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Title: Obama on small-town PA: Clinging to religion, guns, xenophobia
Source: [None]
URL Source: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/mayhi ... -surprise-that-ha_b_96188.html
Published: Apr 11, 2008
Author: Ben Smith
Post Date: 2008-04-11 19:39:50 by christine
Keywords: None
Views: 6046
Comments: 263

Obama on small-town PA: Clinging to religion, guns, xenophobia

Huffpo's Mayhill Fowler has more from Obama's remarks at a San Francisco fundraiser Sunday, and they include an attempt to explain the resentment in small-town Pennsylvania that won't be appreciated by some of the people whose votes Obama's seeking:

You go into these small towns in Pennsylvania and, like a lot of small towns in the Midwest, the jobs have been gone now for 25 years and nothing's replaced them. And they fell through the Clinton administration, and the Bush administration, and each successive administration has said that somehow these communities are gonna regenerate and they have not.

And it's not surprising then they get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy toward people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations. That's a pretty broad list of things to explain with job loss.

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Begin Trace Mode for Comment # 255.

#3. To: christine (#0) (Edited)

This is the furore du jour on Lou Dobbs' show and, I suspect on other shows.

Hillary says that it's not true. She only saw pumped up people, full of enthusiasm and ready to roll sleeves. The McCain says that it's unbelievable to say the truth about people being bitter. I mean... don't we all love it?

My view: he proves, again, that he is a thinking man, capable of facing reality. I believe that the essence of what he said is true. What's missing, and maybe this thing is all out of context, is how he things this is going to develop. Is there a happy end? I'm curious of what his views are on where we are going.

On the other hand, I don't know what these bitter people are going to do when they hear Hillary claiming that everyone is cheerful and full of enthusiasms.

Interestingly, on Lou Dobbs' poll...

Do you believe that Senator Barack Obama's comments reveal his elitist attitude toward every hardworking American?
Yes 46% 4158
No 54% 4786
Total Votes: 8944

Dobbsy usually gets 99.5% supporting what he wants to be supported. This time the majority is with the Obamer. Very interesting, while the punditry are screaming political Obamicide.

a vast rightwing conspirator  posted on  2008-04-11   19:51:42 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#108. To: a vast rightwing conspirator (#3)

I believe that the essence of what he said is true.

That they suupport gun rights, don't support illegal immigration or are anti- NAFTA becasue they're bitter they don't have jobs? WTF is wrong with you?

angle  posted on  2008-04-12   12:45:52 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#145. To: angle (#108)

That they suupport gun rights, don't support illegal immigration or are anti- NAFTA becasue they're bitter they don't have jobs? WTF is wrong with you?

Absolutely.

Most of the opposition to immigration and trade comes from those who are affected by it or whose lifestyles or survival is threatened by them. Did you think it was different.

As for people going to church more often when they are insecure - this is not news to you, or it shouldn't be.

And anyone feeling angry and discouraged and caring more about their little shooters under such circumstances... of course they do and of course they are.

You don't believe that it is so?

a vast rightwing conspirator  posted on  2008-04-12   15:38:58 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#160. To: a vast rightwing conspirator (#145) (Edited)

You don't believe that it is so?

Therefore, those who support the constitution are bitter about the constitution being violated? One does not necessarily follow from the other.

People go to church to worship God.

People who want weapons on hand are realists.

People who want the laws follwed in the country regarding immigration and are alarmed at how illegal immigrants destroy the economies through their stealing of the tax benefits intended for citizens are educated.

The disparaging remarks regarding these folks being motivated by bitterness and fear are part and parcel of the neocon propaganda to paint U.S. Nationals as fringe malcontents.

McWar, Rodham and Obama. Their choice, not ours.

angle  posted on  2008-04-12   17:25:37 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#183. To: angle (#160)

Therefore, those who support the constitution are bitter about the constitution being violated? One does not necessarily follow from the other.

People go to church to worship God.

People who want weapons on hand are realists.

People who want the laws follwed in the country regarding immigration and are alarmed at how illegal immigrants destroy the economies through their stealing of the tax benefits intended for citizens are educated.

These, of course, are your theories.

However, it is known that people are more likely to go to church during hard times. Hard times also makes people more likely to volunteer for a revolution or some armed rebellion. This is also known. If you have a steady, well-paying job and live in a safe neighborhood you may not notice the presence of illegals or, if you do, you might appreciate their willingness to provide you services for less that the natives would charge. You may also support your government 'open trade' initiatives because they bring in cheap goods.

As for the constitution, it's always open for interpretation and the worse off you are the less happy you are likely to be with the current constitutional views.

