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Title: Live Iowa Caucus Thread
Source:
Live CSPAN Republican Caucus Coverage
URL Source: http://play.rbn.com/play.asx?url=cs ... n2v.asf&proto=mms?mswmext=.asx
Published: Jan 3, 2008
Author: Me, I guess
Post Date: 2008-01-03 19:53:13 by Critter
Keywords: None
Views: 14160
Comments: 554
I figured we should have an official caucus thread, no? Click here to view live CSPAN coverage
Poster Comment: Let the discussion begin!
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#401. To: Ferret Mike (#379)
That one is too funny, thanks.
So you're a GOP-bot but not a Bushbot. I am not surprised.
Antiparty - find out why, think about 'how'
I already stated that the only (small) chance RP has to win the US presidency is by seeking the vote of the people, not that of the GOPs. If RP ran as in Indie, a 34% of the vote could have won him the presidency, in the context of Rudy/Hillary as his other 2 opponents. As a GOP, RP will get nothing and all this effort is going to be nothing but a waste. By the way, the Ronbots have been very effective at trivializing his ideas too. Lately, all they talk about is the millions the RP campaign raised instead of having a thoughtful discussion of the GOP and Demo ideologies and contrast them with RP's views.
Antiparty - find out why, think about 'how'
Tell me just what may be the effort and or consequence post a Paul failure. No one liners please, lets see your depth of thinking. Just maybe we have a common ground. Up to you to look over the horizon. Above is what I asked for...post Ron Paul failure... Please address that.
Other than his failing to win any and all the GOP primaries/caucuses and having his message trivialized to 'count the millions'? Hmmm... can't think of any. I remember how Buchanan's message got trivialized, back in 2000, as his campaign spent all its energy fighting over control of Ross Perot's $60 million Reform Party booty. See how often these opportunities come? 8 years is a very long time in a mortal's life. The 2008 opportunity is being wasted now. Any guess as of when the next non-violent opportunity to end world hunger and bring about peace may present itself?
Antiparty - find out why, think about 'how'
Winning the presidency is not the only way Ron Paul can win. Just by raising his issues and airing them in debates, he has already won a major victory. I just read a book about the 1912 election. Obviously, Teddy Roosevelt did not regain the presidency in that election. But a great many of the things he and the Progressives had put in their platform that year were enacted in the next few years by Woodrow Wilson and the Democratic Congress.
To reason, indeed, he was not in the habit of attending. His mode of arguing, if it is to be so called, was one not uncommon among dull and stubborn persons, who are accustomed to be surrounded by their inferiors. He asserted a proposition; and, as often as wiser people ventured respectfully to show that it was erroneous, he asserted it again, in exactly the same words, and conceived that, by doing so, he at once disposed of all objections. - Macaulay, "History of England," Vol. 1, Chapter 6, on James II.
Wasted???? It appears you have given zero thinking concerning a post Paul failure. There are many avenues to explore and it would be interesting to read what you see.
Associated Press - January 4, 2008 12:04 AM ET DES MOINES, Iowa (AP) - Republican Ron Paul says his run for the White House is just beginning, despite a fifth-place finish in the Iowa caucuses. The Texas congressman spoke to a boisterous crowd tonight that chanted "Live free or die" and "Ron Paul." He answered the chants by saying -- "I am more encouraged than ever before." Paul says he is encouraged he placed ahead of former New York Mayor Rudy Giuliani. Paul, a 10-term member of Congress, has waged an unusual campaign that matched his libertarian views with events involving a blimp and the re-enactment of the Boston Tea Party. Paul opposes the Iraq war, opposes the federal income tax and urges Americans to push for a fiscally responsible government. Sound like he's just getting started.
"He who votes decides nothing; he who counts the votes decides everything." - Josef Stalin
You are exactly right. RP's lone voice was relatively unknown to the public. He has left us a guidebook to move forward no matter what happens. The world loves him too, and I would say, nothing has been wasted in spreading RP's message. I hope he continues to lead us all. The message is so feared, the media blacks him out. Little fires are burning across the land. He is the most inspiring candidate I have ever seen.
Ari... Good to see someone is thinking beyond tomorrow. Ron Paul win lose or draw is in a position to influence the future course of this country. Ross Perot walked away from 20 million Americans that were hungry for change.
It's so funny. Just as I thought. Now that reality is pinching you, instead of waking up to it, you change the 'win' discussion is not shifting to the 'education' thing. It's like those guys who buy the Penthouse for the nice interviews. Shouldn't you get back to your older threads and recall what the talk there was about? By the way, if the education thing is what matters, why 75% of the RP talk is about the millions he raised and why do you bother to follow the caucuses and primaries returns?
