[Home]  [Headlines]  [Latest Articles]  [Latest Comments]  [Post]  [Sign-in]  [Mail]  [Setup]  [Help]  [Register] 

Status: Not Logged In; Sign In

Target Finally Gets Serious About Out-Of-Control Thefts,

Haaretz: Official Documents Reveal that Israel Had Prior Knowledge of the October 7 Hamas Attack

Supreme Court Rules that Corrupt Biden DOJ Overcharged 350 Innocent Americans for Crimes Related to Jan 6

John Deere announces mass layoffs in Midwest amid production shift to Mexico

Trillion dollar trainwreck: US super stealth fighter is eating the next generation

RFK Jr. Leaves Dr. Phil Stunned As He Explains Huge Kickbacks Fauci And NIH Have Earned From Moderna Vaccines (VIDEO)

79,000 DACA Recipients Were Approved Despite Arrest Records, Some Arrested 10x or More

Davos Forum Founder Schwab Reportedly Facing Sexual Harassment Allegations

FAB-3000 is breaking the Ukraine military

Secret Negotiations! Jill Biden's Demands for $2B Library, Legal Immunity, and $100M Book Deal

Supreme Court FREES HUNDREDS of January 6th Political Prisoners | Nukes TRUMP Charges

Diseases Increase Exponentially With Each Added Vaccine Given to Babies

Mexican cartels boast of increased lethal firepower, including some weapons from the U.S.

US Military Bases in Europe Declare Highest Security Alert in a Decade Amid Terror Threats

5 Devices You Cant Hide From- The Government Alphabet Agencies

How your FedEx driver is helping cops spy on YOU

‘Historically ludicrous’: Jewish leaders speak out against comparing vaccine passports to Holocaust

Israeli Officials Hiding Data About Forced Starvation of Gaza Prisoners:

How the F*** Are You Going to Put All These White People Ahead of Kamala?

Protests Erupt In Paris After Marine Le Pens Party Wins Big In Parliamentary Elections

Supreme Court Rules Trump Has Immunity For Official Acts, Likely Delays Trial Past Election

Rising Debt Means a Weaker Dollar

Lefties losing it: Sky News host roasts 'leftie' Jill Biden after Trump rant

JiLL THe SHRiLL...

Lefties losing it: Jill Biden ‘gaslights’ crowd after presidential debate

Why will Kamala Harris resign from her occupancy of the Office of Vice President of the USA? Scroll down for records/details

Secret Negotiations! Jill Biden’s Demands for $2B Library, Legal Immunity, and $100M Book Deal to Protect Biden Family Before Joe’s Exit

Mark Levin: They lied to us about Biden

RIGGED: Pfizer cut deal to help Biden steal 2020 election

It's Dr. Kimmy date night!


9/11
See other 9/11 Articles

Title: Ex-Italian President: Intel Agencies Know 9/11 An Inside Job
Source: Prison Planet
URL Source: http://infowars.com/articles/sept11 ... encies_know_911_inside_job.htm
Published: Dec 4, 2007
Author: Paul Joseph Watson
Post Date: 2007-12-05 12:44:26 by FormerLurker
Keywords: 9/11, treason, NWO
Views: 989
Comments: 80

Ex-Italian President: Intel Agencies Know 9/11 An Inside Job
Man who blew the whistle on Gladio tells Italy's largest newspaper attacks were run by CIA, Mossad

Prison Planet | December 4, 2007
Paul Joseph Watson

Former Italian President and the man who revealed the existence of Operation Gladio Francesco Cossiga has gone public on 9/11, telling Italy's most respected newspaper that the attacks were run by the CIA and Mossad and that this was common knowledge amongst global intelligence agencies.

Cossiga was elected President of Italian Senate in July 1983 before being winning a landslide 1985 election to become President of the country in 1985.

Cossiga gained respect from opposition parties as one of a rare breed - an honest politician - and led the country for seven years until April 1992.


Cossiga's tendency to be outspoken upset the Italian political establishment and he was forced to resign after revealing the existence of, and his part in setting up, Operation Gladio - a rogue intelligence network under NATO auspices that carried out bombings across Europe in the 60's, 70's and 80's.

Gladio's specialty was to carry out what they coined "false flag operations," terror attacks that were blamed on their domestic and geopolitical opposition.

Cossiga's revelations contributed to an Italian parliamentary investigation of Gladio in 2000, during which evidence was unearthed that the attacks were being overseen by the U.S. intelligence apparatus .

In March 2001, Gladio agent Vincenzo Vinciguerra stated, in sworn testimony, "You had to attack civilians, the people, women, children, innocent people, unknown people far removed from any political game. The reason was quite simple: to force ... the public to turn to the state to ask for greater security."

Cossiga's new revelations appeared last week in Italy's oldest and most widely read newspaper, Corriere della Sera. Below appears a rough translation. "[Bin Laden supposedly confessed] to the Qaeda September [attack] to the two towers in New York [claiming to be] the author of the attack of the 11, while all the [intelligence services] of America and Europe ... now know well that the disastrous attack has been planned and realized from the CIA American and the Mossad with the aid of the Zionist world in order to put under accusation the Arabic Countries and in order to induce the western powers to take part ... in Iraq [and] Afghanistan."

Cossiga first expressed his doubts about 9/11 in 2001, and is quoted in Webster Tarpley's book as stating that "The mastermind of the attack must have been a “sophisticated mind, provided with ample means not only to recruit fanatic kamikazes, but also highly specialized personnel. I add one thing: it could not be accomplished without infiltrations in the radar and flight security personnel.”

Coming from a widely respected former head of state, Cossiga's assertion that the 9/11 attacks were an inside job and that this is common knowledge amongst global intelligence agencies is highly unlikely to be mentioned by any establishment media outlets, because like the hundreds of other sober ex-government, military, air force professionals, allied to hundreds more professors and intellectuals - he can't be sidelined as a crackpot conspiracy theorist. (1 image)

Post Comment   Private Reply   Ignore Thread  


TopPage UpFull ThreadPage DownBottom/Latest

#1. To: robin, christine, Original_Intent, TwentyTwelve, wudidiz, FOH, Artisan, All (#0)

((((( Ping )))))


You appear to be a major trouble maker...and I'm getting really pissed. - GoldiLox, 7/27/2006

FormerLurker  posted on  2007-12-05   12:46:14 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#2. To: FormerLurker (#0)

to force ... the public to turn to the state to ask for greater security."

Somehow this sounds familiar.

Cynicom  posted on  2007-12-05   12:49:23 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#3. To: honway, aristeides, Bill D Berger (#0)

((((( Ping )))))


You appear to be a major trouble maker...and I'm getting really pissed. - GoldiLox, 7/27/2006

FormerLurker  posted on  2007-12-05   12:50:09 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#4. To: Cynicom (#2)

Somehow this sounds familiar.

Seems like a tried and proven method.


You appear to be a major trouble maker...and I'm getting really pissed. - GoldiLox, 7/27/2006

FormerLurker  posted on  2007-12-05   12:50:51 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#5. To: FormerLurker (#4)

Result=DHS

Cynicom  posted on  2007-12-05   12:54:38 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#6. To: FormerLurker (#4)

and that this was common knowledge amongst global intelligence agencies.

It is common knowledge to any logical person with a modicum of common sense and the courage to face their own demons. Even most people who poo poo the "conspiracy theories" know the deal- they are just to afraid to admit it to themselves. The more vociferous attackers of the "Truthers" are the most unsure. I know- I was one- I attacked them because of fear- fear of what the truth would mean to my neat little world and everything I believed in- and even what that would mean to who I was as person.

There isn't an intelligence agency in the world that believes the official story.

The Daily Burkeman1

Burkeman1  posted on  2007-12-05   13:02:32 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#7. To: Burkeman1 (#6)

The more vociferous attackers of the "Truthers" are the most unsure.

There are those that are truly unsure, and then there are those that ARE sure, and are part of the coverup operation, ie. co-conspirators.


You appear to be a major trouble maker...and I'm getting really pissed. - GoldiLox, 7/27/2006

FormerLurker  posted on  2007-12-05   13:14:55 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#8. To: Burkeman1 (#6)

There isn't an intelligence agency in the world that believes the official story.

We all had to come to grip with the reality of 9/11 in our own way, and at our own pace - but the truth could not be ignored by any honest individual.

Join the Ron Paul Revolution

Lod  posted on  2007-12-05   13:22:02 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#9. To: lodwick, Burkeman1, TwentyTwelve, all (#8)

I knew it was an inside job the afternoon of the "attack" simply because it did not add up from the "get-go".

The first glaring outpoint was NORAD's nonresponse.

The second was the rapidity with which the buildings collapsed from the minimal damage done.

The third giveaway was the news coverage which had PsyOps written all over it. The non-stop day after day after day replay of the impact was obviously intended to put people into emotional shock. If you are familiar with the Tavistock Institute it is published in a Tavistock doctrine, which got released in a publication a few years ago - which the public was never meant to see. Simply, that the way to make a population compliant is to administer a massive emotional shock which numbs them, and then they will accept measures, Patriot Act - War, which they otherwise would not willingly accept.

If you recall - following OKC Klinton was able to push through his "Anti-Terror" legislation which was stalled in the Congress and destined to die in Committee. Since it was already obvious that OKC was a PsyOP, and knowing that the Bushes and the Clintons are part of the same machine, it was no great leap to diagnose what was going on with 911. It simply requires that people be willing to look at the data and not reject information because it does not agree with what they would find more comfortable and rather believe.

"The truth is cruel but it can be loved, and makes free those who have loved it." ~ Albert Camus

"When I die I want to go peacefully in my sleep like my grandfather - not screaming in terror like his passengers." - Unk.

Original_Intent  posted on  2007-12-05   13:42:38 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#10. To: FormerLurker, *9-11* (#0)

If you join a ping list, you can then ping the whole group from the Ping List: drop down list.

Ron Paul for President - Join a Ron Paul Meetup group today!

robin  posted on  2007-12-05   13:44:58 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#11. To: FormerLurker (#0)

«Da ambienti vicini a Palazzo Chigi, centro nevralgico di direzione dell'intelligence italiana, si fa notare che la non autenticità del video è testimoniata dal fatto che Osama Bin Laden in esso 'confessa' che Al Qaeda sarebbe stato l'autore dell'attentato dell'11 settembre alle due torri in New York, mentre tutti gli ambienti democratici d'America e d'Europa, con in prima linea quelli del centrosinistra italiano, sanno ormai bene che il disastroso attentato è stato pianificato e realizzato dalla Cia americana e dal Mossad con l'aiuto del mondo sionista per mettere sotto accusa i Paesi arabi e per indurre le potenze occidentali ad intervenire sia in Iraq sia in Afghanistan. Per questo - conclude Cossiga - nessuna parola di solidarietà è giunta a Silvio Berlusconi, che sarebbe l'ideatore della geniale falsificazione, né dal Quirinale, né da Palazzo Chigi né da esponenti del centrosinistra!».

The crucial passage in Italian from the Corriere article in Italian.

To reason, indeed, he was not in the habit of attending. His mode of arguing, if it is to be so called, was one not uncommon among dull and stubborn persons, who are accustomed to be surrounded by their inferiors. He asserted a proposition; and, as often as wiser people ventured respectfully to show that it was erroneous, he asserted it again, in exactly the same words, and conceived that, by doing so, he at once disposed of all objections. - Macaulay, "History of England," Vol. 1, Chapter 6, on James II.

aristeides  posted on  2007-12-05   13:48:01 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#12. To: Original_Intent (#9)

Looking back on it- I was pretty enraged by the whole thing- but- even then- in the emotional days afterward- a comment by a guy at a bar I was at when the pics of the hijackers were being shown the next day on the news sorta made me do a double take- he just said "yeah, right- that's believable" (which I took to mean how it was werid how they had their pics on the news so fast)- and he said it so matter of factly that for a second I felt some doubt- but mostly I was pissed that he would dare express any doubt on such a solemn matter. But I quickly tried to forget about it. But I never did- and the guy's comment kept coming back to me.

The Daily Burkeman1

Burkeman1  posted on  2007-12-05   13:56:05 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#13. To: Burkeman1 (#12)

Looking back on it- I was pretty enraged by the whole thing- but- even then- in the emotional days afterward- a comment by a guy at a bar I was at when the pics of the hijackers were being shown the next day on the news sorta made me do a double take- he just said "yeah, right- that's believable" (which I took to mean how it was werid how they had their pics on the news so fast)- and he said it so matter of factly that for a second I felt some doubt- but mostly I was pissed that he would dare express any doubt on such a solemn matter. But I quickly tried to forget about it. But I never did- and the guy's comment kept coming back to me.

It was a contradictory observation that cut through the PsyOps fog that was thrown up in the first few days.

Thus, you, by virtue of granting, however reluctantly, the validity of the observation carried within you the seeds of the dissolution of the cover legend.

That is why, contrary to what some people have argued, the architects of this operation are not nearly as bright as they think they are.

They left too many things uncovered, and were not prepared for the way the "Official Conspiracy Theory" began to erode from all the outpoints within hours.

The better you understand PsyOps and psychological manipulation the easier it is to see through the fog. Ditto basic logic. That is why logic has been eliminated, along with much history, from the High School Curriculum. People who understand the basics of critical thinking are not so easily sold these kind of Psychological manipulations. Never forget that the Intelligence Community and the Government have large cadres of Psychiatrists and Psychologists. MK Ultra was revealed in the late '50s - they have been working on these techniques for a while.

"When I die I want to go peacefully in my sleep like my grandfather - not screaming in terror like his passengers." - Unk.

Original_Intent  posted on  2007-12-05   14:14:11 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#14. To: FormerLurker (#0) (Edited)

A poster on the Daily Kos thread is now threatening with banning not only the poster of the thread, but those who have recommended it.

