[Home]  [Headlines]  [Latest Articles]  [Latest Comments]  [Post]  [Sign-in]  [Mail]  [Setup]  [Help] 

Status: Not Logged In; Sign In

America and Israel both told Qatar to allow Hamas to stay in their country

Video | Robert Kennedy brings down the house.

Owner releases video of Trump banner ripping, shooting in WNC

Cash Jordan: Looters ‘Forcibly Evict’ Millionaires… as California’s “NO ARRESTS” Policy BACKFIRES

Dallas Motel Horror: Immigrant Machete Killer Caught

America has been infiltrated and occupied Netanyahu 1980

Senior Trump Official Declares War On Far-Left NGOs Sowing Chaos Nationwide

White House Plans Security Boost On Civil Terrorism Fears

Visualizing The Number Of Farms In Each US State

Let her cry

The Secret Version of the Bible You’re Never Taught - Secret History

Rocker defames Charlie Kirk threatens free speech

Paramount Has a $1.5 Billion South Park Problem

European Warmongers Angry That Trump Did Not Buy Into the ‘Drone Attack in Poland’

Grassley Unveils Declassified Documents From FBI's Alleged 'Political Hit Job' On Trump

2 In 5 Young Adults Are Taking On Debt For Social Image, To Impress Peers, Study Finds

Visualizing Global Gold Production By Region

RFK Jr. About to DROP the Tylenol–Autism BOMBSHELL & Trump tweets cryptic vaccine message

Elon Musk Delivers Stunning Remarks At Historic UK March

Something BIG is happening (One Assassination Changed Everything)

The Truth About This Piece Of Sh*t

Breaking: 18,000 Epstein emails just dropped.

Memphis: FOUR CHILDREN shot inside a home (National Guard Inbound)

Elon Musk gives CHILLING WARNING after Charlie Kirk's DEATH...

ActBlue Lawyers Subpoenaed As House GOP Investigation Into Donor Fraud Intensifies

Cash Jordan: Gangs EMPTY Chicago Plaza... as Mayor's "LET THEM LOOT" Plan IMPLODES

Trump to send troops to Memphis

Who really commands China’s military? (Xi Jinping on his way out)

Ghee: Is It Better Than Butter?

What Is Butyric Acid? 6 Benefits (Dr Horse says eat butter, not margarine!)


(s)Elections
See other (s)Elections Articles

Title: What’s the Real Racial Divide?
Source: The New York Times
URL Source: http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/16/magazine/16wwln-lede-t.html?hp
Published: Mar 13, 2008
Author: MATT BAI
Post Date: 2008-03-13 20:53:03 by robin
Keywords: None
Views: 659
Comments: 53

March 16, 2008
The Way We Live Now

What’s the Real Racial Divide?

By MATT BAI

This article will appear in this Sunday's Times Magazine.

When old-time Democrats in Washington reminisce about the days of brokered conventions floor fights and frantic early-morning calls, deals cut under the haze of cigar smoke they talk about them the way a paleontologist might describe the hurtling stride of a velociraptor: an awesome spectacle, to be sure, but not one you would really want to see up close. Last week, Democrats woke up to find that the unthinkable may be upon them. There might still be an unforeseen turn in the titanic clash between Hillary Rodham Clinton and Barack Obama, but the way it looks now, the outcome will probably rest with the party’s nearly 800 superdelegates, many of whom will no doubt expect to be bribed and beseeched by both campaigns. If that’s the case, there is about as much chance of settling the issue before the convention as there is of, say, Obama waking up one morning and deciding that “hope” is kind of a dumb slogan after all.

You can already discern the outlines of the argument that Clinton will make to the superdelegates: The contest is basically a draw, and now it’s time to choose the candidate who can be elected. Sure, Barack’s won all those little states like North Dakota and Idaho, but what does that really get you? I’m the candidate who has won all the big states, and that’s what matters in November. In fact, Clinton has already declared that Democrats will never carry states like Idaho and Alaska, which sided with Obama an argument that has to rankle Howard Dean, the party chairman, who has been pouring money into rural states as part of his “50-state strategy” for expanding the electoral map.

