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Title: Obama on small-town PA: Clinging to religion, guns, xenophobia
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URL Source: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/mayhi ... -surprise-that-ha_b_96188.html
Published: Apr 11, 2008
Author: Ben Smith
Post Date: 2008-04-11 19:39:50 by christine
Keywords: None
Views: 5491
Comments: 263
Obama on small-town PA: Clinging to religion, guns, xenophobia Huffpo's Mayhill Fowler has more from Obama's remarks at a San Francisco fundraiser Sunday, and they include an attempt to explain the resentment in small-town Pennsylvania that won't be appreciated by some of the people whose votes Obama's seeking: You go into these small towns in Pennsylvania and, like a lot of small towns in the Midwest, the jobs have been gone now for 25 years and nothing's replaced them. And they fell through the Clinton administration, and the Bush administration, and each successive administration has said that somehow these communities are gonna regenerate and they have not. And it's not surprising then they get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy toward people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations. That's a pretty broad list of things to explain with job loss.
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#224. To: Sam Houston (#221)
ClintonBush should always be written as one word. The two families are joined at the hip. To think there is any distance between them is akin to believing professional wrestling is legit. I disagree with your math there. If that were true, dems would not have taken congress to end the war. The donations to the RNC are far behind the D's. There was hope that the d's were better and were given a chance to lead, but joined with their other half to do us all in. That you can not see there is one party, disguised as two, is more than too bad, it's a deadly delusion. That you want to play the pub v dem game and think the people will win, then offer up something, ANYTHING that would show it. The argument for dems is that they hate pubs, and it goes no deeper. Obama is as bought and paid for as the others. He is the status quo and worse, he ushers in a new extreme door for more like him. If you happen to be a commie, than perhaps he's your guy.
I can actually mock myself, and I don't mind it if someone gets the best of me, as long as they're funny.
You can spot the moralist by his exaggerations - Unknown
My friend, you are turning completely irrational. Try to remember, this thread is not about your fantasies concerning... poor me. Perhaps you should stay on the topic on this thread an start another one concerning me if you so wish. I do not mind and I might even contribute.
Antiparty - find out why, think about 'how'
Intelligent people sometimes have a difficult time coming to the conclusion that there is only ONE party. Their lack of objectivity then becomes part of the problem, which is what the government wants. Clinton was better than Reagan, Bush was worse than Clinton, on and on. Sounds like third grade babble to me.
Just what Obama was talking about. Huh? Just about everyone I read expects to continue to be screwed by politics/government, save for the hopeful set who live in a delusionary state. Anyone who thinks one man can defund the MIC is about to experience big time bitter.
Vast... Stop changing horses in midstream, either you supported Paul or you did not. I do not recall one word of support let alone any money. Any "American" would be open to Paul, all you could do was run up and down the sidelines chanting, "Paul cant win", as if you had the only word from God himself. Now you are supporting someone of three that all want more war. Take up your cause by voting for any of the three and WE will have more war. Thanks a lot.
Partisan politics is alive and well, just what the government wants, people unable to think for themselves.
Do the folks in Hazleton have a right to be bitter w/Obama suggested that illegals receive free health care and in state tuition?
Clinton was better than Reagan, Bush was worse than Clinton, on and on. Sounds like third grade babble to me. I think some are indoctrinated from birth, and that programming can never be changed. Some get off on revenge voting. And no matter who wins, we all lose. We are all in one fast sinking boat. One side is bailing the water out, the other side bailing the water in, and the Captain sits on shore laughing at the drowning dingbats.
i would characterize that as facing reality based on experience. i don't want politicians to do a damn thing for me. i simply want them to uphold and govern by the oath they took to the consititution. "I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will faithfully execute the office of __________, and will to the best of my ability, preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States."
Alright. Let me say it again. I very much agree with Ron Paul's views. I clearly found his run for the GOP ticket stupid, self-defeating and, in fact, damaging to the cause of freedom because his GUARANTEED crushing defeat was going to legitimize the GOP and the 2-party system. I was right that he was going to lose big. And I was right that McCain, now that he defeated everyone else, including RP, is more legitimate that he would have been otherwise. I always suggested that RP ran as an independent and that he NEVER participated in the GOP primaries. He didn't and he did and we are all worse off for it. Mr. Barr may now do a Libertarian run. I hope that he does and I wish he started it several months ago. If he is in the run, it's likely that I will support him. As for the current Demo primary, I will vote for Obama because that's why I registered Demo 3 weeks ago.
