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Religion See other Religion Articles Title: Thoughts on the Fifth of November Recently I received the following comment during an exchange regarding Glenn Beck's interview of David Horowitz and Jonathan Sands in which Ron Paul's fringe supporters were identified as potential terrorists in part because of a recent fundraiser that identified with Guy Fawkes Day and the Gunpowder Plot to restore a Catholic monarchy in England in 1607. George Washington's edict is interesting, and it supports my argument that the Gunpowder Plot was an important inspiration for the American Revolution. That there was more than one faction celebrating the historical event is especially interesting. We know that the celebration of Guy Fawkes day is ostensibly out of commemoration of the failure of an anti-Protestant revolution. We know that Guy Fawkes is typically burned in effigy, and that the commonwealth citizens were supposedly happy that the Gunpowder plot failed. Catholics would not see the celebrations in the same light as Protestants, however. Catholics would see the celebrations as a sad reminder that for a time, they had been persecuted, their clergy tortured and murdered, and their places of worship destroyed. The more thoughtful among those who celebrated Guy Fawkes day would have understood the sharp irony found in praising the harsh torture of someone who had been resisting a tyrannical religious establishment — which had been created to displace another one. Furthermore, the march toward representational government was not to be deterred by the English monarchy. Americans would have their revolution, and they would replace governmental religious oppression with a nation founded on religious freedom. Putting George Washington's edict against celebrating Guy Fawkes or "Pope's Day" into context illustrates how much the Founding Fathers were concerned with preventing religious establishment in the new federal government. Scott Horton in Harpers this month writes that Washington's decision to ban November Fifth celebrations was in order to curtail the hatred toward Catholics that he believed was so injurious to civility and tolerance in the new American nation, especially when Americans were seeking the support of Catholic Canadians. Horton quotes Washington: This topic is very complex, and as I mentioned, in the 19th century, the Know-Nothing party probably would have wanted to celebrate the Fifth of November despite Washington's erstwhile injunction against the practice. Know-Nothing reasoning was a combination of Protestantism and Enlightenment values. As Protestants, they believed that liberty could not emerge under a faith that placed an earthly figure such as the Pope from a foreign country above the American Constitution. Guy Fawkes day now should symbolize Parliamentary oppression of those who once followed an equally oppressive Catholic monarchy. This memory affirms that America's founding fathers outlawed avoid federal religious establishments. By dwelling on the irony in the colonial celebrations, we magnify the genius they had for building a governmental framework based on liberty of conscience. We should always remember the Fifth of November.
Poster Comment: Because the LP thread on which I posted a version of the above essay may be pulled, I've posted a comment here edited to be an essay on the Fifth of November. Today while I was writing this piece, I tried to find a source for a popular Madison quote about blood soaked soil in Europe. I found some evidence that this is a hoax. But there is a quote that we can safely attribute to Madison found in his Memorial and Remonstrance Against Religious Assessments written in 1785 in which he ,a href="http://religiousfreedom.lib.virginia.edu/sacred/madison_m&r_1785.html"> speaks out against government support of religious instruction: Post Comment Private Reply Ignore Thread Top • Page Up • Full Thread • Page Down • Bottom/Latest
#1. To: Peppa, Zipporah, christine, FOH, iconoclast, mirage, Cynicom, Dakmar, (#0)
For your comments. Peppa, I apologize but I could not find a source for our favorite Madison quote. I think I might have found one that's just as good (in Madison's 1785 Memorial and Remonstrance Against Religious Assessments), though.
What a laugher ... Beck interviews a full blown pinko, seeking divine guidance ! He's still drunk and trying to sober up with meth !
"The mighty are only mighty because we are on our knees. Let us rise!" --Camille Desmoulins
this was educational for me, buckeye. i admit to being ignorant about Guy Fawkes before the movie, V for Vendetta. i need to do more reading. thanks for the post.
You're welcome. It is so nice to have a place to publish my writing where it won't be banned.
Major source: Happy Counterterrorism Day by Scott Horton in Harpers this month.
An excellent piece!
America is not at war. The military is at war. America is at the mall and the Congress is out to lunch.
buckeye, It is most ironic that U.S. citizens would choose to attack Ron Paul supporters for being a mix of several different types of groups which share the one unifying trait of love of liberty. The fact that we came together to raise several million dollars for Dr. Paul on Guy Fawkes Day is simply symbolic of our mutual desire to throw off the oppression of an out of control federal government. That's it. It has nothing to do with Catholic, Protestant or any other religious group and certainly nothing to do with real bombs or violence.
"I've even suggested that we follow the constitution." We actually have two categories specifically for this. 'All is Vanity' and 'Author Author'...and we have Bookmarks so that you can save those and your favorities on your homepage.
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