Clinton’s argument highlights the most vexing contrast of this Democratic campaign. Obama, fueled by overwhelming African-American support, has trounced Clinton in most big cities, while Clinton has pounded him in outlying areas. In Ohio, for instance, Obama won only the four largest urban areas in the state, while Clinton took 70 percent of the vote in smaller cities and towns; if you took only a passing glance at the electoral maps of states like Ohio, Missouri and Texas, you would think you were looking at one of those stark red-and-blue maps from recent general elections, with Obama cast as the Democrat and Clinton as the Republican. And yet, oddly, it is Obama who has emerged as the preferred candidate of sparsely populated rural states that are thought to be more conservative, and it is Clinton who has taken the larger, industrialized states. (Obama did carry his home state, Illinois, and neighboring Missouri, but he won the latter by only a single percentage point.) To put this simply, Obama wins in major urban areas but can’t seem to win in urbanized states, while Clinton wins in rural communities but consistently loses in rural states. Why?

One relevant fact, as many Clinton supporters have pointed out, is that rural states often hold caucuses rather than primaries, which require the kind of local organizing at which Obama’s team excels. It might also be that the economic downturn has had a more traumatic effect in bigger states, making the voters there responsive to Clinton’s more pragmatic message. It is also possible, however, that the disparity between Obama’s performance in urban primaries and rural caucuses tells us something larger — and counterintuitive — about race in America.

The assumption has always been that a black candidate should perform worse among white voters in states with less racial diversity because those voters are supposedly less enlightened. In fact, the reverse has been true for Obama: in the overwhelmingly white states of Wisconsin and Vermont, for instance, he carried 54 and 60 percent of the white voters respectively, according to exit polls, while in New Jersey he won 31 percent and in Tennessee he won 26 percent. As some bloggers have shrewdly pointed out, Obama does best in areas that have either a large concentration of African-American voters or hardly any at all, but he struggles in places where the population is decidedly mixed.

What this suggests, perhaps, is that living in close proximity to other races — sharing industries and schools and sports arenas — actually makes Americans less sanguine about racial harmony rather than more so. The growing counties an hour’s drive from Cleveland and St. Louis are filled with white voters whose parents fled the industrial cities of their youth before a wave of African-Americans and for whom social friction and economic competition, especially in an age of declining opportunity, are as much a part of daily life as traffic and mortgage payments. As Erica Goode wrote in these pages last year, Robert Putnam and other sociologists have, in fact, found that people living in more diverse areas evince less trust for others — no matter what their race. Maybe it shouldn’t surprise us that while white Democrats in rural states are apparently willing to accept the notion of a racially transcendent candidate, those living in the shadow of postindustrial atrophy seem to have a harder time detaching from enduring stereotypes, and they may be less optimistic that the country as a whole would actually elect a black candidate.

For Obama, no matter what social currents may be at play, the issue is hardly academic. At two critical junctures in the past six weeks, he has been on the precipice of securing the nomination only to fall frustratingly short in primaries in the most populous states. For this reason, the contest next month in Pennsylvania, the last of the big battleground states to hold a primary (aside from possible do-overs in Florida and Michigan), may carry a significance beyond the delegates themselves. There is no question that Obama could lose to Clinton in that state and still go on to give the acceptance speech in Denver. But this may also be his last chance to reassure his supporters — and maybe even himself — that he can break through whatever barriers have limited an otherwise stellar and historic campaign. Obama holds himself out as the candidate whose own life and lineage embody the nation’s new racial complexities. The question is whether he can win the sprawling states that embody them too.

Matt Bai, who covers politics for the magazine, is the author of “The Argument: Billionaires, Bloggers and the Battle to Remake Democratic Politics.”

Post Comment   Private Reply   Ignore Thread  


TopPage UpFull ThreadPage DownBottom/Latest

#1. To: robin (#0)

It doesn't matter if Barak, Hillary or McCain wins: they're all scum.