Antiparty - find out why, think about 'how'
Vast... Let me phrase this in your terms... "I have always accepted that Ron Pauls chances of becoming President are zero". That is reality and I would believe that most people accept that. That however does not allow me and most other Americans here to sit on the sidelines doing nothing. That is your option and welcome to it. Most of the good people here are made of sterner material. Now, will you please show us your thinking post a Ron Paul failure??????? Why do you keep avoiding ADDING something to the discussion??? Anyone can be negative, it takes no great intellect, however discussing the future does require thinking.
I think Ron Paul getting 10% in Iowa yesterday is very good Ron Paul will do better in New Hampshire and even better in South Carolina After that there will be momentum to win primaries His campaign builds all the time I know in my gut Ron Paul will be our President I watched some of the coverage of Iowa on FOX last evening The Iowa journalist said "money and a big campaign organization isn't what does it in Iowa This is a paraphrase and poor rendition But basically he was saying Iowans don't want the same people running government It occurred to me Iowans may not have been that well-acquainted with Ron Paul, And if it is true that Iowans chose Huckabee for these reasons, They always used to say how Iowa votes is an emblem of how country feels All my love, Palo
Nice summary and analysis, cookie. Thanks!
Fred, thank you
PS (back on a political note) it really is what Ron Pal will give them but it showed me what voters want now, and what they want is what Ron Paul offers Now is the time for Ron Paul to really get his message out to ALL We learn from the Iowa primary and I do thnk how Iowa voters think is emblem of the country to sum it up, we learned from Iowa primary what voters want
Good morning I. I've been thinking about this comment all night. Do you really think that's what it was? I was glad RP took the time to educate or re-educate people with the Constitution, and what freedom and liberty actually mean. The government OUT of your beeswax. So, I didn't feel I was being Libertarianized. It wasn't political, it was a freeing message. Drawing in people stuck in the left/right camp that had no place to go. And it is a good thought, and one with which I agree. The point is not any particular dogma whether it is labeled "libertarian" or otherwise. The message is the same one Thomas Jefferson offered - Liberty and a government bound from mischief with firm constraints. Anyone not interested in that message is not interested in being free. Whether someone is an Iowa Farmer or a City Slicker the point remains unchanged. Taking money from one person forcibly to give to another is still theft - whether one uses the government to do it or the old fashioned way at gun point. Either Americans are interested in holding their heads up and walking the walk of the free man or they are willing to trade their liberty for chains and the illusion that they are "being taken care of". "The difference between an honorable man and a moral man is that an honorable man regrets a discreditable act even when it has worked and he is in no danger of being caught." ~ H. L. Mencken
Hi Palo! Nice to see you dropping in.
"The difference between an honorable man and a moral man is that an honorable man regrets a discreditable act even when it has worked and he is in no danger of being caught." ~ H. L. Mencken
Iowans appear to be "dumbed down".
I am happy to see you too, my sweet love GO Ron GO!!
I think the observation that someone made (I forget who and too lazy to look) that a lot of Iowans still get most of their "Nooze and Infotainment" from the Lamestream Lying Dishonest Sons of Bitches in the controlled media is likely true. Given that - a lot of what they know to be true ain't. Thus we get the result we got - and with a little help from the "wonders" of technology.
"The difference between an honorable man and a moral man is that an honorable man regrets a discreditable act even when it has worked and he is in no danger of being caught." ~ H. L. Mencken
Jesus advised His followers to "be wise as serpents"...didn't see too many 'serpents' in the crowd last night. :-(
An astounding number of them showed up at the cauci (plural for 'caucus', right?) last night without having ANY IDEA who to vote for. They made up their mind at the CAUCUS. Geez...
Truly disturbing information. Wake UP, America - use what brain-cells you have to educate yourselves about these people who (except one) want to rule you.
Join the Ron Paul Revolution Yeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee Hawwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww! (That's my Rebel ancestors talking.)
"The difference between an honorable man and a moral man is that an honorable man regrets a discreditable act even when it has worked and he is in no danger of being caught." ~ H. L. Mencken
Glad to hear your comments. I was wondering what you would say about his showings. My initial hope a couple of weeks ago was that he would do only okay in Iowa, thus throwing off-guard his neocon msm detractors, but would then would astound the pundits with him pulling first or second in New Hampshire and beyond. I hope this is the case. In any event, Paul has two delegates so far for the convention, and unlike most Republican delegates, are unlikely to change their votes to accommodate any of the other candidates, causing possible gridlock at the convention (it's either Ron Paul or nobody). Stay tuned. Jan 8 will have me glued to the computer/tv. I'll be off from work and it's also my birthday. A Ron Paul victory will be the best present in years.