To reason, indeed, he was not in the habit of attending. His mode of arguing, if it is to be so called, was one not uncommon among dull and stubborn persons, who are accustomed to be surrounded by their inferiors. He asserted a proposition; and, as often as wiser people ventured respectfully to show that it was erroneous, he asserted it again, in exactly the same words, and conceived that, by doing so, he at once disposed of all objections. - Macaulay, "History of England," Vol. 1, Chapter 6, on James II.

aristeides  posted on  2007-12-05   14:16:15 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#15. To: aristeides (#14) (Edited)

A poster on the Daily Kos thread is now threatening with banning not only the poster of the thread, but those who have recommended it.

There is obviously a LOT of pressure being put on popular websites to eradicate ANY mention of inconvenient facts concerning 9/11. ElPee eradicated 9/11 from its list of articles, banning them to the "BikerBar", and here we have KOS which is supposed to be another one of these "free speech sites" banning people over discussion of 9/11.

Those placing the pressure are obviously part of the 9/11 operation.


You appear to be a major trouble maker...and I'm getting really pissed. - GoldiLox, 7/27/2006

FormerLurker  posted on  2007-12-05   14:34:22 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#16. To: robin (#10)

If you join a ping list, you can then ping the whole group from the Ping List: drop down list.

I'm on the 9/11 ping list, but it doesn't show up when I post an article.


You appear to be a major trouble maker...and I'm getting really pissed. - GoldiLox, 7/27/2006

FormerLurker  posted on  2007-12-05   14:49:50 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#17. To: FormerLurker (#15)

There is obviously a LOT of pressure being put on popular websites to eradicate ANY mention of inconvenient facts concerning 9/11. ElPee eradicated 9/11 from its list of articles, banning them to the "BikerBar", and here we have KOS which is supposed to be another one of these "free speech sites" banning people over discussion of 9/11.

Getting closer to the whole truth................every day

Stop foreign welfare NOW!

WhiteGuy  posted on  2007-12-05   15:09:59 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#18. To: FormerLurker, robin, TwentyTwelve, Wudidiz, all (#15)

Those placing the pressure are obviously part of the 9/11 operation.

I think Goldi's banning of the topic of 911 to the "Biker Bar" was an indicator that she is being "handled/controlled" by some outside influence. The banning of Ron Paul Articles pretty well cinched it.

El Pee must now be regarded as enemy held territory.

Goldi-Israel First - Lox must be regarded as no different than Rimjob Robinscum - she is a wholly controlled disinformation source a Traitor to this nation and its people. Her first loyalty is to a foreign power's intelligence apparatus.

Of course it has long been obvious that El-Pee is infested with disinformation posters and various varieties of government shills and Zionazi disruptors/PsyOps posters.

"When I die I want to go peacefully in my sleep like my grandfather - not screaming in terror like his passengers." - Unk.

Original_Intent  posted on  2007-12-05   15:10:22 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#19. To: Burkeman1 (#6)

I came around about 911 in the spring of 2004. You had the intelligence to change your ideas, for the others that support the government theory, it has become an emotional belief.

Mark

If America is destroyed, it may be by Americans who salute the flag, sing the national anthem, march in patriotic parades, cheer Fourth of July speakers - normally good Americans who fail to comprehend what is required to keep our country strong and free - Americans who have been lulled into a false security (April 1968).---Ezra Taft Benson, US Secretary of Agriculture 1953-1961 under Eisenhower

Kamala  posted on  2007-12-05   15:35:18 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#20. To: aristeides (#14)

Kos is a total joke.

Mark

If America is destroyed, it may be by Americans who salute the flag, sing the national anthem, march in patriotic parades, cheer Fourth of July speakers - normally good Americans who fail to comprehend what is required to keep our country strong and free - Americans who have been lulled into a false security (April 1968).---Ezra Taft Benson, US Secretary of Agriculture 1953-1961 under Eisenhower

Kamala  posted on  2007-12-05   15:36:38 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#21. To: FormerLurker (#0)

BUSH: So, what's the plan again?

CHENEY: Well, we need to invade Iraq and Afghanistan. So what we've decided to do is crash a whole bunch of remote-controlled planes into Wall Street and the Pentagon, say they're real hijacked commercial planes, and blame it on the towelheads; then we'll just blow up the buildings ourselves to make sure they actually fall down.

RUMSFELD: Right! And we'll make sure that some of the hijackers are agents of Saddam Hussein! That way we'll have no problem getting the public to buy the invasion.

CHENEY: No, we won't.

RUMSFELD: We won't?

CHENEY: No, that's too obvious. We'll make the hijackers Al Qaeda and then just imply a connection to Iraq.

RUMSFELD: But if we're just making up the whole thing, why not just put Saddam's fingerprints on the attack?

CHENEY: (sighing) It just has to be this way, Don. Ups the ante, as it were. This way, we're not insulated if things go wrong in Iraq. Gives us incentive to get the invasion right the first time around.

BUSH: I'm a total idiot who can barely read, so I'll buy that. But I've got a question. Why do we need to crash planes into the Towers at all? Since everyone knows terrorists already tried to blow up that building complex from the ground up once, why don't we just blow it up like we plan to anyway, and blame the bombs on the terrorists?

RUMSFELD: Mr. President, you don't understand. It's much better to sneak into the buildings ourselves in the days before the attacks, plant the bombs and then make it look like it was exploding planes that brought the buildings down. That way, we involve more people in the plot, stand a much greater chance of being exposed and needlessly complicate everything!

CHENEY: Of course, just toppling the Twin Towers will never be enough. No one would give us the war mandate we need if we just blow up the Towers. Clearly, we also need to shoot a missile at a small corner of the Pentagon to create a mightily underpublicized additional symbol of international terrorism -- and then, obviously, we need to fake a plane crash in the middle of f**king nowhere in rural Pennsylvania.

RUMSFELD: Yeah, it goes without saying that the level of public outrage will not be sufficient without that crash in the middle of f**king nowhere.

CHENEY: And the Pentagon crash -- we'll have to do it in broad daylight and say it was a plane, even though it'll really be a cruise missile.

BUSH: Wait, why do we have to use a missile?

CHENEY: Because it's much easier to shoot a missile and say it was a plane. It's not easy to steer a real passenger plane into the Pentagon. Planes are hard to come by.

BUSH: But aren't we using two planes for the Twin Towers?

CHENEY: Mr. President, you're missing the point. With the Pentagon, we use a missile, and say it was a plane.

BUSH: Right, but I'm saying, why don't we just use a plane and say it was a plane? We'll be doing that with the Twin Towers, right?

CHENEY: Right, but in this case, we use a missile. (Throws hands up in frustration) Don, can you help me out here?

RUMSFELD: Mr. President, in Washington, we use a missile because it's sneakier that way. Using an actual plane would be too obvious, even though we'll be doing just that in New York.

BUSH: Oh, OK.

RUMSFELD: The other good thing about saying that it was a passenger jet is that that way, we have to invent a few hundred fictional victims and account for a nonexistent missing crew and plane. It's always better when you leave more cover story to invent, more legwork to do and more possible holes to investigate. Doubt, legwork and possible exposure -- you can't pull off any good conspiracy without them.

BUSH: You guys are brilliant! Because if there's one thing about Americans -- they won't let a president go to war without a damn good reason. How could we ever get the media, the corporate world and our military to endorse an invasion of a secular Iraqi state unless we faked an attack against New York at the hands of a bunch of Saudi religious radicals? Why, they'd never buy it. Look at how hard it was to get us into Vietnam, Iraq the last time, Kosovo?

CHENEY: Like pulling teeth!

RUMSFELD: Well, I'm sold on the idea. Let's call the Joint Chiefs, the FAA, the New York and Washington, D.C., fire departments, Rudy Giuliani, all three networks, the families of a thousand fictional airline victims, MI5, the FBI, FEMA, the NYPD, Larry Eagleburger, Osama bin Laden, Noam Chomsky and the fifty thousand other people we'll need to pull this off. There isn't a moment to lose!

BUSH: Don't forget to call all of those Wall Street hotshots who donated $100 million to our last campaign. They'll be thrilled to know that we'll be targeting them for execution as part of our thousand-tentacled modern-day bonehead Reichstag scheme! After all, if we're going to make martyrs -- why not make them out of our campaign paymasters? s**t, didn't the Merrill Lynch guys say they needed a refurbishing in their New York offices?

RUMSFELD: Oh, they'll get a refurbishing, all right. Just in time for the "Big Wedding"!

ALL THREE: (cackling) Mwah-hah-hah!

longnose gar  posted on  2007-12-05   15:40:56 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#22. To: longnose gar (#21)

Hey cracknose gar, if you want something to read other than your jokes concerning the death of 3000 people on 9/11/2001, read this...


A TIMELINE SURROUNDING SEPTEMBER 11TH - IF CIA AND THE GOVERNMENT WEREN'T INVOLVED IN THE SEPTEMBER 11 ATTACKS
WHAT WERE THEY DOING?

by Michael C. Ruppert

[© COPYRIGHT 2001, All Rights Reserved, Michael C. Ruppert and From The Wilderness Publications, www.fromthewilderness.com. May be copied and distributed for non-profit purposes only.]

[Expanded and Revised Sept. 4, 2002 - Evidence of Bush Administration Foreknowledge and complicity is now overwhelming. Since our last revision July 11, 2002, 16 New Items! (noted in RED)]

 

Nov. 2, 2001, 12:00 PST -- On Oct. 31 the French daily Le Figaro dropped a bombshell. While in a Dubai hospital receiving treatment for a chronic kidney infection last July, Osama bin Laden met with a top CIA official -- presumably the chief of station. The meeting, held in bin Laden's private suite, took place at the American hospital in Dubai at a time when he was a wanted fugitive for the bombings of two U.S. embassies and last year's attack on the USS Cole. Bin Laden was eligible for execution according to a 2000 intelligence finding issued by President Bill Clinton before leaving office in January. Yet on July 14, 2001 he was allowed to leave Dubai on a private jet, and there were no Navy fighters waiting to force him down.

In 1985 Oliver North -- the only member of the Reagan-Bush years who doesn't appear to have a hand in the current war -- sent the Navy and commandos after terrorists on the cruise ship Achille Lauro. In his 1991 autobiography "Under Fire," while describing terrorist Abu Abbas North wrote, "I used to wonder: how many dead Americans will it take before we do something?" One could look at the number of Americans Osama bin Laden is alleged to have killed before Sept. 11 and ask the same question.

It gets worse, much worse. A more complete timeline listing crucial events both before and after the Sept. 11 suicide attacks, which have been blamed on bin Laden, establishes CIA foreknowledge of them and strongly suggests that there was criminal complicity on the part of the U.S. government in their execution. It also makes clear that the events that have taken place since Sept. 11 are based upon an agenda that has little to do with the attacks.

[June 19, 2002] -- As the revelations of Bush Administration foreknowledge have progressed from silence, to trickle, to cascade, the question has now changed from forcing the evidence into the open into one of forcing both the media and the people to avoid denying this information in the hopes that their desire for a sense of "normalcy" can be fulfilled. As many of us have known for years, normalcy went out the window forever when the first plane hit the tower. And what has been revealed will not be resolved with an expensive fact-finding commission, a few firing, or even an impeachment proceeding. What is needed in America -- and in the global economic system -- is an overhaul, not a tune up.

1. 1991-1997 - Major U.S. oil companies including ExxonMobil, Texaco, Unocal, BP Amoco, Shell and Enron directly invest billions in cash bribing heads of state in Kazakhstan to secure equity rights in the huge oil reserves in these regions. The oil companies further commit to future direct investments in Kazakhstan of $35 billion. Not being willing to pay exorbitant prices to Russia to use Russian pipelines, the major oil companies have no way to recoup their investments. [Source: "The Price of Oil" by Seymour Hersh, The New Yorker, July 9, 2001 - The Asia Times, "The Roving Eye Part I Jan. 26, 2002.]

2.    January 1995 - Philippine police investigating a possible attack on the Pope uncover plans for Operation Bojinka, connected to World Trade Center (WTC) bomber Ramsi Youssef. Parts of the plan call for crashing hijacked airliners into civilian targets. Details of the plan are disclosed in Youssef's 1997 trial for the 1993 WTC bombing. [Source: Agence France-Presse, Dec. 7, 2001]

3.  Dec. 4, 1997 - Representatives of the Taliban are invited guests to the Texas headquarters of Unocal to negotiate their support for the pipeline. Subsequent reports will indicate that the negotiations failed, allegedly because the Taliban wanted too much money. [Source: The BBC, Dec. 4, 1997]

4. Feb. 12, 1998 - Unocal Vice President John J. Maresca -- later to become a special ambassador to Afghanistan -- testifies before the House that until a single, unified, friendly government is in place in Afghanistan, the trans- Afghani pipeline needed to monetize the oil will not be built. [Source: Testimony before the House International Relations Committee: http://www.house.gov/international_relations/105th/ap/wsap212982 .htm]

5.  August 1998 - After the U.S. cruise missile attacks on Al Qaeda targets in Afghanistan in retaliation for the African embassy bombings, Unocal officially withdraws from participation in the CentGas trans-Afghani gas pipeline project. [Various sources, Unocal]

6.  1998 - The CIA ignores warnings from Case Officer Robert Baer that Saudi Arabia was harboring an Al Qaeda cell led by two known terrorists. A more detailed list of known terrorists is offered to Saudi intelligence in August 2001 and refused. [Source: Financial Times Jan. 21, 2001; "See No Evil" by Robert Baer (release date February 2002)]

7.  April 1999 - Enron with a $3 billion investment to build an electrical generating plant at Dabhol, India loses access to plentiful LNG supplies from Qatar to fuel the plant. Its only remaining option to make the investment profitable is a trans-Afghani gas pipeline to be built by Unocal from Turkmenistan that would terminate near the Indian border at the city of Multan. [Source: The Albion Monitor, Feb. 28, 2002]

8.  July 4, 1999 - President Clinton signs Executive Order 13129, which freezes Taliban assets in the U.S. and prohibits trade between the Afghan fundamentalist regime and U.S. entities. [Source: Federal Register, Vol. 64, No. 129, July 7, 1999]