The stupider people are the more surprised they are when you kill them.

YertleTurtle  posted on  2008-03-13   20:58:14 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#2. To: YertleTurtle (#1)

they're all scum.

Amen brother, and Amen.

Scum always rises to the top on swill.

Cynicom  posted on  2008-03-13   21:01:39 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#3. To: robin (#0)

living in close proximity to other races — sharing industries and schools and sports arenas — actually makes Americans less sanguine about racial harmony rather than more so.

By George, I think he's got it.


I've already said too much.

MUDDOG  posted on  2008-03-13   21:08:49 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#4. To: all (#0)

living in close proximity to other races — sharing industries and schools and sports arenas — actually makes Americans less sanguine about racial harmony rather than more so

This is the unintended consequence of forced integration. Affirmative action, racial norming, one-way hate laws all serve notice on whites that a dual justice exists, and that fleeing - if possible - is a sane alternative.

Jethro Tull  posted on  2008-03-13   21:16:48 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#5. To: Jethro Tull (#4)

This is the unintended consequence of forced integration. Affirmative action, racial norming, one-way hate laws all serve notice on whites that a dual justice exists, and that fleeing - if possible - is a sane alternative.

But, but, but, there's only one race -- the human race!!!

Never mind that some dogs, like border collies, are really, really smart, and others, like pugs and Afghans, are reallly, really stupid.

There is only one race -- the dog race!!!

The stupider people are the more surprised they are when you kill them.

YertleTurtle  posted on  2008-03-13   21:23:01 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#6. To: robin (#0)

As Erica Goode wrote in these pages last year, Robert Putnam and other sociologists have, in fact, found that people living in more diverse areas evince less trust for others — no matter what their race. Maybe it shouldn’t surprise us that while white Democrats in rural states are apparently willing to accept the notion of a racially transcendent candidate, those living in the shadow of postindustrial atrophy seem to have a harder time detaching from enduring stereotypes,

i agree with this. age, locale, and one's own experiences do account for the differing opinions amongst us regarding multiculturalism.

christine  posted on  2008-03-13   21:32:26 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#7. To: christine (#6)

differing opinions amongst us regarding multiculturalism.

I just want to know about your different lives, on this here people farm.


I've already said too much.

MUDDOG  posted on  2008-03-13   22:07:52 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#8. To: robin (#0)

What this suggests, perhaps, is that living in close proximity to other races — sharing industries and schools and sports arenas — actually makes Americans less sanguine about racial harmony rather than more so.

So when does the south get an apology?

When thou art the only purchaser, then buy; when other buyers are present, be thou nobody.

Tauzero  posted on  2008-03-13   22:55:12 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#9. To: robin (#0)

I'm hoping that muslims detonate a nuke at the 2008 DNC convention, just to prove that God has a sense of humor....

"Do your duty in all things. You cannot do more, you should never wish to do less." - Robert E. Lee

X-15  posted on  2008-03-13   23:16:23 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#10. To: robin (#0) (Edited)

What’s the Real Racial Divide?

Hi robin,

Now that all(?) the bigots have chimed in, I'll take my shot.

Blacks have voted as a block for as long as I can remember. The difference is that this year they actually have a viable black candidate to vote for. The Dems were happy as a hog in slops to get that block of votes heretofore.

But lo and behold! Many white voters are joining in support of Barack! In fact, if it weren't for a buzzilion white women, Independents and Republican-switchers alike (especially the geriatric gals), the nomination of the Democratic candidate wouldn't even be close. How sweet the poetic justice is!

I for one am laughing my ass off at the hypocritical Dem establishment trying like hell to shove Barack to the back of the bus ticket.

So enough of this Geraldine Ferraro type bigotry. How delicious it is to see these phonies panic.

Keep on keepin' on Barack! You're head and shoulders above the other two old jokers we have as an option.

