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Title: The Hour of Our Time - The Legacy of William Cooper Source: Ether Films URL Source: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-2829245257205113781 Published: Mar 22, 2007 Author: James Jankiewicz Post Date: 2008-03-14 21:30:43 by buckeye Keywords: NoneViews: 367 Comments: 27
William (Bill) Cooper was a former naval officer, decorated veteran, short wave radio broadcaster and world renound lecturer and author, he ... all » was shot and killed November 5th 2001 under suspicious circumstances. This is his story. Poster Comment:What common bond do we have, people? Freedom. A Clinton White house memo is rumored to have called Cooper "the most dangerous radio host in America." (See also http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milton_William_Cooper. A Jim Jankiewicz film It's interesting that he started wondering if the UFO information he had seen while in Navy intelligence was "fed" to him.
William (Bill) Cooper was a former naval officer, decorated veteran, short wave radio broadcaster and world renound lecturer and author, he ... all » was shot and killed November 5th 2001 under suspicious circumstances. This is his story.
Poster Comment:
What common bond do we have, people? Freedom.
A Clinton White house memo is rumored to have called Cooper "the most dangerous radio host in America." (See also http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milton_William_Cooper.
A Jim Jankiewicz film
It's interesting that he started wondering if the UFO information he had seen while in Navy intelligence was "fed" to him.
Post Comment Private Reply Ignore Thread
#1. To: christine, robin, Dakmar, iconoclast, Jethro Tull, YertleTurtle, angle, farmfriend, Cynicom (#0) I look at heavy focus on any occult aspect of conspiracy theories as a form of symbolism used by the "researcher" to either attract attention or represent evil in a most direct manner possible. This can be for his own benefit, for the audience, or both. Still, the things that bother them, almost like the silhouettes of truth when truth seems difficult to grasp, are interesting. While they ramble about owls or lizards, or they hearken back to sun worship or fast forward to UFOs, they also tend to talk about imminently relevant facts like why the media can visit with Osama bin Laden but the CIA "can't find him." This is an interesting film, and worth watching if you have time. I see a lot of talk about the potential for these researchers to be intelligence operatives. So what? Some of the things they question are not being discussed in TV, but everyone with any sense of perception is wondering them. If anything, conspiracy "researchers" like Cooper serve as a reminder that there are unexplored regions in our understanding of how the contemporary world functions. buckeye posted on 2008-03-14 21:44:56 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #2. To: buckeye (#0) "Most people are like animals because they do not use their intelligence". Two decades of Clinton/Bush shame and decline and a large segment herein seem determined to either vote for, or stay home and let the animals vote for, more of the same. A man comes along with a message of hope and change and we're going to sit by and let bigots, bots, and feminists make our decision for us? For the country's sake give the man at least four years. I'm certain you won't wind up on a black-owned plantation by then and you'll get another opportunity to banish him to IL. Success is relative. It is what we can make of the mess we have made of things. T. S. Eliot OBAMA/WEBB IN 2008The perfect is the enemy of the good. Voltaire iconoclast posted on 2008-03-15 9:33:02 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #3. To: iconoclast (#2) A man comes along with a message of hope and change Supported by an unabashed liberal voting record and a 20 plus year association with Pastor Wright, an Afrocentric, anti-white freak. That's one hell of a leader you've chosen. The Obamaphiles remind me of the Japanese women at the fall of Saipan. Jethro Tull posted on 2008-03-15 9:37:27 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #4. To: iconoclast (#2) For the country's sake give the man at least four years. Morning Joe wants 911 Truthers Tased & Sent To Secret Camps Zbigniew's daughter Mika Brzezinski is OK with that. Her mother: Emilie Anna Benes. buckeye posted on 2008-03-15 9:45:02 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #5. To: buckeye (#1) I see a lot of talk about the potential for these researchers to be intelligence operatives. So what? Some of the things they question are not being discussed in TV, but everyone with any sense of perception is wondering them. If anything, conspiracy "researchers" like Cooper serve as a reminder that there are unexplored regions in our understanding of how the contemporary world