Think about it. It kind of makes sense.

a vast rightwing conspirator  posted on  2008-04-12   19:36:24 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#191. To: a vast rightwing conspirator (#183)

As for the constitution, it's always open for interpretation and the worse off you are the less happy you are likely to be with the current constitutional views.

You may call them constitutional views, but calling a load of shit a chocolate pie doesn't make it so. Same with trying to whitewash Obama's views.

angle  posted on  2008-04-12   22:13:27 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#194. To: angle (#191)

You may call them constitutional views, but calling a load of shit a chocolate pie doesn't make it so. Same with trying to whitewash Obama's views.

Why would I want to whitewash Obama's views? I am pleased that there is a politician who, sometimes, expresses his thoughts for others to hear.

Compare Obama's relatively unrehearsed words with Clinton's claiming that all those victims of outsourcing, free trade, and competition from legal guest worers and illegal immigrants are all enthusiastic and energized to roll their sleeves and then do... what? Other than voting for Hillary, of course.

It seems to me that the expectation for politicians talking is that it is always done at the 'total moron' level and, every time someone dares elevate the discussion to, let's say, 'idiot' level, the total morons feel it's their duty to scream 'APOLOLGIZE!!!'

a vast rightwing conspirator  posted on  2008-04-13   8:45:10 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#196. To: a vast rightwing conspirator, Peppa, Jethro Tull, robin (#194)

Why would I want to whitewash Obama's views? I am pleased that there is a politician who, sometimes, expresses his thoughts for others to hear.

I happen to be one of the "small town" people that Obama was referring to.

I and all my friends took offense to his words, now mind you we are the subject of his remarks.

Does that mean that you not being one of us are telling thousands of us "small towners" that we do not understand?

Does that not make you a tad "elitist", a tad "condescending"? Granted we may not be as educated and intelligent as you, but we do seem to be of one mind on this.

Cynicom  posted on  2008-04-13   9:05:34 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#198. To: Cynicom (#196)

His words weren't moronic, they were clear and straight forward. Unfortunately his elitist put down of small towners was offered to the San Francisco white wine and brae cheese crowd, thereby reinforcing nasty stereotypes. His comment damaged his Teflon coating and the Os aren't handling his gun grabbing honesty very well.

Jethro Tull  posted on  2008-04-13   9:18:40 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#204. To: Jethro Tull (#198)

He is unelectable for a number of reasons. (This doesn't mean his distaff opponent is. She is even more unelectable.)

But he speaks as if he were a political scientist analyzing the various strains of the ethos and electorate.

Once you begin to campaign for President in this country, you have to weigh ever utterance BEFORE it comes out of your mouth for how it will play in Peoria.

Ironically, even though conservatives decry "political correctness," in recent years, it is often they who jump on any faux pas, real or perceived.

Usually, as they are now so firmly allied with and beholden to Israel, it is to declare the speaker "anti-Semitic."

My former preachers down at the Baptist church like to see God directing and micromanaging everything.

Using their method of interpreting events, I would say God has decided to finish us off posthaste by placing Insane McPain in the White House.

Nuclear war, along with the total breakdown of civilization, at least in this country, will follow soon afterwards.

Sam Houston  posted on  2008-04-13   9:29:06 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#240. To: Sam Houston (#204)

Well put and I'd actually have respect for the man's words if he'd defend them. This BS about misspeaking has become nauseating. I've seen the video of his comments and they were well thought through, IMO.

Jethro Tull  posted on  2008-04-13   10:22:52 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#243. To: Jethro Tull (#240)

Well put and I'd actually have respect for the man's words if he'd defend them.

Did you read the article I linked to in #212? He does defend what he said. He says his words were a truth everybody knows. He just says he could have expressed himself better, and is sorry he offended some people.

aristeides  posted on  2008-04-13   10:25:57 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#248. To: aristeides (#243)

He says his words were a truth everybody knows.

You know, when a politician begins to talk about truths "everybody knows" he attains a new level of absurdity. *Everybody* knows that.....

Jethro Tull  posted on  2008-04-13   10:43:41 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#251. To: Jethro Tull (#248)

You know, when a politician begins to talk about truths "everybody knows" he attains a new level of absurdity. *Everybody* knows that.....

What exactly did he say that in your opinion is not true?

aristeides  posted on  2008-04-13   11:36:11 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#252. To: aristeides (#251)

What exactly did he say that in your opinion is not true?

