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Science/Tech
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Title: Warning on rising Med Sea levels
Source: BBC
URL Source: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/7197379.stm
Published: Jan 19, 2008
Author: BBC
Post Date: 2008-01-19 00:25:26 by robin
Keywords: None
Views: 1718
Comments: 130

Warning on rising Med Sea levels

Generic boat on Mediterranean Sea

Scientists noted sea temperatures had also risen significantly

The level of the Mediterranean Sea is rising rapidly and could increase by up to half a metre in the next 50 years, scientists in Spain have warned.

A study by the Spanish Oceanographic Institute says levels have been rising since the 1970s with the rate of increase growing in recent years.

It says even a small rise could have serious consequences in coastal areas.

The study noted that the findings were consistent with other investigations into the effects of climate change.

The study, entitled Climate Change in the Spanish Mediterranean, said the sea had risen "between 2.5mm and 10mm (0.1 and 0.4in) per year since the 1990s".

If the trend continued it would have "very serious consequences" in low-lying coastal areas even in the case of a small rise, and "catastrophic consequences" if a half-metre increase occurred, the study warned.

Global climate change

Scientists noted that sea temperatures had also risen significantly by 0.12 to 0.5C since the 1970s.

Sea level rise is a key effect of global climate change. There are two major contributory effects: the melting of ice, and expansion of sea water as the oceans warm.

Last month, a study by the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change said the world's sea levels could rise twice as much this century as UN climate scientists had previously predicted.

The Nobel Prize-winning IPCC predicted a maximum sea level rise of 81cm (32in) this century.

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#1. To: All, *Global Climate Change* (#0)

Ron Paul for President - Join a Ron Paul Meetup group today!
The Revolution will not be televised!

robin  posted on  2008-01-19   0:26:24 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#2. To: robin, *Agriculture-Environment* (#0)

It was warmer during the medieval warm period yet there was no mass melting of glaciers or catostrophic rise in sea levels.

If the trend continued it would have "very serious consequences" in low-lying coastal areas even in the case of a small rise, and "catastrophic consequences" if a half-metre increase occurred, the study warned.

But the trend is not continuing. The oceans are already showing cooling, record ice in Antarctica and record cold in many places. Cooling is much more dangerous for all species yet we do not prepare.


My spelling is Wobbly. It's good spelling but it Wobbles,
and the letters get in the wrong places.
-- Winnie the Pooh

farmfriend  posted on  2008-01-19   1:33:50 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#3. To: robin (#1)

Every year billions of tons of earth get washed into the sea, raising sea levels. In 100 million years, mountains become plains. Most people, except for the scientific, believe short term trends will continue.

Global temperature changes for number of reasons and none are man made. One is because the sun has a variable output another is due to the wobble of the earth. The current warm period will reverse in about 20 years and we will start a cooling trend that will make most humans wish it was warmer.

When certain astronomical events occur all at once, there will be another ice age and with our present technology man will be unable to prevent it. If an ice age occurs with man's present level of technology, billions of people will die. Well, they will die anyway; but the the death rate will exceed the birth rate to such an extent that the population of the earth will be billions less. We are advancing toward a Type I civilization. Such a civilization should be able to prevent an ice age.

DWornock  posted on  2008-01-19   1:57:49 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#4. To: DWornock (#3)

Global temperature changes for number of reasons and none are man made.

Most scientists agree that global warming is at least in part man made; and most of those who disagree are paid by Exxon.

We all need to keep an open mind. Most scientists are apolitical, but not all of them. I'm sure you can find politics involved on both sides, in an attempt to control us and lead us astray. Certainly Big Oil has obvious reasons for wanting to confuse the facts on this issue.

www.motherjones.com/news/.../05/some_like_it_hot.html
News: Forty public policy groups have this in common: They seek to undermine the scientific consensus that humans are causing the earth to overheat. And they all get money from ExxonMobil.

Cold comfort in British Antarctic deep ice core results

Fred Bortz's picture
Submitted by Fred Bortz on Tue, 2006-09-05 08:52.