9.  1998 and 2000 - Former President George H.W. Bush travels to Saudi Arabia on behalf of the privately owned Carlyle Group, the 11th largest defense contractor in the U.S. While there he meets privately with the Saudi royal family and the bin Laden family. [Source: Wall Street Journal, Sept. 27, 2001. See also FTW, Vol. IV, No. 7 - "The Best Enemies Money Can Buy"
http://www.fromthewilderness.com/free/ww3/carlyle.html ]

10.  March 2000 - An FBI agent, reportedly angry over a glitch in Carnivore that has somehow mixed innocent non-targeted emails with those belonging to Al Qaeda, destroys all of the FBI's Denver-based intercepts of bin Laden's colleagues in a terrorist investigation. [Source: The Washington Post, May 29, 2002]

11.  2000 (est.) - The FBI refuses to disclose the date of an internal memo stating that a Middle Eastern nation had been trying to purchase a flight simulator. [Source: Los Angeles Times, May 30, 2002]

12.  August 2000 -- Suspected Al Qaeda operatives wiretapped by Italian police made apparent references to plans for major attacks involving airports, airplanes and the United States according to transcripts obtained by the Los Angeles Times. The Times suggests that the information might not have been passed to U.S. authorities (hard to believe), but it did report that Italian authorities would not comment on the report. The Times also noted that "Italian and U.S. anti-terrorism experts cooperate closely." [Source: The Los Angeles Times, May 29, 2002]

13.  Oct. 24-26, 2000 - Pentagon officials carry out a "detailed" emergency drill based upon the crashing of a hijacked airliner into the Pentagon. [Source: The Mirror, May 24, 2002]

14.  January 2001 - The Bush Administration orders the FBI and intelligence agencies to "back off" investigations involving the bin Laden family, including two of Osama bin Laden's relatives (Abdullah and Omar) who were living in Falls Church, Va. -- right next to CIA headquarters. This followed previous orders dating back to 1996 that frustrated efforts to investigate the bin Laden family. [Source: BBC Newsnight, Correspondent Gregg Palast, Nov. 7, 2001]

15.  Jan. 30, 2001 - Sept. 11 hijacker Ziad Jarrah was questioned in the United Arab Emirates (UAE). A number of UAE, Middle Eastern, European, and U.S. sources were cited in this CNN report, which said the CIA requested Jarrah be interrogated because he had been in Afghanistan and was suspected to have ties to terrorists. An unnamed CIA spokesman said the other sources' claims that the agency knew anything about Jarrah before Sept. 11 were "flatly untrue." Jarrah's Jan. 30 detainment at the airport in Dubai, UAE came six months after he took flying lessons in the U.S. Jarrah was released because "U.S. officials were satisfied," said the report. [Source: CNN, Aug. 1, 2002 http://www.cnn.com/2002/US/08/01/cia.hijacker/index.html] 

16.  Feb. 13, 2001 - UPI terrorism correspondent Richard Sale -- while covering a trial of bin Laden's Al Qaeda followers -- reports that the National Security Agency has broken bin Laden's encrypted communications. Even if this indicates that bin Laden changed systems in February, it does not mesh with the fact that the government insists that the attacks had been planned for years.

17.  May 2001 - Secretary of State Colin Powell gives $43 million in aid to the Taliban regime, purportedly to assist hungry farmers who are starving since the destruction of their opium crop in January on orders of the Taliban regime. [Source: Los Angeles Times, May 22, 2001]

18.  May 2001 - Deputy Secretary of State Richard Armitage, a career covert operative and former Navy Seal, travels to India on a publicized tour, while CIA Director George Tenet makes a quiet visit to Pakistan to meet with Pakistani leader Gen. Pervez Musharraf. Armitage has long and deep Pakistani intelligence connections. It would be reasonable to assume that while in Islamabad, Tenet, in what was described as "an unusually long meeting," also met with his Pakistani counterpart, Lt. Gen. Mahmud Ahmad, head of the ISI. [Source: The Indian SAPRA news agency, May 22, 2001]

19.  June 2001 - German intelligence, the BND, warns the CIA and Israel that Middle Eastern terrorists are "planning to hijack commercial aircraft to use as weapons to attack important symbols of American and Israeli culture." [Source: Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung, Sept. 14, 2001; See
http://www.fromthewilderness.com/free/ww3/f_a_zeitung_story.html< /a>]

20.  June 8, 2001 - Radio Free Europe/Radio Liberty (RFE/RL) publishes a story headlined, "Central Asia: Charges Link Russian Military to Drug Trade." According to the article, figures for 1999 published in a report by the United Nations Drug Control Program (UNDCP) revealed that 80 percent of the heroin consumed in Western Europe originated in Afghanistan and Pakistan. The UNDCP report also revealed half of the drugs in that 80 percent traveled through Central Asia. A study by the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace published in March 2000 said Russian soldiers headquartered in Tajikistan were suspected of helping drug traffickers by providing them with transportation facilities. This was confirmed by a Russian intelligence officer who told the Moscow News weekly, "You can come to an arrangement [with custom officials] so that the search of military transport planes remains purely formal. The same goes for train convoys carrying military cargo [to Russia from Tajikistan]." [Source: www.rferl.org/nca/features/2001/06/08062001111711.asp ]

21.  July 2001 - FBI agents in Arizona write a memorandum warning about suspicious activities involving a group of Middle Eastern men taking flight training lessons in Phoenix. The memorandum specifically mentions Osama bin Laden and warns of connections to terrorist activities. [Source: The New York Times, May 14, 2002]

22.  summer 2001 - The National Security Council convenes a Dabhol working group as revealed in a series of government e-mails obtained by the Washington Post and the New York Daily News. [Source: The Albion Monitor, Feb. 28, 2002]

23.  summer 2001 - According to a Sept. 26 story in Britain's The Guardian, correspondent David Leigh reported that "U.S. department of defense official, Dr. Jeffrey Starr, visited Tajikistan in January. The Guardian's Felicity Lawrence established that U.S. Rangers were also training special troops in Kyrgyzstan. There were unconfirmed reports that Tajik and Uzbek special troops were training in Alaska and Montana."

24.  summer 2001 (est.) - Pakistani ISI Chief Gen. Ahmad (see above) orders an aide to wire transfer $100,000 to Mohammed Atta who was, according to the FBI, the lead terrorist in the suicide hijackings. Ahmad recently resigned after the transfer was disclosed in India and confirmed by the FBI. The individual who makes the wire transfer at Ahmad's direction is Ahmad Umar Sheik, the lead suspect in the kidnapping and murder of Wall Street Journal reporter Daniel Pearl. [Source: The Times of India, Oct.11, 2001.]

25.  summer 2001 - The online newswire online.ie reports on Sept. 14 that an Iranian man phones U.S. law enforcement to warn of an imminent attack on the WTC in the week of Sept. 9. German police confirm the calls but state that the U.S. Secret Service would not reveal any further information. [Source:
http://www.online.ie/news/viewer.adp? article=1512332.
http://www.fromthewilderness.com/free/ww3/online_ie_story.html ]

26.  summer 2001 - Jordanian intelligence, the GID, makes a communications intercept deemed so important that King Abdullah's men relay it to Washington, probably through the CIA station in Amman. To make doubly sure the message got through it was passed through an Arab intermediary to a German intelligence agent. The message: A major attack was planned inside the U.S., and aircraft would be used. The code name of the operation was "The Big Wedding."  "When it became clear that the information was embarrassing to Bush Administration officials and congressmen who at first denied that there had been any such warnings before Sept. 11, senior Jordanian officials backed away from their earlier confirmations." This case was authenticated by ABC reporter John K. Cooley. [Source: International Herald Tribune (IHT), May 21, 2002]

27.  summer 2001 (est.) - The National Security Agency intercepts telephone conversations between bin Laden aide Khalid Shaikh Mohammed and Mohammed Atta and does not share the information with any other agencies. [Source: Jonathan Landay, Knight Ridder Newspapers, June 6, 2002]

28.  June 26, 2001 - The magazine indiareacts.com states that "India and Iran will 'facilitate' U.S. and Russian plans for 'limited military action' against the Taliban." The story indicates that the fighting will be done by U.S. and Russian troops with the help of Tajikistan and Uzbekistan. [Source: indiareacts.com, June 26, 2001]

29.  summer 2001 - Russian intelligence notifies the CIA that 25 terrorist pilots have been specifically training for missions involving hijacked airliners. This is reported in the Russian press and news stories are translated for FTW by a retired CIA officer. (Note: The story currently on the Izvestia web site has been edited to delete a key paragraph.) [Source: Izvestia, Sept. 12, 2001,
http://www.fromthewilderness.com/free/ww3/izvestia_story_pic.html ]

30.  July 4-14, 2001 - Osama bin Laden receives treatment for kidney disease at the American hospital in Dubai and meets with a CIA official, who returns to CIA headquarters on July 15. [Source: Le Figaro, Oct. 31, 2001]
http://www.fromthewilderness.com/free/ww3/Le Figaro_osama_dubai.html

31.  July 15, 2001 - Members of the G8, meeting in Genoa, Italy, discuss the Taliban, pipelines, and the handing over of Osama bin Laden. According to Pakistani representative Ambassador Naiz Naik, the U.S. delegation, led by former Clinton Ambassador to Pakistan Tom Simmons warned of a "military option" if the Taliban did not change position. [Source: Jean-Charles Brisard and Guillaume Dasquie, "Bin Laden: La Verite Interdite," pp76-7. Thanks to Prof. Peter Dale Scott]

32.  July 2001 - Immediately after the G8 Summit three American officials -- Tom Simmons (former U.S. ambassador to Pakistan), Karl Inderfurth (former assistant secretary of state for South Asian affairs) and Lee Coldren (former State Department expert on South Asia) -- meet with Pakistani and Russian intelligence officers in Berlin and tell them that the U.S. is planning military strikes against Afghanistan in October. A French book released in November, "Bin Laden - La Verite Interdite," discloses that Taliban representatives often sat in on the meetings. British papers confirm that the Pakistani ISI relayed the threats to the Taliban. [Source: The Guardian, Sept. 22, 2001; the BBC, Sept. 18, 2001; The Inter Press Service, Nov. 16, 2001; Alexander's Gas and Oil Connections, Feb. 21, 2002]

33.  July 2001 - The G8 summit at Genoa, Italy is surrounded by anti-aircraft guns, and local airspace is closed off after Italian and Egyptian officials (including President Hosni Mubarak) warn American intelligence that airliners stuffed with explosives might be used to attack President Bush. U.S. officials state that the warnings were "unsubstantiated." (But I wonder if they would have taken away the anti-aircraft artillery?) [Source: Los Angeles Times, Sept. 27, 2001]

34.  July 26, 2001 - CBS News reports that John Ashcroft has stopped flying commercial airlines due a threat assessment. Ashcroft told the press that he didn't know anything about what had caused it.

35.  Aug. 2, 2001 - U.S. ambassador to Pakistan, Christine Rocca (a former CIA officer), meets in Islamabad with a Taliban ambassador and demands the extradition of bin Laden. This was the last known meeting on the subject. [Source: Brisard and Dasquie, p 79. Thanks to Prof. Peter Dale Scott]

36.  August 2001 - The FBI arrests an Islamic militant linked to bin Laden in Boston. French intelligence sources confirm that the man is a key member of bin Laden's network and the FBI learns that he has been taking flying lessons. At the time of his arrest the man is in possession of technical information on Boeing aircraft and flight manuals. [Source: Reuters, Sept. 13, 2001]

37.  Aug. 11 or 12, 2001 ‚ U.S. Navy Lt. Delmart "Mike" Vreeland, jailed in Toronto on U.S. fraud charges and claiming to be an officer with U.S. naval intelligence, writes details of the pending WTC attacks and seals them in an envelope, which he gives to Canadian authorities. [Source: The Toronto Star, Oct. 23, 2001; Toronto Superior Court Records]

38.  August 2001 - As reported in the IHT both a French magazine (name not given) and a Moroccan newspaper simultaneously report that a Moroccan agent named Hassan Dabou had penetrated Al Qaeda to the point of getting close to bin Laden, who was "very disappointed" that the 1993 bombing had not toppled the WTC. Dabou was called to the U.S. after reporting this, which curtailed his ability to stay in touch with the organization and gather additional intelligence that might have prevented the attacks. Though not proved beyond a doubt, these stories have been met with a wall of silence. [The IHT, May 21, 2002]

39.  August 2001 - Russian President Vladimir Putin orders Russian intelligence to warn the U.S. government "in the strongest possible terms" of imminent attacks on airports and government buildings. [Source: MSNBC interview with Putin, Sept. 15, 2001]

40.  August 2001 - President Bush receives classified intelligence briefings at his Crawford, Texas ranch indicating that Osama bin Laden might be planning to hijack commercial airliners. [CBS News; CNN, May 15, 2002]

41.  late-August 2001 - Prince Turki, the pro-U.S. head of Saudi intelligence (also known to be close to bin Laden), is replaced by his more neutral half-brother, Prince Nawwaf who is an ally of Crown Prince Abdullah. [Source: Saudi Arabian Information Resource, Aug. 31, 2001; http://www.saudinf.com/ - Thanks to Prof. Peter Dale Scott]

42.  August/September 2001 - The Dow Jones Industrial Average drops nearly 900 points in the three weeks prior to the attack. A major stock market crash is imminent.

43.  August/September 2001 - According to a detailed 13-page memo written by Minneapolis FBI legal officer Colleen Rowley, FBI headquarters ignores urgent, direct warnings from French intelligence services about pending attacks. In addition, a single Supervisory Special Agent (SSA) in Washington expends extra effort to thwart the field office's investigation of Zacarias Moussaoui, in one case rewriting Rowley's affidavit for a search warrant to search Moussaoui's laptop. Rowley's memo uses terms like "deliberately sabotage," "block," "integrity," "omitted," "downplayed," "glossed over," "mis- characterize," "improper political reasons, "deliberately thwarting," "deliberately further undercut," "suppressed," and "not completely honest." These are not terms describing negligent acts but rather, deliberate acts. FBI field agents desperately attempt to get action, but to no avail. One agent speculates that bin Laden might be planning to crash airliners into the WTC, while Rowley ironically noted that the SSA who had committed these deliberate actions had actually been promoted after Sept. 11. [Source: Associated Press, May 21, 2002]

44.  Sept. 3-10, 2001 - MSNBC reports on Sept. 16 that a caller to a Cayman Islands radio talk show gave several warnings of an imminent attack on the U.S. by bin Laden in the week prior to 9-11.