Success is relative. It is what we can make of the mess we have made of things. T. S. Eliot
OBAMA/WEBB IN 2008
The perfect is the enemy of the good. Voltaire

iconoclast  posted on  2008-03-14   0:29:52 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#11. To: YertleTurtle (#5)

Never mind that some dogs, like border collies, are really, really smart,

What's your point Yertle, you're a border collie?

I'll give you that .... and little more.

Success is relative. It is what we can make of the mess we have made of things. T. S. Eliot
OBAMA/WEBB IN 2008
The perfect is the enemy of the good. Voltaire

iconoclast  posted on  2008-03-14   0:38:15 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#12. To: iconoclast (#11)

What's your point Yertle, you're a border collie?

I'll give you that .... and little more.

My point, snicker, blew right by you, didn't it?

The stupider people are the more surprised they are when you kill them.

YertleTurtle  posted on  2008-03-14   5:20:47 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#13. To: MUDDOG (#7)

I just want to know about your different lives, on this here people farm.

I heard some of you got your families living in cages tall and cold. Some just stay there and dust away... past the age of old.

That was the first LP I bought. 4th grade. I haven't always had such presence of mind.

Old Fud  posted on  2008-03-14   7:20:16 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#14. To: Jethro Tull (#4)

This is the unintended consequence of forced integration. Affirmative action, racial norming, one-way hate laws all serve notice on whites that a dual justice exists, and that fleeing - if possible - is a sane alternative.

These things you cite are all lousy excuses for solutions to problems real or perceived and they all come from demagogic politicians.

Forced integration is as incompatible with freedom as forced segregation.

State funded Afro-centric schools are as outrageously ridiculous as state funded Zionist or white supremacist schools would be.

Success is relative. It is what we can make of the mess we have made of things. T. S. Eliot
OBAMA/WEBB IN 2008
The perfect is the enemy of the good. Voltaire

iconoclast  posted on  2008-03-14   8:18:19 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#15. To: YertleTurtle (#12)

My point, snicker, blew right by you, didn't it?

When your "points" stop blowing by me, I'll get worried.

Success is relative. It is what we can make of the mess we have made of things. T. S. Eliot
OBAMA/WEBB IN 2008
The perfect is the enemy of the good. Voltaire

iconoclast  posted on  2008-03-14   8:22:06 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#16. To: robin (#0)

What no one at COMCENTCOM (Communist Central Command) has the ovaries to say to Hillary is this:

DEMs are going to vote for whoever wins the nomination in November, but not so with disenchanted PUBs. If Hillary wins then PUBs who despise McCain will hold their noses and vote for him because the one person they despise more than McCain is Hillary. But, an election-deciding number of these Pubs will vote for Obama if he wins the DEM nomination.

So, if the Dems really want the White House then they'll have to run a candidate that PUBs will vote for, and that darn sure isn't Hillary.

As far as PUBs are concerned there's no down side to a DEM prez this time, because then PUBs (who are clearly uninspired-clueless as to what to do with the power at this point) can do what they do best-monkey wrench proposed legislation that they don't want the DEMs to pass. (It's not even about party principles because these same PUBs would vote for any gun ban that *Bush proposes but they'd stop it dead if a DEM prez wants it)

So, PUBs will vote for a DEM using the rationale that they need time to pull their gig together and tighten up their show, secure in the knowledge that the DEMs can be effectively stalemated by the PUBs in Congress.

And, then in 4 years the PUBs can come back tanned, rested and ready with some newer, fresher ideas on how to give tax breaks to rich folks, and they'll have some really kewl graphics to simplify the explanation of their new and improved trickle down or "voodoo" economics.

______________

* Bush may yet stick it to gun owners and make his last act the passage of the most sweeping gun ban in our history. He's no friend of gun owners and if not for the fact that it was before his last election he would have most assuredly voted to renew the AWB which sunset at that time. And, he has set the stage for the complete repudiation of all constitutional limitations on the govt, and the most troublesome obstacle is the 2nd amendment.