What is the average Iowan IQ?
:-(
How many precincts in Carrol County ???? What does a golfer say when he strikes an errant ball ????
"Banking was conceived in iniquity and was born in sin. The bankers own the earth. Take it away from them, but leave them the power to create money, and with the flick of the pen they will create enough deposits to buy it back again. However, take it away from them, and all the great fortunes like mine will disappear and they ought to disappear, for this would be a happier and better world to live in. But, if you wish to remain the slaves of bankers and pay the cost of your own slavery, let them continue to create money ." --- Josiah Stamp
Palo, good to see your handle again. Missed your sweet posts.
Anyone not interested in that message is not interested in being free. You nailed OI. Perfect!! Thank you!
What is the average Iowan IQ? 1200 baud? /s
Just checking, nothing yet? Didn't think so.
The Establishment's Voting Machines
Thanks TT. Damn. If all the people woke up at the same time and acknowledged this, would it make any difference?
"For there is one thing we must never forget… the majority can never replace the man. And no more than a hundred empty heads make one wise man will an heroic decision arise from a hundred cowards." -- Adolf Hitler
www.iowagop.net/straw.poll.asp Iowa Straw Poll Results (Augusts 11, 2007) Mitt Romney Wins Iowa Straw Poll With attendance of 33,000 and votes cast by more than 14,000, Republican party officials called the 2007 Iowa Straw Poll a resounding success. No one was more pleased than Governor Mitt Romney who received 4,516 votes to win the Straw Poll. In second place Governor Mike Huckabee earned 2,587 votes and was followed by Senator Sam Brownback who received 2,192 ballots cast in his favor. In a close fourth, U.S. Representative Tom Tancredo received 1,961 votes. In fifth place was U.S. Representative Ron Paul with 1,305. Governor Tommy Thompson finished in sixth place with 1,029 votes and was followed by seventh place finisher, and undeclared candidate, Fred Thompson who had 203 votes cast for him. Mayor Rudy Giuliani received 183 votes for eighth place followed by U.S. Representative Duncan Hunter in ninth place with 174 votes. Senator John McCain, in 10th position, got 101 votes. And finishing last with 41 votes was John Cox. "Reports of the demise of the Iowa Straw Poll were premature and proven false today," stated Ray Hoffmann, chairman of the Republican Party of Iowa. "Activists turned out in great numbers to support their candidates despite a heat index exceeding 100 degrees. The atmosphere here rivaled that of the State Fair." New voting procedures were in place at the Iowa Straw Poll which required presentation and validation of a photo ID along with a ticket. "Iowans proudly stepped up to meet our voting requirements," Chuck Laudner, executive director of the Republican Party of Iowa, remarked. "To see more than 14,000 purple thumbs on this campus was thrilling." With theses new voting procedures in place, party officials were confident all votes were cast by Iowans only. "Tickets were punched then scanned along with photo IDs," Laudner explained. "Our process guaranteed the one person, one vote ideal was upheld. We believe photo identification should be required before any vote is cast in Iowa elections and today we proved the process was not only possible, it was effective and efficient." The Iowa Straw Poll continues a decades' long tradition of testing candidates' organizational strength, bringing likely caucus-goers together, and winnowing the field. In the 1999 caucus, 89,000 participated. Today's Straw Poll vote tally represents more than 15 percent of that total, the most representative sample of likely voters' opinions, Laudner concluded.
This bugs me. Checking the ID, fine. Scanning it in WITH your vote, not so much.
In fifth place was U.S. Representative Ron Paul with 1,305."
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#402. To: Peppa (#399)
If all indy's have your touch of class, I may not ever vote for one.
#403. To: Cynicom (#398)
#404. To: a vast rightwing conspirator (#403)
Lets see just how politically astute you really are.
#405. To: Cynicom (#404)
Above is what I asked for...post Ron Paul failure...
#406. To: a vast rightwing conspirator (#400)
(Edited)
I am still waiting to hear more about RP's strategy of winning the US presidency by fist winning the GOP nomination.
#407. To: a vast rightwing conspirator (#405)
The 2008 opportunity is being wasted now. Any guess as of when the next non-violent opportunity to end world hunger and bring about peace may present itself?