A BBC News story reports findings from the British Antarctic Survey (BAS) that the rate of increase of atmospheric greenhouse gases in Earth's atmosphere is unprecedented, at least over the past 800,000 years.

Studying a deep ice core sample, the scientists have not only been able to measure the greenhouse gas concentrations in ancient atmospheres but also the average temperatures. The result, according to the BBC report, is that carbon dioxide concentration and temperature rise and fall in lockstep.

The report quotes BAS scientist Dr. Eric Wolff, who saw no signs that geological or biological systems have served as CO2 sinks to mitigate the increases.

Wolff told the BBC that the fastest observed increase in CO2 was about 30 parts per million (ppm) in 1000 years, in contrast to present circumstances in which "the last 30 ppm of increase has occurred in just 17 years. We really are in the situation where we don't have any analogue in our records."

Ron Paul for President - Join a Ron Paul Meetup group today!
The Revolution will not be televised!

robin  posted on  2008-01-19   12:24:39 ET  (1 image) Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#5. To: robin (#4)

Most scientists agree that global warming is at least in part man made;

Oh really? Name one that is not bribed by research grants.

DWornock  posted on  2008-01-19   15:55:41 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#6. To: DWornock (#5)

I guess you didn't read the link or anything I just posted. There's really no point in discussing this subject with someone who has such a closed mind.

www.motherjones.com/news/.../05/some_like_it_hot.html
News: Forty public policy groups have this in common: They seek to undermine the scientific consensus that humans are causing the earth to overheat. And they all get money from ExxonMobil.

Ron Paul for President - Join a Ron Paul Meetup group today!
The Revolution will not be televised!

robin  posted on  2008-01-19   17:37:47 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#7. To: robin (#6)

I guess you didn't read the link or anything I just posted. There's really no point in discussing this subject with someone who has such a closed mind.

Hell, there's many that refuse to acknowledge that there IS such a thing as global warming, either by ignorance or deceit. I'm at a point where I really don't know if I care anymore, since if the majority wish to pollute the planet and ignore any evidence contrary to their opinion, perhaps they deserve what they end up with.


You appear to be a major trouble maker...and I'm getting really pissed. - GoldiLox, 7/27/2006

FormerLurker  posted on  2008-01-19   17:47:24 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#8. To: robin (#6)

I guess you didn't read the link or anything I just posted.

Oh! You mean like "most of those who disagree are paid by Exxon."
And, "They seek to undermine the scientific consensus that humans are causing the earth to overheat. And they all get money from ExxonMobil."

DWornock  posted on  2008-01-19   18:14:18 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#9. To: DWornock (#8) (Edited)

I didn't write that, it was at the link I provided, along with evidence. But there seems to be no point in posting research like the ice core samples and other evidence and links to evidence to you. Good luck with your further education brainwashing.

EXXONMOBIL’S FUNDING OF THINK TANKS hardly compares with its lobbying expenditures—$55 million over the past six years, according to the Center for Public Integrity.

Inhofe's 400 Global Warming Deniers Debunked
List of "Scientists" Includes Economists, Amateurs, TV Weathermen and Industry Hacks

Inhofe's list includes 413 people. (Score one Inhofe; the math holds up.)

84 have either taken money from, or are connected to, fossil fuel industries, or think tanks started by those industries.

Ron Paul for President - Join a Ron Paul Meetup group today!
The Revolution will not be televised!

robin  posted on  2008-01-19   18:24:32 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#10. To: robin (#9)

What I can't understand is why these people are against alternative energy and wish to continue to rely on fossil fuels. It's bad enough we use fossil fuels for energy in regards to tranportation, but few even know that we produce all the plastics, most synthetic textiles, as well as food colorings from petroleum.

They somehow swallow the lie that the oil companies wish to ELIMINATE our reliance on oil, hence their alleged concern towards global warming. They think the "good guys" are those that ridicule those that show concern about global warming, even though most if not all of the supposed "scientists" that dismiss global warming are PAID by oil companies for their "research".