45.  early-September 2001 - An FBI internal document, based upon field notes from Minnesota field agents discloses that the agents had been investigating and had questioned the "20th hijacker," Zacarias Moussaoui. The field notes speculate that Moussaoui, who had been taking flight lessons, might crash an airliner into the WTC. Interestingly, the field agents' requests to obtain a search warrant for his personal computer were denied. French intelligence confirms to the FBI that Moussaoui has ties to terrorist groups and may have traveled to Afghanistan. The agents also had no knowledge of the Phoenix memo (See Item #18). One news story states that agents were in "a frenzy," absolutely convinced that he was "going to do something with a plane." [Source: Newsweek, May 20, 2002 issue, story by Michael Isikoff].

46.  Sept. 1-10 2001 - In an exercise, called Operation "Swift Sword" and planned for four years, 23,000 British troops are steaming toward Oman. Although the 9-11 attacks caused a hiccup in the deployment, the massive operation was implemented as planned. At the same time two U.S. carrier battle groups arrive on station in the Gulf of Arabia just off the Pakistani coast. Also at the same time, some 17,000 U.S. troops join more than 23,000 NATO troops in Egypt for Operation "Bright Star." All of these forces are in place before the first plane hits the WTC. [Sources: The Guardian; CNN; Fox; The Observer; International Law Professor Francis Boyle, the University of Illinois.]

47.  Sept. 4-5, 2001 - A freshman at Brooklyn's New Utrecht High School who had recently emigrated from Pakistan reportedly predicts the destruction of the World Trade Center a week prior to the 9-11 attacks, according to the JournalNews newspaper in White Plains, N.Y. Citing "three police sources and a city official familiar with the investigation" as well as confirmation from the FBI that the bureau had received this information, the paper reported that in the midst of a heated class discussion the student pointed to the World Trade Center from a third story window and said, "Do you see those two buildings? They won't be standing there next week." New York City Board of Education spokeswoman Catie Marshall confirmed for the JournalNews "that school officials reported the matter to police within minutes of the Sept. 11 attack" and students told the paper that "FBI agents and NYPD detectives descended on the school on Sept. 13 to interrogate the student [who made the prediction] and others in his class," which was "an English class for Arab-American students." [Source: The JournalNews, Oct. 11, 2001, http://www.thejournalnews.com/newsroom/101101/11warumors.html]

48.  Sept. 5, 2001 - "Five hundred websites -- many of them with an Arab or Muslim connection -- crash when an anti-terrorism taskforce raids InfoCom Corp. in Texas," reported Britain's the Guardian on Sept. 10, 2001. A taskforce of approximately 80 federal agents and officials from the FBI, Secret Service, INS, Customs, Bureau of Diplomatic Security, IRS, and Commerce Department occupied InfoCom's office building in the Dallas suburb of Richardson, Texas for four days, "copying every hard disc they could find." InfoCom hosts many websites for Middle Eastern clients and is located across the street from the Holy Land Foundation, a charitable organization which has been alleged to have connections with terrorist groups. InfoCom's vice president of marketing, Ghassan Elashi, is also the chairman of the Holy Land Foundation. [Source: The Guardian, Sept. 10, 2001, http://www.guardian.co.uk/elsewhere/journalist/story/0,7792,5495 90,00.html]

49.  Sept. 7, 2001 - Florida Governor Jeb Bush signs a two-year emergency executive order (01-261) making new provisions for the Florida National Guard to assist law enforcement and emergency-management personnel in the event of large civil disturbances, disaster or acts of terrorism. [Source: State of Florida website listing of Governor's executive orders]

50.  Sept. 6-7, 2001 - Put options (a speculation that the stock will go down) totaling 4,744 are purchased on United Air Lines stock, as opposed to only 396 call options (speculation that the stock will go up). This is a dramatic and abnormal increase in sales of put options. Many of the United puts are purchased through Deutschebank/A.B. Brown, a firm managed until 1998 by the current executive director of the CIA, A.B. "Buzzy" Krongard. [Source: The Herzliyya International Policy Institute for Counterterrorism (ICT), http://www.ict.org.il/, Sept. 21, 2001 (Note:The ICT article on possible terrorist insider trading appeared eight days *after* the 9/11 attacks.); The New York Times; The Wall Street Journal; The San Francisco Chronicle, Sept. 29, 2001]

51.  Sept. 10, 2001 - Put options totaling 4,516 are purchased on American Airlines as compared to 748 call options. [Source: Herzliyya Institute - above]

52.  Sept. 6-11, 2001 - No other airlines show any similar trading patterns to those experienced by United and American. The put option purchases on both airlines were 600 percent above normal. This at a time when Reuters (Sept. 10) issues a business report stating, "Airline stocks may be poised to take off."

53.  Sept. 6-10, 2001 - Highly abnormal levels of put options are purchased in Merrill Lynch, Morgan Stanley, AXA Re(insurance) which owns 25 percent of American Airlines, and Munich Re. All of these companies are directly impacted by the Sept. 11 attacks. [Source: ICT, above;
FTW
, Oct. 18, 2001, http://www.fromthewilderness.com/free/ww3/oct152001.html]

54.  2001-2002 - It has been documented that the CIA, the Israeli Mossad, and many other intelligence agencies monitor stock trading in real time using highly advanced programs reported to be descended from Promis software. This is to alert national intelligence services of just such kinds of attacks. Promis was reported as recently as June 2001 to be in Osama bin Laden's possession and, as a result of recent stories by Fox, both the FBI and the Justice Department have confirmed its use for U.S. intelligence gathering through at least summer 2002. This would confirm that CIA had additional advance warning of imminent attacks. [Sources: The Washington Times, June 15, 2001; Fox, Oct. 16, 2001;
FTW
, Oct. 26, 2001, - http://www.fromthewilderness.com/free/ww3/11_19_01_magic_carpet.html
FTW
, Vol. IV, No. 6, Sept. 18, 2001 - http://www.fromthewilderness.com/free/ww3/sept1801.html;
FTW
, Vol. III, No. 7, Sept. 30, 2000 - http://www.fromthewilderness.com/free/pandora/052401_promis.html< /a>]

55.  Sept. 9, 2001 - President George W. Bush is presented with detailed war plans to overthrow Al Qaeda, according to U.S. and foreign sources speaking to NBC News. [Source: MSNBC, May 16, 2002. Thanks to Prof. Peter Dale Scott]

56.  Sept. 10, 2001 - This item has been removed solely at the request of the party previously named in this entry. Recent court proceedings 51; which occurred after the news story we had cited - have indicated that there was no connection between the story listed here, the person named therein and the attacks of 9-11-01. At the request of the previously named party, FTW has replaced the $1,000 reward with a $1,000 donation to The Childrens Defense Fund on behalf of the named party and the issue is now amicably resolved without any hard feelings between that party and FTW.

57.  Sept. 10, 2001 - According to Newsweek, a group of top Pentagon officials suddenly cancelled travel plans for the next morning, apparently because of security concerns. [Source: Newsweek, Sept. 24, 2001]

58.  Sept. 10, 2001 - The Houston Chronicle reports the FBI was notified of a fifth grader from a Dallas suburb who told his teacher, "Tomorrow, World War III will begin. It will begin in the United States, and the United States will lose." The Chronicle was unclear on specifically when Garland, Texas school district officials told the FBI about the incident, but it was some time between Sept. 13, 2001 and the story's publication date of Sept. 19, 2001. [Source: Houston Chronicle, Sept. 19, 2001 http://www.chron.com/cs/CDA/story.hts/metropolitan/1055222

59.  Sept. 10, 2001 - San Francisco Mayor Willie Brown receives a call from what he described as "his security people at the airport" eight hours before the terrorist attacks "advising him that Americans should be cautious about their air travel," as reported by the San Francisco Chronicle. Brown was scheduled to fly to New York from San Francisco International Airport. He told the Chronicle the call "didn't come in any alarming fashion, which is why I'm hesitant to make any alarming statement." [Source: San Francisco Chronicle, Sept. 12, 2001, http://www.sfgate.com/today/0912_chron_mnreport.shtml ]

60.  Sept. 11, 2001 - The National Reconnaissance Office (NRO), the federal agency that runs many of the nation's spy satellites, schedules an exercise involving a plane crashing into one of the agency's buildings. "On the morning of Sept. 11, 2001," according to a website advertising a homeland security conference in Chicago run by the National Law Enforcement and Security Institute, CIA official John Fulton and his team "were running a pre-planned simulation to explore the emergency response issues that would be created if a plane were to strike a building. Little did they know that the scenario would come true in a dramatic way." Fulton is the head of the NRO's strategic gaming division. [Source: National Law Enforcement and Security Institute, http://www.nlsi.net, http://story.news.yahoo.com/news? tmpl=story&u=/ap/20020821/ap_wo_en_ge/us_sept_11_plane_exercise_1 ]

61.  Sept. 11, 2001 - After the attacks on the World Trade Center and Pentagon occur, National Public Radio's congressional correspondent David Welna reports, "I spoke with congressman Ike Skelton, a Democrat from Missouri and a member of the Armed Services Committee, who said that just recently the director of the CIA warned that there could be an attack -- an imminent attack - on the United States of this nature. So this is not entirely unexpected." [Source: http://www.thememoryhole.org/updates.htm]

62.  Sept. 11, 2001 - United Air Lines flight 23, scheduled to fly from New York City to Los Angeles was delayed after four Muslim passengers began demanding that the plane take off immediately. This happened apparently after the first plane had hit the WTC. The passengers were thrown off the flight. [Source: The Globe and Mail, June 13, 2002]

63.  Sept. 11, 2001 - Gen. Mahmud of the ISI (see #16), friend of Mohammed Atta, is visiting Washington on behalf of the Taliban. He is meeting with the Chairmen of the House and Senate Intelligence Committees, Rep. Porter Goss, R-Fla., and Sen. Bob Graham, D-Fla., [Source: MSNBC, Oct. 7, 2001; The New York Times, Feb. 17, 2002]

64.  Sept. 11, 2001 - Employees of Odigo, Inc. in Israel, one of the world's largest instant messaging companies with offices in New York, receive threat warnings of an imminent attack on the WTC less than two hours before the first plane hits. Law enforcement authorities have gone silent about any investigation of this. The Odigo research and development offices in Israel are located in the city of Herzliyya, a ritzy suburb of Tel Aviv that is the same location as the Institute for Counter Terrorism, which eight days later reports details of insider trading on 9- 11. [Source: CNN's Daniel Sieberg, Sept. 28, 2001; MSNBC Newsbytes, Brian McWilliams, Sept. 27, 2001; Ha'aretz, Sept. 26, 2001]

65.  Sept. 11, 2001 - For 50 minutes, from 8:15 AM until 9:05 AM, with it widely known within the FAA and the military that four planes have been simultaneously hijacked and taken off course, no one notifies the President of the United States. It is not until 9:30 that any Air Force planes are scrambled to intercept, but by then it is too late. This means that the National Command Authority waited for 75 minutes before scrambling aircraft, even though it was known that four simultaneous hijackings had occurred. [Source: CNN; ABC; MSNBC; Los Angeles Times; The New York Times; www.tenc.net]

66.  Sept. 11-12, 2001 - Nearly a month before the first reported outbreak, White House officials start taking the powerful antibiotic Cipro to treat anthrax. By the end of the year it will be known that the Ames strain of anthrax used in the attacks against Sens. Leahy and Daschle was produced by CIA programs coordinated through Fort Detrick, the Batelle Memorial Institute and the Dugway Proving Ground. [Source: NBC; CNN; www.tetrahedron.org, www.judicialwatch.org]

67.  Sept. 13, 2001 - China is admitted to the World Trade Organization quickly, after years of unsuccessful attempts. [Source: The New York Times, Sept. 30, 2001]

68.  Sept. 14, 2001 - Canadian jailers open the sealed envelope from Mike Vreeland in Toronto and see that is describes attacks against the WTC and Pentagon. The U.S. Navy subsequently states that Vreeland was discharged as a seaman in 1986 for unsatisfactory performance and has never worked in intelligence. [Source: The Toronto Star, Oct. 23, 2001; Toronto Superior Court records]

69.  Sept. 15, 2001 - The New York Times reports that Mayo Shattuck III has resigned, effective immediately, as head of the Alex Brown (A.B.) unit of Deutschebank.

70.  Sept. 29, 2001 - The San Francisco Chronicle reports that $2.5 million in put options on American and United airlines are unclaimed. This is likely the result of the suspension in trading on the New York Stock Exchange after the attacks, which gave the Securities and Exchange Commission time to be waiting when the owners showed up to redeem their put options.

71.  Oct. 10, 2001 - The Pakistani newspaper The Frontier Post reports that U.S. Ambassador Wendy Chamberlain has paid a call on the Pakistani oil minister. A previously abandoned Unocal gas pipeline project from Turkmenistan, across Afghanistan, to Pakistan is now back on the table "in view of recent geopolitical developments."

72.  Oct. 11, 2001 - The Ashcroft Justice Department takes over all terrorist prosecutions from the U.S. Attorneys office in New York, which has had a highly successful track record in prosecuting terrorist cases connected to Osama bin Laden. [Source: The New York Times, Oct. 11, 2001]

73.  mid-October 2001 - The Dow Jones Industrial Average, after having suffered a precipitous drop has recovered most of its pre- attack losses. Although still weak and vulnerable to negative earnings reports, a crash has been averted by a massive infusion of government spending on defense programs, subsidies for "affected" industries and planned tax cuts for corporations.

