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Title: France stunned by rioters’ savagery
Source: Times
URL Source: http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/ne ... orld/europe/article2983714.ece
Published: Dec 2, 2007
Author: Matthew Campbell
Post Date: 2007-12-02 21:32:56 by Horse
Keywords: None
Views: 501
Comments: 38

IN retrospect, it was not a good idea to have left his pistol at home. Called to the scene of a traffic accident in the Paris suburbs last Sunday, Jean-François Illy, a regional police chief, came face to face with a mob of immigrant youths armed with baseball bats, iron bars and shotguns.

What happened next has sickened the nation. As Illy tried to reassure the gang that there would be an investigation into the deaths of two teenagers whose motorbike had just collided with a police car, he heard a voice shouting: “Somebody must pay for this. Some pigs must die tonight!”

The 43-year-old commissaire realised it was time to leave, but that was not possible: they set his car ablaze. He stood as the mob closed in on him, parrying the first few baseball bat blows with his arms. An iron bar in the face knocked him down.

“I tried to roll myself into a ball on the ground,” said Illy from his hospital bed. He was breathing with difficulty because several of his ribs had been broken and one had punctured his lung.

His bruised and bloodied face signalled a worrying new level of barbarity in the mainly Muslim banlieues, where organised gangs of rioters used guns against police in a two-day rampage of looting and burning last week.

Not far from where Illy was lying was a policeman who lost his right eye after being hit by pellets from a shotgun. Another policeman displayed a hole the size of a 10p coin in his shoulder where a bullet had passed through his body armour.

Altogether 130 policemen were injured, dozens by shotgun pellets and shells packed with nails that were fired from a homemade bazooka. It prompted talk of urban “guerrilla warfare” being waged on French streets against the forces of law and order.

By the end of the week an extraordinarily heavy police presence in Villiers-le-Bel, where most of the rioting took place, appeared to have halted the violence: on top of public transport strikes and student protests against his reform plans, Nicolas Sarkozy, the French president, could not afford a repeat of 2005, when a similar incident involving the deaths of two youths provoked the worst French urban unrest in four decades.

Things were so tense in the suburbs, however, that the riots could easily erupt again with the prospect of deaths on either side setting off a much greater explosion and, conceivably, the deployment of the army to keep peace.

“Given the weapons being used, it was lucky that nobody was killed,” said a policeman. Nearby were the charred remains of the local constabulary. The nursery school was burnt down. So was the library.

Rioting two years ago was widely regarded as a protest against poor housing, racial discrimination and unemployment of up to 40% in the grim housing estates surrounding most big French cities.

But “Sarko” dismissed suggestions that nothing had been done to improve the situation, referring to the “Marshall plan” for the banlieues being drawn up by Fadela Amara, his urban development minister.

At the same time he argued that, far from reflecting difficult living conditions, the violence was a result of the “thugocracy” of the suburbs, where drug-trafficking criminals held sway.

“We shouldn’t try to excuse the inexcusable,” said the president in a television address to an anxious nation on Thursday, ridiculing the left’s vision of rioters as “victims of social injustice”. He pledged that those who fired at police would be tracked down, one by one, and tried on charges of attempted murder.

Lawlessness in the suburbs is an awkward issue for Sarkozy because he had promised to deal with it as interior minister, when he introduced “zero tolerance” policing, only to be accused of aggravating the problem by referring to trouble-makers as “thugs” and “scum”. Despite some successes, many of the suburban ghettoes remain a law unto their own and, like parts of New York in the bad old days, policemen do not like to set foot there.

“It felt like they were out to kill us,” said one of the officers in Villiers-le-Bel last week. “We knew that there were weapons in the suburbs, but they have never been turned against us like that. The kids were shooting at us at close range, loading and reloading their weapons. I’ve never seen anything like it.”

Sarkozy has ordered a full judicial inquiry into the teenagers’ deaths, even though all the evidence seems to support the police version that the boys were thrown from their unlicensed motorcycle when it accidentally collided with a patrol car. Friends and relatives of the victims dismiss the official account of the incident as fantasy.

As for Illy, he says he is not feeling vengeful but has identified one of his attackers from police photographs. He is certain to be able to pinpoint the rest. “Fortunately,” he said, “I’ve got a very good memory.”

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=kKPqT_c2xlI Video of riots.


Poster Comment:

Mass immigration is working well for the French. AFter the dollar collapses, a news article like this would be considered a quiet night in an American city.