The brainwashing must be quite effective. I can see no other reason why people would be so carefree about the possibility that the earth's climate is being irreversibly affected, where soon, no matter what we do, it'll be too late to stop a runaway cycle of warming due to the oceans producing more CO2 from the higher tempertures. The more CO2 they produce, the warmer it gets, and the warmer it gets, the more CO2 they produce.

Just because it's cold this winter doesn't mean there isn't global warming. Global warming involves the tempertures of the oceans and of the atmosphere at higher elevations. It also involves changes in weather patterns, including more violent storms due to the higher retained energy of the planet's climate.

Of course, the melting of glaciers and the polar ice are strong indications that the earth isn't getting colder.


You appear to be a major trouble maker...and I'm getting really pissed. - GoldiLox, 7/27/2006

FormerLurker  posted on  2008-01-19   18:48:21 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#11. To: FormerLurker (#10)

What I can't understand is why these people are against alternative energy and wish to continue to rely on fossil fuels.

Can you spell EXXON?

There are good economic and geopolitical reasons for alternative energy sources too.

Whatever science continues to learn about what is actually happening to the 3rd marble from the sun, we should remain open minded. Whenever someone claims they KNOW global climate change is NOT man made, I am instantly suspicious. They simply cannot KNOW that for a fact.

www.grida.no/climate/vital/19.htm

Ron Paul for President - Join a Ron Paul Meetup group today!
The Revolution will not be televised!

robin  posted on  2008-01-19   18:52:15 ET  (1 image) Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#12. To: robin, DWornock, Andre (#4)

Studying a deep ice core sample, the scientists have not only been able to measure the greenhouse gas concentrations in ancient atmospheres but also the average temperatures.

Ice cores are not good proxies for past climate and atmosphere concentrations. I have a friend who is writing a paper for publication on this right now in relation to the Younger Dryas.


My spelling is Wobbly. It's good spelling but it Wobbles,
and the letters get in the wrong places.
-- Winnie the Pooh

farmfriend  posted on  2008-01-19   18:58:31 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#13. To: robin, FormerLurker (#11)

My opinion, for what it's worth: this is just another fear tactic the elite are using to push us in one direction or another. I don't claim to know what yet. But it isn't good. I'm not so worried about global warming. I'm worried about the mass fear of it.

buckeye  posted on  2008-01-19   19:00:56 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#14. To: buckeye (#13)

I agree, the topic will be and is being used to control us.

Ron Paul for President - Join a Ron Paul Meetup group today!
The Revolution will not be televised!

robin  posted on  2008-01-19   19:01:57 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#15. To: farmfriend, wudidiz (#12)

I have a friend who is writing a paper for publication on this right now in relation to the Younger Dryas.

You appear to have a lot of "friends" that attempt to say there is no such thing as global warming. Why are these people your friends?

Don't you care if the earth becomes uninhabitable, with all of our children and grandchildren suffering horrible deaths in the not too distant future, if global warming turns out to be true? Why are you so willing to gamble with the earth's future, and why do you support those that wish to continue to pollute the planet, regardless of global warming?


You appear to be a major trouble maker...and I'm getting really pissed. - GoldiLox, 7/27/2006

FormerLurker  posted on  2008-01-19   19:03:58 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#16. To: FormerLurker, wudidiz, robin, buckeye, DWornock, *Agriculture-Environment* (#15)

Here is a quote from another one of my friends on AGW:

There are several climate forcing solar cycles at play. The "Maunder" cycle, which brought the Medieval Warm period 300-year Little ice Age 1400-1700 is a 1 000 year cycle, and the next LIA is due in 2400- 2700. We are now at the end of a 210 year Vries cycle and a 60 year Gleissberg cycle. In a few years, temperatures will plunge and the Londonders can look forward to ice markets on the Thames for the first time since 1814. The ensuing global famine is less amusing. The warmest years in Uppsala, Sweden were 1789, 1930 and 1999, all 7,7 degrees Celsius. In 1801 it was 6,0 and in 1805 3,7. In the famine year of of 1868, it was 2,5. This kind of sudden drop is typical of a Vries cycle, and today it is once more imminent. AGW and environmentalism will have its place in history alongside the witch processes.

