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Religion
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Title: Feds ban grandma's angel ornament on Christmas tree....avoid Jesus in decorations
Source: [None]
URL Source: http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=58596
Published: Nov 9, 2007
Author: WorldNetDaily
Post Date: 2007-11-13 21:09:51 by AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt
Keywords: Dead Constitution
Views: 1000
Comments: 68

Feds ban grandma's angel ornament on Christmas tree

HUD orders residents to avoid Jesus in decorations

Posted: November 9, 2007

© 2007 http://WorldNetDaily.com

Federal Department of Housing and Urban Development officials have announced a ban on any decorations in HUD housing complexes that mention Jesus or represent religion for the Christmas season, and the American Family Association has responded with a petition drive to overturn the decision.

The AFA has set up a link to allow constituents to send e-mails to the HUD secretary or President Bush expressing their objections to the policy.

The issue arose at the Plant City Living Center in Plant City, Fla., where 85-year-old Mrs. Arnold was told that federal law now prohibits her from displaying anything that references religion – words, decorations and the like – in the common area of her apartment building, a HUD facility.

The grandmother told AFA she was instructed that even an angel decoration would be disallowed by the ban, which makes her think of the restrictions in Germany during World War II.

According to the center, HUD has issued a directive banning "any religious symbols or religious words associated with Christmas," which effectively prevents Mrs. Arnold from placing a small Christmas tree outside her door if it contains any religious symbols or words – "even an angel," AFA said in a special alert asking for e-mails.

A spokeswoman at the center who preferred not to give her name told WND the rules now prevent displays "like a manger, like a Christ child, any religious symbols."

"We used to have a sign outside that said, 'Jesus is the reason for the season,' but we can't anymore," she told WND. "We're all very unhappy about that."

The building has about 40 one-bedroom apartments for seniors who are at least 62 years old.

The spokeswoman said she didn't know what would be used for decorations now. "I don't know. We can probably decorate the tree, but we can't put anything on it that symbolizes Christ," she said.

"If the residents want to have a Christmas party in their community room, they cannot call it a Christmas party. The Center says HUD directs residents not to use the word 'Christmas' but to use the word 'holiday,'" the AFA advisory said.

"A Sunday School class from a church near Mrs. Arnold's apartment comes every year to host a Hanging of the Greens and Christmas Party for all the residents. She said the highlight of their Christmas Party comes at the very end of The Hanging of the Greens when someone places the angel on top of their Christmas tree. Their tradition is now banned by the federal government," the AFA said.

The family group noted the federal government has become increasingly active in banning Christianity from the public square, citing the National Park Service's efforts to conceal the words "Laus Deo," which is Latin for "Praise Be to God" at the Washington Monument, and the move by a Veterans Administration official to ban the script of a flag-folding ceremony that mentions "Abraham, Isaac and Jacob" and "Father, Son and Holy Ghost" at 100 national cemeteries.

However, "both of these were rescinded after AFA supporters sent e-mails to proper authorities," the AFA said. In the case of the Washington Monument dispute, Park Service officials told WND they got 26,000 e-mails in a morning.

WND also reported earlier this week that government officials in Fort Collins, Colo., are considering new regulations for Christmas decorations that appear to ban red and green lights because they are too religious.

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Begin Trace Mode for Comment # 26.

#10. To: AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt, robin, thread commenters and lurkers (#0)

All right, I'll start some fireworks - and take the flak.

WHERE in Scripture is Christmas ever pronounced as a Holy Day (holiday) in the first place? What does God have to say about it?

Isaiah 1:14 Your new moons and your appointed feasts my soul hateth: they are a trouble unto me; I am weary to bear [them]. 15 And when ye spread forth your hands, I will hide mine eyes from you: yea, when ye make many prayers, I will not hear: your hands are full of blood.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't Christmas a holiday of MAN'S creation? Furthermore, it would appear that this ban is actually upholding the 2nd Commandment:

Exodus 20:4 Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness [of any thing] that [is] in heaven above, or that [is] in the earth beneath, or that [is] in the water under the earth:

That's right. Cute as they may be, Grandma's little angel ornament, and all those plastic Jesus statues adorning everybody's homes are in VIOLATION of the Second Commandment.

Why is it that we don't get all excited about the Feast of Weeks, or Feast of Trumpets? Probably 4 out of 5 Americans never even heard of those, but those I CAN find in Scripture as Holy Days set for us by the Creator...