74.  Oct. 29, 2001 - The Bush Administration drafts "an executive order that would usher in a new era of secrecy for presidential records and allow an incumbent president to withhold a former president's papers even if the former president wanted to make them public," wrote the Washington Post. The order also required members of the public to prove "at least a demonstrated, specific need'" for a president's papers to be released. Critics contend this would overturn the 1978 Presidential Records Act, which releases documents after 12 years. The White House maintained that a Supreme Court decision in 1977 allows presidents various privileges for their records. [Source: Washington Post, Nov. 1, 2001, http://washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/A20731-2001Oct31? language=printer]

75.  Nov. 21, 2001 - The British paper The Independent runs a story headlined, "Opium Farmers Rejoice at the Defeat of the Taliban." The story reports that massive opium planting is underway all over the country.

76.  Nov. 25, 2001 - The Observer runs a story headlined "Victorious Warlords Set To Open the Opium Floodgates." It states that farmers are being encouraged by warlords allied with the victorious Americans are "being encouraged to plant as much opium as possible."

77.  Dec. 4, 2001 - Convicted drug lord and opium kingpin Ayub Afridi is recruited by the U.S. government to help establish control in Afghanistan by unifying various Pashtun warlords. The former opium smuggler who was one of the CIA's leading assets in the war against the Russians is released from prison in order to do this. [Source: The Asia Times Online, Dec. 4, 2001]

78.  Dec. 25, 2001 - Newly appointed Afghani Prime Minister Hamid Karzai is revealed as being a former paid consultant for Unocal. [Source: Le Monde]

79.  Jan. 3, 2002 - President Bush appoints Zalmy Khalilzad as a special envoy to Afghanistan. Khalilzad, a former employee of Unocal, also wrote op-eds in the Washington Post in 1997 supporting the Taliban regime. [Source: Pravda, Jan. 9, 2002]

80.  Jan. 4, 2002 - Florida drug trafficking explodes after 9-11. In a surge of trafficking reminiscent of the 1980s the diversion of resources away from drug enforcement has opened the floodgates for a new surge of cocaine and heroin from South America. [The Christian Science Monitor, Jan. 4, 2002]

81.  Jan. 10, 2002 - In a call from a speaker phone in open court, attorneys for Mike Vreeland call the Pentagon's switchboard operator, who confirms that Vreeland is indeed a naval lieutenant on active duty. She provides an office number and a direct dial phone extension to his office in the Pentagon. [Source: Attorney Rocco Galati; Toronto Superior Court records]

82.  Jan. 10, 2002 - Attorney General John Ashcroft recuses himself from the Enron investigation because Enron had been a major campaign donor in his 2000 Senate race. He fails to recuse himself from involvement in two sitting federal grand juries investigating bribery and corruption charges against ExxonMobil and BP Amoco, which have massive oil interests in Central Asia. Both were major Ashcroft donors in 2000. [Source: CNN, Jan. 10, 2002; FTW, "The Elephant in the Living Room, Part I," April 4, 2002,
http://www.fromthewilderness.com/free/ww3/04_04_02_elephant.html< /a>]

83.  Jan. 23, 2002 - Wall Street Journal reporter Daniel Pearl is kidnapped in Pakistan. Pearl is reported dead on Feb. 21. Lead suspect Ahmad Umar Sheik, former colleague of Gen. Ahmad, is arrested on Feb. 12 and named as the lead suspect in the kidnapping and murder. Legal sources close to the Pakistani government tell FTW that Pearl was investigating the ISI. [Source: CNN.com]

84.  Feb. 9, 2002 - Pakistani leader Gen. Musharraf and Afghan leader Hamid Karzai announce their agreement to "cooperate in all spheres of activity," including the proposed Central Asian pipeline. Pakistan will give $10 million to Afghanistan to help pay Afghan government workers. [Source: The Irish Times, Feb. 9, 2002]

85.  Feb. 18, 2002 - The Financial Times reports that the estimated opium harvest in Afghanistan in the late-spring 2002 will reach a world record 4,500 metric tons.

86.  mid-April, 2002 - World Bank chief James Wolfensohn, at the opening of the World Bank's offices in Kabul, states he has held talks about financing the Trans-Afghanistan gas pipeline. He confirms $100 million in new grants for the interim Afghani government. Wolfensohn also states that a number of companies have already expressed interest in the project. [Source: Alexander's Gas and oil Connections, citing an Agence France-Presse story]

87. May 13, 2002 - The BBC reports that Afghanistan is about to close a deal for construction of the $2 billion gas pipeline to run from Turkmenistan to Pakistan and India. The story states, "work on the project will start after an agreement is expected to be struck" at a summit scheduled for the end of the month. Unocal will build the pipeline. [Source: BBC, May 13, 2002]

88.  May 2002 - A number of sources report progress on both oil and gas pipelines. Regional sources state that Unocal will re-emerge as a pipeline contender after withdrawing from the CentGas pipeline project in 1998. Unocal denies plans to revive the gas pipeline but curiously neglects to mention whether or not it has any interest in the oil pipeline, which local sources say is moving ahead. [Source: The Dawn Group of Newspapers, May 7, May 17, May 22, 2002]

89. May 30, 2002 - Afghanistan's interim leader, Hamid Karzai, Turkmenistan's President Niyazov, and Pakistani President Musharraf meet in Islamabad to sign a memorandum of understanding on the trans- Afghanistan gas pipeline project. The three leaders will meet for more talks on the project in October. The Turkmen- Afghan-Pakistani gas pipeline accord has been published and can be viewed at the following website: http://www.gasandoil.com/goc/news/nts22622.htm. [Source: NewsBase, June 5, 2002]

90.  May 16, 2002 - White House Press Secretary Ari Fleischer states unequivocally that while President Bush had been warned of possible hijackings, "The president did not -- not -- receive information about the use of airplanes as missiles by suicide bombers." [Source: CBS News, May 15, 2002]

91. May 19, 2002 - Former FBI Agent Tyrone Powers, now a professor at Anne Arundel Community College states on radio station KISS 98.7 that he has credible evidence suggesting that the Bush Administration did in fact allow the Sept. 11 attacks to further a hidden agenda. [Source: http://www.indymedia.org - May 20, 2002]

92. May 31, 2002 - FBI Agent Robert Wright delivers a tearful press conference at the National Press Club describing his lawsuit against the FBI for deliberately curtailing investigations that might have prevented the 9-11 attacks. He uses words like "prevented," "thwarted," "obstructed," "threatened," "intimidated," and "retaliation" to describe the actions of his superiors in blocking his attempts to shut off money flows to Al Qaeda and other terrorist groups. These are not words of negligence. They are words describing deliberate and malicious actions. [Source: C-SPAN website]

93. June 4, 2002 - Air Force Lt. Col. Steve Butler, who had called President Bush a joke and accused him of allowing the Sept. 11 attacks to happen, is suspended from his post at the Defense Language School in Monterey, Calif. and could face a court martial. [Source: Associated Press, June 4, 2002]

94.  June 14, 2002 - Common Dreams website publishes an account from a former member of the 1/118th Infantry Battalion of the South Carolina National Guard: "My unit reported for drill in July 2001 and we were suddenly and unexpectedly informed that all activities planned for the next two months would be suspended in order to prepare  for a mobilization exercise to be held on Sept. 14, 2001. We worked diligently for two weekends and even came in on an unscheduled day in August to prepare for the exercise. By the end of August all we needed was a phone call, which we were to expect, and we could hop into a fully prepared convoy with our bags and equipment packed." [Source: Common Dreams, http://www.commondreams.org/views02/0614-02.htm]          

95.  June 17, 2002 - Reuters reports that Butler's case has been resolved without the necessity of a court martial. (I guess so. There's enough material here to prove him right. -- MCR) [Reuters, June 17, 2002]

96.  July 2, 2002 - Motions from Zacarias Moussaoui are unsealed in federal court, indicating that Moussaoui wants to testify before both a grand jury and Congress about the Sept. 11 attacks. Moussaoui claims to have information showing that the U.S. government wanted the attacks to happen. [Source: The Washington Post, July 3, 2002]

97.  July 3, 2002 - The first-ever shipment of Russian oil, 200,000 metric tons, arrives in Houston. [Source: The Moscow Times, July 6, 2002].

98.  July 6, 2002 - Afghan Vice President Hajji Abdul Qadir is assassinated by Afghan warlords. The New York Times reports that Qadir may have been assassinated by opium warlords upset by Qadir's efforts to reduce the rampant opium farming and processing that has taken place since the U.S. occupation. Qadir had been overseeing a Western-backed eradication program, according to the Times. However, the opium warlords of the region are same ones sponsored, protected, and in some cases released from prison by the CIA and who have been protected by President Bush's special envoy, Zalmay Khalilzad. It is reported that the raw opium is being refined near U.S. bases at Kandahar. [Sources: The New York Times, July 8, 2002; Far Eastern Economic Review, April 18, 2002]

99.  July 26, 2002 - White House security prevented the legal watch-group Judicial Watch from serving Vice President Cheney with a lawsuit filed on behalf of Halliburton shareholders. Before becoming vice president Cheney was CEO of Halliburton, which has filed for bankruptcy. [Source: Cybercast News Service, cnsnews.com] 

100.  Aug. 2, 2002 - The FBI asked members of the House and Senate intelligence committees to take lie-detector tests as investigators try to determine who leaked information to CNN about communications in Arabic that made vague references to an impending attack on the United States. The communications were intercepted by the National Security Agency on Sept. 10 but weren't translated until Sept. 12. [Source: Associated Press story published in the Boston Globe, Aug. 2, 2002, http://www.truthout.org/docs_02/08.03A.fbi.lie.det.p.htm]

101.  Aug. 5, 2002 - The Associated Press reported Russia's major role over the last five years in the trafficking of Afghan heroin into Europe. [Source: Santa Fe New Mexican, Aug. 5, 2002, www.sfnewmexican.com]

102.  Aug. 16, 2002 - A Knight Ridder story discloses that members of Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld's staff have created a special planning unit for an invasion of Iraq. The unit is composed primarily of civilians and was spearheaded by conservative members of Rumsfeld's staff, such as Deputy Secretary of Defense Paul Wolfowitz. The story was headlined, "White House Methodically Preparing for Iraq Campaign." [Source: Knight Ridder Newspapers, www.truthout.org/docs 02/08.17B.wh.prep.irq.p.htm]

103.  Aug. 28, 2002 - The Globe and Mail of Canada reports Afghanistan will become the world's top producer of opium this year, surpassing Southeast Asia. [Source: the Globe and Mail, Aug. 28, 2002]   

Now, let's go back to the Oct. 31 story by Le Figaro -- the one that has Osama bin Laden meeting with a CIA officer in Dubai in July 2001.

The story says, "Throughout his stay in the hospital, Osama Bin Laden received visits from many family members [There goes the story that he's a black sheep! --MCR] and Saudi Arabian Emirate personalities of status. During this time the local representative of the CIA was seen by many people taking the elevator and going to bin Laden's room.

"Several days later the CIA officer bragged to his friends about having visited the Saudi millionaire. From authoritative sources, this CIA agent visited CIA headquarters on July 15, the day after bin Laden's departure for Quetta.

"According to various Arab diplomatic sources and French intelligence itself, precise information was communicated to the CIA concerning terrorist attacks aimed at American interests in the world, including its own territory.

"Extremely bothered, they [American intelligence officers in a meeting with French intelligence officers] requested from their French peers exact details about the Algerian activists [connected to bin Laden through Dubai banking institutions], without explaining the exact nature of their inquiry. When asked the question, What do you fear in the coming days?' the Americans responded with incomprehensible silence.

"On further investigation, the FBI discovered certain plans that had been put together between the CIA and its 'Islamic friends' over the years. The meeting in Dubai is, so it would seem, consistent with 'a certain American policy.'"

Even though Le Figaro reported that it had confirmed with hospital staff that bin Laden had been there as reported, stories printed on Nov. 1 contained quotes from hospital staff that these reports were untrue. On Nov. 1, as reported by the Ananova press agency, the CIA flatly denied that any meeting between any CIA personnel and Osama bin Laden at any time.

Who do you believe?

WATCH THIS PAGE FOR CONTINUING ADDITIONS TO THIS TIMELINE



You appear to be a major trouble maker...and I'm getting really pissed. - GoldiLox, 7/27/2006

FormerLurker  posted on  2007-12-05   16:18:26 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#23. To: Original_Intent (#18)

I think Goldi's banning of the topic of 911 to the "Biker Bar" was an indicator that she is being "handled/controlled" by some outside influence. The banning of Ron Paul Articles pretty well cinched it.

El Pee must now be regarded as enemy held territory.

That's for sure..


You appear to be a major trouble maker...and I'm getting really pissed. - GoldiLox, 7/27/2006

FormerLurker  posted on  2007-12-05   16:23:11 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#24. To: Original_Intent (#18)

Hellz ya.

"They must find it difficult... Those who have taken authority as the truth, rather than truth as the authority." ~ Gerald Massey

wudidiz  posted on  2007-12-05   16:33:59 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#25. To: FormerLurker (#0)

Thank you for the ping. We already know this, but it's just good that people like that are saying it.

Ooooh, I am so looking forward to some justice on this.

"They must find it difficult... Those who have taken authority as the truth, rather than truth as the authority." ~ Gerald Massey

wudidiz  posted on  2007-12-05   16:38:01 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#26. To: longnose gar (#21)

Just in time for the "Big Wedding"!

summer 2001 - Jordanian intelligence, the GID, makes a communications intercept deemed so important that King Abdullah's men relay it to Washington, probably through the CIA station in Amman. To make doubly sure the message got through it was passed through an Arab intermediary to a German intelligence agent. The message: A major attack was planned inside the U.S., and aircraft would be used. The code name of the operation was "The Big Wedding." "When it became clear that the information was embarrassing to Bush Administration officials and congressmen who at first denied that there had been any such warnings before Sept. 11, senior Jordanian officials backed away from their earlier confirmations." This case was authenticated by ABC reporter John K. Cooley. [Source: International Herald Tribune (IHT), May 21, 2002]

So you know the code words. Were you part of the operation longnose?


