'm not a mole. Sheeesh! Is that the latest insult that the 3 Amigos for a Utopian Leninesque World have come up with today? - my goodness, what next? - wild imaginations, they are not short of, I have to give praise where praise is due.

But ghost I'm not having any second thoughts about my position on the Frost parents. IMO, they were negligent in not providing a basic high deductible insurance policy to protect their family against catastrophic events and they had the assets ( 2 properties) and the means - they could have gotten a real sweet deal for a line of credit of $5000 to start up in HSA in January, 2004 so as to get a cheaper rate on the high deductible insurance premium - and HSA's are tax deductible, a win/win.

But they chose to throw caution to the wind - they rolled the dice and they lost and lost terribly. They got lucky because Maryland's laws were lax and a means test was not required to access SCHIP funds. If they resided in other states that require means testing [ I think means testing should be a requirement in all states] the Frosts would have failed. There's no doubt about it - they had too many assets. But what is unforgiveable in my mind is that the Frost parents let their child be used as a pawn by the Dem Party to promote a political agenda. The Frosts knowingly let their son be USED by political hacks exposing him to public scrutiny. Would you do that to your kid?

With regards to the reich wingers going after the Frosts - I don't defend their tactics - I never have - but how does Michele Malkin's distasteful conduct excuse the Frosts' negligence and irresponsible behavior and bad decisions? It doesn't and you know it and aristeides and robin and Mekons4 know it too - that's why those 3 are trying so hard to kick up dust on the issue and blame the evil reich wingers for this very sad situation. The reich winger party partisans are doing exactly what the left winger partisans would do if the situation were reversed, which is take advantage of opportunity when it presents itself and to go for the jugular. The Frosts parents chose to come out of the shadows - the reich wingers did not pull them out in front of the microphones - as soon as the Frosts consented to go public,they became fair game.

Consider that if there had been no glaring irregularities in the Frost Family story, the Dems would have been successful in using a little boy ( how is that noble?) to promote their expanded SCHIP platform agenda - ie. to buy votes of middle class families earning up to $83,000 in the run up to the 2008 election. Come on - you think the Dem Party is wanting to expand SCHIP out of the goodness of their hearts or because they love the children more the the GOP? I don't think so. As Cyni pointed out elsewhere - both parties use and abuse sheeple individuals to get elected, to get more power and then the sheeple are discarded and forgotten like yesterday's newspaper.

You're a Ron Paul supporter, yes? Ron Paul voted "no" to expand the SCHIP program. You think Ron Paul who is an obgyn hates kids and that's why he voted "no"? No it's more likely that he knows how the intent of the SCHIP 1997 legislation has been totally lost/ misused - SCHIP was set up by bipartisan votes to specifically help impoverished children of indigent families. States like Maryland don't even do a means test before they shell out $ - Baltimore has countless #'s of impoverished children but the Maryland officials gave $ designated for impoverished children in the state to the Frosts who own 2 properties and an SUV - does that seem right? - some states have even given SCHIP money holus bolus to adults - does that seem right? I read recently that one of the big cheerleaders for expanded SCHIP is the Governor of New Jersey - dumteedum -my taxpayer antennae go up whenever I hear that a NJ politician is a booster for an entitlement program.

scrapper2  posted on  2007-10-12   20:15:55 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

The spinning continues. When you're on the side of Rushbo, Malkin, Coulter et al, you might want to investigate the facts. What "business" did they own? What was it worth when it was dissolved?

You act like your high-deductible insurance is free. It's not. It's very expensive, and when you are supporting a family of six on $45,000 a year...well, let's see YOU do it.

Your insistent attack on the Frosts is just sickening. Keep spamming and spinning, but the duty of any society is to improve the lives of its citizens. If you want to, in the words of Jeanne Kirkpatrick, make America safe for rich people with lawyers, by all means go ahead. Just stop being disingenuous about it.

Mekons4  posted on  2007-10-12   20:24:46 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

The spinning continues. When you're on the side of Rushbo, Malkin, Coulter et al, you might want to investigate the facts. What "business" did they own? What was it worth when it was dissolved?

You act like your high-deductible insurance is free. It's not. It's very expensive, and when you are supporting a family of six on $45,000 a year...well, let's see YOU do it.

Your insistent attack on the Frosts is just sickening. Keep spamming and spinning, but the duty of any society is to improve the lives of its citizens. If you want to, in the words of Jeanne Kirkpatrick, make America safe for rich people with lawyers, by all means go ahead. Just stop being disingenuous about it.

When will you stop lying about me? You are a person with no scruples - your consistent stretching of the truth, making up scenarios as you go along, impuning my character as it suits your cause - catch a clue why don't you - your tactics are transparent and they reflect poorly on you not on me - I hope you realize that.

You say I'm on the side of "Rushbo, Malkin, Coulter et al". I have consistently stated that reich wingers like Malkin's antics are distasteful. So stop aligning me with people I have never praised and whom I do not admire.