And, my prophesied election scenario is based on the presumption that Ron Paul is no longer in the race or he has been cheated in a way that PUBs will meekly accept, and saving America is no longer possible. I have to allow for this because after the blatant theft of two elections without a single principled voice rising in opposition, then the boys in the back room may already be counting on the party delegates to fold with little or no resistance once the high command orders it, and of course there's no chance of the supreme court interfering when the very survival of the two party swindle is at stake.

"...and girl you know that rain, is bad for my guitar strings...."__Forrest Lee, Jr.

HOUNDDAWG  posted on  2008-03-14   9:01:17 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#17. To: iconoclast (#10)

Now that all(?) the bigots have chimed in, I'll take my shot.

Sorry I'm late.

The nightly coon hunt ran a little long after the dogs treed one.

"...and girl you know that rain, is bad for my guitar strings...."__Forrest Lee, Jr.

HOUNDDAWG  posted on  2008-03-14   9:06:41 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#18. To: iconoclast (#14)

Forced integration is as incompatible with freedom as forced segregation.

State funded Afro-centric schools are as outrageously ridiculous as state funded Zionist or white supremacist schools would be.

I'm so glad you see the evils of forced integration, unfortunately this is the world we live in. This is the world Obama and Michelle were belched from, and this is the world you, and others with a guilt ridden soul, will stand in line to vote for.

Jethro Tull  posted on  2008-03-14   9:07:30 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#19. To: Old Fud (#13)

That was the first LP I bought. 4th grade.

Excellent choice.

The 4th grade was never the same again.


I've already said too much.

MUDDOG  posted on  2008-03-14   9:44:23 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#20. To: Jethro Tull (#18)

"Forced integration ....This is the world Obama and Michelle were belched from"

Oh I am just sooo disappointed in you. Being from NY you should know its never been about any

shade of color but Green. Seeing how Obama and the Ms was ecumacated I doubt they ever

saw a "Forced integration " school.

castletrash  posted on  2008-03-14   9:54:42 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#21. To: castletrash (#20)

Their adherents believe they are "of the people", who am I to disturb their illusion?

Jethro Tull  posted on  2008-03-14   10:00:58 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#22. To: Jethro Tull (#21)

who am I to disturb their illusion

Ahhh a believer of myths and legends, I will see you at the next Dragoncon .

castletrash  posted on  2008-03-14   10:04:57 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#23. To: castletrash (#22)

I might be late. The Grand Wizard has me on special assignment. I have nooses to make and confederate flags to mend. Start without me. I'll bring the vino.

Jethro Tull  posted on  2008-03-14   10:08:38 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#24. To: YertleTurtle (#1)

"It does not take a majority to prevail, but rather an irate, tireless minority, keen on setting brush fires of freedom in the minds of men." -- Samuel Adams (1722-1803)‡

ghostdogtxn  posted on  2008-03-14   10:13:49 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#25. To: Jethro Tull (#4)

"It does not take a majority to prevail, but rather an irate, tireless minority, keen on setting brush fires of freedom in the minds of men." -- Samuel Adams (1722-1803)‡

ghostdogtxn  posted on  2008-03-14   10:16:20 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#26. To: ghostdogtxn (#25)

Bail is for white people.

Tell that to OJ Simpson or perhaps the exotic dancers who tried to send those Duke kids away for 30 years based on hatred of whites.

Jethro Tull  posted on  2008-03-14   10:22:36 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#27. To: Jethro Tull (#26)

"It does not take a majority to prevail, but rather an irate, tireless minority, keen on setting brush fires of freedom in the minds of men." -- Samuel Adams (1722-1803)‡

ghostdogtxn  posted on  2008-03-14   10:27:26 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#28. To: iconoclast (#14)

Forced integration is as incompatible with freedom as forced segregation.

State funded Afro-centric schools are as outrageously ridiculous as state funded Zionist or white supremacist schools would be.

Forced integration is a reality in America, Western Europe, New Zealand, and Australia, the areas where white Europeans are a majority. Involuntary integration, payed for in zogbucks, is intended to destroy white Europeans as a majority anywhere they congregate on the planet.