#408. To: a vast rightwing conspirator (#400)
http://www.kptm.com/Global/story.asp?S=7576069&nav=menu606_2
Rep. Ron Paul vows to take GOP campaign to New Hampshire
#409. To: aristeides (#406)
Winning the presidency is not the only way Ron Paul can win. Just by raising his issues and airing them in debates, he has already won a major victory.
#410. To: aristeides (#406)
Winning the presidency is not the only way Ron Paul can win. Just by raising his issues and airing them in debates, he has already won a major victory.
#411. To: Cynicom (#410)
#412. To: a vast rightwing conspirator (#411)
It's so funny. Just as I thought. Now that reality is pinching you,
#413. To: ALL (#412)
(Palo) I didnt see this thread so I posted my two cents about the Iowa primary on another thread
here is is where it belonged
I'll copy it here
it is only 3% less than McCain and Fred Thompson
What interested me most was when Brit Hume interviewed the Iowa political journalist,
who is expert on Iowa politics
"Iowans like a message
"Huckabee gave them a message, which was populist
"Iowa voters don't want Wall Street running our country anymore,
"they want someone who will look out for the little guy"
who have been there before,
they really do want a change, and change in direction
He said this is why they voted for Huckabee
since he offers them what they truly want
then it is very likely voters in other States will choose Ron Paul for these same reasons
And it is immensely positive for the Ron Paul campaign, that the majority of our country
wants a change from the establishment and the establishment's way of doing things
#414. To: palo verde (#413)
#415. To: Fred Mertz (#414)
I am smiling with pleasure at your post
you are so nice to me
Love, Palo
#416. To: Fred Mertz, ALL (#414)
It really did strike me when I heard that Iowa poltical journalist explain why Iowans voted for Huckabee
He said what message it was that Huckabee gave, that Iowans wanted
(and what Huckabee would never deliver on)
and will deliver on
If media won't let him
he must use all that money supporters gave him to plaster TV with ads week before the Primaries
Good ads! So they know exactly who Ron Paul is, what he stands for,
what he wants and what he will do
that all voters need is to know Ron Paul, and they will vote for him
Love, Palo
and what they want is what Ron Paul will give them
how can this not be great news for us
we just have to let all voters know Ron Paul
#417. To: Peppa, iconoclast, TwentyTwelve, christine, FormerLurker, All (#397)
The campaign so far has had as its focus converting America to libertarianism, not winning a national election.
"Life is tough; it's even tougher if you're stupid." ~ John Wayne
#418. To: Critter (#263)
Maybe it's time to finish up those 69gr .223 rounds I started a couple of months ago.
#419. To: palo verde (#416)
#420. To: Original_Intent (#417)
Either Americans are interested in holding their heads up and walking the walk of the free man or they are willing to trade their liberty for chains and the illusion that they are "being taken care of".
#421. To: Original_Intent (#419)
hugs and kisses, Palo
#422. To: TwentyTwelve (#420)
#423. To: TwentyTwelve (#420)
Remember...G-d saved more animals than people on the ark. www.siameserescue.org
#424. To: Original_Intent (#422)
Remember...G-d saved more animals than people on the ark. www.siameserescue.org
#425. To: who knows what evil (#424)
An astounding number of them showed up at the cauci (plural for 'caucus', right?) last night without having ANY IDEA who to vote for. They made up their mind at the CAUCUS. Geez...
Freedom*Peace*Prosperity
#426. To: palo verde (#421)
#427. To: palo verde (#416)
From Two Party System... ...to Two Family System.
#428. To: Original_Intent (#422)
Given that - a lot of what they know to be true ain't.
#429. To: who knows what evil (#423)
#430. To: TwentyTwelve (#428)
What is the average Iowan IQ?
#431. To: palo verde (#415)
My spelling is Wobbly. It's good spelling but it Wobbles, and the letters get in the wrong places. -- Winnie the Pooh
#432. To: Original_Intent (#417)
The message is the same one Thomas Jefferson offered - Liberty and a government bound from mischief with firm constraints.
#433. To: TwentyTwelve (#428)
#434. To: palo verde (#421)
GO Ron GO!!
#435. To: Cynicom (#412)
#436. To: Peppa, Original_Intent, Critter, FOH (#433)
#437. To: TwentyTwelve (#436)
The Establishment's Voting Machines
#438. To: Original_Intent (#426)
#439. To: Peppa, Original_Intent, Critter, FOH (#437)
#440. To: TwentyTwelve (#439)
"Tickets were punched then scanned along with photo IDs,"
#441. To: Peppa (#440)
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