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9/11
See other 9/11 Articles

Title: The Israeli Military Aircraft Company Tied To 9-11
Source: The Peoples Voice
URL Source: http://www.thepeoplesvoice.org/cgi- ... s/voices.php/2008/04/25/p25046
Published: Apr 25, 2008
Author: Whistleblower
Post Date: 2008-04-26 11:04:32 by Dakmar
Keywords: None
Views: 1257
Comments: 70

Facts Not Fairies

We must not abandon 9/11 until this 'crime of the century' is solved.

A little-known and privately-held aircraft leasing company created by the Israeli military intelligence is connected to the Mossad-run airport security and passenger screening company at the center of the "false flag" terror network of 9-11.

SOLVING 9-11

I am not like those who claimed to be 9-11 researchers, but who now say they have "moved beyond 9/11." How can anyone abandon the pursuit of the truth about 9-11 before the crime has been solved?

Six years after the terrorist attacks in which some 3,000 innocent people died, not one victim's lawsuit has yet gone to trial. As a nation, Americans can not allow 9-11 to go unsolved.

How can we forget the hundreds of people who were roasted alive in the burning twin towers? How can we ignore the death and destruction that we, as a result, have wrongfully inflicted on the innocent people of Iraq, Afghanistan, Lebanon, and Palestine?

Who can accept an unelected administration dragging our military from one illegal war to another in the utterly fraudulent "war on terror," which they have promised will last for generations?

If we, as Americans and citizens of the world, don't demand the truth of 9-11, who and what do we really stand for? Everything this administration has done for the past 6 years has been based on an unproven interpretation of the events of 9-11.

What does it mean to be a citizen of "the land of the free and the home of the brave" if we allow our minds and our nation to be so easily hijacked by a pack of lies construed by a foreign power that terrorizes our citizens and extorts our government officials?

During the past few months, I have redoubled my efforts to solve 9-11. As the cover-up becomes more obvious and the guilty parties reveal themselves, this is the time to pile on the pressure, not give up.

ZIONIST ZEITGEIST

I cannot abide mass murder, occupation, and genocidal wars of aggression. Nor can I accept the corruption of our values and destruction of our basic American rights to suit an artificially imposed "war on terror."

With the passage of time, it is now clear that 9-11 was carried out in order to kick-start the perverse Zionist Zeitgeist called the "war on terror" with its pre-planned wars of aggression and occupation.

In December 2001, veteran German intelligence professionals told me that 9-11 had been executed by a state-sponsored criminal network and had required years of planning.

Eckehardt Werthebach, the former president of Germany's domestic intelligence service, Verfassungsschutz, told me in 2001 that "the deathly precision" and "the magnitude of planning" of the 9-11 attacks would have required "years of planning."

Such a sophisticated operation, Werthebach said, would require the "fixed frame" of a state intelligence organization, something not found in a "loose group" like the one allegedly led by Mohammed Atta while he studied in Hamburg.

If Werthebach's analysis is correct, which I have every reason to believe it is, the official version is nothing but a pack of lies. This would mean that the members of the criminal network are still in the highest positions of power in the U.S., Israel, and other nations.

The members of this network are dedicated to preventing the evidence from being released because the evidence would expose the real perpetrators. This is the only logical reason why the 9-11 evidence has been confiscated, the investigation controlled, and the litigation and discovery processes obstructed.

At this point, it should be clear that 9-11 will never be solved by the federal government, the appointed investigators or law enforcement agencies, or the corrupt courts. These controlled agencies, like the Zionist-controlled media, are only interested in controlling the information and preventing the evidence from coming out.

This crime will only be solved by concerned and dedicated independent researchers.

THE ZIONIST STRATEGY

9-11 was a very sophisticated operation, as Werthebach said, which required the "fixed frame" of a state intelligence organization. It was carefully planned years in advance and carried out for one strategic purpose: to kick-start the Zionist-planned "war on terror."

The rabid Neo-Con Zionists who have dominated the Bush administrations pushed the "war on terror" with its criminal wars of aggression, occupation, and Balkanization in the Middle East as the strategic response to 9-11. The Zionist media moguls, who dominate the U.S. mass media, have in turn pushed the "war on terror" into the public mind as the suitable and proper response to 9-11.

An Israeli official named Oded Yinon revealed the Zionist strategy to Balkanize the entire Middle East into ethnic mini-states in the early 1980s. The plan for a global "war on terror" to accomplish this goal has been articulated since the mid-1980s ad nauseam by Benjamin Netanyahu, the former Israeli prime minister of the extreme right-wing Likud party. The Israeli military's plans to realize these strategic goals have obviously been in the works for at least three decades.

THE HOAX OF 9-11

9-11 is, in fact, a gigantic hoax on the world. Only by exposing the terrorist masterminds behind 9-11 will we reveal the criminals behind the fraudulent "war on terror" and epidemic of "false flag" terrorism that plagues the world.