I don't insistently attack the Frosts. I state facts which no one can defend. They owned 2 properties. They had assets in addition to their $48,000 annual income that many middle class people only aspire to have. They choose not to establish an HSA and they chose not to buy a catastrphic health care plan. They accessed a fund that was specifically designated to serve impoverished children of indigent families - the $ the Frosts used was that much less for poor children in Maryland to have access to. They allowed their child to be used by a political party as a pawn, which resulted in their family coming under public scrutiny.

The evil reich wingers distasteful tactics do not absolve Mr. and Mrs. Frost for their series of irresponsible negligent actions and bad choices -Mr. and Mrs. Frost own them and you can't blame the evil reich wingers for those decisions and actions. The evil recichwingers only came into the picture after the Dems orchestrated the photo op with Graeme.

As for society and its duties, thanks but I think we have something better in place in this republic than your philosophical musings about what the responsibilites of taxpayer supported government programs are - and in that document spelling out duties of federal government no where do I read "dispensing universal health care" and nowhere do I read "improve the lives of its citizens" - thank you PlatoMekons4 for your suggestion but I like the Founders' vision better.

As for lawyers - hey I'm no fan of lawyers - why do think I have health/auto/home insurance up the wazoo -??? - because I like dealing with lawyers or I have a lawyer on consignment? No it's to protect me and my family and our assets FROM greedy trial lawyers. And on the subject of health care costs and lawyers, you might consider that if we didn't have malpractice lawyers and their greedy citizens hoping to strike it big with a frivolous lawsuit, we wouldn't have physicians ordering every test under the sun to protect their as**s from lawsuits. But I don't see or hear Hilary and other Dems [or even you for that matter] talking about TORT REFORM when they talk about universal health care. The Trial Lawyers Association is one of the top 10 donors to the Dem Party.

scrapper2  posted on  2007-10-12   21:04:38 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

Apparently to some here, there aren't supposed to be any negative consequences for not purchasing a personal injury/medical care rider on your auto insurance policy when you could have clearly afforded it.

And apparently this also isn't supposed to be pointed out when you allow your children to be used in a partisan radio spot on the topic of medical coverage. Go figure.

SmokinOPs  posted on  2007-10-12   22:16:24 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

when you could have clearly afforded it.

And your proof of this is? Nada.

Mekons4  posted on  2007-10-12   22:19:11 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

And your proof of this is? Nada.

My proof of this is the value of their house. You just don't think anyone should ever have to liquidate an asset to take care of more immediate needs.

SmokinOPs  posted on  2007-10-12   22:22:49 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

My proof of this is the value of their house. You just don't think anyone should ever have to liquidate an asset to take care of more immediate needs.

I keep vowing to drop out of this discussion and then jumping back in - are you saying one should give up their home to pay for possible future, currently non- existing medical needs? lose the home to pay for medical insurance? or are you saying when their children were injured they should have lost their home?

kiki  posted on  2007-10-12   22:27:49 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

I keep vowing to drop out of this discussion and then jumping back in - are you saying one should give up their home to pay for possible future, currently non- existing medical needs?

It ain't like there were twelve of them crammed into a 2 room shack. Are you telling me they had to have a 3000+ sq. ft home? Are you saying this family couldn't downsize by 1500 feet and get out from under their house payment?

SmokinOPs  posted on  2007-10-12   22:34:43 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

It ain't like there were twelve of them crammed into a 2 room shack. Are you telling me they had to have a 3000+ sq. ft home? Are you saying this family couldn't downsize by 1500 feet and get out from under their house payment?

I thought they bought it for 55k as a rehab, and did the work themselves. they can downsize size-wise but they aren't going to find a much cheaper house, I wouldn't imagine.

kiki  posted on  2007-10-12   22:44:21 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

I thought they bought it for 55k as a rehab, and did the work themselves. they can downsize size-wise but they aren't going to find a much cheaper house, I wouldn't imagine.

You don't think they could have sold a rehabilitated 3040 sq.ft house purchased in 1990 for 55k, for enough to pay cash for a 1500 sq. ft. house in 2003? Are you serious?

They could have done that and put cash in their pocket (preferably into a medical rider on their auto policy).

SmokinOPs  posted on  2007-10-12   22:59:18 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

You don't think they could have sold a rehabilitated 3040 sq.ft house purchased in 1990 for 55k, for enough to pay cash for a 1500 sq. ft. house in 2003? Are you serious?

They could have done that and put cash in their pocket (preferably into a medical rider on their auto policy).

whatever, yeah, of course they could have. we could all cram into the smallest space we can breath in and pour our money into the insurance industry, just in case. I don't want to argue, really - I just feel like there are people who see what could be their 'dream home' with some sweat equity, and they go for it. they could see it as an investment rather than a home, and that's probably more sensible, but less exciting. it's becoming more clear that only the wealthy are entitled to a little excitement, the rest are villians if they veer off the sensible track.

kiki  posted on  2007-10-12   23:31:36 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

whatever, yeah, of course they could have. we could all cram into the smallest space we can breath in and pour our money into the insurance industry, just in case.

Yeah, because 1500 sq. ft is such a tiny shack. In fact it ought to be a law that no one has to live in a house under 3000 sq. ft.

SmokinOPs  posted on  2007-10-12   23:45:39 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

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