Antiparty - find out why, think about 'how'
I see only Democratic partisans here. I have no idea what they see in that branch of the national party, but there is some wacky attraction.
You keep saying that, even though not a single poster on this forum, as far as I know, has ever indicated a willingness to vote for Hillary. I myself told you I would not vote for Hillary, when you directly asked me. I also asked you if you would admit you were wrong when Hillary does not get the presidential nomination.
To reason, indeed, he was not in the habit of attending. His mode of arguing, if it is to be so called, was one not uncommon among dull and stubborn persons, who are accustomed to be surrounded by their inferiors. He asserted a proposition; and, as often as wiser people ventured respectfully to show that it was erroneous, he asserted it again, in exactly the same words, and conceived that, by doing so, he at once disposed of all objections. - Macaulay, "History of England," Vol. 1, Chapter 6, on James II.
I am saying there is ONE FAMILY disguised as two, the Bush Crime Family with the Clintons along for the ride ever since Poppy recruited Bubba into the CIA in the late Sixties, disguising him as a hippie war protester on the trip the Company sent him on to the Soviet Union. I think you must have me confused with someone else. I have NO HOPE in politics whatsoever, partisan or not.
“I would give no thought of what the world might say of me, if I could only transmit to posterity the reputation of an honest man.” - Sam Houston
I won't dispute that. They may well be right, although I prefer to entertain some hopes. But you are admitting that Obama was telling the truth about such people, aren't you? Why are people getting so exercised over what he said?
To reason, indeed, he was not in the habit of attending. His mode of arguing, if it is to be so called, was one not uncommon among dull and stubborn persons, who are accustomed to be surrounded by their inferiors. He asserted a proposition; and, as often as wiser people ventured respectfully to show that it was erroneous, he asserted it again, in exactly the same words, and conceived that, by doing so, he at once disposed of all objections. - Macaulay, "History of England," Vol. 1, Chapter 6, on James II.
"I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will faithfully execute the office of __________, and will to the best of my ability, preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States." Excellent statement. While they're busy protecting and defending the constitution, we may be able to live our lives. But Bush's campaign in 2004 promised that Bush was going to protect every single American, individually, against the Mooslums who were about to take over their homesteads. And Bush got elected. I know, 'barely' elected but a sizable number of Americans, allegedly a majority of those who actually voted, voted for Bush.
Antiparty - find out why, think about 'how'
Well put and I'd actually have respect for the man's words if he'd defend them. This BS about misspeaking has become nauseating. I've seen the video of his comments and they were well thought through, IMO.
That attitude is just what Obama was talking about. You're saying that attitude is right. But you're also, in effect, admitting that Obama was telling the truth. So why are people getting so upset about what he said?
To reason, indeed, he was not in the habit of attending. His mode of arguing, if it is to be so called, was one not uncommon among dull and stubborn persons, who are accustomed to be surrounded by their inferiors. He asserted a proposition; and, as often as wiser people ventured respectfully to show that it was erroneous, he asserted it again, in exactly the same words, and conceived that, by doing so, he at once disposed of all objections. - Macaulay, "History of England," Vol. 1, Chapter 6, on James II.
Gee, go ask the rest of political America. We aren't alone in detecting liberal condescension.
Did you read the article I linked to in #212? He does defend what he said. He says his words were a truth everybody knows. He just says he could have expressed himself better, and is sorry he offended some people.
To reason, indeed, he was not in the habit of attending. His mode of arguing, if it is to be so called, was one not uncommon among dull and stubborn persons, who are accustomed to be surrounded by their inferiors. He asserted a proposition; and, as often as wiser people ventured respectfully to show that it was erroneous, he asserted it again, in exactly the same words, and conceived that, by doing so, he at once disposed of all objections. - Macaulay, "History of England," Vol. 1, Chapter 6, on James II.
I just had Chris Matthews's show on on my TV. I had it playing in the background, and didn't listen to every word, so I may have missed something, but I didn't hear any discussion at all of Obama's remarks.