Nothing. It's all true. We who live in small towns are a bitter lot, filled with antipathy toward "immigrants" (I love when these frauds fail to add *ILLEGAL*) and people who don't look like us. For solace, we cling to our guns as a baby would a pacifier. His words are true ari, and they're working so very well for him :)

Jethro Tull  posted on  2008-04-13   12:08:49 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#254. To: Jethro Tull (#252)

His words are true ari, and they're working so very well for him :)

..."Full-blown political disaster Political insiders differed on whether Obama's comments, which came to light Friday, would become a full-blown political disaster that could prompt party leaders to try to steer the nomination to Clinton even though Obama has more pledged delegates. Clinton supporters were eagerly hoping so.

They handed out "I'm not bitter" stickers in North Carolina, and held a conference call of Pennsylvania mayors to denounce the Illinois senator. In Indiana, Clinton did the work herself, telling plant workers in Indianapolis that Obama's comments were "elitist and out of touch."

At issue are comments he made privately at a fundraiser in San Francisco last Sunday. He was trying to explain his troubles winning over some working-class voters, saying they have become frustrated with economic conditions:

"It's not surprising, then, they get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti- trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations."

Video

Obama: 'Bitter' remarks ill chosen April 12: Barack Obama wishes he had chosen his words more carefully, but stands by his point that voters are angry and frustrated by Washington politics. MSNBC

Trying to defuse the issue The comments, posted Friday on The Huffington Post Web site, set off a blast of criticism from Clinton, Republican nominee-in-waiting John McCain and other GOP officials, and drew attention to a potential Obama weakness — the image some have that the Harvard-trained lawyer is arrogant and aloof.

His campaign scrambled to defuse possible damage.

There has been a small "political flare-up because I said something that everybody knows is true, which is that there are a whole bunch of folks in small towns in Pennsylvania, in towns right here in Indiana, in my hometown in Illinois, who are bitter," Obama said Saturday morning at a town hall-style meeting at Ball State University in Muncie, Ind. "They are angry. They feel like they have been left behind. They feel like nobody is paying attention to what they're going through.

"So I said, well you know, when you're bitter you turn to what you can count on. So people, they vote about guns, or they take comfort from their faith and their family and their community. And they get mad about illegal immigrants who are coming over to this country."

After acknowledging his previous remarks in California could have been better phrased, he added:

"The truth is that these traditions that are passed on from generation to generation, those are important. That's what sustains us. But what is absolutely true is that people don't feel like they are being listened to."

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/24082427


Didn't he speak of BITTERNESS in his race speech and isn't he using it to pander enough to create a false hope that he can bring reconciliation by just mouthing the words? He is not one of any of us. He promises more of the same, and having done so, has delivered the sheep to the same old shoots. The same old rotting corpses will be marking thier success by the applause of nutbar nation.

Generations of potential and promise have been swallowed by this evil.

We all should be bitter that the nation is too stupid to reject them all outright.

Peppa  posted on  2008-04-13   12:51:38 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#255. To: Peppa (#254)

"They are angry. They feel like they have been left behind. They feel like nobody is paying attention to what they're going through.

Obama, hey stupid...

We white trash hill billies that you so scorn never went to Hahvud or Yale, cause we wuz poor and white.

Geraldine Ferraro had it right, YOU would be po white trash if you were white.

Gov. Rendcell of Pa. had it right, voters will NOT elect a black man.

Clinton/Obama will win in a landslide.

I would love to see Obummer as candidate and Hillary as VP for McKooK, now there is a winner.

Cynicom  posted on  2008-04-13   13:07:11 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


Replies to Comment # 255.

#256. To: Cynicom (#255)

Obama, hey stupid...

We white trash hill billies that you so scorn never went to Hahvud or Yale, cause we wuz poor and white.

Geraldine Ferraro had it right, YOU would be po white trash if you were white.

Gov. Rendcell of Pa. had it right, voters will NOT elect a black man.

Clinton/Obama will win in a landslide.

I would love to see Obummer as candidate and Hillary as VP for McKooK, now there is a winner.

See now, if he'd been paying attention to his typical white gramma, he might've been able to finesse that speech jusssss right. He is unable to connect with middle class voters (white) because he rejects them at their core. And as for his connection with the black voter, he's black and a Democrat. If he's not the candidate, they'll go to Clinton. I'm not sure how the young will be swayed knowing he really wants them turned over to government service. And without jobs, or anyone promising such a nasty thing will be coming back for the citizen of this nation, well then kids... there's the Army. And that's all there's going to be.

Peppa  posted on  2008-04-13 13:17:35 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#258. To: Cynicom (#255)

.

Clinton/Obama will win in a landslide.

I'm not so sure about that anymore. Both of them could be a setup to get McNuts in there.

RickyJ  posted on  2008-04-13 13:58:09 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


End Trace Mode for Comment # 255.

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