Do you differentiate between white supremacism, white nationalism, or white separatism? Remember, non-whites are encouraged to practice racial nationalism/supremacy/separatism by the usual suspects.

"I am not in favor of making voters or jurors of Negroes, nor of qualifying them to hold office..." --- Abraham Lincoln, 9/15/1858 campaign speech

X-15  posted on  2008-03-14   11:28:54 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#29. To: X-15 (#28)

Forced integration is a reality in America

Indeed it is.

There is a rent subsidized apt complex which was "inserted" not very far from my abode some time back (it would take some research to pinpoint the date, but if I'm not mistaken it was during the Reagan-Bush years).

I abhor such social engineering.

Had a black family moved into the same neighborhood on their own nickel and had crosses burned in their yard, I would have likewise abhorred that.

There are also enclaves of white supremacists in our country. I have no plans to move to one but it's their nickel also as far as I'm concerned.

Success is relative. It is what we can make of the mess we have made of things. T. S. Eliot
OBAMA/WEBB IN 2008
The perfect is the enemy of the good. Voltaire

iconoclast  posted on  2008-03-15   11:00:45 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#30. To: X-15 (#28)

Do you differentiate between white supremacism, white nationalism, or white separatism?

Nutcases.

Remember, non-whites are encouraged to practice racial nationalism/supremacy/separatism by the usual suspects.

The other side of the nutcase coin.

You have some kind of point you're trying to make?

Success is relative. It is what we can make of the mess we have made of things. T. S. Eliot
OBAMA/WEBB IN 2008
The perfect is the enemy of the good. Voltaire

iconoclast  posted on  2008-03-15   11:09:42 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#31. To: Jethro Tull (#18)

I'm so glad you see the evils of forced integration, unfortunately this is the world we live in. This is the world Obama and Michelle were belched

Give it rest Jethro.

These two pretty much "did it the old fashioned way", with the possible exception of Michelle's acceptance at Princeton (I also recognize the evils of quotas and set asides).

But, I also acknowledge the immorality that the "privileged" (to use a term momentarily in ill favor) feed off of. McCain had no more business being accepted at Annapolis than his wastrel counterpart did at Yale and Harvard.

Right now, my hot button is the prevention of another administration headed by privileged criminals.

Success is relative. It is what we can make of the mess we have made of things. T. S. Eliot
OBAMA/WEBB IN 2008
The perfect is the enemy of the good. Voltaire

iconoclast  posted on  2008-03-15   11:37:04 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#32. To: iconoclast (#31)

But, I also acknowledge the immorality that the "privileged" (to use a term momentarily in ill favor) feed off of. McCain had no more business being accepted at Annapolis than his wastrel counterpart did at Yale and Harvard.

Right now, my hot button is the prevention of another administration headed by privileged criminals.

Amen.

'Individuals should not take responsibility for their own defense. That’s what the police are for. ... If I oppose individuals defending themselves, I have to support police defending them. I have to support a police state.”' Alan Dershowitz

robin  posted on  2008-03-15   11:47:33 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#33. To: iconoclast (#31)

Give it rest Jethro. These two pretty much "did it the old fashioned way"

Please accept the truth or crawl back into your PC hole.

Obama attended The Punahou Schol followed by Columbia undergrad then Harvard law. Obama wouldn’t take the time to pee on you, Iconclast, so please stop making him the next Abe Lincoln.

Jethro Tull  posted on  2008-03-15   16:55:01 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#34. To: Jethro Tull (#33)

Obama attended The Punahou Schol followed by Columbia undergrad then Harvard law.

If you have something negative from your special perspective (aside from several degrees of melanin content in the student body) of Punahou School pray share them.

Success is relative. It is what we can make of the mess we have made of things. T. S. Eliot
OBAMA/WEBB IN 2008
The perfect is the enemy of the good. Voltaire

iconoclast  posted on  2008-03-15   21:07:26 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#35. To: ghostdogtxn, Jethro Tull (#25)

Walk into any courthouse in America and you will see that the judges and prosecutors more than compensate for the racial inequality of hate laws. I still make the best pitch for bail for my black clients that I can, but I don't know why I bother, frankly. Bail is for white people.

