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Title: ARG Poll has PA tied between Obama and Clinton at 45-45
Source: Democratic Underground
URL Source: [None]
Published: Apr 7, 2008
Author: DU people
Post Date: 2008-04-07 17:42:11 by ghostdogtxn
Keywords: None
Views: 4026
Comments: 259

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Begin Trace Mode for Comment # 181.

#1. To: ghostdogtxn (#0)

I doubt Obama is electable in the fall, but I KNOW Hillary isn't.

Sam Houston  posted on  2008-04-07   17:51:23 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

ghostdogtxn  posted on  2008-04-08   9:37:08 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

I didn't get the impression there was a big surge for Obama when I was in the southeast part of the state around Easter. It was non-stop MSM politics. People are sick of it.

angle  posted on  2008-04-08   9:57:13 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

ghostdogtxn  posted on  2008-04-08   10:06:33 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

I think there's a lot of misunderestimation going on about Obama.

Rendell & Hillary are right. He can't win a national. There simply aren't enough guilt laden whites out here.......thank god.

Jethro Tull  posted on  2008-04-08   10:13:08 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

There simply aren't enough guilt laden whites out here.......thank god.

It seems we have a lot of them here.

They are all very quiet about the fact that Obama will garner 99 per cent of the black vote, " because he is black", very quiet.

Cynicom  posted on  2008-04-08   10:19:01 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

They are all very quiet about the fact that Obama will garner 99 per cent of the black vote, " because he is black", very quiet.

I think you're old enough to remember how much of the Catholic vote JFK got in 1960. Do you ascribe his victory to "Protestant guilt"?

aristeides  posted on  2008-04-08   11:51:57 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

I think you're old enough to remember how much of the Catholic vote JFK got in 1960. Do you ascribe his victory to "Protestant guilt"?

It's so silly to talk about guilt. If I vote for Obama, it will be out of a very healthy fear of the warmonger McCain.

There is no guilt involved, just fear and anger of the CABAL currently led by the Bush Regime.

You may have noticed, the ZioNazis don't like Obama. Why? If he is just like McCain, why don't they like Obama?

Did you see the thread last night? T-shirts made in Israel that say "Who killed Obama?"
Israeli designs 'Who killed Barack Obama?' T-shirts

Like Buchanan said, "McCain will make Cheney look like Gandhi".

I don't know where this nonsense about guilt originated.

robin  posted on  2008-04-08   12:17:29 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

It's so silly to talk about guilt. If I vote for Obama, it will be out of a very healthy fear of the warmonger McCain.

For reasons I don't understand you've chosen to ignore countless articles detailing O's foreign policy as one that is closely aligned with the other two candidates. Obama's redeployment is to other ME nations and his adoption of the recommendations in the Iraqi Study Group, and the endorsement of it's co-chair Lee Hamilton, sounds like an endorsement of Obama as a custodian of continued homeland security (see Hamilton's 911 investigation).

So, given this, some white guilt is a reasonable assumption for me at least.

Jethro Tull  posted on  2008-04-08   12:36:49 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

For reasons I don't understand you've chosen to ignore countless articles detailing O's foreign policy as one that is closely aligned with the other two candidates.

You're ignoring the other major difference between Obama and the other candidates: civil liberties. Obama repeatedly calls for restoring habeas corpus in his speeches. The other candidates do not do that.

aristeides  posted on  2008-04-08   14:03:35 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

Obama repeatedly calls for restoring habeas corpus in his speeches. The other candidates do not do that.

My understanding is that he wants it restored for Gitmo detainees, as described here:

In an e-mail to supporters, Sens. Chris Dodd (D-CT) and Patrick Leahy (D-VT) announced that they were reintroducing the Habeas Corpus Restoration Act as an amendment to a defense authorization bill today. Last fall’s Military Commissions Act stripped detainees charged as enemy combatants of their right of habeas corpus. Watch Dodd introduce the bill on the Senate floor today:

thinkprogress.org/2007/09...eintroduce-habeas-corpus- restoration-act/

I can't assume he means for all of us at this point. Do you have a reference?

Peppa  posted on  2008-04-08   14:26:07 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

We know it’s time to time to restore our Constitution and the rule of law. This is an issue that was at the heart of Senator Dodd’s candidacy, and I share his passion for restoring the balance between the security we demand and the civil liberties that we cherish.

The American people must be able to trust that their president values principle over politics, and justice over unchecked power. I’ve been proud to stand with Senator Dodd in his fight against retroactive immunity for the telecommunications industry. Secrecy and special interests must not trump accountability. We must show our citizens – and set an example to the world – that laws cannot be ignored when it is inconvenient. Because in America – no one is above the law.

It’s time to reject torture without equivocation. It’s time to close Guantanamo and to restore habeas corpus. It’s time to give our intelligence and law enforcement agencies the tools they need to track down and take out terrorists, while ensuring that their actions are subject to vigorous oversight that protects our freedom. So let me be perfectly clear: I have taught the Constitution, I understand the Constitution, and I will obey the Constitution when I am President of the United States.

From Obama's speech accepting Dodd's endorsement (late February).

Google "Obama" and "habeas corpus" and you will find repeated statements made by him, starting in the Senate debate in 2006 on the habeas corpus issue.

aristeides  posted on  2008-04-08   14:33:35 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

So let me be perfectly clear: I have taught the Constitution, I understand the Constitution, and I will obey the Constitution when I am President of the United States.

Coming from anyone besides Ron Paul and maybe Bob Barr, this is an ominous.....lie. Got to admit that.

Pinguinite  posted on  2008-04-08   14:40:54 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

No doubt he has a different view of what the Constitution means than you do.

But he sincerely believes in civil liberties. Otherwise he wouldn't repeatedly call for restoring habeas corpus in his stump speeches.

aristeides  posted on  2008-04-08   14:43:12 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

But he sincerely believes in civil liberties. Otherwise he wouldn't repeatedly call for restoring habeas corpus in his stump speeches.

I am astounded you know every tiny nuance by Obama, bordering on idolatry.

Yet you were never interested in Paul, the one man that made the rest look like the run of the mill politicians they are.

i·dol·a·try (-dl-tr) n. pl. i·dol·a·tries 1. Worship of idols. 2. Blind or excessive devotion to something.

Cynicom  posted on  2008-04-08   14:48:18 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

As I have said here repeatedly, the only presidential candidate I have contributed to this campaign season so far is Ron Paul. (And I made no effort to get my money refunded either, unlike some.)

I heard Obama make that statement about restoring habeas corpus in another stump speech he made, when he took his campaign from Iowa to New Hampshire. (That's the same speech that Jeffrey Rosen heard and commented on.) I happened to have C-SPAN Radio on at the time his speech came on.

And yes, I admit I was impressed by his statement. I think I even posted a thread here at the time. I know I posted one when he made the same statement when he accepted Dodd's endorsement a few weeks later.

Unlike some, I do not have a closed mind.

aristeides  posted on  2008-04-08   14:51:42 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

#189. To: aristeides (#181)

Unlike some, I do not have a closed mind.

Perhaps you are confusing people with "closed minds" with people that have had enough of politics and will no longer follow the ring in our noses.

This nation suffered thru eight long years with Clinton, another eight with Bush and you want us to accept the next Johnny come lately being foisted upon us by the system?

We arrived at this place in history by voting for lesser of two evils with both evils serving the same master, somehow believing Obama is his own man by people is a valid sign that the government propaganda does indeed work on non thinking people.

Cynicom  posted on  2008-04-08 14:58:16 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

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