And we wonder why the world is going to hell in a handbasket...

Isaiah 1:15 And when ye spread forth your hands, I will hide mine eyes from you: yea, when ye make many prayers, I will not hear: your hands are full of blood.

innieway  posted on  2007-11-14   0:57:53 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#11. To: innieway (#10)

Yes, Christmas is a man-made creation, and Christians celebrate it as a time to recapture the joy of the birth of their savior, and to be with family and friends, to let bygones be bygones, and to spread good will and cheer and hopes for peace at least ONCE a year. No, the lost sheep have probably never heard of the feasts you mentioned. If the antichrists in our midst did away with them, the people wouldn't miss them, and wouldn't know or care who's doing this to them. Christmas they can understand. Let's do away with it and celebrate Hanukah and the tribe of Dan Messiah, instead.

".....Chanuka spreads its light across two months. A month of light and a month of darkness. And even after the last night of Chanuka is over and the blaze of all its eight candles has gone out, and it seems that the night is flooded by the neon glare of artificial light, those thirty-six hidden candles burn on in the days of Tevet for the people of the moon like the thirty-six hidden tzaddikim, righteous people, on whose shoulders this world is standing.

Seasons of the MOON: Night Killer

ohr.edu/yhiy/article.php/1401

THE LOST TRIBE OF DAN

THE EARLY JEWISH & CHRISTIAN VIEW OF THE IDENTITY OF THE ANTICHRIST

http://www.watch.pair.com/dan.html

1Jo 2:18 Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.

1Jo 2:22 Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.

1Jo 4:3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that [spirit] of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.

2Jo 1:7 For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.

AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt  posted on  2007-11-14   7:38:28 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#19. To: AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt (#11)

Christians celebrate it as a time to recapture the joy of the birth of their savior, and to be with family and friends, to let bygones be bygones, and to spread good will and cheer and hopes for peace at least ONCE a year.

I understand the concept and I'll readily admit that it is a NICE concept. BUT, that doesn't mean we should be doing it. This may be a poor example, but the concept of "something for nothing" is nice too - but it's no excuse for shoplifting. And it should be known I'm not an advocate of Hanukkah or Chanuka or whatever either. Doing away with one false Holy Day does not mean replacing it with another.

My position is quite simple. We should get back to following what Scripture actually teaches, and forget all these "feel good" concepts (however "nice" they may be). Unless we do (and it appears we WON'T) we cannot expect the Creator or the Messiah to "be there for us".

In Matthew 12:50 we are told by the Messiah For whosoever shall do the will of my Father which is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother.

Just WHAT would the WILL of the Creator be? I would argue that since He told us 22 times in Scripture to "Keep My Commandments" (in those exact words, and many more times we were told to "keep my statutes" etc) He must have deemed it as being very important to HIM. This was summed up quite nicely and simply in John 14:15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.
I think doing His will might be to do as we are told, and quit being disobedient children. Disobedient children deserve a spanking. Is this a spanking we really want?

innieway  posted on  2007-11-14   10:15:56 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#20. To: innieway (#19) (Edited)

Some of my happiest childhood memories revolve around the holidays. Some of my favorite music, including hymns, involves Christmas.

There was a special star and the Three Wise Men thought His birth was a very big deal and something to celebrate.

Why shouldn't we?

robin  posted on  2007-11-14   10:18:42 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#26. To: robin (#20)

There was a special star and the Three Wise Men thought His birth was a very big deal and something to celebrate.

Why shouldn't we?

Well, I checked it out pretty carefully, and can't seem to find where it became a yearly holiday in Scripture. Can you point out to me where it is? I'm sure I just overlooked it.

These are exactly the type things people and religions use as their justification for doing things which violate Scripture. They don't want their beliefs tested, they are comfortable in them. It feels good. The truth and/or facts may be more than they can handle. So they dig up things for excuses as to why they should NOT change.

Why shouldn't we? Well, perhaps because Christmas practices are pretty well described in Jeremiah 10:3,4 3 For the customs of the people [are] vain: for [one] cutteth a tree out of the forest, the work of the hands of the workman, with the axe. 4 They deck it with silver and with gold; they fasten it with nails and with hammers, that it move not.
Jeremiah 10:2 says this is the practice of the HEATHEN, and specifically states NOT to do this. Heathen and pagan are synonymous.