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Begin Trace Mode for Comment # 33.

#2. To: Horse (#0)

a worrying new level of barbarity in the mainly Muslim banlieues

The barbarity of Muslim wackos shouldn't surprise anyone.

Mister Clean  posted on  2007-12-02   21:55:55 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#4. To: Mister Clean (#2)

The barbarity of Muslim wackos shouldn't surprise anyone.

As though our nation and our good friend, Israel, are any more civilized considering our regular use of DU weaponry and DIME bombs and bunker busters - all used on civilian populations ( better known as "collateral damages"). Give me a friggin' break with your closed mind and pious judgmental tone.

Never forget that it was our nation that was the first nation ever to use atomic bombs on 2 non-military targets in Japan.

Your remarks are shallow and embaressing to say the least.

scrapper2  posted on  2007-12-03   0:44:01 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#14. To: scrapper2 (#4)

As though our nation and our good friend, Israel, are any more civilized considering our regular use of DU weaponry and DIME bombs and bunker busters - all used on civilian populations ( better known as "collateral damages"). Give me a friggin' break with your closed mind and pious judgmental tone.

Never forget that it was our nation that was the first nation ever to use atomic bombs on 2 non-military targets in Japan.

Apples and oranges.

Muslims cause trouble where ever they gather in large numbers whether it's in Europe, Africa, Asia... whether it's Islamic revolution, insurgency, terrorism, kidnapping or sharia law, a significant number of Muslims choose violence over civility.

Americans and Israelis don't immigrate to other countries and start riots.

Mister Clean  posted on  2007-12-03   10:17:37 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#15. To: Mister Clean (#14)

Americans and Israelis don't immigrate to other countries and start riots.

No the Bush Regime and the Knesset call them preemptive strikes. So much more civilized; especially the white phosphorus and cluster bombs.

If the ME was not such a boiling cauldron, Muslims would not have had a reason to leave Palestine, Lebanon and Iraq.

robin  posted on  2007-12-03   10:26:23 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#16. To: robin (#15)

No the Bush Regime and the Knesset call them preemptive strikes. So much more civilized; especially the white phosphorus and cluster bombs.

If the ME was not such a boiling cauldron, Muslims would not have had a reason to leave Palestine, Lebanon and Iraq.

Israel and the US are not responsible for the backward belief systems and behavior found in Muslim nations.

Israel and the US don't subjugate women. Israel and the US don't enforce barbaric sharia laws. Israel and the US don't punish rape victims. Israel and the US don't make Muslims riot in Europe. Israel and the US don't force Muslims in the Philippines to kidnap people. Israel and the US don't make the crazies in Sudan kill in the name of their religion.

Mister Clean  posted on  2007-12-03   10:32:07 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#18. To: Mister Clean (#16)

There was nothing backward in Iraq. Women were college educated, wore western dress and had good careers; and before the US imposed embargo children were healthy. No question, their leader was a vicious dictator, just like so many others that still exists, NK for example (and Kim Il Jong enjoys starving his people just for fun).

Yet, out of all the Muslim world, this was the nation the US bombed and destroyed. It had nothing to do with their "backward" ways, just the opposite.

Israel has invaded Lebanon twice, both times Lebanon was an economic powerhouse, the Swiss of the ME, making Israel look tawdry.

You are short on facts and long on propaganda.

robin  posted on  2007-12-03   10:41:48 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#19. To: robin (#18)

There was nothing backward in Iraq. Women were college educated, wore western dress and had good careers; and before the US imposed embargo children were healthy. No question, their leader was a vicious dictator, just like so many others that still exists, NK for example (and Kim Il Jong enjoys starving his people just for fun).

So you don't consider a "vicious dictator" to be backward. Oooookay.

Israel has invaded Lebanon twice, both times Lebanon was an economic powerhouse, the Swiss of the ME, making Israel look tawdry.

Is that what makes Muslims all over the world engage in violence?

Mister Clean  posted on  2007-12-03   10:45:06 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#24. To: Mister Clean (#19)

I see you ignored this part of my post:
Israel has invaded Lebanon twice, both times Lebanon was an economic powerhouse, the Swiss of the ME, making Israel look tawdry.

And it was you who first mentioned Israel:
Americans and Israelis don't immigrate to other countries and start riots.

So why haven't you addressed Israel's invasion TWICE of the NOT backward Lebanon; where IDF illegally used white phosphorus and cluster bombs against the NOT backward and INNOCENT civilian population of Lebanon?