functions. great post, buckeye. i look foward to watching this film. also, i very much appreciate your use of the term conspiracy "researchers." christine posted on 2008-03-15 9:58:35 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #6. To: IndieTx (#0) William Cooper ping christine posted on 2008-03-15 10:02:36 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #7. To: Jethro Tull (#3) A man comes along with a message of hope and change Supported by an unabashed liberal voting record and a 20 plus year association with Pastor Wright, an Afrocentric, anti-white freak. Those who choose to vote for, or allow, four more years of fear and decline are certainly free to do so. The Limbaugh-ish terror of the "L" word is still mighty powerful. His warning rants of economic collapse prior to the election of Slick are still fresh in my ears. Clinton/McCain will readily accept support from any slimy corner. Obama has forthrightly rejected Pastor Wright's moments of extremism. Mr. Wright has undoubtedly given thousands of sermons over his lifetime ... I keep seeing one or two. Can't imagine who's pushing them. Success is relative. It is what we can make of the mess we have made of things. T. S. Eliot OBAMA/WEBB IN 2008The perfect is the enemy of the good. Voltaire iconoclast posted on 2008-03-15 10:04:27 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #8. To: buckeye (#4) Zbigniew's daughter Mika Brzezinski is OK with that. Her mother: Emilie Anna Benes. And the obnoxious "Joe" gets a free ride because he bears the sacred "R"? Success is relative. It is what we can make of the mess we have made of things. T. S. Eliot OBAMA/WEBB IN 2008The perfect is the enemy of the good. Voltaire iconoclast posted on 2008-03-15 10:08:08 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #9. To: iconoclast (#8) Does Mika? The apple didn't fall far from the tree. buckeye posted on 2008-03-15 10:08:48 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #10. To: Jethro Tull (#3) The Obamaphiles remind me of the Japanese women at the fall of Saipan. The anti-Obamaphiles remind me of fear driven neutered rams. Success is relative. It is what we can make of the mess we have made of things. T. S. Eliot OBAMA/WEBB IN 2008The perfect is the enemy of the good. Voltaire iconoclast posted on 2008-03-15 10:15:54 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #11. To: buckeye (#9) Does Mika? The apple didn't fall far from the tree. In future, kindly reply to my posts, not your inferences. Success is relative. It is what we can make of the mess we have made of things. T. S. Eliot OBAMA/WEBB IN 2008The perfect is the enemy of the good. Voltaire iconoclast posted on 2008-03-15 10:17:53 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #12. To: christine (#5) i very much appreciate your use of the term conspiracy "researchers." Thanks, but I'm not flattering them. I put the term in quotes because there is no standard method for supporting their arguments, little attempt to build a position based on a chain of proof, and no apparent standard for community review. They often just have a haunch that something is wrong and they work from personal observations or intuition. Of course the establishment they criticize funds "formal" denial of their assertions, and group think carries the day. I look at the "researchers" as lone analysts who are frequently mistaken, products of their own personal struggles, and potentially misled by disinformation themselves. But they release observations and provable facts from time to time that force us to rethink our understanding of the world. To suppress this kind of speech is one of the worst forms of soft tyranny we see today. Clinton Confronts Heckler over 9/11 Conspiracy The argument that most conspiracy researchers are disinformation specialists seems irrelevant to me. People either accept that something is wrong with the official story, or they don't. Once the official story becomes unbelievable, the dissent is effectively begun. Dissent is critical, even if somewhat misguided. Dissent at a time when accepted media sources are owned by a few corporate interests is even more critical. buckeye posted on 2008-03-15 10:30:13 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #13. To: buckeye (#4) Her mother: Emilie Anna Benes. Her mother??? As far as I can Google, her mother is/was a sculptor and stay at home mom. One of her sons is working with the McCain campaign. I guess that apple fell from the tree and rolled downhill? Where the heck are you coming from lately, buck? If you have some information on "subversiveness" on the part of Mika's mother, post it plainly. Not in the form of a Hillary-esque insinuation. Success is relative. It is what we can make of the mess we have made of things. T. S. Eliot OBAMA/WEBB IN 2008The perfect is the enemy of the good. Voltaire iconoclast posted on 2008-03-15 10:42:29 