Other than that, refer to my previous argument.

I'm really not trying to change anyone's beliefs concerning the matter, even though I know it seems I am. I don't have a problem with people following their religious beliefs; in fact, I feel they have a right to do so unimpeded. All I'm attempting to do is report what Scripture actually teaches, and offer an explanation for why - despite many prayers - we still have wars, so much illness, economic strife, etc...

innieway  posted on  2007-11-14   11:17:55 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


Replies to Comment # 26.

#30. To: innieway (#26)

Christmas practices are pretty well described in Jeremiah 10:3,4 3 For the customs of the people [are] vain: for [one] cutteth a tree out of the forest, the work of the hands of the workman, with the axe. 4 They deck it with silver and with gold; they fasten it with nails and with hammers, that it move not. Jeremiah 10:2 says this is the practice of the HEATHEN, and specifically states NOT to do this. Heathen and pagan are synonymous.

Actually, innie, I don't think that refers to the Christmas tree, although the Noahides use it in their argument against Christians and Christmas; I think that refers to carving "gods"/idols of wood :

Jer 10:3 For the customs of the people [are] vain: for [one] cutteth a tree out of the forest, the work of the hands of the workman, with the axe.

Jer 10:4 They deck it with silver and with gold; they fasten it with nails and with hammers, that it move not.

Jer 10:5 They [are] upright as the palm tree, but speak not: they must needs be borne, because they cannot go. Be not afraid of them; for they cannot do evil, neither also [is it] in them to do good.

www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/Jer/Jer010.html#top

Matthew Henry:

I. A solemn charge given to the people of God not to conform themselves to the ways and customs of the heathen. Let the house of Israel hear and receive this word from the God of Israel: "Learn not the way of the heathen, do not approve of it, no, nor think indifferently concerning it, much less imitate it or accustom yourselves to it. Let not any of their customs steal in among you (as they are apt to do insensibly) nor mingle themselves with your religion.’’ Note, It ill becomes those that are taught of God to learn the way of the heathen, and to think of worshipping the true God with such rites and ceremonies as they used in the worship of their false gods. See Deu. 12:29–31. It was the way of the heathen to worship the host of heaven, the sun, moon, and stars; to them they gave divine honours, and from them they expected divine favours, and therefore, according as the signs of heaven were, whether they were auspicious or ominous, they thought themselves countenanced or discountenanced by their deities, which made them observe those signs, the eclipses of the sun and moon, the conjunctions and oppositions of the planets, and all the unusual phenomena of the celestial globe, with a great deal of anxiety and trembling. Business was stopped if any thing occurred that was thought to bode ill; if it did but thunder on their left hand, they were almost as if they had been thunderstruck. Now God would not have his people to be dismayed at the signs of heaven, to reverence the stars as deities, nor to frighten themselves with any prognostications grounded upon them. Let them fear the God of heaven, and keep up a reverence of his providence, and then they need not be dismayed at the signs of heaven, for the stars in their courses fight not against any that are at peace with God. The heathen are dismayed at these signs, for they know no better; but let not the house of Israel, that are taught of God, be so.