To reason, indeed, he was not in the habit of attending. His mode of arguing, if it is to be so called, was one not uncommon among dull and stubborn persons, who are accustomed to be surrounded by their inferiors. He asserted a proposition; and, as often as wiser people ventured respectfully to show that it was erroneous, he asserted it again, in exactly the same words, and conceived that, by doing so, he at once disposed of all objections. - Macaulay, "History of England," Vol. 1, Chapter 6, on James II.
Gee, I wonder why???? Maybe he thinks like Ari...LOL
You're right, I did. Please accept my apology. I am saying there is ONE FAMILY disguised as two, the Bush Crime Family with the Clintons along for the ride ever since Poppy recruited Bubba into the CIA in the late Sixties, disguising him as a hippie war protester on the trip the Company sent him on to the Soviet Union. Yes, yet here we sit in a food fight about who is worse. I do not understand why perpetuating suicide politics is considered a game either 'side' wins. I have NO HOPE in politics whatsoever, partisan or not. I hope for a miracle, but I doubt one will come at our convenience.
Ah....so why did he trip over his feet to apologize.....twice? Not that it will save him. The Swift Boating is about to begin and frankly it couldn't happen to a more deserving politician. He ain't my brother, he's just another faker.
You know, when a politician begins to talk about truths "everybody knows" he attains a new level of absurdity. *Everybody* knows that.....
I need to get to another rally so I can faint in his glory. .....kerplunk......
Two wings of the same party. If we had different parties one would repeal the laws of the other. It never happens.
You can spot the moralist by his exaggerations - Unknown
What exactly did he say that in your opinion is not true?
To reason, indeed, he was not in the habit of attending. His mode of arguing, if it is to be so called, was one not uncommon among dull and stubborn persons, who are accustomed to be surrounded by their inferiors. He asserted a proposition; and, as often as wiser people ventured respectfully to show that it was erroneous, he asserted it again, in exactly the same words, and conceived that, by doing so, he at once disposed of all objections. - Macaulay, "History of England," Vol. 1, Chapter 6, on James II.
Nothing. It's all true. We who live in small towns are a bitter lot, filled with antipathy toward "immigrants" (I love when these frauds fail to add *ILLEGAL*) and people who don't look like us. For solace, we cling to our guns as a baby would a pacifier. His words are true ari, and they're working so very well for him :)
The boy is full of shit. People don't cling to religion, guns, anti-illegal immigration, and anti-free trade to explain their frustrations. He is a new world order guy and anyone who supports him supports the new world order too. I am sick of seeing his damn name on 4UM.
God is always good!
..."Full-blown political disaster Political insiders differed on whether Obama's comments, which came to light Friday, would become a full-blown political disaster that could prompt party leaders to try to steer the nomination to Clinton even though Obama has more pledged delegates. Clinton supporters were eagerly hoping so. They handed out "I'm not bitter" stickers in North Carolina, and held a conference call of Pennsylvania mayors to denounce the Illinois senator. In Indiana, Clinton did the work herself, telling plant workers in Indianapolis that Obama's comments were "elitist and out of touch." At issue are comments he made privately at a fundraiser in San Francisco last Sunday. He was trying to explain his troubles winning over some working-class voters, saying they have become frustrated with economic conditions: "It's not surprising, then, they get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti- trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations." Video Obama: 'Bitter' remarks ill chosen April 12: Barack Obama wishes he had chosen his words more carefully, but stands by his point that voters are angry and frustrated by Washington politics. MSNBC Trying to defuse the issue The comments, posted Friday on The Huffington Post Web site, set off a blast of criticism from Clinton, Republican nominee-in-waiting John McCain and other GOP officials, and drew attention to a potential Obama weakness — the image some have that the Harvard-trained lawyer is arrogant and aloof. His campaign scrambled to defuse possible damage. There has been a small "political flare-up because I said something that everybody knows is true, which is that there are a whole bunch of folks in small towns in Pennsylvania, in towns right here in Indiana, in my hometown in Illinois, who are bitter," Obama said Saturday morning at a town hall-style meeting at Ball State University in Muncie, Ind. "They are angry. They feel like they have been left behind. They feel like nobody is paying attention to what they're going through. "So I said, well you know, when you're bitter you turn to what you can count on. So people, they vote about guns, or they take comfort from their faith and their family and their community. And they get mad about illegal immigrants who are coming over to this country." After acknowledging his previous remarks in California could have been better phrased, he added: "The truth is that these traditions that are passed on from generation to generation, those are important. That's what sustains us. But what is absolutely true is that people don't feel like they are being listened to." http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/24082427 Didn't he speak of BITTERNESS in his race speech and isn't he using it to pander enough to create a false hope that he can bring reconciliation by just mouthing the words? He is not one of any of us. He promises more of the same, and having done so, has delivered the sheep to the same old shoots. The same old rotting corpses will be marking thier success by the applause of nutbar nation. Generations of potential and promise have been swallowed by this evil. We all should be bitter that the nation is too stupid to reject them all outright.