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #14. To: iconoclast (#13) If you have anything to say about Bill Cooper, please post it to this thread. Otherwise, you're welcome to ping me from an Obama thread and try to get me to support Obama on one of those. I personally see Obama as an establishment puppet like the other two leading candidates, so your efforts are likely to be in vain. buckeye posted on 2008-03-15 10:46:58 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #15. To: IndieTx, christine, robin (#6) (Edited) I acknowledge that disinformation can be used in dangerous ways. Consider TOS2's resident OKC bombing "expert" who continually discovers reasons for us to blame the Arab world for the OKC bombing: www.libertypost.org/cgi-bin/readart.cgi?ArtNum=219131 The blame is continually shifted away from Americans with ulterior motives, and ascribed to incompetence. Bill Clinton's cabinet takes the fall, but not because they wanted an excuse to impose martial law and persecute the militia types or those critical of Israel (as HR 1955 has intended). There could be a lot of truth in these "exposes," but as with 9/11, angry and intent on the part of foreigners to harm us is one thing. Providing excuses for the government to crack down on our freedoms is another. buckeye posted on 2008-03-15 11:14:29 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #16. To: buckeye (#15) who continually discovers reasons for us to blame the Arab world for the OKC bombing: I never understood that, except that he is religious and probably influenced by his church. 'Individuals should not take responsibility for their own defense. That’s what the police are for. ... If I oppose individuals defending themselves, I have to support police defending them. I have to support a police state.”' Alan Dershowitz robin posted on 2008-03-15 11:19:22 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #17. To: robin (#16) I tend to believe there were foreign terrorists involved with the Murrah bombing. McVeigh had expressed deep sympathies for the Iraqis killed during the first gulf war, and I can believe he could have collaborated with foreign terrorists. That's not the point. As with 9/11, the point is what our government did with the event in its communications with the American people that I despise. As a typical second amendment supporter, I felt that Janet Reno had brought every pro-constitution patriot under attack when they started tarring all militias in with McVeigh and the Elohim supremacists. Something similar happened after 9/11: it became a Reichstag fire that rallied the anti-constitutional forces to greater and greater accomplishments -- rarely opposed. buckeye posted on 2008-03-15 11:27:40 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #18. To: buckeye (#0) bookmarked, thanks 'Individuals should not take responsibility for their own defense. That’s what the police are for. ... If I oppose individuals defending themselves, I have to support police defending them. I have to support a police state.”' Alan Dershowitz robin posted on 2008-03-15 11:28:16 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #19. To: robin (#18) I viewed the entire hour plus robin and found it very interesting. Cynicom posted on 2008-03-15 11:31:16 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #20. To: buckeye (#17) (Edited) Janet Reno had brought every pro-constitution patriot under attack when they started tarring all militias in with McVeigh and the Elohim supremacists. Something similar happened after 9/11 Yes of course, there is an agenda to make the US like the USSR once was. Why else would DHS hire an ex head of Stasi (Marcus Wolf) and an ex-KGB (Primakov)? Briley understands that: CHERTOFF CREATED TERROR PRETEXTS FOR US POLICE STATE I tend to believe McVeigh was used by an operation designed to forward that agenda. FORMER KGB HEADS TO HELP SPY ON AMERICANS 'Individuals should not take responsibility for their own defense. That’s what the police are for. ... If I oppose individuals defending themselves, I have to support police defending them. I have to support a police state.”' Alan Dershowitz robin posted on 2008-03-15 11:38:15 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #21. To: robin (#20) (Edited) I tend to believe McVeigh was used by an operation designed to forward that agenda. Regardless of the events leading up to the bombing, Establishment efforts afterward were single minded in that regard. It was a kind of slight of hand where the government appeared to be shocked by an operation that they were actually investigating, and then wheeled around to point the finger of doom at anyone who might question the erosion of our constitutional rights as a potential terrorist who could destroy innocent American life for that "unjust" cause. You might be interested in Gore Vidal's commentary regarding the incident. He struck up a friendship with McVeigh and exchanged letters with him before writing this article. buckeye posted on 2008-03-15 11:57:15 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #22. To: buckeye (#21) from Briley: FEDERAL CONCEALMENT OF OKC BOMBING PROVOCATEURSMcVeigh was known to be with one or more of the FBI provocateurs McVeigh was working with Andreas Strassmeyer and FBI agents. This was clearly a govt operation. Gore Vidal did not seem to go into this (I did not read the entire long article), although he did make some good points. 