You appear to be a major trouble maker...and I'm getting really pissed. - GoldiLox, 7/27/2006

FormerLurker  posted on  2007-12-05   16:41:49 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#27. To: FormerLurker, , *9-11* (#22)

Hey don't waste a great post on a NWO prison-bitch.

Mark

If America is destroyed, it may be by Americans who salute the flag, sing the national anthem, march in patriotic parades, cheer Fourth of July speakers - normally good Americans who fail to comprehend what is required to keep our country strong and free - Americans who have been lulled into a false security (April 1968).---Ezra Taft Benson, US Secretary of Agriculture 1953-1961 under Eisenhower

Kamala  posted on  2007-12-05   16:48:59 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#28. To: Kamala (#27)

Hey don't waste a great post on a NWO prison-bitch.

It had the intended effect I believe..


You appear to be a major trouble maker...and I'm getting really pissed. - GoldiLox, 7/27/2006

FormerLurker  posted on  2007-12-05   17:32:08 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#29. To: wudidiz (#25)

Ooooh, I am so looking forward to some justice on this.

I doubt we'll see it happen unless Ron Paul wins the election.


You appear to be a major trouble maker...and I'm getting really pissed. - GoldiLox, 7/27/2006

FormerLurker  posted on  2007-12-05   17:34:29 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#30. To: Original_Intent (#18)

I think Goldi's banning of the topic of 911 to the "Biker Bar" was an indicator that she is being "handled/controlled" by some outside influence. The banning of Ron Paul Articles pretty well cinched it.

El Pee must now be regarded as enemy held territory.

Liberty Post has been taken over by the New World Order.

TwentyTwelve  posted on  2007-12-06   0:39:26 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#31. To: FormerLurker (#22)

if you want something to read other than your jokes

The joke is you absolute morons who think it makes any sense to believe that that Bush and the Joos flew drones into the WTCs, and THEN blew them up with planted demolitions and THEN flew a missile into the Pentagon pretending it was plane, and THEN just for good measure, faked a plane crash in the middle of nowhere. What kind of an idiot thinks this scenario makes any sense? Take a step back and realize what total dumbasses you are.

Where are the flight crews and passengers from these "fake" crashes? Will you idiots realize what fools you are?

longnose gar  posted on  2007-12-06   10:21:33 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#32. To: longnose gar (#31)

The official conspiracy theory is laughable, what actually happened we don't know. But the law of physics led to the planted demolition idea, as well as some physical evidence. Again, we don't know what actually happened, but we are certain the official explanation is a crock of lies. That in other times of history false flag operations have been used for political reasons, and that the PNAC wrote about needing a "new Pearl Harbor event", illuminates motivation.

If the Bush Regime is willing to kill hundreds of thousands of Iraqis, and possibly 3000 Americans at WTC, why would a couple plane loads of passengers be a problem?

I refer you to the CIA's "family jewels" released over the summer, for the kind of evil our govt was capable of in the 50s and 60s and now freely admits to. Among what they have publicly admitted, and it was published in all the major American newspapers, is brutally experimenting on and altering the minds of 4 year olds. Before the release of the "family jewels", such talk was considered wild conspiracies and spoken of by only "kooks".

Ron Paul for President - Join a Ron Paul Meetup group today!

robin  posted on  2007-12-06   10:31:25 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#33. To: robin (#32)

The official conspiracy theory is laughable,

TwentyTwelve  posted on  2007-12-06   10:35:46 ET  (1 image) Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#34. To: robin (#32)

The official conspiracy theory is laughable

There is no "official conspiracy theory." There is an explanation of events based on the best empirical evidence.

But the law of physics

The laws of physics have been meticulously used to explain the fall of towers, but the twoofers ignore that and stick to their harebrained ideas.

we don't know

True. The twoofers don't know jack.

If the Bush Regime is willing to kill hundreds of thousands of Iraqis, and possibly 3000 Americans at WTC, why would a couple plane loads of passengers be a problem?

You know you are dealing with advanced stage BDS when terms like "Bush regime" are used. So I am not shocked at the rest of your pathetic accusations. How are things going for you down at Moveon.org headquarters?

longnose gar  posted on  2007-12-06   10:50:01 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#35. To: longnose gar (#34)

The laws of physics have been meticulously used to explain the fall of towers

Another lie.

TwentyTwelve  posted on  2007-12-06   11:02:47 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#36. To: longnose gar (#34)

WHY DID THE TOWERS FALL SO FAST?

TwentyTwelve  posted on  2007-12-06   11:04:10 ET  (1 image) Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#37. To: wudidiz (#25)

Ooooh, I am so looking forward to some justice on this.

TwentyTwelve  posted on  2007-12-06   11:08:17 ET  (1 image) Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#38. To: longnose gar (#34)

The laws of physics have been meticulously used to explain the fall of towers

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Ron Paul for President - Join a Ron Paul Meetup group today!

robin  posted on  2007-12-06   11:10:50 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#39. To: robin (#38)

9/11 Coincidences Made Easy

9/11 Coincidences (Part One) (WTC Collapses)

9/11 Coincidences (Part Two) (WTC Collapses Freefall Speed)

9/11 Coincidences (Part Three) (Explosives)

9/11 Coincidences (Part Four) (Pentagon)

9/11 Coincidences (Part Five) (PNAC Document)

9/11 Coincidences (Part Six) (NORAD) (Able Danger)

9/11 Coincidences (Part Seven) (WTC7)

9/11 Coincidences (Part Eight) (Controlled Demolition)

9/11 Coincidences (Part Eight Update) (Thermite/Thermate) (Molten Metal)

9/11 Coincidences (Part Nine) (WTC Security)

9/11 Coincidences (Part Ten) (911 Commission Report)

9/11 Coincidences (Part Eleven) (911: Who Benefits?)

9/11 Coincidences (Part Eleven Update) (Osama Bin Landen/Al Queda)

9/11 Coincidences (Part Twelve) (Bush, 911)

9/11 Coincidences (Part Thirteen) (The Bush-Laden Connection)

9/11 Coincidences (Part Fourteen) (The Bush-Laden Connection Con?d)

9/11 Coincidences (Part Fifteen) (Osama Bin Laden CIA Asset: AKA Tim Osman)

TwentyTwelve  posted on  2007-12-06   11:18:58 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#40. To: robin (#38)

The laws of physics have been meticulously used to explain the fall of towers

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Purdue Simulation Full of Hot Air

George Washington's Blog

Thursday June 21, 2007

The newest volley in the disinformation campaign regarding 9/11 is a simulation of the Twin Towers created by Purdue University. As summarized by Raw Story:

The simulation found jet engine shafts from airlines flown into the World Trade Center "flew through the building like bullets," according to an Associated Press vide report.

Flaming jet fuel cascaded through the tower stripping away fireproofing material and causing the building to collapse, the AP video reports.

"The weight of the aircraft's fuel, when ignited, acted like a flash flood of flaming liquid," according to the video.

However, Kevin Ryan has already demonstrated that there was not enough energy from the airplane impacts to have knocked much of the fireproofing off. See also this article.

And very few of the core columns were severed by the planes' impact. And tests by NIST showed that temperatures in the Twin Towers never got hot enough to significantly weaken the structural steel of the 47-column inner core.

Researchers have stated that the Purdue simulation contradicts the observed facts in other ways, and in the next couple of weeks, they will publish their findings.

Moreover, the Purdue simulation still does not address the flies in the ointment which NIST also ignored:

(1) The simulation either fails to include, or inaccurately represents, the 47 core columns holding up each of the Twin Towers.

(2) Most of the jet fuel burned outside the buildings, especially in the case of the South Tower - which produced a glowing orange fireball as the building was struck at an oblique angle. So the simulation could not hold true for the South Tower.

(3) The people who designed the Twin Towers did not think that an airplane plus fire from the jet fuel could bring the buildings down. Indeed, they assumed that "all the fuel (from the airplane) would dump into the building", and yet assumed "The building structure would still be there." Since most of the fuel (especially with the South Tower) exploded outside of the buildings, shouldn't they "still be there"?

(4) Even if the planes and fire had initiated a collapse sequence, why did the towers totally collapse, when no modern steel-framed building has ever before completely collapsed due to fire?

(5) Why did they collapse at virtually free-fall speed? And why did WTC7 -- which wasn't even hit by a plane -- totally collapse at free-fall speed later that same day?

(6) How could the buildings have fallen at near free-fall speed, indicating very little resistance, and yet produce tremendous pulverization of concrete, which indicates great resistance?

(7) No one can explain why "steel columns in building 7 were "PARTLY EVAPORATED in extraordinarily high temperatures" (pay-per-view). Absent controlled demolition, how could such temperatures have been generated by jet fuel or diesel?

As if that's not enough, Kevin Ryan pointed out to me today by email that the Purdue simulation contradicts many aspects of NIST's findings:

"1. Were columns on the south face of WTC severed by aircraft impact? NIST says maybe one, but Purdue now suggests several. NCSTAR1, p. 22-23.

2. Was there any jet fuel in AA11's center fule tank? NIST says no, but Purdue now says yes, it was completely full. NCTSAR1-5A, p liii, lviii.

3. How did the fieproofing get "widely dislodged"? NIST suggests the aircraft debris turned into shotgun blasts to affect this. Purdue now suggests the jet fuel did it. Thanks to Purdue for invalidating NIST's work. NCSTAR1, p 119."

In other words, not only does the Purdue simulation contain many of the same errors as the NIST reports, but, as if that's not bad enough, it stretches the truth beyond even what NIST itself has done.

Moreover, as pointed out by the blog Truth Or Lies:

"The following statement was used in the Purdue simulation: 'The weight of the aircraft's fuel, when ignited, acted like a flash flood of flaming liquid.' This is a direct contradiction of the FEMA report (which can be viewed HERE) which stated: 'despite the huge fireballs caused by the two planes crashing into the WTC towers each with 10,000 gallons of jet fuel, the fireballs did not explode or create a shock wave that would have resulted in structural damage.'”

As Crockett L. Grabbe, PhD, research scientist and visiting scholar, department of physics and astronomy, university of Iowa 1980, and former researcher at Naval Research Laboratory put it:

“Many may conclude that the building structure of the World Trade Center twin towers was poorly designed with fire retardants that the heat from the airliner explosions within an hour caused catastrophic destruction of the south tower, and in less than 2 hours the north tower. However, the evidence overwhelmingly supports a different conclusion: this collapse was in fact caused by explosive devices planted well in advance."

Indeed, numerous scientists, engineers and demolition experts have said the official version of the destruction of the World Trade Centers is impossible.

TwentyTwelve  posted on  2007-12-06   11:20:50 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#41. To: TwentyTwelve (#39)

Thank You! Bookmarked!

Ron Paul for President - Join a Ron Paul Meetup group today!

robin  posted on  2007-12-06   11:20:56 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#42. To: robin (#41)

10 False Flags That Changed the World

by Joe Crubaugh

**************************************

10 False Flags that Changed the World

10. Nero, Christians, and the Great Fire of Rome

9. Remember the Maine, to Hell with Spain

8. The Manchurian Incident

7. Secrets of the Reichstag Fire

6. Fake Invasion at Gleiwitz

5. The Myth of Pearl Harbor

4. Israeli Terrorist Cell Uncovered in Egypt

3. U.S.-Sponsored Terrorism: Operation Northwoods

2. Phantoms in the Gulf of Tonkin

{{drumroll}}

NUMBER ONE

The September 11, 2001 Attacks

http://www.911blogger.com/taxonomy/term/227

TwentyTwelve  posted on  2007-12-06   11:24:22 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#43. To: TwentyTwelve, *9-11* (#39)

9/11 Coincidences (Part Five) (PNAC Document)

9/11 Coincidences (Part Six) (NORAD) (Able Danger)

These should be watched first, IMO. They should be called Part One and Part Two, respectively.

Ron Paul for President - Join a Ron Paul Meetup group today!

robin  posted on  2007-12-06   12:43:25 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#44. To: TwentyTwelve (#39)

I forgot about Enron, Part 7, reminds us.

www.newswithviews.com/Devvy/kidd155.htm

Ron Paul for President - Join a Ron Paul Meetup group today!

robin  posted on  2007-12-06   13:01:39 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#45. To: longnose gar (#31)

The joke is you absolute morons who think it makes any sense to believe that that Bush and the Joos flew drones into the WTCs

Only raving nutters such as you imply that. Obviously Bush didn't fly anything, but he might have been aware of and complicit in the attacks, regardless of who actually carried out the operation.

And BTW, are you a Jew hater? Why do you make derogatory remarks about Jewish people?


You appear to be a major trouble maker...and I'm getting really pissed. - GoldiLox, 7/27/2006

FormerLurker  posted on  2007-12-06   14:16:21 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#46. To: longnose gar (#31)

Where are the flight crews and passengers from these "fake" crashes? Will you idiots realize what fools you are?

BTW, I don't recall ever saying that airplanes didn't hit the WTC towers, although the planes themselves wouldn't and couldn't have caused the buildings to collapse.

The office fires could not have heated the steel support structure to a point where it would have weakened enough to precipitate a collapse. The entire structure acted as a huge heat sink, where the heat was distributed throughtout the structure, and not just at the floors that were on fire. Don't try to tell me about jet fuel, as even the government's NIST report states that the jet fuel fires only lasted several minutes, where the fuel was burnt up within that time.

Since the buildings did in fact collapse, even WTC7 that had minimal damage from falling debris, and considering the fact that the US government has made every effort NOT to consider explosives in the buildings, then I must assume that those in the US government HAVE to be complicit, as only they could orchestrate a coverup on such a grand scale.

So longnose, what do you do for work?