Obama, hey stupid... We white trash hill billies that you so scorn never went to Hahvud or Yale, cause we wuz poor and white. Geraldine Ferraro had it right, YOU would be po white trash if you were white. Gov. Rendcell of Pa. had it right, voters will NOT elect a black man. Clinton/Obama will win in a landslide. I would love to see Obummer as candidate and Hillary as VP for McKooK, now there is a winner.
We white trash hill billies that you so scorn never went to Hahvud or Yale, cause we wuz poor and white. Geraldine Ferraro had it right, YOU would be po white trash if you were white. Gov. Rendcell of Pa. had it right, voters will NOT elect a black man. Clinton/Obama will win in a landslide. I would love to see Obummer as candidate and Hillary as VP for McKooK, now there is a winner. See now, if he'd been paying attention to his typical white gramma, he might've been able to finesse that speech jusssss right. He is unable to connect with middle class voters (white) because he rejects them at their core. And as for his connection with the black voter, he's black and a Democrat. If he's not the candidate, they'll go to Clinton. I'm not sure how the young will be swayed knowing he really wants them turned over to government service. And without jobs, or anyone promising such a nasty thing will be coming back for the citizen of this nation, well then kids... there's the Army. And that's all there's going to be.
Hey there. Welcome to my new store. I'm the author of HOW TO HEAL THE HURT BY HATING and the forthcoming HOW TO STAY BITTER THROUGH THE HAPPIEST TIMES OF YOUR LIFE (both will be available online and in stores in June, 2006). In terms of merchandise, I've tried to give you people some good options, but if there's a certain phrase that you'd like to see on a different style of shirt, just let me know and I'll stay up real late making it exactly the way you want it. 'Cause that's how much I care. Here's my e-mail address: anita@anitaliberty.com. Here's my website: www.anitaliberty.com. Here's my phone number: Yeah, like I'd give you my phone number. Buy some product and then we'll see. http://www.cafepress.com/staybitter
Clinton/Obama will win in a landslide. I'm not so sure about that anymore. Both of them could be a setup to get McNuts in there.
God is always good!
They are sure doing their darndest to put him there. There are just some oddities that are striking. Bill Clinton, once revered for his political prowess, has time and again, said things that almost appear to be deliberate missteps that hurt Hillary's chances. With Obama, anyone with a shred of common sense would look at his words and comments and ask, could any other politician get away with that these days without being nailed to the wall? In both cases, it makes you go, hmmmmmmmmmm. wHAT is going on here? It's like a long running play that no longer worries about audience attendance, and just shoves any actor onto the stage. It matters not what the people buy or believe. It's just a show.
Yes, they subscribe to that philosophy...as well for the immediate right now, they are insulated from the effects of the war and economic policies so they can continue to "believe."
Shrewd assessment.
In recent years it's become popular to dismiss the labels "liberal" "leftist" etc. It was said such terms were used by the establishment to divide us. I bought into it for a time, but this latest selection process snapped me back to my senses. There is a political left and right, and the left never, ever seems to come over the the positions of the right. It's always the other way around. The Ds who live here are remain true to their wing of the party, regardless of how evil the nominee is. I now 'get it' as do some others.
Thanks angle.
There are even more on the other side who are still blaming the Clinton regime for everything bad that has happened under Bush.