'Individuals should not take responsibility for their own defense. That’s what the police are for. ... If I oppose individuals defending themselves, I have to support police defending them. I have to support a police state.”' Alan Dershowitz robin posted on 2008-03-15 12:15:54 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #23. To: robin (#22) Yes, Patrick often talks about those provocateurs, as do Laurie Mylorie and Jayna Davis. It doesn't prove that the operation was intentional; it could mean that the government simply let it get out of control accidentally (possibly by failing to imagine how terrible the plans were). That's in the middle between MIHOP and LIHOP: made it happen on purpose, and let it happen on purpose. Yes, I've also heard that the explosion caused by fertilizer could not have done the damage done. The whole situation is very much like the 9/11 truth debate: endless, filled with inconsistencies, and potentially shattering to the integrity of our republic. buckeye posted on 2008-03-15 12:27:01 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #24. To: buckeye (#14) If you have anything to say about Bill Cooper, please post it to this thread. Otherwise, you're welcome to ping me from an Obama thread and try to get me to support Obama on one of those. I personally see Obama as an establishment puppet like the other two leading candidates, so your efforts are likely to be in vain. You inserted Emilie Anna Benes into the thread, for God only know what reason. My post carried no mention of Obama. You're losing more than your cool, fella. I'll surely check with you before making any more comments. NOT! Success is relative. It is what we can make of the mess we have made of things. T. S. Eliot OBAMA/WEBB IN 2008The perfect is the enemy of the good. Voltaire iconoclast posted on 2008-03-15 12:37:50 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #25. To: iconoclast (#24) For the country's sake give the man at least four years. I'm certain you won't wind up on a black-owned plantation by then and you'll get another opportunity to banish him to IL. Who's that, Abraham Lincoln? buckeye posted on 2008-03-15 12:46:38 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #26. To: buckeye (#23) There were reports of explosions/bombs planted in the building too. I go with MIHOP. The overall picture is one of coverup and deception; just like 9/11. 'Individuals should not take responsibility for their own defense. That’s what the police are for. ... If I oppose individuals defending themselves, I have to support police defending them. I have to support a police state.”' Alan Dershowitz robin posted on 2008-03-15 13:24:33 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #27. To: buckeye (#25) ... you'll get another opportunity to banish him to IL. Who's that, Abraham Lincoln? Lincoln should never have been allowed to cross the state line in the first place. Success is relative. It is what we can make of the mess we have made of things. T. S. Eliot OBAMA/WEBB IN 2008The perfect is the enemy of the good. Voltaire iconoclast posted on 2008-03-15 22:21:59 ET Reply Trace Private Reply Top • Page Up • Full Thread • Page Down • Bottom/Latest
I look at heavy focus on any occult aspect of conspiracy theories as a form of symbolism used by the "researcher" to either attract attention or represent evil in a most direct manner possible. This can be for his own benefit, for the audience, or both. Still, the things that bother them, almost like the silhouettes of truth when truth seems difficult to grasp, are interesting. While they ramble about owls or lizards, or they hearken back to sun worship or fast forward to UFOs, they also tend to talk about imminently relevant facts like why the media can visit with Osama bin Laden but the CIA "can't find him." This is an interesting film, and worth watching if you have time. I see a lot of talk about the potential for these researchers to be intelligence operatives. So what? Some of the things they question are not being discussed in TV, but everyone with any sense of perception is wondering them. If anything, conspiracy "researchers" like Cooper serve as a reminder that there are unexplored regions in our understanding of how the contemporary world functions.
This is an interesting film, and worth watching if you have time.
