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Title: ARG Poll has PA tied between Obama and Clinton at 45-45
Source: Democratic Underground
URL Source: [None]
Published: Apr 7, 2008
Author: DU people
Post Date: 2008-04-07 17:42:11 by ghostdogtxn
Keywords: None
Views: 3958
Comments: 259

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Begin Trace Mode for Comment # 162.

#1. To: ghostdogtxn (#0)

I doubt Obama is electable in the fall, but I KNOW Hillary isn't.

Sam Houston  posted on  2008-04-07   17:51:23 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#6. To: Sam Houston (#1)

ghostdogtxn  posted on  2008-04-08   9:37:08 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#10. To: ghostdogtxn (#6)

I didn't get the impression there was a big surge for Obama when I was in the southeast part of the state around Easter. It was non-stop MSM politics. People are sick of it.

angle  posted on  2008-04-08   9:57:13 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#14. To: angle (#10)

ghostdogtxn  posted on  2008-04-08   10:06:33 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#16. To: ghostdogtxn (#14)

I think there's a lot of misunderestimation going on about Obama.

Rendell & Hillary are right. He can't win a national. There simply aren't enough guilt laden whites out here.......thank god.

Jethro Tull  posted on  2008-04-08   10:13:08 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#21. To: Jethro Tull (#16)

There simply aren't enough guilt laden whites out here.......thank god.

It seems we have a lot of them here.

They are all very quiet about the fact that Obama will garner 99 per cent of the black vote, " because he is black", very quiet.

Cynicom  posted on  2008-04-08   10:19:01 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#89. To: Cynicom (#21)

They are all very quiet about the fact that Obama will garner 99 per cent of the black vote, " because he is black", very quiet.

I think you're old enough to remember how much of the Catholic vote JFK got in 1960. Do you ascribe his victory to "Protestant guilt"?

aristeides  posted on  2008-04-08   11:51:57 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#100. To: aristeides, Cynicom, Jethro Tull (#89)

I think you're old enough to remember how much of the Catholic vote JFK got in 1960. Do you ascribe his victory to "Protestant guilt"?

It's so silly to talk about guilt. If I vote for Obama, it will be out of a very healthy fear of the warmonger McCain.

There is no guilt involved, just fear and anger of the CABAL currently led by the Bush Regime.

You may have noticed, the ZioNazis don't like Obama. Why? If he is just like McCain, why don't they like Obama?

Did you see the thread last night? T-shirts made in Israel that say "Who killed Obama?"
Israeli designs 'Who killed Barack Obama?' T-shirts

Like Buchanan said, "McCain will make Cheney look like Gandhi".

I don't know where this nonsense about guilt originated.

robin  posted on  2008-04-08   12:17:29 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#103. To: robin (#100)

It's so silly to talk about guilt. If I vote for Obama, it will be out of a very healthy fear of the warmonger McCain.

For reasons I don't understand you've chosen to ignore countless articles detailing O's foreign policy as one that is closely aligned with the other two candidates. Obama's redeployment is to other ME nations and his adoption of the recommendations in the Iraqi Study Group, and the endorsement of it's co-chair Lee Hamilton, sounds like an endorsement of Obama as a custodian of continued homeland security (see Hamilton's 911 investigation).

So, given this, some white guilt is a reasonable assumption for me at least.

Jethro Tull  posted on  2008-04-08   12:36:49 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#144. To: Jethro Tull (#103)

For reasons I don't understand you've chosen to ignore countless articles detailing O's foreign policy as one that is closely aligned with the other two candidates.

You're ignoring the other major difference between Obama and the other candidates: civil liberties. Obama repeatedly calls for restoring habeas corpus in his speeches. The other candidates do not do that.

aristeides  posted on  2008-04-08   14:03:35 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#156. To: aristeides (#144)

Obama repeatedly calls for restoring habeas corpus in his speeches. The other candidates do not do that.

My understanding is that he wants it restored for Gitmo detainees, as described here:

In an e-mail to supporters, Sens. Chris Dodd (D-CT) and Patrick Leahy (D-VT) announced that they were reintroducing the Habeas Corpus Restoration Act as an amendment to a defense authorization bill today. Last fall’s Military Commissions Act stripped detainees charged as enemy combatants of their right of habeas corpus. Watch Dodd introduce the bill on the Senate floor today:

thinkprogress.org/2007/09...eintroduce-habeas-corpus- restoration-act/

I can't assume he means for all of us at this point. Do you have a reference?

Peppa  posted on  2008-04-08   14:26:07 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#162. To: Peppa (#156)

Jeffrey Rosen’s TRB column in the February 27, 2208, New Republic is about how Obama would be the first truly civil libertarian president. That column really sums up what I like about Obama. As a libertarian, civil and fiscal, I don’t agree with a lot of his ideas, but I love his honest and strong civil libertarian bent. After the Bush 43 years this approach to personal liberty and privacy would be a welcome change.

And as far as government spending goes, I’m going to go out on a limb and guess he’d be less “liberal” than Bush. Sure Obama’s spending will focus on different areas than Bush’s, but in pure government expansion it’s almost impossible for Obama, or any other “spend thrift liberal,” to match Bush’s woeful record. Plus an Obama presidency might push the GOP to look deep into the dark night and find a core that seems to be lost in Rovian factions and coalitions. The Rove gloat of creating a generation of GOP rule died, oh, about two or three years in.

All that being said, I sincerely hope Obama wins either Texas or Ohio and forces Clinton out of the Democratic nomination race. Of course that would also involve Clinton conceding with grace. An outcome still in serious doubt at this time.

Here is Rosen’s lede:

If Barack Obama were to win the Democratic nomination and the White House, he would be, among other things, our first civil libertarian president. This is clear not just from his lifetime rating on the ACLU’s scorecard (82 percent compared to John McCain’s 25 percent). It is clear from the fact that civil liberties have been among his most passionate interests–as a constitutional law professor, state legislator, and senator. On the campaign trail, he has been unapologetic about these enthusiasms. In New Hampshire, I heard him end a rousing stump speech by promising the cheering crowd, “We will close Guantánamo, we will restore habeas corpus, we will have a president who will respect and obey the Constitution.” Has a political consultant ever urged a candidate to brandish habeas corpus?

Obama, the civil libertarian.

aristeides  posted on  2008-04-08   14:39:12 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


Replies to Comment # 162.

#210. To: aristeides (#162)

Obama, the civil libertarian.

A voting record to support that would be nice. As a constitutional lecturer, how does he square with funding an undeclared war, now knowing what he does about the intelligence? As much as his credentials are supposed to prove, he shrinks from his known responsibilities. A leader would lead.

Peppa  posted on  2008-04-08 16:04:17 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


End Trace Mode for Comment # 162.

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