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War, War, War
See other War, War, War Articles

Title: Clinton demands withdrawal from Iraq
Source: [None]
URL Source: http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/2008040 ... usvoteiraqclinton_080408170420
Published: Apr 9, 2008
Author: n
Post Date: 2008-04-09 01:39:56 by christine
Keywords: None
Views: 84
Comments: 5

WASHINGTON (AFP) - Democratic presidential hopeful Hillary Clinton Tuesday poured disdain on assurances by the top US general and diplomat in Iraq that US policy was working and demanded an orderly troop withdrawal.

"For the past five years, we have continually heard from the administration that things are getting better, that we are about to turn the corner," the New York senator told General David Petraeus and US ambassador to Baghdad Ryan Crocker.

"Each time, Iraqi leaders fail to deliver," she said, saying it was time to start an "orderly" US withdrawal from Iraq.

"It might well be irresponsible to continue the policy that has not produced the results that have been promised time and time again."

Clinton, who appeared more disdainful, yet less confrontational than she had been in a previous hearing involving Petraeus in September, instead dwelt on the huge costs to US troops and their family of staying in Iraq.

She said the situation in Iraq was "tenuous" and did not merit the upbeat descriptions of the US administration.

"What conditions would have to exist for you to recommend to the President that the current strategy is not working?" she asked.

"How are we to judge General Petraeus what the conditions are, or should be and the actions that you and the administration would recommend pursing, based on them?"

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#1. To: christine (#0)

Clinton is getting political religion.(Just for a brief spell however)

Cynicom  posted on  2008-04-09   2:01:42 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#2. To: Cynicom (#1)

Clinton .... a brief spell

Perfect terminology for this "witch"

I believe that banking institutions are more dangerous to our liberties than standing armies. If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their currency, first by inflation, then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around the banks will deprive the people of all property until their children wake-up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered. The issuing power should be taken from the banks and restored to the people, to whom it properly belongs.

Thomas Jefferson, Letter to the Secretary of the Treasury Albert Gallatin (1802)

noone222  posted on  2008-04-09   5:08:31 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#3. To: noone222 (#2)

She is trying to lure away some of the lemmings following that other Pied Piper, namely Obummer.

Cynicom  posted on  2008-04-09   8:10:57 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#4. To: christine (#0)

"Each time, Iraqi leaders fail to deliver," she said, saying it was time to start an "orderly" US withdrawal from Iraq.

It would have been nice for a direct quote of what she said there, rather than the paraphrase, because I'm curious whether her statement was that unequivocal or strong. I also don't like the complete placement of blame on Iraqi leaders, since their options are rather limited, and our actions undermine their authority and ability to do things.

Her last two statements are a little bit confusing, especially the last statement. My issue is that they seem to be subordinating grand strategic policy to the military leadership. Petraeus should be giving the civilian leadership the information they ask for so that they can make the decision. The civilian leadership, though, seems to be dependent upon him to determine their course of action, which is alarming. If the Bush Administration wants to stay there, his testimony is irrelevant, because he can tell them the consequences of their decisions, but the decisions should be theirs. If he has issue with it, he should resign. It just really bothers me that they seem to be depending upon what he says in public to determine the justification for their course of action.

Since I'm kind of straying off topic and rambling, I'm going to continue, since it's semi-relevant to his testimony. One of the most odious arguments I've seem that is used quite often is the "It's only been 4K dead soldiers, we lost a lot more in (choose your conflict)." I actually had a soldier I work with use that as an argument. He also said that we didn't publish casualty figures in WWII until 1945, which a 30 second search in the NYTimes archive shows was absolutely false. I searched from NOV 8, 1942 (the beginning of Operation Torch) through June 1945, and found they reported it about the same way we do now. In fact, the War Department began emphasizing the casualty figures to show the level of effort being undertaken so that the American people would be willing to forgo some consumer goods so that the military could have them. But anyway, true enough, we lost more than that in WWI, WWII, Korea and Vietnam. That implies that there's some threshold that makes actions right as long as the cost is low. My feeling is that, if invading Iraq was the right thing to do, then if it cost a million lives, it should still be right. Conversely, if invading Iraq was wrong, then it is still wrong, even if there was no cost in lives. And invading Iraq was wrong in any context, regardless of the cost of the invasion.

Rivers of blood were spilled out over land that, in normal times, not even the poorest Arab would have worried his head over." Field Marshal Erwin Rommel

historian1944  posted on  2008-04-09   8:24:57 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#5. To: historian1944 (#4)

If the Bush Administration wants to stay there, his testimony is irrelevant, because he can tell them the consequences of their decisions, but the decisions should be theirs. If he has issue with it, he should resign. It just really bothers me that they seem to be depending upon what he says in public to determine the justification for their course of action.

"If he has issue with it, he should resign.

Adm. Fallon was booted for this reason. However he has not resigned and indicated any statement will be forth coming. A great disappointment.

Cynicom  posted on  2008-04-09   8:31:47 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


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