I see a lot of talk about the potential for these researchers to be intelligence operatives. So what? Some of the things they question are not being discussed in TV, but everyone with any sense of perception is wondering them. If anything, conspiracy "researchers" like Cooper serve as a reminder that there are unexplored regions in our understanding of how the contemporary world functions.
buckeye posted on 2008-03-14 21:44:56 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
"Most people are like animals because they do not use their intelligence". Two decades of Clinton/Bush shame and decline and a large segment herein seem determined to either vote for, or stay home and let the animals vote for, more of the same. A man comes along with a message of hope and change and we're going to sit by and let bigots, bots, and feminists make our decision for us? For the country's sake give the man at least four years. I'm certain you won't wind up on a black-owned plantation by then and you'll get another opportunity to banish him to IL.
"Most people are like animals because they do not use their intelligence".
Two decades of Clinton/Bush shame and decline and a large segment herein seem determined to either vote for, or stay home and let the animals vote for, more of the same.
A man comes along with a message of hope and change and we're going to sit by and let bigots, bots, and feminists make our decision for us?
For the country's sake give the man at least four years. I'm certain you won't wind up on a black-owned plantation by then and you'll get another opportunity to banish him to IL.
Success is relative. It is what we can make of the mess we have made of things. T. S. Eliot OBAMA/WEBB IN 2008The perfect is the enemy of the good. Voltaire
iconoclast posted on 2008-03-15 9:33:02 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
A man comes along with a message of hope and change Supported by an unabashed liberal voting record and a 20 plus year association with Pastor Wright, an Afrocentric, anti-white freak. That's one hell of a leader you've chosen. The Obamaphiles remind me of the Japanese women at the fall of Saipan.
A man comes along with a message of hope and change
Supported by an unabashed liberal voting record and a 20 plus year association with Pastor Wright, an Afrocentric, anti-white freak. That's one hell of a leader you've chosen. The Obamaphiles remind me of the Japanese women at the fall of Saipan.
Jethro Tull posted on 2008-03-15 9:37:27 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
For the country's sake give the man at least four years. Morning Joe wants 911 Truthers Tased & Sent To Secret Camps Zbigniew's daughter Mika Brzezinski is OK with that. Her mother: Emilie Anna Benes.
For the country's sake give the man at least four years.
buckeye posted on 2008-03-15 9:45:02 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
I see a lot of talk about the potential for these researchers to be intelligence operatives. So what? Some of the things they question are not being discussed in TV, but everyone with any sense of perception is wondering them. If anything, conspiracy "researchers" like Cooper serve as a reminder that there are unexplored regions in our understanding of how the contemporary world functions. great post, buckeye. i look foward to watching this film. also, i very much appreciate your use of the term conspiracy "researchers."
great post, buckeye. i look foward to watching this film. also, i very much appreciate your use of the term conspiracy "researchers."
christine posted on 2008-03-15 9:58:35 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
William Cooper ping
christine posted on 2008-03-15 10:02:36 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
A man comes along with a message of hope and change Supported by an unabashed liberal voting record and a 20 plus year association with Pastor Wright, an Afrocentric, anti-white freak. Those who choose to vote for, or allow, four more years of fear and decline are certainly free to do so. The Limbaugh-ish terror of the "L" word is still mighty powerful. His warning rants of economic collapse prior to the election of Slick are still fresh in my ears. Clinton/McCain will readily accept support from any slimy corner. Obama has forthrightly rejected Pastor Wright's moments of extremism. Mr. Wright has undoubtedly given thousands of sermons over his lifetime ... I keep seeing one or two. Can't imagine who's pushing them.
A man comes along with a message of hope and change Supported by an unabashed liberal voting record and a 20 plus year association with Pastor Wright, an Afrocentric, anti-white freak.
Supported by an unabashed liberal voting record and a 20 plus year association with Pastor Wright, an Afrocentric, anti-white freak.
Those who choose to vote for, or allow, four more years of fear and decline are certainly free to do so.
The Limbaugh-ish terror of the "L" word is still mighty powerful. His warning rants of economic collapse prior to the election of Slick are still fresh in my ears.
Clinton/McCain will readily accept support from any slimy corner. Obama has forthrightly rejected Pastor Wright's moments of extremism.
Mr. Wright has undoubtedly given thousands of sermons over his lifetime ... I keep seeing one or two. Can't imagine who's pushing them.
iconoclast posted on 2008-03-15 10:04:27 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
Zbigniew's daughter Mika Brzezinski is OK with that. Her mother: Emilie Anna Benes. And the obnoxious "Joe" gets a free ride because he bears the sacred "R"?