Magnus Hagelstam, Finland


My spelling is Wobbly. It's good spelling but it Wobbles,
and the letters get in the wrong places.
-- Winnie the Pooh

farmfriend  posted on  2008-01-19   19:10:55 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#17. To: FormerLurker (#15)

Why are these people your friends

Because they are intelligent.


My spelling is Wobbly. It's good spelling but it Wobbles,
and the letters get in the wrong places.
-- Winnie the Pooh

farmfriend  posted on  2008-01-19   19:12:01 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#18. To: buckeye (#13)

I'm not so worried about global warming. I'm worried about the mass fear of it.

My concern is twofold. First is the fact that globnl warming is deadly serious, and if it IS true, could be fatal for mankind if allowed to continue unabated.

Secondly, I'm concerned that otherwise rational people are being conditioned to not be concered about the matter. The info IS conflicting, perhaps purposely so.

Regardless of individual motivations, it IS a fact that global warming is occuring, with natural events certainly playing a role, however it is more than likely ALSO true that man-made pollution is a factor as well.


You appear to be a major trouble maker...and I'm getting really pissed. - GoldiLox, 7/27/2006

FormerLurker  posted on  2008-01-19   19:13:05 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#19. To: farmfriend (#17)

Because they are intelligent

There are a LOT of intelligent people that understand the climate and the science behind it, that are saying the OPPOSITE of what you believe, and what your "friends" say.

So your answer is quite lame and evasive.


You appear to be a major trouble maker...and I'm getting really pissed. - GoldiLox, 7/27/2006

FormerLurker  posted on  2008-01-19   19:15:04 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#20. To: farmfriend (#16)

BTW, you never explained what you mean by "AGW"..


You appear to be a major trouble maker...and I'm getting really pissed. - GoldiLox, 7/27/2006

FormerLurker  posted on  2008-01-19   19:15:43 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#21. To: FormerLurker (#18)

I see more people worrying about it than not. I think the hysteria is with the worriers. There's a lot to analyze and discuss over the next couple of hundred years, but if we start limiting our potential because of fears that might or might not be valid, we'll certainly do more damage than if we simply ignore the danger.

The biggest concern I have is the collectivism being advocated as a solution. Carbon credits are the biggest Stalinist nightmare I've seen in a long time.

Fear is what we have most to fear, especially since 9/11.

buckeye  posted on  2008-01-19   19:16:16 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#22. To: FormerLurker, buckeye (#18)

First is the fact that globnl warming is deadly serious, and if it IS true, could be fatal for mankind if allowed to continue unabated.

The risks are much greater with global cooling though. Nothing catastrophic happened during the medieval warm period and it was much warmer then. We even call it climate optimum. However, the little ice age was very devastating. Historically cooling periods have always been worse than warming periods. So if your concern were genuine you would be preparing for cooling.


My spelling is Wobbly. It's good spelling but it Wobbles,
and the letters get in the wrong places.
-- Winnie the Pooh

farmfriend  posted on  2008-01-19   19:17:22 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#23. To: farmfriend, wudidiz, robin, buckeye, DWornock, TwentyTwelve, Original_Intent, christine (#16)

Don't you care if the earth becomes uninhabitable, with all of our children and grandchildren suffering horrible deaths in the not too distant future, if global warming turns out to be true? Why are you so willing to gamble with the earth's future, and why do you support those that wish to continue to pollute the planet, regardless of global warming?


You appear to be a major trouble maker...and I'm getting really pissed. - GoldiLox, 7/27/2006

FormerLurker  posted on  2008-01-19   19:17:23 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#24. To: FormerLurker (#23)

Hysteria.

buckeye  posted on  2008-01-19   19:18:32 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#25. To: farmfriend (#22)

The risks are much greater with global cooling though.