You appear to be a major trouble maker...and I'm getting really pissed. - GoldiLox, 7/27/2006

FormerLurker  posted on  2007-12-06   19:36:30 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#47. To: TwentyTwelve (#40)

As Crockett L. Grabbe, PhD, research scientist and visiting scholar, department of physics and astronomy, university of Iowa 1980, and former researcher at Naval Research Laboratory put it:

“Many may conclude that the building structure of the World Trade Center twin towers was poorly designed with fire retardants that the heat from the airliner explosions within an hour caused catastrophic destruction of the south tower, and in less than 2 hours the north tower. However, the evidence overwhelmingly supports a different conclusion: this collapse was in fact caused by explosive devices planted well in advance."

Indeed, numerous scientists, engineers and demolition experts have said the official version of the destruction of the World Trade Centers is impossible.

Good info, thanks for posting it.


You appear to be a major trouble maker...and I'm getting really pissed. - GoldiLox, 7/27/2006

FormerLurker  posted on  2007-12-06   19:39:17 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#48. To: longnose gar (#34)

The laws of physics have been meticulously used to explain the fall of towers, but the twoofers ignore that and stick to their harebrained ideas.

People like you appear to think physics is some sort of voodoo. Trying to use very simple explanations involving physics to the likes of you is like trying to teach a tree to sing, it's a total waste of energy.

Those that DO understand physics DO see how impossible the "official" explanations are, especially when looking at the amount of time it took the towers to collapse. People like you are "magical thinkers", where even though science definitively confirms the fact that the WTC towers could NOT have fallen in the amount of time that they fell UNLESS there were explosives planted in the buildings, you'll continue to believe the opposite, and insist that those that disagree with your mistaken beliefs are "KOOKS", while claiming that "the laws of physics" support your ideas, which they don't.


You appear to be a major trouble maker...and I'm getting really pissed. - GoldiLox, 7/27/2006

FormerLurker  posted on  2007-12-06   19:53:21 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#49. To: longnose gar (#34)

The laws of physics have been meticulously used to explain the fall of towers, but the twoofers ignore that and stick to their harebrained ideas.

Uh-huh! Norman Podhoretz must love Hoosiers like me...Obviously.

"Most of the trouble in this world has been caused by folks who can't mind their own business, because they have no business of their own to mind, any more than a smallpox virus has." - William S Burroughs

Dakmar  posted on  2007-12-06   19:56:10 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#50. To: FormerLurker (#48)

and insist that those that disagree with your mistaken beliefs are "KOOKS"

Because you are a kook. A delusional imbecile.

It is an unquestionable fact that the towers began collapsing at the point of plane impacts. So, a rationale person would conclude empirically then, that the planes were the cause of the collapse. Delusional kooks like yourself surmise that somebody planted explosives in exactly those locations the planes would hit, and then the pilots managed to hit exactly those spots with the planes without detonating the explosives, and then the buildings were blown up an hour later. To delusional kooks like yourself, this is supposed to make more sense than the planes caused the collapse.

It has been demonstrated over and over that the buildings did not fall at free fall speed, that they did not fall into their own footprints, and seasoned structural engineers have outlined the most likely mechanisms of collapse. Yet you delusional kooks rely on the speculations of fellow kooks who don't have an effin clue.

So keep living in your fantasy world, and I'll just keep laughing at you.

longnose gar  posted on  2007-12-07   13:27:11 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#51. To: longnose gar (#50)

Think Khalid Sheikh Mohammed was the second unnamed victim of the CIA torture that we now learn the videotapes were destroyed of?

If so, everything the 9/11 Commission Report said about the operational details of 9/11 becomes questionable. Because it was all based on KSM's testimony.

To reason, indeed, he was not in the habit of attending. His mode of arguing, if it is to be so called, was one not uncommon among dull and stubborn persons, who are accustomed to be surrounded by their inferiors. He asserted a proposition; and, as often as wiser people ventured respectfully to show that it was erroneous, he asserted it again, in exactly the same words, and conceived that, by doing so, he at once disposed of all objections. - Macaulay, "History of England," Vol. 1, Chapter 6, on James II.

aristeides  posted on  2007-12-07   13:31:24 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#52. To: longnose gar (#50)

It has been demonstrated over and over that the buildings did not fall at free fall speed,

Hey genius, post your source. The NIST report states the collapse times were between 10-11 seconds, where the free fall time is ~9 seconds.

So go ahead and tell me how long YOU think it took for the towers to fall.


You appear to be a major trouble maker...and I'm getting really pissed. - GoldiLox, 7/27/2006

FormerLurker  posted on  2007-12-07   13:49:30 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#53. To: longnose gar (#50)

Yet you delusional kooks

BTW, I'm not the one that lives in a fantasy world that relies on physically impossible events in order for it to exist, YOU are.


You appear to be a major trouble maker...and I'm getting really pissed. - GoldiLox, 7/27/2006

FormerLurker  posted on  2007-12-07   13:50:50 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#54. To: FormerLurker (#53)

I thought the shill had been canned already.

angle  posted on  2007-12-07   13:53:44 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#55. To: angle (#54) (Edited)

I thought the shill had been canned already.

I know he's been warned about posting anti-Paul propaganda, but apparently he's still here.

Honestly, it's not that bad having a shill or two around if only to have fun beating them over the head with truth and facts.


You appear to be a major trouble maker...and I'm getting really pissed. - GoldiLox, 7/27/2006

FormerLurker  posted on  2007-12-07   14:19:53 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#56. To: FormerLurker (#52)

The explanations for this have been posted everywhere:

In every photo and every video, you can see columns far outpacing the collapse of the building. Not only are the columns falling faster than the building but they are also falling faster than the debris cloud which is ALSO falling faster than the building. This proves the buildings fell well below free fall speed. That is, unless the beams had a rocket pointed to the ground.

Just look at any video you like and watch the perimeter columns.

Deceptive videos stop the timer of the fall at 10:09 when only the perimeter column hits the ground and not the building itself. If you notice, the building just finishes disappearing behind the debris cloud which is still about 40 stories high.

Below is a more accurate graphic using a paper written by Dr. Frank Greening which can be found at: http://www.911myths.com/WTCREPORT.pdf

The paper takes the transfer of momentum into account. Like a billiard ball being hit by another on a pool table, each floor transferred its momentum to the next as represented below. The more weight, the less resistance each floor gave.

d = 1/2at^2

so

t = (2d/a)^1/2

a is 9.8m/s^2

t = (834m/9.8m/s^2)^1/2 = 9.23s at free fall

As seen in the chart, the fall time for the tops to reach the ground was about 11 - 13 seconds, demonstrating the building fell much slower than free fall.

ENERGY TRANSFER IN THE WTC COLLAPSE

longnose gar  posted on  2007-12-07   15:15:14 ET  (2 images) Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#57. To: longnose gar (#56)

9.23s at free fall

As seen in the chart, the fall time for the tops to reach the ground was about 11 - 13 seconds, demonstrating the building fell much slower than free fall.

So you think that it would only take an extra 1.77 seconds or so to smash through 80 stories of undamaged concrete and steel, eh?

Yep, I guess all that steel and concrete must be about as weak as thin air...

LOL, what an idiot you are.


You appear to be a major trouble maker...and I'm getting really pissed. - GoldiLox, 7/27/2006

FormerLurker  posted on  2007-12-07   16:33:34 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#58. To: FormerLurker (#57)

I provided you with a link in which a momentum transfer analysis was performed to determine the expected time of collapse -- which was between 11 and 13 seconds. It was a scientific analysis by a qualified expert, not just something pulled out of his ass like what you and your kook "experts" provide. No one knows exactly how long it took for the buildings to collapse because the top was hidden in the dust cloud as it was collapsing. But it is abundantly clear it was falling at less than free fall from the debris falling which is falling faster than the buildings.

ENERGY TRANSFER IN THE WTC COLLAPSE

longnose gar  posted on  2007-12-08   13:11:30 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#59. To: longnose gar (#58)

It was a scientific analysis by a qualified expert, not just something pulled out of his ass like what you and your kook "experts" provide.

Any sane person would realize that it would take more than just a mere 1.77 seconds to break through 80 undamaged floors of a skyscraper, which was designed to support the load of the upper floors PLUS a wide safety factor.

The initial fall was of a distance of ONE floor, if the official collapse theory is to be believed. There would not have been enough energy to cause a total immediate collapse at near free fall speeds, regardless of what your government sponsored "expert" states.

The only "kooks" are those that believe as you do that a 110 story building could totally collapse in 11-13 seconds without a bit of help.

Here's some REAL experts that disagree with you and your "expert";

Engineers and Architects Question the 9/11 Commission Report


You appear to be a major trouble maker...and I'm getting really pissed. - GoldiLox, 7/27/2006

FormerLurker  posted on  2007-12-08   19:54:40 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#60. To: longnose gar (#58) (Edited)

ENERGY TRANSFER IN THE WTC COLLAPSE

BTW, I can see by browsing through your "experts" analysis that he's a liar that wrote the material specifically for people that don't understand physics.

He used a totally inelastic collision as the basis of his analysis, which is NOT the case in the WTC collapse, as much of the structure disintegrated into dust and was ejected horizontally, thus negating any concept of an inelastic collision.

Additionally, he assumed that the floors would break immediately upon impact from the upper floors, and did not substract the energy required to break the floor from his total kinetic energy, until much later giving it another very crude analysis that doesn't stand up to scrutiny. He also neglected to substract the loss of mass due to material being ejected horizontally away from the structure.

In other words, he performed a dishonest analysis, which was good enough to convince the likes of people such as yourself.


You appear to be a major trouble maker...and I'm getting really pissed. - GoldiLox, 7/27/2006

FormerLurker  posted on  2007-12-08   20:17:01 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#61. To: longnose gar (#58)

Here's an analysis you might wish to look over..

A Refutation of the Official Collapse Theory


You appear to be a major trouble maker...and I'm getting really pissed. - GoldiLox, 7/27/2006

FormerLurker  posted on  2007-12-08   20:21:29 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#62. To: FormerLurker (#61)

The clock starts when the blue ball is dropped from the roof (110th floor). Just as the blue ball passes the 100th floor, the red ball drops from the 100th floor. When the red ball passes the 90th floor, the orange ball drops from the 90th floor, ... etc. Notice that the red ball (at floor 100) cannot begin moving until the blue ball reaches that level, which is 2.8 seconds after the blue ball begins to drop.

This proves you are an idiot if you believe crap like this.

Hint: you're not rolling balls across a table. The floors are falling and accelerating at the rate of gravity.

Again, you are going to believe whatever junk math that gets thrown out to support your dumbass kook position. What you should ponder, and what you can't refute is: The buildings began collapsing at the point of plane impact. This is visually indisputable. So for your stupid controlled demolition theory to be true, the explosives would have had to be planted (completely undetected) at the point of plane impact, the pilots would have had to manage to exactly hit these points in each building, the explosives would have had to survive the impact, and then for some reason, they were detonated an hour later. Only a complete idiot would believe this scenario over the fact that planes caused the collapse.

longnose gar  posted on  2007-12-10   9:44:09 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#63. To: longnose gar (#62)

This proves you are an idiot if you believe crap like this.

Of course idiots like you pick the phrase designed for idiots like you, and ignore the other material that is 99% of the document.

The floors are falling and accelerating at the rate of gravity.

If they were falling through thin air, yes. That could only happen if there were no floors under them, as in what would happen in a controlled demolition.

You even ignore your own post where your expert stated in a ideal inelastic collision the velocity would be reduced by half upon impact with the floor immediately below. This isn't even taking into account the material ejected laterally, which would make it an elastic collision thus reducing the speed further and lowering the momentum downwards due to loss of mass.

But of course you're too stupid to understand any of that, and prefer to call people with more knowledge than you "kooks" and "idiots"...


You appear to be a major trouble maker...and I'm getting really pissed. - GoldiLox, 7/27/2006

FormerLurker  posted on  2007-12-13   11:45:19 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#64. To: longnose gar (#62)

Again, you are going to believe whatever junk math that gets thrown out to support your dumbass kook position.

You don't even understand the info you post, which IS junk math, so shut the hell up you retard.


You appear to be a major trouble maker...and I'm getting really pissed. - GoldiLox, 7/27/2006

FormerLurker  posted on  2007-12-13   11:47:28 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#65. To: longnose gar (#62)

The buildings began collapsing at the point of plane impact. This is visually indisputable. So for your stupid controlled demolition theory to be true, the explosives would have had to be planted (completely undetected) at the point of plane impact, the pilots would have had to manage to exactly hit these points in each building, the explosives would have had to survive the impact, and then for some reason, they were detonated an hour later. Only a complete idiot would believe this scenario over the fact that planes caused the collapse.

The explosives could have been planted on all floor levels over a period of years. Only a complete moron would think that's impossible.

It's also not impossible that the general area of the impact would be known, especially if the planes were somehow taken over by remote control, which IS entirely possible and has already been done.

As far as the explosives surviving the impact, it's not that difficult if they were placed in the inner core, which was relatively undamaged from the impacts.

But rather than look at how it could have been done, one needs to look at how the buildings came down as they did, and any reasonably intelligent person can see that they could not have possibly come down as they did without some type of explosives.

Hell, the steel hadn't even weakened to a point where there was a danger of collapse, as the fires didn't burn long enough. Similar office fires burned for a day or so in one of the towers in 1975, and the building didn't come close to collapsing then, as the structure acts as a huge heat sink and dissipates the heat throughtout the steel frame and concrete.


You appear to be a major trouble maker...and I'm getting really pissed. - GoldiLox, 7/27/2006

FormerLurker  posted on  2007-12-13   11:54:33 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#66. To: longnose gar (#62)

This proves you are an idiot if you believe crap like this.

Go back to El pee.

TwentyTwelve  posted on  2007-12-13   11:57:15 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#67. To: FormerLurker (#65)

When this story about Cossiga broke, we didn't yet know about the CIA's destruction of the waterboarding tapes.

The news of that destruction makes it a lot harder to believe in the 9/11 Commission's account of 9/11, which relied on tortured detainees' testimony. Robert Scheer: Waterboarding Our Democracy.