Zbigniew's daughter Mika Brzezinski is OK with that. Her mother: Emilie Anna Benes.
And the obnoxious "Joe" gets a free ride because he bears the sacred "R"?
iconoclast posted on 2008-03-15 10:08:08 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
Does Mika? The apple didn't fall far from the tree.
buckeye posted on 2008-03-15 10:08:48 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
The Obamaphiles remind me of the Japanese women at the fall of Saipan. The anti-Obamaphiles remind me of fear driven neutered rams.
The Obamaphiles remind me of the Japanese women at the fall of Saipan.
The anti-Obamaphiles remind me of fear driven neutered rams.
iconoclast posted on 2008-03-15 10:15:54 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
Does Mika? The apple didn't fall far from the tree. In future, kindly reply to my posts, not your inferences.
In future, kindly reply to my posts, not your inferences.
iconoclast posted on 2008-03-15 10:17:53 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
i very much appreciate your use of the term conspiracy "researchers." Thanks, but I'm not flattering them. I put the term in quotes because there is no standard method for supporting their arguments, little attempt to build a position based on a chain of proof, and no apparent standard for community review. They often just have a haunch that something is wrong and they work from personal observations or intuition. Of course the establishment they criticize funds "formal" denial of their assertions, and group think carries the day. I look at the "researchers" as lone analysts who are frequently mistaken, products of their own personal struggles, and potentially misled by disinformation themselves. But they release observations and provable facts from time to time that force us to rethink our understanding of the world. To suppress this kind of speech is one of the worst forms of soft tyranny we see today. Clinton Confronts Heckler over 9/11 Conspiracy The argument that most conspiracy researchers are disinformation specialists seems irrelevant to me. People either accept that something is wrong with the official story, or they don't. Once the official story becomes unbelievable, the dissent is effectively begun. Dissent is critical, even if somewhat misguided. Dissent at a time when accepted media sources are owned by a few corporate interests is even more critical.
i very much appreciate your use of the term conspiracy "researchers."
Thanks, but I'm not flattering them. I put the term in quotes because there is no standard method for supporting their arguments, little attempt to build a position based on a chain of proof, and no apparent standard for community review.
They often just have a haunch that something is wrong and they work from personal observations or intuition.
Of course the establishment they criticize funds "formal" denial of their assertions, and group think carries the day.
I look at the "researchers" as lone analysts who are frequently mistaken, products of their own personal struggles, and potentially misled by disinformation themselves. But they release observations and provable facts from time to time that force us to rethink our understanding of the world. To suppress this kind of speech is one of the worst forms of soft tyranny we see today.
The argument that most conspiracy researchers are disinformation specialists seems irrelevant to me. People either accept that something is wrong with the official story, or they don't. Once the official story becomes unbelievable, the dissent is effectively begun. Dissent is critical, even if somewhat misguided. Dissent at a time when accepted media sources are owned by a few corporate interests is even more critical.
buckeye posted on 2008-03-15 10:30:13 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
Her mother: Emilie Anna Benes. Her mother??? As far as I can Google, her mother is/was a sculptor and stay at home mom. One of her sons is working with the McCain campaign. I guess that apple fell from the tree and rolled downhill? Where the heck are you coming from lately, buck? If you have some information on "subversiveness" on the part of Mika's mother, post it plainly. Not in the form of a Hillary-esque insinuation.
Her mother: Emilie Anna Benes.
Her mother???
As far as I can Google, her mother is/was a sculptor and stay at home mom.
One of her sons is working with the McCain campaign. I guess that apple fell from the tree and rolled downhill?