So global cooling is melting the glaciers and ice caps uh? And federal deficits are a good thing, as printing more money means everybody gets more of it, right?


You appear to be a major trouble maker...and I'm getting really pissed. - GoldiLox, 7/27/2006

FormerLurker  posted on  2008-01-19   19:18:59 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#26. To: FormerLurker (#23)

Don't you care if the earth becomes uninhabitable, with all of our children and grandchildren suffering horrible deaths in the not too distant future, if global warming turns out to be true?

Global cooling is much more likely to do that. It always has historically.

Why are you so willing to gamble with the earth's future, and why do you support those that wish to continue to pollute the planet, regardless of global warming?

CO2 is not a pollutant! Man only contributes 3%. CO2 follows temperature. Cause does not follow effect.


My spelling is Wobbly. It's good spelling but it Wobbles,
and the letters get in the wrong places.
-- Winnie the Pooh

farmfriend  posted on  2008-01-19   19:20:51 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#27. To: FormerLurker (#23)

It is rapid Global Climate Change. That cooling follows warming and warming follows cooling is part of what we must learn to deal with.

Currently, the ice sheets are breaking and melting, leaving polar bears to drown. The Northwest passage is open. The sea levels are rising.

news.nationalgeographic.c...17-northwest-passage.html

Climate models had projected the passage would eventually open as warming temperatures melted the Arctic sea ice—but no one had predicted it would happen this soon.

"We're probably 30 years ahead of schedule in terms of the loss of the Arctic sea ice," said Mark Serreze, a senior scientist at the National Snow and Ice Data Center (NSIDC) in Boulder, Colorado.

"We're on this fast track of change."

This should concern the people who inhabit earth.

Ron Paul for President - Join a Ron Paul Meetup group today!
The Revolution will not be televised!

robin  posted on  2008-01-19   19:21:09 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#28. To: buckeye (#24)

Hysteria.

You don't know that. I have a problem with people that dismiss science and believe what they are told by those with an agenda. I think caution is certainly the best policy here, especially when it comes to the future of mankind.

Of course, if mankind is at a point where it doesn't care about it's own future, perhaps it deserves whatever fate awaits it...


You appear to be a major trouble maker...and I'm getting really pissed. - GoldiLox, 7/27/2006

FormerLurker  posted on  2008-01-19   19:21:53 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#29. To: FormerLurker (#25)

So global cooling is melting the glaciers and ice caps uh?

No that would be the increased sun spots over the last 3 sun cycles.


My spelling is Wobbly. It's good spelling but it Wobbles,
and the letters get in the wrong places.
-- Winnie the Pooh

farmfriend  posted on  2008-01-19   19:22:09 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#30. To: robin (#27)

This should concern the people who inhabit earth.

Serious talk of global taxation using the United Nations should, at this time, concern them much, much more. We can live without polar bears, but we can't live without our economic freedom.

buckeye  posted on  2008-01-19   19:23:03 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#31. To: robin (#27)

Currently, the ice sheets are breaking and melting, leaving polar bears to drown.

LOL! Right, that's why bear populations have been increasing.


My spelling is Wobbly. It's good spelling but it Wobbles,
and the letters get in the wrong places.
-- Winnie the Pooh

farmfriend  posted on  2008-01-19   19:23:31 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#32. To: FormerLurker (#28)

I have a problem with people that dismiss science and believe what they are told by those with an agenda.

So you have a problem with yourself?


My spelling is Wobbly. It's good spelling but it Wobbles,
and the letters get in the wrong places.
-- Winnie the Pooh

farmfriend  posted on  2008-01-19   19:24:20 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#33. To: FormerLurker (#20)

BTW, you never explained what you mean by "AGW"..

AGW = Anthropogenic Global Warming

And yes I have explained it.


