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All is Vanity
See other All is Vanity Articles

Title: Get Ready for a Major, Major Disappointment (Ron Paul's Built-In Loss)
Source: Meself
URL Source: [None]
Published: Dec 24, 2007
Author: Me, Me, Me
Post Date: 2007-12-24 10:19:48 by a vast rightwing conspirator
Keywords: None
Views: 8067
Comments: 264

Merry Xmas everyone and may your grandest wishes come true, for as long as they don't come into conflict with my own :). I haven't done a vanity in a long, long, long time but I felt that it's important to discuss the reality of where RP is currently heading.

Disclaimer: I stand for just about everything RP stands for. 'Just about' stands for his continuing membership in the stupid, evil, dangerous GOP party.

Now, on the topic of Ron Paul. I just watched a clip of him on the Tim Russert show where RP re-stated in the most forceful way that he has no intention whatsoever to run for US Prez outside of the GOP reservation. The inescapable conclusion, therefore, is that RP is really running for the GOP nomination and, of course, he is NOT going to get it. He is not even going to be a close third or fourth. In the end, you will find RP trailing Huckabee, McCain, Thompson, Giuliani and just about everyone else who stands for Bush, War and the fat State way because this is what the GOP membership is standing for these days.

I am fully aware of the 'hijacking' theory. Its exponents believe that, somehow, the RP activists are going to show up all 100% of them to vote in primaries and everyone else's supporters are going to stay home and we will see RP winning state after state after state. This is, of course, nonsense. Reality is coming on Jan 3, I believe, and Jan 2 will be the last time you are going to hear about the hijacking theory.

Then, I heard someone here stating that 'the 2 parties' are nothing but tools for whomever is seeking the presidency to get the presidency. This, my friends, is as naive as it gets. The parties are Mafia-like organizations whose aim is to seek, get and exercise political power for the benefit of the inner circles who own them and they as much a 'free' tool for the people the parties put forward for the voters to vote on as the Mafia is a tool for the Mafia bosses. The inner circle has no use for RP, he does not support the type of 'leadership' they are paying for.

Now, RP is going to lose. He took millions of dollars from supporters who refused to accept that he can NOT win the US presidency under the stinky and filthy flag of the GOP. He was asked repeatedly whether he would consider running as an independent, OPPOSING the 2 monstrous political Mafias and, every time he answered the question, the answer was a strong 'NO'.

THE FUTURE: the next US Prez is going to be Hillary, O'Bama, Giuliani, Romney or, maybe, Huckabee. Ron Paul will win ZERO primaries/caucuses and, if he is true to his words, he will get back to delivering babies and representing his Texas district. I suspect that RP is going to be very much at peace with himself but, what are his supporters going to feel about it? What are they going to do? They supported a campaign for the US presidency that was built from the ground up to lose the race - and they refused to see it because they liked the excitement. Are they going to be sad? Angry? What would be the consequences of RP's campaign? The main consequence that I see is that of legitimizing the 2-party system. RP is a saint among politicians. He says and does all the right things and, yet, he insists in staying inside the GOP party and he retreats when the GOP, as predicted and as expected, deals him a humiliating defeat in his attempt to represent the political Cosa Nostra - because he is not a made made and he is not from the families. However, staying as an 'unmade' member of the organization, he adds credibility to it. It would be something close to Jesus joining the Pharisees and seeking Caiafa's job.

I will be watching with interest how the RP fantasy gets itself crushed by the inevitable political reality. Just you all keep in mind that, while 'the media' and 'the corrupt politicians' can be blamed for RP's inability to win the GOP nomination, the main problem is RP's seeking the GOP nomination instead of running for the US presidency and seeking the support of the people, not the nod of the GOP party bosses.

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#37. To: noone222 (#0)

your opinion?

christine  posted on  2007-12-24   17:57:00 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#45. To: christine (#37)

your opinion?

I have yet to see a comparable political situation. Ron Paul has support from every quarter of society and the unique position of having a 20 year track record of excellence. He also has the internet communications network supplying more energy, contributing more dollars and converts than the competition.

Kennedy had the Catholic Church network with its publications, sermons, organizations, Bingo and millions of energetic supporters when he made his run, and I saw that as a child. There were posters everywhere, people in the streets talking about it, people attending conferences and meetings etc., similar to what appears to be happening with Ron Paul.

Ron Paul is hated by his own party. He will have more problem getting nominated than he would have getting elected. I think the secret to his success lies in the nomination process. Get him nominated and he will be elected.