Where the heck are you coming from lately, buck? If you have some information on "subversiveness" on the part of Mika's mother, post it plainly. Not in the form of a Hillary-esque insinuation.
iconoclast posted on 2008-03-15 10:42:29 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
If you have anything to say about Bill Cooper, please post it to this thread. Otherwise, you're welcome to ping me from an Obama thread and try to get me to support Obama on one of those. I personally see Obama as an establishment puppet like the other two leading candidates, so your efforts are likely to be in vain.
buckeye posted on 2008-03-15 10:46:58 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
I acknowledge that disinformation can be used in dangerous ways. Consider TOS2's resident OKC bombing "expert" who continually discovers reasons for us to blame the Arab world for the OKC bombing: www.libertypost.org/cgi-bin/readart.cgi?ArtNum=219131 The blame is continually shifted away from Americans with ulterior motives, and ascribed to incompetence. Bill Clinton's cabinet takes the fall, but not because they wanted an excuse to impose martial law and persecute the militia types or those critical of Israel (as HR 1955 has intended). There could be a lot of truth in these "exposes," but as with 9/11, angry and intent on the part of foreigners to harm us is one thing. Providing excuses for the government to crack down on our freedoms is another.
The blame is continually shifted away from Americans with ulterior motives, and ascribed to incompetence. Bill Clinton's cabinet takes the fall, but not because they wanted an excuse to impose martial law and persecute the militia types or those critical of Israel (as HR 1955 has intended).
There could be a lot of truth in these "exposes," but as with 9/11, angry and intent on the part of foreigners to harm us is one thing. Providing excuses for the government to crack down on our freedoms is another.
buckeye posted on 2008-03-15 11:14:29 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
who continually discovers reasons for us to blame the Arab world for the OKC bombing: I never understood that, except that he is religious and probably influenced by his church.
who continually discovers reasons for us to blame the Arab world for the OKC bombing:
I never understood that, except that he is religious and probably influenced by his church.
'Individuals should not take responsibility for their own defense. That’s what the police are for. ... If I oppose individuals defending themselves, I have to support police defending them. I have to support a police state.”' Alan Dershowitz
robin posted on 2008-03-15 11:19:22 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
I tend to believe there were foreign terrorists involved with the Murrah bombing. McVeigh had expressed deep sympathies for the Iraqis killed during the first gulf war, and I can believe he could have collaborated with foreign terrorists. That's not the point. As with 9/11, the point is what our government did with the event in its communications with the American people that I despise. As a typical second amendment supporter, I felt that Janet Reno had brought every pro-constitution patriot under attack when they started tarring all militias in with McVeigh and the Elohim supremacists. Something similar happened after 9/11: it became a Reichstag fire that rallied the anti-constitutional forces to greater and greater accomplishments -- rarely opposed.
That's not the point. As with 9/11, the point is what our government did with the event in its communications with the American people that I despise. As a typical second amendment supporter, I felt that Janet Reno had brought every pro-constitution patriot under attack when they started tarring all militias in with McVeigh and the Elohim supremacists. Something similar happened after 9/11: it became a Reichstag fire that rallied the anti-constitutional forces to greater and greater accomplishments -- rarely opposed.
buckeye posted on 2008-03-15 11:27:40 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
bookmarked, thanks
robin posted on 2008-03-15 11:28:16 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
I viewed the entire hour plus robin and found it very interesting.
Cynicom posted on 2008-03-15 11:31:16 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
Janet Reno had brought every pro-constitution patriot under attack when they started tarring all militias in with McVeigh and the Elohim supremacists. Something similar happened after 9/11 Yes of course, there is an agenda to make the US like the USSR once was. Why else would DHS hire an ex head of Stasi (Marcus Wolf) and an ex-KGB (Primakov)? Briley understands that: CHERTOFF CREATED TERROR PRETEXTS FOR US POLICE STATE I tend to believe McVeigh was used by an operation designed to forward that agenda. FORMER KGB HEADS TO HELP SPY ON AMERICANS
Janet Reno had brought every pro-constitution patriot under attack when they started tarring all militias in with McVeigh and the Elohim supremacists. Something similar happened after 9/11
Yes of course, there is an agenda to make the US like the USSR once was. Why else would DHS hire an ex head of Stasi (Marcus Wolf) and an ex-KGB (Primakov)?
Briley understands that: CHERTOFF CREATED TERROR PRETEXTS FOR US POLICE STATE
I tend to believe McVeigh was used by an operation designed to forward that agenda.