#225. To: Cynicom (#215)
Too many of these people take themselves too seriously, they really believe what they say and that is scary. They are totally humorless and I look askance at such people.
#226. To: Cynicom (#222)
#227. To: Peppa (#224)
#228. To: aristeides (#217)
There are plenty of bitter people posting here who keep telling us that nothing can be expected from politics, that government can do nothing for them.
#229. To: a vast rightwing conspirator (#226)
Try to remember, this thread is not about your fantasies concerning... poor me.
#230. To: Jethro Tull (#228)
Huh? Just about everyone I read expects to continue to be screwed by politics/government, save for the hopeful set who live in a delusionary state.
#231. To: a vast rightwing conspirator (#218)
#232. To: Cynicom (#227)
Intelligent people sometimes have a difficult time coming to the conclusion that there is only ONE party. Their lack of objectivity then becomes part of the problem, which is what the government wants.
#233. To: aristeides (#217)
There are plenty of bitter people posting here who keep telling us that nothing can be expected from politics, that government can do nothing for them.
#234. To: Cynicom (#229)
(Edited)
#235. To: Cynicom (#230)
Partisan politics is alive and well
#236. To: Cynicom (#202)
(Edited)
"These same people are going to be orgasmic when Obama decides to ride in the back of the bus as VP and Queen Hillary is the driver." It will be a two for one deal that will send them into ecstasy.
#237. To: Peppa (#224)
That you can not see there is one party, disguised as two, is more than too bad, it's a deadly delusion.
#238. To: christine (#233)
i would characterize that as facing reality based on experience
#239. To: christine (#233)
i would characterize that as facing reality based on experience. i don't want politicians to do a damn thing for me. i simply want them to uphold and govern by the oath they took to the consititution.
#240. To: Sam Houston (#204)
#241. To: Jethro Tull (#228)
Huh? Just about everyone I read expects to continue to be screwed by politics/government, save for the hopeful set who live in a delusionary state. Anyone who thinks one man can defund the MIC is about to experience big time bitter.
#242. To: aristeides (#241)
So why are people getting so upset about what he said?
#243. To: Jethro Tull (#240)
Well put and I'd actually have respect for the man's words if he'd defend them.
#244. To: Jethro Tull (#242)
Gee, go ask the rest of political America.
#245. To: aristeides (#244)
I just had Chris Matthews's show on on my TV. I had it playing in the background, and didn't listen to every word, so I may have missed something, but I didn't hear any discussion at all of Obama's remarks
#246. To: Sam Houston (#237)
I think you must have me confused with someone else.
#247. To: aristeides (#244)
I just had Chris Matthews's show on on my TV. I had it playing in the background, and didn't listen to every word, so I may have missed something, but I didn't hear any discussion at all of Obama's remarks.
#248. To: aristeides (#243)
He says his words were a truth everybody knows.
#249. To: Jethro Tull (#247)
Not that it will save him. The Swift Boating is about to begin and frankly it couldn't happen to a more deserving politician. He ain't my brother, he's just another faker.
#250. To: Cynicom (#227)
only ONE party
#251. To: Jethro Tull (#248)
You know, when a politician begins to talk about truths "everybody knows" he attains a new level of absurdity. *Everybody* knows that.....
#252. To: aristeides (#251)
What exactly did he say that in your opinion is not true?
#253. To: aristeides (#243)
He says his words were a truth everybody knows.
#254. To: Jethro Tull (#252)
His words are true ari, and they're working so very well for him :)
#255. To: Peppa (#254)
"They are angry. They feel like they have been left behind. They feel like nobody is paying attention to what they're going through.
#256. To: Cynicom (#255)
Obama, hey stupid...
#257. To: All (#256)
#258. To: Cynicom (#255)
.
#259. To: RickyJ (#258)
(Edited)
I'm not so sure about that anymore. Both of them could be a setup to get McNuts in there.
#260. To: Jethro Tull (#198)
his elitist put down of small towners was offered to the San Francisco white wine and brae cheese crowd
#261. To: Peppa (#259)
It matters not what the people buy or believe. It's just a show.
#262. To: angle (#260)
Yes, they subscribe to that philosophy...
#263. To: angle (#261)
It matters not what the people buy or believe. It's just a show. Shrewd assessment.
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