Here in De we see a definite pattern. If a perp makes bail and all that stands between him and a walk is a dead witness, then the witness is murdered and nobody sees nuthin'.

At the risk of reducing your clients to unflattering stereotypes, is it possible that the judges who set high bail or put no bail holds on your clients do so because the judges see a pattern, too?

You didn't mention if black clients who are arrested for singing too loud in church are treated the same as violent ex cons who are facing mandatory, 3X loser time if a witness lives to tell the tale.

I'm sure that a number of the judges in your state are just hate-filled crackers, but do you make any distinction between those and judges who really see a potential problem if a psycho con who knows who is causing his grief makes bail?

(let's not quibble over the constitutional right to bail or a legal presumption of innocence. As you said, "as long as there's a state there will be lawyers" and one of the unfortunate consequences of that is, the law becomes the friend of the rich and a weapon used against the poor and powerless. After all, a well paid lawyer is a happy judge is a bribed jury is an acquitted defendant, right?)

"...and girl you know that rain, is bad for my guitar strings...."__Forrest Lee, Jr.

HOUNDDAWG  posted on  2008-03-15   21:14:54 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#36. To: ghostdogtxn (#25)

. I still make the best pitch for bail for my black clients that I can, but I don't know why I bother, frankly. Bail is for white people.

Very interesting. Bush's Willy Horton lives on and on and on.

"Satan / Cheney in "08" Just Foreign Policy Iraqi Death Estimator

tom007  posted on  2008-03-15   21:29:00 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#37. To: Jethro Tull (#33)

Obama wouldn’t take the time to pee on you, Iconclast, so please stop making him the next Abe Lincoln.

A little unusual even for you, but you managed to cram at least four misapprehensions into one sentence.

1) I happen to hold Mr. Lincoln in low esteem.

2) I do not expect extraordinarily wondrous results from an Obama administration, I'll settle for a slow down if not a halt to a diminishing of foreign and domestic tribulations.

3) I do not old him forth as a giant among men, just head and shoulders above his miserable opponents.

4) Consideration of whether or not he would "pee" on me had not entered my mind as a standard of measurement.

Success is relative. It is what we can make of the mess we have made of things. T. S. Eliot
OBAMA/WEBB IN 2008
The perfect is the enemy of the good. Voltaire

iconoclast  posted on  2008-03-15   21:35:45 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#38. To: HOUNDDAWG (#35)

"It does not take a majority to prevail, but rather an irate, tireless minority, keen on setting brush fires of freedom in the minds of men." -- Samuel Adams (1722-1803)‡

ghostdogtxn  posted on  2008-03-17   9:59:43 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#39. To: ghostdogtxn (#38)

Hey dog, you said that bail was for white, rich folk. The brothers who killed these women have long, lengthy rap sheets. That kinda bucks your theory.

Happy St. Patty's day, you Irish bastard :)

Jethro Tull  posted on  2008-03-17   10:08:43 ET  (2 images) Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#40. To: Jethro Tull (#39)

"It does not take a majority to prevail, but rather an irate, tireless minority, keen on setting brush fires of freedom in the minds of men." -- Samuel Adams (1722-1803)‡

ghostdogtxn  posted on  2008-03-17   10:12:31 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#41. To: ghostdogtxn (#40)

Do some research; check their rap sheets.

I'm saying they've been in and out of the system ad nauseum. They're neither white nor rich, just blind ass lucky to be released back into society, I guess.

Jethro Tull  posted on  2008-03-17   12:15:02 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  



      .
      .
      .

Comments (42 - 53) not displayed.

TopPage UpFull ThreadPage DownBottom/Latest


[Home]  [Headlines]  [Latest Articles]  [Latest Comments]  [Post]  [Sign-in]  [Mail]  [Setup]  [Help]