FORMER KGB HEADS TO HELP SPY ON AMERICANS
robin posted on 2008-03-15 11:38:15 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
I tend to believe McVeigh was used by an operation designed to forward that agenda. Regardless of the events leading up to the bombing, Establishment efforts afterward were single minded in that regard. It was a kind of slight of hand where the government appeared to be shocked by an operation that they were actually investigating, and then wheeled around to point the finger of doom at anyone who might question the erosion of our constitutional rights as a potential terrorist who could destroy innocent American life for that "unjust" cause. You might be interested in Gore Vidal's commentary regarding the incident. He struck up a friendship with McVeigh and exchanged letters with him before writing this article.
Regardless of the events leading up to the bombing, Establishment efforts afterward were single minded in that regard. It was a kind of slight of hand where the government appeared to be shocked by an operation that they were actually investigating, and then wheeled around to point the finger of doom at anyone who might question the erosion of our constitutional rights as a potential terrorist who could destroy innocent American life for that "unjust" cause. You might be interested in Gore Vidal's commentary regarding the incident. He struck up a friendship with McVeigh and exchanged letters with him before writing this article.
buckeye posted on 2008-03-15 11:57:15 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
from Briley: FEDERAL CONCEALMENT OF OKC BOMBING PROVOCATEURSMcVeigh was known to be with one or more of the FBI provocateurs McVeigh was working with Andreas Strassmeyer and FBI agents. This was clearly a govt operation. Gore Vidal did not seem to go into this (I did not read the entire long article), although he did make some good points.
from Briley:
FEDERAL CONCEALMENT OF OKC BOMBING PROVOCATEURSMcVeigh was known to be with one or more of the FBI provocateurs
McVeigh was working with Andreas Strassmeyer and FBI agents. This was clearly a govt operation. Gore Vidal did not seem to go into this (I did not read the entire long article), although he did make some good points.
robin posted on 2008-03-15 12:15:54 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
Yes, Patrick often talks about those provocateurs, as do Laurie Mylorie and Jayna Davis. It doesn't prove that the operation was intentional; it could mean that the government simply let it get out of control accidentally (possibly by failing to imagine how terrible the plans were). That's in the middle between MIHOP and LIHOP: made it happen on purpose, and let it happen on purpose. Yes, I've also heard that the explosion caused by fertilizer could not have done the damage done. The whole situation is very much like the 9/11 truth debate: endless, filled with inconsistencies, and potentially shattering to the integrity of our republic.
Yes, I've also heard that the explosion caused by fertilizer could not have done the damage done.
The whole situation is very much like the 9/11 truth debate: endless, filled with inconsistencies, and potentially shattering to the integrity of our republic.
buckeye posted on 2008-03-15 12:27:01 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
If you have anything to say about Bill Cooper, please post it to this thread. Otherwise, you're welcome to ping me from an Obama thread and try to get me to support Obama on one of those. I personally see Obama as an establishment puppet like the other two leading candidates, so your efforts are likely to be in vain. You inserted Emilie Anna Benes into the thread, for God only know what reason. My post carried no mention of Obama. You're losing more than your cool, fella. I'll surely check with you before making any more comments. NOT!
You inserted Emilie Anna Benes into the thread, for God only know what reason.
My post carried no mention of Obama.
You're losing more than your cool, fella.
I'll surely check with you before making any more comments. NOT!
iconoclast posted on 2008-03-15 12:37:50 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
For the country's sake give the man at least four years. I'm certain you won't wind up on a black-owned plantation by then and you'll get another opportunity to banish him to IL. Who's that, Abraham Lincoln?
Who's that, Abraham Lincoln?
buckeye posted on 2008-03-15 12:46:38 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
There were reports of explosions/bombs planted in the building too. I go with MIHOP. The overall picture is one of coverup and deception; just like 9/11.
The overall picture is one of coverup and deception; just like 9/11.
robin posted on 2008-03-15 13:24:33 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
... you'll get another opportunity to banish him to IL. Who's that, Abraham Lincoln? Lincoln should never have been allowed to cross the state line in the first place.
... you'll get another opportunity to banish him to IL. Who's that, Abraham Lincoln?
Lincoln should never have been allowed to cross the state line in the first place.
iconoclast posted on 2008-03-15 22:21:59 ET Reply Trace Private Reply