To reason, indeed, he was not in the habit of attending. His mode of arguing, if it is to be so called, was one not uncommon among dull and stubborn persons, who are accustomed to be surrounded by their inferiors. He asserted a proposition; and, as often as wiser people ventured respectfully to show that it was erroneous, he asserted it again, in exactly the same words, and conceived that, by doing so, he at once disposed of all objections. - Macaulay, "History of England," Vol. 1, Chapter 6, on James II.

aristeides  posted on  2007-12-13   11:59:33 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#68. To: FormerLurker (#63)

You even ignore your own post where your expert stated in a ideal inelastic collision the velocity would be reduced by half upon impact with the floor immediately below. This isn't even taking into account the material ejected laterally, which would make it an elastic collision thus reducing the speed further and lowering the momentum downwards due to loss of mass.

The material ejected laterally was collateral material. The floors themselves fell as a bulk, and it is perfectly reasonable to model using an assumed inelastic collisin.

Your modeler thinks a reasonable assumption is that the building fell like rolling billiard balls across a table. Dumbass like all the truthers.

longnose gar  posted on  2007-12-13   13:05:54 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#69. To: longnose gar (#68)

collapse from fire pulverized into fine powder the entire building and its contents, huh? give it up.

christine  posted on  2007-12-13   13:54:55 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#70. To: christine (#69)

As we examined the WTC-debris sample, we found large chunks of concrete (irregular in shape and size, one was approximately 5cm X 3 cm X 3cm) as well as medium-sized pieces of wall-board (with the binding paper still attached). Thus, the pulverization was in fact NOT to fine dust, and it is a false premise to start with near-complete pulverization to fine powder (as might be expected from a mini-nuke or a “star-wars” beam destroying the Towers). Indeed, much of the mass of the MacKinlay sample was clearly in substantial pieces of concrete and wall-board rather than in fine-dust form...

It seems that the 9/11 truth community likewise “has been slow to understand” that the WTC dust particles in greatest abundance are the “supercoarse” variety rather than “fine” particles, and that significant chunks of concrete were also found in the WTC rubble.

http://www.journalof911studies.com/letters/a/Hard-Evidence-Rebudiates-the-Hypothesis-that-Mini-Nukes-were-used-on-the-wtc-towers-by-steven-jones.pdf

longnose gar  posted on  2007-12-13   14:11:31 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#71. To: christine, longnose gar, FormerLurker (#69)

collapse from fire pulverized into fine powder the entire building and its contents, huh? give it up.

I suppose the US government wants us to believe that 300,000 pounds of aircraft parts collided with over 13 million tons of steel (a weight estimate of 7 world trade center floors) and 14,000 cubic feet of concrete (estimate) and that a paper passport navigated it's way through all of that including an explosion that was at least 100 yards in diameter (estimate) to land safely on top of the rubble below?

Get real.

And if that were even possible, you would think the chances of it happening were once in a lifetime, right? Well how about twice?

You may remember that after the planes hit the World Trade Center towers--an epic disaster that melted structural steel designed to withstand a Hellish temperature of 2000 degrees Fahrenheit, incinerated both planes? cockpit recorders and black-box recorders, and vaporized the flesh and bones of nearly 3,000 human beings--the passport of suspected hijacker Mohammed Atta was found intact, in pristine condition, lying on the sidewalk below.

Well, guess what. It happened again. I am not kidding. Both CBS News and the Associated Press are reporting that the passport of another hijacker, one Satam al-Sugami, floated down to Earth along with Mohammed Atta's passport. And not just a charred piece of a passport but , like the other passort, it was IN PRISTINE CONDITION.

Here's the original link (before it was removed:

http://www.11alive.com/news/usnews_article.aspx?storyid=42069

Taken from: http://www.rumormillnews.com/cgi-bin/archive.cgi?read=43653

TwentyTwelve  posted on  2007-12-13   14:30:18 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#72. To: TwentyTwelve (#71)

It was hardly the only personal effect that was discovered:

On September 11 2002, one year Anniversary of the death of our son, we were informed that the Recovery team at Ground Zero have found the ATM Bank card of Waleed [Iskandar, passenger on Flight 11] and that it will be mailed to us in Northridge. When we received it, we found it in good condition.

How could a plastic card survive the fire of the terrorist attack of the Black Tuesday on the USA? I consider it as a sign from Waleed to his parents on the first Anniversary of his loss. http://www.iskandar.com/waleed911/atmcard.html

"Orange County, CA., Sept. 11 - Lisa Anne Frost was 22 and had just graduated from Boston University in May 2001 with two degrees and multiple academic and service honors. She had worked all summer in Boston before coming home, finally, to California to start her new life. The Rancho Santa Margarita woman was on United Flight 175 on the morning of Sept. 11, 2001, when it became the second plane to slam into the World Trade Center...

Her parents, Tom and Melanie Frost, have spent two years knowing they will never understand why.

A few days before the first anniversary of our daughter's murder, we were notified that they had found a piece of her in the piles and piles of gritty rubble of the World Trade Center that had been hauled out to Staten Island. It was Lisa's way, we believe, of telling us she wasn't lost. In February, the day of the Columbia tragedy, we got word they'd found her United Airlines Mileage Plus card. It was found very near where they'd found a piece of her right hip. We imagine that she used the card early on the morning of Sept. 11 to get on the plane and just stuck it in her back pocket, probably her right back pocket, instead of in her purse. They have found no other personal effects".

http://216.239.59.104/search?q=cache:tI2PQRqfJiIJ:www.msnbc.com/local/MYOC/M324557.asp

On Oct. 12, it arrived inside a second envelope at Mrs. Snyder's modest white house on Main Street here, and the instant she took it out and saw it, she says, chills just went over me. It was singed and crumpled. A chunk was ripped out, giving the bottom of the envelope she had sent the look of a jagged skyline. Mrs. Snyder's lyrical script had blurred into the scorched paper. The stamp, depicting a World War II sailor embracing a woman welcoming him home, was intact.

Along with the letter was a note: To whom it may concern. This was found floating around the street in downtown New York. I am sorry if you suffered any loss in this tragedy. Sincerely, a friend in New York! Since then, Mrs. Snyder, a customer service representative at a grocery store, has discovered that she has one of only two pieces of mail known to have been recovered from the planes that crashed into the World Trade Center. At least one auction house has contacted her, saying she could sell the letter for tens of thousands of dollars.

One Letter's Odyssey Helps Mend a Wound New York Times

December 20, 2001

United Airlines Flight 93 slammed into the earth Sept. 11 near Shanksville, Somerset County, at more than 500 mph, with a ferocity that disintegrated metal, bone and flesh. It took more than three months to identify the remains of the 40 passengers and crew, and, by process of elimination, the four hijackers...

But searchers also gathered surprisingly intact mementos of lives lost. Those items, such as a wedding ring and other jewelry, photos, credit cards, purses and their contents, shoes, a wallet and currency, are among seven boxes of identified personal effects salvaged from the site.

http://www.post-gazette.com/headlines/20011230flight931230p3.asp

"So what am I getting back?" I asked Miller when he got off the phone.

"A credit card", he said. "It got melted some but it's mostly intact"...

The binder was entitled "Unassociated Personal Effects of Flight 93"... Inside were colour photographs of everything found in Shanksville not clearly linked to a particular person. Jer's wedding ring didn't survive, but seventy other pieces of jewelry did, along with a bewildering variety of scrunchies, hats, belts, bras, dresses, T-shirts, unmatched shoes, and other items that somehow escaped the heat, some virtually unmarred. Then there were keys, books, gift cards, letters, photographs, compact discs, pens, medallions... Some of the shoes were badly mutilated, disturbing evidence of the violence to which they'd been subjected. There was a length of electrical cord, a crumpled cigarette lighter, eighteen toenail clippers in various states of mangling. There were many snapshots of children, most painstakingly glued back together...

I found a pair of his black briefs on the second page of the men's underwear. They were discoloured and savagely torn, but there was no question they were his... At the bottom of the page was an American Express datebook. The cover looked burned and maybe water damaged as well...

There it was, just like the psychic promised: bound in leather, or what was left of of leather. Jeremy's datebook.

Your Father's Voice

Liz Glick, widow of Flight 93 passenger Jeremy Glick, and Dan Zegart "During an interview earlier this week, Koch delicately handled eerie mementos of the crash found during cleanup [at the Pentagon]: Whittington's battered driver's license... a burnt luggage tag and a wedding ring lie on a book dedicated to those lost in the events of Sept. 11, 2001. The wedding ring belonged to Ruth's daughter and the luggage tag belonged to one her granddaughters."

http://onlineathens.com/stories/091104/new_20040911030.shtml

longnose gar  posted on  2007-12-13   14:44:24 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#73. To: longnose gar (#72)

Why 'Debunkers' Help The 911 Truth Movement
Two kinds of 9-11 truth deniers (debunkers) exist today: Those who deny our government has the expertise to carry out the 9-11 attack, and those who deny ...
www.rense.com/general73/whyd.htm - 29k -

All truths passes through three stages, said the philosopher Schopenauer.

First, it is ridiculed.

Second, it is violently opposed.

Third, it is accepted as being self-evident.

Debunkers, those people who adamantly deny government involvement in the 9-11 conspiracy, who adamantly deny such a conspiracy could even occur, are stuck in the first and second stages.

TwentyTwelve  posted on  2007-12-13   15:10:10 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#74. To: longnose gar (#72)

According to a new New York Times/CBS News poll, only 16% of Americans think the government is telling the truth about 9/11:

"Do you think members of the Bush Administration are telling the truth, are mostly telling the truth but hiding something, or are they mostly lying?

Telling the truth 16%

Hiding something 53%

Mostly lying 28%

Not sure 3%"

TwentyTwelve  posted on  2007-12-13   15:12:57 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#75. To: TwentyTwelve (#74)

That news about the poll is dated Oct. 14, well before the news came out about the destroyed CIA videotapes. I wonder how low the figure is now.

To reason, indeed, he was not in the habit of attending. His mode of arguing, if it is to be so called, was one not uncommon among dull and stubborn persons, who are accustomed to be surrounded by their inferiors. He asserted a proposition; and, as often as wiser people ventured respectfully to show that it was erroneous, he asserted it again, in exactly the same words, and conceived that, by doing so, he at once disposed of all objections. - Macaulay, "History of England," Vol. 1, Chapter 6, on James II.

aristeides  posted on  2007-12-13   15:17:50 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#76. To: aristeides (#75)

That news about the poll is dated Oct. 14, well before the news came out about the destroyed CIA videotapes.

The "Official Story" is losing it's credibility.
911 was a False Flag Operation

TwentyTwelve  posted on  2007-12-13   15:29:23 ET  (1 image) Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#77. To: longnose gar (#68)

The material ejected laterally was collateral material. The floors themselves fell as a bulk

Bullshit. The floors were pulverized and traveled UP as well as SIDEWAYS. Not much was left to fall DOWNWARDS.

Your modeler thinks a reasonable assumption is that the building fell like rolling billiard balls across a table. Dumbass like all the truthers.

Another lie. Your mischaracterization of the analysis I linked is just another tactic used by the liars such as yourself. Idiotic liars at that.


You appear to be a major trouble maker...and I'm getting really pissed. - GoldiLox, 7/27/2006

FormerLurker  posted on  2007-12-13   16:45:14 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#78. To: longnose gar (#70)

As we examined the WTC-debris sample, we found large chunks of concrete (irregular in shape and size, one was approximately 5cm X 3 cm X 3cm) as well as medium-sized pieces of wall-board (with the binding paper still attached). Thus, the pulverization was in fact NOT to fine dust, and it is a false premise to start with near-complete pulverization to fine powder

Your pal is a liar, just like you.

From University of California - Davis

The new work helps explain the very fine particles and extraordinarily high concentrations found by an earlier UC Davis study, the first to identify very fine metallic aerosols in unprecedented amounts from Ground Zero. It will be essential to understanding the growing record of health problems.

From JSTOR: World Trade Center Fine Particulate Matter Causes Respiratory Tract Hyperresponsiveness in Mice

Pollutants originating from the destruction of the World Trade Center (WTC) in New York City on 11 September 2001 have been reported to cause adverse respiratory responses in rescue workers and nearby residents. We examined whether WTC-derived fine particulate matter [particulate matter with a mass median aerodynamic diameter < 2.5 mm]

From Analysis of Energy Requirements for the Expansion of the Dust Cloud Following the Collapse of 1 World Trade Center

On September 11th, both of the Twin Towers disintegrated into vast clouds of concrete and other materials, which blanketed Lower Manhattan. This paper shows that the energy required to produce the expansion of the dust cloud observed immediately following the collapse of 1 World Trade Center (the North Tower) was much greater than the gravitational energy available from its elevated mass. It uses only basic physics


You appear to be a major trouble maker...and I'm getting really pissed. - GoldiLox, 7/27/2006

FormerLurker  posted on  2007-12-13   17:02:09 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#79. To: longnose gar (#70) (Edited)

It seems that the 9/11 truth community likewise “has been slow to understand” that the WTC dust particles in greatest abundance are the “supercoarse” variety rather than “fine” particles, and that significant chunks of concrete were also found in the WTC rubble.

What were you saying about there not being any pulverization of the towers into fine dust?


You appear to be a major trouble maker...and I'm getting really pissed. - GoldiLox, 7/27/2006

FormerLurker  posted on  2007-12-13   17:04:21 ET  (1 image) Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#80. To: longnose gar (#70)

Thus, the pulverization was in fact NOT to fine dust, and it is a false premise to start with near-complete pulverization to fine powder (as might be expected from a mini-nuke or a “star-wars” beam destroying the Towers). Indeed, much of the mass of the MacKinlay sample was clearly in substantial pieces of concrete and wall-board rather than in fine-dust form...

Uh huh....


You appear to be a major trouble maker...and I'm getting really pissed. - GoldiLox, 7/27/2006

FormerLurker  posted on  2007-12-13   17:13:31 ET  (1 image) Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


TopPage UpFull ThreadPage DownBottom/Latest


[Home]  [Headlines]  [Latest Articles]  [Latest Comments]  [Post]  [Sign-in]  [Mail]  [Setup]  [Help]  [Register]