That's my 2 cents worth !

noone222  posted on  2007-12-25   11:29:31 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#46. To: noone222 (#45)

He will have more problem getting nominated than he would have getting elected.

I have been preaching that for a long time but to no avail. Glad you share the view.

Cynicom  posted on  2007-12-25   11:34:21 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#47. To: Cynicom, noone222 (#46)

What can we do to help get him nominated?

buckeye  posted on  2007-12-25   11:43:44 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#49. To: buckeye (#47)

What can we do to help get him nominated?

Glad you asked.

Money is always the prime need but it alone will not accomplish the job.

It takes thinking and doing, big and small, by many people, such as the money bombs and the blimp and the 4um ad. Waiting for someone else to do it has gotten this country into this mess.

Cynicom  posted on  2007-12-25   12:00:47 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#52. To: Cynicom, buckeye (#49)

The MSM will not get the message out, and advertisements can only do so much. Some people will google Ron Paul and learn what he stands for, but many more will have to be reached one-on-one. Discuss him with family, friends, co-workers, associates. Show how he has credible arguments for

eliminating the income tax,
bringing the troops home -- discuss how many countries we have troops posted in --
discuss that there is a credible economic answer to the inflation of $3-4/gas and $4-5/milk and $4 hamburger.

People will start to look and think for themselves.

DeaconBenjamin  posted on  2007-12-25   12:26:26 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#53. To: DeaconBenjamin (#52)

In that vein, I asked a friend if he could support Ron Paul. His answer... "I am a democrat".

Cynicom  posted on  2007-12-25   12:38:36 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#56. To: Cynicom, DeaconBenjamin (#53)

Democrats are going to have to face the facts: do they want to war to end, or do they want Fed-funded welfare. They can have welfare a little longer under Ron Paul, but he'll lead us away from both war and socialism. I wish I could teach them what I know: a big federal welfare state requires an empire to pay for its excesses. They can't be unlinked.

buckeye  posted on  2007-12-25   12:46:20 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#58. To: buckeye (#56)

The overwhelming advantage to genuine Constitutional Government is that it isn't biased in favor of anyone or any group. I think Ron Paul already enjoys a good deal of "democrat" support.

This country hasn't had an open, honest leader in a hundred years or more. It's time we did.

noone222  posted on  2007-12-25   12:53:04 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#62. To: noone222 (#58)

This country hasn't had an open, honest leader in a hundred years or more. It's time we did.

You would have loved Rutherford B. Hayes. No, I was not olde enough to vote for him.

Hayes promised two things, he would serve one term and go away and there would be no corruption. He delivered on both.

His wife promised no booze in the Whitehouse and she delivered on that.

Cynicom  posted on  2007-12-25   13:07:01 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#74. To: Cynicom (#62)

According to President Rutherford Hayes, who issued no formally designated “executive orders”:

The executive power is large because not defined in the Constitution. The real test has never come, because the Presidents have down to the present been conservative, or what might be called conscientious men, and have kept within limited range. And there is an unwritten law of usage that has come to regulate an average administration. But if a Napoleon ever became President, he could make the executive almost what he wished to make it. The war power of President Lincoln went to lengths which could scarcely be surpassed in despotic principle.

cited in Executive Orders and National Emergencies: How Presidents Have Come to "Run the Country" by Usurping Legislative Power

DeaconBenjamin  posted on  2007-12-25   14:08:53 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#88. To: DeaconBenjamin (#74)

The executive power is large because not defined in the Constitution.

someone(s) erred, big time, with that.

christine  posted on  2007-12-26   10:10:37 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#93. To: christine, DeaconBenjamin (#88)

The executive power is large because not defined in the Constitution.

someone(s) erred, big time, with that.

It was not an err, christine. To understand, study the establishment of the First Bank of the United States, and Washington's.... as in President Washington's, role in the charade.

Or, as I have posted before, study the order made by President Washington that established what has come to be known as the Federal Zone, which overlays the states of the union.

Or, read the book, The CONstitution That Never Was, but, well, perhaps you get the picture.

richard9151  posted on  2007-12-26   10:39:35 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#94. To: richard9151 (#93)

George Washington's choice for secretary of the treasury was our first clue.

RidinShotgun  posted on  2007-12-26   10:43:22 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#100. To: RidinShotgun (#94)

George Washington's choice for secretary of the treasury was our first clue.

LOL! Why would an agent of the Rochschilds make anyone think something smelly was going on?!