I mean, you seem to think causing untold death and destruction by invasion is somehow more superior to immigrating and starting riots.

BTW, aren't you planning to immigrate? Will you be starting any riots?

robin  posted on  2007-12-03   11:07:00 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#25. To: robin (#24)

So why haven't you addressed Israel's invasion TWICE of the NOT backward Lebanon; where IDF illegally used white phosphorus and cluster bombs against the NOT backward and INNOCENT civilian population of Lebanon?

I mean, you seem to think causing untold death and destruction by invasion is somehow more superior to immigrating and starting riots.

Superior? No, I never said superior. You seem to equate the violent and intolerant actions of Muslims world wide with the conflict between Israel and the extremists in Lebanon.

I see that as apples and oranges. You're just looking for a reason to lump Israel in with the wacko Muslims who cause trouble virtually everywhere they go. You're trying to change the subject away from the bad behavior of Muslims in France and elsewhere.

I'm not buying it.

Mister Clean  posted on  2007-12-03   11:11:39 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#27. To: Mister Clean (#25)

You were disparaging of a people who immigrate, saying that the US and Israel don't immigrate and start riots.

I said there would not be as many Muslims in EU had the ME not become so impossible to live in since 1947.

I pointed out that the US and Israel just INVADE and DESTROY, (something much worse than immigrating and rioting).

You don't seem to object to this behavior, but find people immigrating and rioting something to complain about!

robin  posted on  2007-12-03   11:21:16 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#29. To: robin (#27)

You were disparaging of a people who immigrate, saying that the US and Israel don't immigrate and start riots.

I'm disparaging of people who engage in violence like what we see in France.

I said there would not be as many Muslims in EU had the ME not become so impossible to live in since 1947.

That's pure speculation on your part. You just want to blame the West for all the ills of the Middle East. That's really a contemptuous attitude toward Muslims because you're basically saying they have no self control, their behavior is determined by Western powers. Again, the West isn't responsible for things like the recent punishment that the Saudis inflicted on a rape victim. Why don't you try to defend that?

I pointed out that the US and Israel just INVADE and DESTROY, (something much worse than immigrating and rioting).

Again, apples and oranges.

You don't seem to object to this behavior, but find people immigrating and rioting something to complain about!

Well, the article of the thread is about Muslim immigrants who riot. But you want to change the subject. I don't.

Mister Clean  posted on  2007-12-03   11:28:09 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#31. To: Mister Clean (#29) (Edited)

Well, the article of the thread is about Muslim immigrants who riot. But you want to change the subject. I don't.

You fail to see the connection?!

As I pointed out now more than once, many of the Muslims in EU would still be happy at home in the ME, were it not for the fact that Israel and the US have destroyed their homes!

robin  posted on  2007-12-03   11:31:18 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#32. To: robin (#31)

As I pointed out now more than once, many of the Muslims in EU would still be happy at home in the ME, were it not for the fact that Israel and the US have made destroyed their homes!

That's your extremely simplistic theory. I don't buy it given the trouble found pretty much everywhere large numbers of Muslims are found.

Did the Muslim murder Theo Van Gogh because Israel attacked Lebanon?

How about the Muslims in Sudan who want that teacher executed. Are they calling for her blood because of Israel?

Your theory doesn't hold up.

Mister Clean  posted on  2007-12-03   11:43:33 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#33. To: Mister Clean (#32)

I did not say all of the Muslims in EU are refugees from Palestine, Lebanon and Iraq.

The foreign worker program after the destruction of WWII is what first opened the door into EU.

Similar to the foreign worker program the US has, except we don't need them; we have high unemployment even among the college educated, including among engineering and computer science grads.

The anger of the Muslim community in the EU is fueled by the way the Israel treats the Palestinians and by the preemptive invasions into Iraq and Lebanon by the US and Israel.

robin  posted on  2007-12-03   11:49:42 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


Replies to Comment # 33.

#34. To: robin (#33)

The anger of the Muslim community in the EU is fueled by the way the Israel treats the Palestinians and by the preemptive invasions into Iraq and Lebanon by the US and Israel.

So Muslims in France are rioting because of Israel.

How ridiculous.

You should convert to Islam since all you want to do is blame Israel for the bad behavior of Muslims. You'd fit right in.

Mister Clean  posted on  2007-12-03 11:53:53 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


End Trace Mode for Comment # 33.

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