My spelling is Wobbly. It's good spelling but it Wobbles,
and the letters get in the wrong places.
-- Winnie the Pooh

farmfriend  posted on  2008-01-19   19:27:17 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#34. To: All (#27)

Study Says Polar Bears Could Face Extinction

Warming Shrinks Sea Ice Mammals Depend On

By Juliet Eilperin
Washington Post Staff Writer Tuesday, November 9, 2004; Page A13

Global warming could cause polar bears to go extinct by the end of the century by eroding the sea ice that sustains them, according to the most comprehensive international assessment ever done of Arctic climate change.

The thinning of sea ice -- which is projected to shrink by at least half by the end of the century and could disappear altogether, according to some computer models -- could determine the fate of many other key Arctic species, said the Arctic Climate Impact Assessment, the product of four years of work by more than 300 scientists. ....

The sea ice in Hudson Bay, Canada, now breaks up 2 1/2 weeks earlier than it did 30 years ago, said Canadian Wildlife Service research scientist Ian Stirling, and as a result female polar bears there weigh 55 pounds less than they did then. Assuming the current rate of ice shrinkage and accompanying weight loss in the Hudson Bay region, bears there could become so thin by 2012 they may no longer be able to reproduce, said Lara Hansen, chief scientist for the World Wildlife Fund.

www.washingtonpost.com/wp...cles/A35233-2004Nov8.html

Ron Paul for President - Join a Ron Paul Meetup group today!
The Revolution will not be televised!

robin  posted on  2008-01-19   19:27:53 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#35. To: farmfriend (#26)

CO2 is not a pollutant!

CO2 is a by-product of various man-made emissions. It goes hand in hand with hydrocarbon emissions. But why stop there, what about the coal burning plants that in addition to CO2 dump enormous quanitites of mercury into the lakes, rivers, streams, and oceans, making it close to impossible to find fish that don't contain dangerous levels of mercury.

Oh that's right, mercury is good for you, isn't it...

In any case, CO2 by itself is not a pollutant, but it DOES lead to higher tempertures, so if we add CO2 to an already overtaxed environment, we are playing with fire if we simply ignore it and continue as if there is "nothing to see here".


You appear to be a major trouble maker...and I'm getting really pissed. - GoldiLox, 7/27/2006

FormerLurker  posted on  2008-01-19   19:28:28 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#36. To: farmfriend (#32)

So you have a problem with yourself?

Apparently so. If people are the problem, we must all curtail ourselves.

buckeye  posted on  2008-01-19   19:28:33 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#37. To: robin (#34)

according to some computer models

You have to read these things a little more carefully. This is not science nor is it proof of anything.


My spelling is Wobbly. It's good spelling but it Wobbles,
and the letters get in the wrong places.
-- Winnie the Pooh

farmfriend  posted on  2008-01-19   19:29:29 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#38. To: robin (#34)

Global warming could cause polar bears to go extinct by the end of the century by eroding the sea ice that sustains them, according to the most comprehensive international assessment ever done of Arctic climate change.

I wonder how many people will simply dismiss that info with "oh well, it doesn't affect me"?


You appear to be a major trouble maker...and I'm getting really pissed. - GoldiLox, 7/27/2006

FormerLurker  posted on  2008-01-19   19:29:46 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#39. To: farmfriend (#32)

So you have a problem with yourself?

Nope, but I DO have a problem with you.


You appear to be a major trouble maker...and I'm getting really pissed. - GoldiLox, 7/27/2006

FormerLurker  posted on  2008-01-19   19:30:45 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#40. To: All (#34)

The sea ice in Hudson Bay, Canada, now breaks up 2 1/2 weeks earlier than it did 30 years ago, said Canadian Wildlife Service research scientist Ian Stirling, and as a result female polar bears there weigh 55 pounds less than they did then. Assuming the current rate of ice shrinkage and accompanying weight loss in the Hudson Bay region, bears there could become so thin by 2012 they may no longer be able to reproduce, said Lara Hansen, chief scientist for the World Wildlife Fund.

They already weigh 55 pounds less than 30 years ago.

Ron Paul for President - Join a Ron Paul Meetup group today!
The Revolution will not be televised!

robin  posted on  2008-01-19   19:31:41 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  



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