I am still amazed at the countless numbers of people who believe that getting back to the Constitution will solve everything, when what we have in America is the fruit OF the Constitution! No one seems to be able/willing to deal with that.

richard9151  posted on  2007-12-26   10:55:23 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#102. To: richard9151 (#100)

I am still amazed at the countless numbers of people who believe that getting back to the Constitution will solve everything, when what we have in America is the fruit OF the Constitution! No one seems to be able/willing to deal with that.

I doubt if many Americans share that opinion.

Cynicom  posted on  2007-12-26   11:02:43 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#104. To: Cynicom (#102)

I doubt if many Americans share that opinion.

Really? How many Americans no longer vote? Perhaps the namber is much larger than you suspect, my friend.

In the groups that I have corresponded with over the last 10 years, there are, litterally, tens of thousands who know where the problems come/came from, and the vast majority of them do not/have not voted in some time. At least, since the connections by and between the Clintons and Bushs became so obvious.

And those are just the ones that I was involved with. Stands to reason I was aware of only a very small percentage of the total.

richard9151  posted on  2007-12-26   11:09:36 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#120. To: richard9151, Cynicom, a vast rightwing conspiracy, lodwick, Jethro Tull, iconoclast, RidinShotgun, duckhunter, ALL (#104)

since i read Votescam: The Stealing of America in 2k, i have advocated (and i still believe it would work)that everyone stay home on election day--refuse to participate. if we all did that, they couldn't fake the numbers and continue to perpetuate the FRAUD of legitimate elections in this country. of course, i know that would never happen as there are too many who benefit economically from the system that is.

so, to repeat, my hope is that RP's candidacy is a step in the process to a huge awakening to this fact.

christine  posted on  2007-12-26   12:16:15 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#124. To: christine (#120) (Edited)

i have advocated (and i still believe it would work)that everyone stay home on election day--refuse to participate. if we all did that, they couldn't fake the numbers and continue to perpetuate the FRAUD of legitimate elections in this country.

Let's back this up a little.

If you do not believe in legitimizing fraudulent election, by not participating in casting a vote, fine. Then why would you want to run an ad in a newspaper asking others to support RP (who apparently for some legitimizes the evil machine) and therefore going against your personal position on the value of voting in the first place?

Is there time to cancel the ad? We certainly would not want to participate in promoting a complete fraud and sham.

Edited to add: Doing such would violate MORALITY 101 set forth by vast.

Peppa  posted on  2007-12-26   12:37:59 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#129. To: Peppa (#124)

Pep, I still believe they're going to steal it from RP. I believe the PTB have already chosen their selection and I think that's Hillary. However, as I posted above to vast and as duckhunter, Paul Revere, and others posted, I think there's never been the grassroots support and awareness of the message of Liberty. For this reason, I have some hope that as the numbers grow (we need a critical mass ala V for Vendetta) if we-the-people are to have a chance of defeating the elites and taking our country back. This is our last hope and I don't want to sit on the sidelines and do nothing. I want to take part in the fight.

christine  posted on  2007-12-26   13:22:35 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#138. To: christine (#129) (Edited)

Pep, I still believe they're going to steal it from RP. I believe the PTB have already chosen their selection and I think that's Hillary. However, as I posted above to vast and as duckhunter, Paul Revere, and others posted, I think there's never been the grassroots support and awareness of the message of Liberty. For this reason, I have some hope that as the numbers grow (we need a critical mass ala V for Vendetta) if we-the-people are to have a chance of defeating the elites and taking our country back. This is our last hope and I don't want to sit on the sidelines and do nothing. I want to take part in the fight.

That doesn't match with your opinion of not voting.

It doesn't match the words on this thread about RP continuing to legitimize an evil party.

Either THOSE WORDS are wrong this time because RON is the candidate, and therefore should be taken back. Or, they are right, and I won't participate in something hipocritical and considered immoral.

Ron Paul is trying the method best for change, and thats to do it from the inside. Anyone that can't see that, has an agenda contrary to the majority supporting RP. Being called immoral for supporting a good man in unacceptable and all are owed an apology.

If millions upon millions show up for Paul, and the fraud goes down as expected, it will wake more people up and can't be spun. That's only my opinion, and so what if we think different here.

But, the forum's name is on that ad, if the forum feels that Ron is an Immoral candidate and his supporters as well, then, perhaps the money should go directly to the campaign, and not advertise the Forum as something that supports what it does not.

If RP changes parties, I'll vote for him no matter. I will not quibble about why, I will be voting for hope.