II. Divers good reasons given to enforce this charge.

1. The way of the heathen is very ridiculous and absurd, and is condemned even by the dictates of right reason, v. 3. The statutes and ordinances of the heathen are vanity itself; they cannot stand the test of a rational disquisition. This is again and again insisted upon here, as it was by Isaiah. The Chaldeans valued themselves upon their wisdom, in which they thought that they excelled all their neighbours; but the prophet here shows that they, and all others that worshipped idols and expected help and relief from them, were brutish and sottish, and had not common sense. (1.) Consider what the idol is that is worshipped. It was a tree cut out of the forest originally. It was fitted up by the hands of the workman, squared, and sawed, and worked into shape; see Isa. 44:12, etc. But, after all, it was but the stock of a tree, fitter to make a gate-post of than any thing else. But, to hide the wood, they deck it with silver and gold, they gild or lacquer it, or they deck it with gold and silver lace, or cloth of tissue. They fasten it to its place, which they themselves have assigned it, with nails and hammers, that it fall not, nor be thrown down, nor stolen away, v. 4. The image is made straight enough, and it cannot be denied but that the workman did his part, for it is upright as the palm-tree (v. 5); it looks stately, and stands up as if it were going to speak to you, but it cannot speak; it is a poor dumb creature; nor can it take one step towards your relief. If there be any occasion for it to shift its place, it must be carried in procession, for it cannot go. Very fitly does the admonition come in here, "Be not afraid of them, any more than of the signs of heaven; be not afraid of incurring their displeasure, for they can do no evil; be not afraid of forfeiting their favour, for neither is it in them to do good. If you think to mend the matter by mending the materials of which the idol is made, you deceive yourselves. Idols of gold and silver are an unworthy to be worshipped as wooden gods. The stock is a doctrine of vanities, v. 8. It teaches lies, teaches lies concerning God. It is an instruction of vanities; it is wood.’’ It is probable that the idols of gold and silver had wood underneath for the substratum, and then silver spread into plates is brought from Tarshish, imported from beyond sea, and gold from Uphaz, or Phaz, which is sometimes rendered the fine or pure gold, Ps. 21:3. A great deal of art is used, and pains taken, about it. They are not such ordinary mechanics that are employed about these as about the wooden gods, v. 3. these are cunning men; it is the work of the workman; the graver must do his part when it has passed through the hands of the founder. Those were but decked here and there with silver and gold; these are silver and gold all over. And, that these gods might be reverenced as kings, blue and purple are their clothing, the colour of royal robes (v. 9), which amuses ignorant worshippers, but makes the matter no better. For what is the idol when it is made and when they have made the best they can of it? He tells us (v. 14): They are falsehood; they are not what they pretend to be, but a great cheat put upon the world. They are worshipped as the gods that give us breath and life and sense, whereas they are lifeless senseless things themselves, and there is no breath in them; there is no spirit in them (so the word is); they are not animated, or inhabited, as they are supposed to be, by any divine spirit or numen—divinity. They are so far from being gods that they have not so much as the spirit of a beast that goes downward. They are vanity, and the work of errors, v. 15. Enquire into the use of them and you will find they are vanity; they are good for nothing; no help is to be expected from them nor any confidence put in them. They are a deceitful work, works of illusions, or mere mockeries; so some read the following clause. They delude those that put their trust in them, make fools of them, or, rather, they make fools of themselves. Enquire into the use of them and you will find they are the work of errors, grounded upon the grossest mistakes that ever men who pretended to reason were guilty of. They are the creatures of a deluded fancy; and the errors by which they were produced they propagate among their worshippers. (2.) Infer hence what the idolaters are that worship these idols. (v. 8): They are altogether brutish and foolish. Those that make them are like unto them, senseless and stupid, and there is no spirit in them—no use of reason, else they would never stoop to them, v. 14. Every man that makes or worships idols has become brutish in his knowledge, that is, brutish for want of knowledge, or brutish in that very thing which one would think they should be fully acquainted with; compare Jude 10, What they know naturally, what they cannot but know by the light of nature, in those things as brute beasts they corrupt themselves. Though in the works of creation they cannot but see the eternal power and godhead of the Creator, yet they have become vain in their imaginations, not liking to retain God in their knowledge. See Rom. 1:21, 18. Nay, whereas they thought it a piece of wisdom thus to multiply gods, it really was the greatest folly they could be guilty of. The world by wisdom knew not God, 1 Co. 1:21; Rom. 1:22. Every founder is himself confounded by the graven image; when he has made it by a mistake he is more and more confirmed in his mistake by it; he is bewildered, bewitched, and cannot disentangle himself from the snare; or it is what he will one time or other be ashamed of.

www.blueletterbible.org/Comm/mhc/Jer/Jer010.html

AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt  posted on  2007-11-14 12:25:21 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#32. To: innieway (#26)

Well, I checked it out pretty carefully, and can't seem to find where it became a yearly holiday in Scripture. Can you point out to me where it is? I'm sure I just overlooked it.

Well, I guess we eeevil Catholics need to assume some responsibility for this "odious" joyful, reverent, awesome celebration of remembrance .... the root of the word Christmas is Christ's Mass after all. It's a tradition we treasure.

For those that prefer to sit in a cold room and flip through scripture for justification of their "bah, humbug" attitude, more power to you. You have the same benefits of the free exercise clause of the first amendment as we.

Didn't the Pilgrims and Puritans choose not to observe a celebration of Christ's birth, too? Wow, they were a notably fun bunch.

iconoclast  posted on  2007-11-14 12:40:41 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


End Trace Mode for Comment # 26.

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