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Title: Firefighters asked to report people who express discontent with the government
Source:
rawstory.com
URL Source: http://rawstory.com/news/2007/Homel ... ghters_into_domestic_1129.html
Published: Dec 3, 2007
Author: David Edwards and Muriel Kane
Post Date: 2007-12-03 17:59:28 by TwentyTwelve
Keywords: Firefighters, "first amendment", "Homeland Security"
Views: 584
Comments: 16
Firefighters asked to report people who express discontent with the government David Edwards and Muriel Kane Published: Thursday November 29, 2007 It was revealed last week that firefighters are being trained to not only keep an eye out for illegal materials in the course of their duties, but even to report back any expression of discontent with the government. A year ago, Homeland Security gave security clearances to nine New York City fire chiefs and began sharing intelligence with them. Even before that, fire department personnel were being taught "to identify material or behavior that may indicate terrorist activities" and were also "told to be alert for a person who is hostile, uncooperative or expressing hate or discontent with the United States." Unlike law enforcement officials, firemen can go onto private property without a warrant, not only while fighting fires but also for inspections. "It's the evolution of the fire service," said a Phoenix, AZ fire chief of his information-sharing arrangement with law enforcement. Keith Olbermann raised the alarm about the program on his show Wednesday, noting that "if the information-sharing program works in New York, the department says it will extend it to other major metropolitan areas, unless we stop them." He then asked Mike German, a former FBI agent who is now with the ACLU, "This program seems to be turning [firefighters], essentially, into legally protected domestic spies, does it not?" "That's the entire intent," German replied, noting the serious legal issues involved. "There is actually still a fourth amendment," he pointed out, "and what makes a firefighter's search reasonable is that it's done to prevent a fire. If now firefighters are going in with this secondary purpose, that end run around the fourth amendment won't work, and it's likely that they will find themselves in legal trouble." Olbermann, however, was most strongly concerned about the implications for civil liberties. "Is what disturbs you and the ACLU the same thing that just jumped off the page for me?" he asked. "That one phrase, 'look for people who are expressing hatred of or discontent with the United States?' Discontent?" German agreed that there are serious first amendment issues raised by the focus of the program on constitutionally-protected literature, such as books that might be considered "terrorist propaganda." Olbermann asked in conclusion whether firefighters could be used under this program to plant evidence. German agreed that the way it is defined "really plays to people's prejudices and gives them the opportunity to do damage to someone." This video is from MSNBC's Countdown, broadcast on November 28, 2007.
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#1. To: TwentyTwelve (#0)
Guess I won't be calling the FD anytime soon...I'm deep into reading a bio on Smedley Butler.
Reading about Gen. Butler is definitely an anti patriotic act.
What the hell?
This is one reason I'm against national healthcare. I feel it would only be a matter of time before such a system would be abused by drug war zealots.
"Most of the trouble in this world has been caused by folks who can't mind their own business, because they have no business of their own to mind, any more than a smallpox virus has." - William S Burroughs
anyone with an active brain cell should be on their "discontent" list. and i'd like to make the firefighter fighters job a tad easier; there isn't a need to snoop into peoples homes looking for offenders. they can begin by monitoring letters to the editor, internet forums like this, all manor of talk radio, even Olbermann himself since many of his best rants are chock full of discontent. The only thing surprising is that people would be surprised by any govt. employee who snoops on their fellow citizens. let the shooting begin (there's some discontent for our friends at Homeland Security :))
We already are Dak. I was asked a while back by my primary if I had any guns in my house. I refused to answer until she told me where this information would end up. Since she was a nice person, she stopped the questions and we both had a laugh. I then left her office with a bevy of scripts for imaginary pain and feigned sleeplessness.
On of the speakers at SAF conference was discussing this very issue. It occurred to me right then and there that were I ever asked such a thing by a physician in my employ, I would affect my best stoner persona (see Jason Mewes) and say something along the lines of "Hells yes, about fifty of them."
"Most of the trouble in this world has been caused by folks who can't mind their own business, because they have no business of their own to mind, any more than a smallpox virus has." - William S Burroughs
Back when I was helping Pat run for President. I visited for something I posted on Lucy's site, that could be seen as against Jr. The funny thing was, it was an article of his "OWN" words..
Only 50? What are you, a Commie?...LOLOLOL
"Yeah, you lookin' to buy?"
"Most of the trouble in this world has been caused by folks who can't mind their own business, because they have no business of their own to mind, any more than a smallpox virus has." - William S Burroughs
If you had told me that I would be supporting the ACLU ten years ago, I would have laughed in your face. How the times have changed! What in the world is going on in Washington and how on earth did we ever elect the current disastrous administration--not once, but twice?
Thanks for posting the clip Jethro. Oh dear, should I begin memorizing Howard Zinn's People's History or A Power Governments Cannot Suppress? I'd want my kids to know a few truths before the book burning gets underway. Snooping around the libary will label me a discontent for sure. Sort of makes be want to make a contribution to the ACLU, just for a bit of insurance.
I don't think we did. The SC did the first time and Dieboldt did the second time.
I could also envision mandatory "flu shots" and mental health screening.
Each and every visit to the VA for my physicals includes a screening for depression. Someone at VA must have the Prozac contract.
#2. To: Sodie Pop (#1)
.I'm deep into reading a bio on Smedley Butler.
#3. To: TwentyTwelve (#0)
#4. To: TwentyTwelve, *libertarians* (#0)
but even to report back any expression of discontent with the government.
My spelling is Wobbly. It's good spelling but it Wobbles, and the letters get in the wrong places. -- Winnie the Pooh
#5. To: TwentyTwelve (#0)
#6. To: TwentyTwelve (#0)
#7. To: Dakmar (#5)
#8. To: Jethro Tull (#7)
I was asked a while back by my primary if I had any guns in my house.
#9. To: Jethro Tull, TwentyTwelve (#6)
#10. To: Dakmar (#8)
"Hells yes, about fifty of them."
#11. To: Refinersfire, Jethro Tull (#10)
Snappy Comeback #2:
#12. To: Sodie Pop (#1)
#13. To: Jethro Tull (#3)
#14. To: mindful (#12)
how on earth did we ever elect the current disastrous administration--not once, but twice?
#15. To: Dakmar (#5)
This is one reason I'm against national healthcare. I feel it would only be a matter of time before such a system would be abused by drug war zealots.
You appear to be a major trouble maker...and I'm getting really pissed. - GoldiLox, 7/27/2006
#16. To: FormerLurker (#15)
and mental health screening.
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