To DO NOTHING ensures HIS LOSS, and ours. And to my mind, THAT is what is immoral. But people are entitled sit home, if only they would shut up then.

I know all members of the forum did not participate in the ad and should not be held to any other members beliefs.

If that ad runs, and people are directed here to the Forum because of the support for Ron Paul or not, the Forum is representing itself as a supporter. Posters here that want to demonize him, are not serving a helpful purpose to get him elected.

Further, saying people should sit home, makes this whole idea nuts.

So, where do we stand. Are his supporters immoral or not?

Peppa  posted on  2007-12-26   14:01:31 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#158. To: Peppa (#138)

That doesn't match with your opinion of not voting.

Silence.

sorry, i didn't answer you post haste. i had an appointment to go to.

i obviously didn't make it clear to you that this had been my position in the past and that Ron Paul's candidacy has caused me to have a change of heart and to give it one last chance.

as for calling RP supporters immoral, i never said anything of the sort as i believe quite the opposite is true. i don't know how you attributed that sentiment to me from anything i've posted on this thread.

christine  posted on  2007-12-26   15:32:54 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#170. To: christine (#158) (Edited)

sorry, i didn't answer you post haste. i had an appointment to go to.

i obviously didn't make it clear to you that this had been my position in the past and that Ron Paul's candidacy has caused me to have a change of heart and to give it one last chance.

Thanks for your response Christine. I hope others will have a change of heart as well. I agree this is our one last chance.

as for calling RP supporters immoral, i never said anything of the sort as i believe quite the opposite is true. i don't know how you attributed that sentiment to me from anything i've posted on this thread.

I didn't attribute the immoral sentiment to you, but you rather did not acknowledge it's flat appraisal by Vast to those that support RP. Rather it was allowed to stand as a form of truth, and many posters seemed to support that.

Many many people in this forum have given much of their time and support for the ad itself to promote a good man. An accusation of immorality of doing so, is more than an insult to at least 10 people I could name right now, and it's not right and should be addressed. If we or they are unwelcome and do not meet the morality bar set by a sideliner, then our efforts, HERE at least are at best an utter waste.

Standing silent against a troll with an agenda to demoralize a community here that believes there is still hope, is unacceptable. Why, because the ad has this Forums name on it.

And that means you.

Where the confusion came was allowing the immorality statement to stand, and that you supported no voting. Those two things together translated as hipocrisy for the forum that is dedicated to freedom. There is no other peaceful way to achieve a victory at the polls, and we all are very much aware of the reality of vote fraud.

Speaking for myself, it's up to us to use the methods we have to affect change. It's up to the people to decide what is and isn't legitimate, and pour to the polls to change it, from the ground up.

The disease in on the inside, and that's where I think, we have the best chance to effect peaceful change.

Peppa  posted on  2007-12-26   15:59:40 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#225. To: Peppa, a vast rightwing conspirator (#170) (Edited)

I didn't attribute the immoral sentiment to you, but you rather did not acknowledge it's flat appraisal by Vast to those that support RP. Rather it was allowed to stand as a form of truth, and many posters seemed to support that.

Many many people in this forum have given much of their time and support for the ad itself to promote a good man. An accusation of immorality

Did avrwc say that Ron Paul supporters are immoral? If he did. I missed it. Here's the only reference to morality that I saw him make and that was directed not towards supporters, but rather to Ron Paul's choice to run as a republican which he sees as lending legitimacy to the 2 party anti-people fraud:

"Of course it is relevant. The goals do not justify the means. It's Morality 101."

I didn't address that because that is avrwc's opinion. Also, it's impossible for me to read every post on 4um much less respond to them. I'm sure you understand that I can't be held responsible for what every member posts especially when I encourage free speech and my policy as far as moderating is pretty much a hands off one.

Anyway, I don't wish to beat this to death or to perpetuate the dissention. I just wanted to make my position clear on that issue.

christine  posted on  2007-12-26   20:20:24 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#240. To: christine (#225)

I encourage free speech and my policy as far as moderating is pretty much a hands off one.

And thank God for that. Keep up the good work!

farmfriend  posted on  2007-12-26   21:29:44 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#251. To: farmfriend (#240)

The Official MSM Guide To Attacking Ron Paul

TwentyTwelve  posted on  2007-12-27   13:35:12 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#253. To: TwentyTwelve (#251)

The Official MSM Guide To Attacking Ron Paul

How many times have we seen that in play? Too many I wager.

farmfriend  posted on  2007-12-27   15:35:49 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


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