False flag terrorism is a crime of terrorism designed by the architects to be blamed on their enemy. The media outlets, which the criminals control, facilitate the blame game by repeating the chorus from the script and stifling any independent investigation or analysis of the crime.

9-11, after all, remains an unsolved crime. It is, however, quite obvious who is responsible for blocking discovery and obstructing justice for the victims and their relatives. At every critical point where the events and circumstances of 9-11 should have been investigated and discussed, there has been a Zionist, a dedicated devotee of the State of Israel, occupying the key position and acting as the controller and censor of evidence the gatekeeper of information.

I have seen this pattern in earlier cover-ups. The same pattern was used with the sinking of Estonia in the Baltic Sea (1994) and the U.S. government's (NTSB) investigation of the downing of TWA Flight 800, two of the most egregious examples of government cover-ups in modern times.

In each case, the three critical phases of the cover-up: investigation and access to evidence, media interpretation of the event, and related litigation, were all tightly controlled to prevent any meaningful discovery of what had really caused the disaster.

The people who are preventing the discovery of the facts in such cases are actually complicit in covering-up crimes of mass murder.

Logically, there can be no reason for dedicated Zionists to obstruct the investigation of 9-11 other than to conceal the evidence of Israeli and Zionist involvement in the crimes.

The FBI, for example, under the command of the Israeli dual-national Michael Chertoff, is responsible for the confiscation of the crucial evidence from 9-11, evidence which has been withheld for than 6 years. This evidence includes video tapes of the Pentagon attack and physical pieces from the different aircraft involved.

This evidence is critical to prove what happened and which aircraft were involved in the attacks but the FBI has refused to release this evidence. Neither President George W. Bush nor the U.S. Congress has demanded that they do so.

The appointed federal judges Alvin K. Hellerstein and Michael B. Mukasey, and the former assistant attorney general Michael Chertoff, who now heads Homeland Security, have not worked for 6 years to hide the critical evidence and block discovery in order to protect fanatical Arab Muslims or conspiratorial Jesuits. The efforts of these dedicated Zionists have been exerted to protect Israel, the foreign state to which they are whole-heartedly devoted.

The 9-11 cover-up is now full-blown and their role in it obvious. The players who are involved in obstructing justice are known. At this point, patriotic Americans must not abandon the pursuit of the truth. For those who died on 9-11 and in its aftermath, for our nation and our posterity, we are obliged to find those who are responsible for the crimes and cover-up of 9-11.

THE EVIDENCE OF ISRAELI INVOLVEMENT

I have pursued the leads of Israeli involvement simply because the evidence indicates that the Israeli military and intelligence had prior knowledge of 9-11, which indicates involvement.

The five jubilant Israeli Mossad agents who were caught celebrating and filming themselves in front of the destruction of the World Trade Center and their subsequent public statements indicate that the Mossad had prior knowledge.

The text message warnings of the attacks sent over the Mossad-controlled Odigo instant messaging system several hours prior to the attacks are further evidence of Israeli prior knowledge.

Furthermore, the Israelis have a long history of committing "false flag" terror attacks, particularly against American targets. The Israeli attack on the USS Liberty in 1967 and the Israeli terrorist bombings of U.S. and British civilian targets in Egypt during the 1954 Lavon Affair are the first that come to mind.

If the evidence indicated that Saudis, Pakistanis, or even Jesuits were behind the attacks, I would investigate them. The evidence, however, points to Israelis being involved so I look there.

There has been no independent investigation of 9-11 done by the controlled media other than Carl Cameron's now deeply buried four-part series on FOX News in December 2001. Think about this for a minute. The mass media in the land of the "free press" has not done any independent investigation about the crime of the century.

The evidence of Israeli involvement in 9-11 is too obvious so senior editors in the controlled media don't let their journalists even approach the subject. The journalists of the "free press" in the United States are, unfortunately, confined to the same "Auschwitz of the Mind" as the American public they write for. They know very well that to touch the subject of Israeli involvement in 9-11 would be like touching a live wire.

Likewise, when it comes to tracking the Israeli criminal network that has operated in the United States for decades, the U.S. media is simply a dog that won't bark - or hunt.

The extent of Zionist control over the U.S. mass media, including the Internet, is astounding. The mass media has effectively prevented most Americans from understanding who is really behind the false flag terror attacks of 9-11, and, by extension, the illegal and genocidal wars in Afghanistan, Palestine, Lebanon, and Iraq.

The controlled media has left Americans with an extremely distorted view of the Middle East, Zionism, and the history of the Zionist state, Israel.

ISRAEL - A TERRORIST STATE

Israel is a nation which was founded by terrorists, ruthless men with histories of committing genocidal crimes and false flag terror attacks. Israel was created in 1948 in Palestine on land that had been "ethnically cleansed" of its indigenous Christian and Muslim inhabitants.

Ariel Sharon, the former prime minister who is reportedly being kept in a controlled coma, is also a prime example of an Israeli terrorist. Sharon came to power in early 2001, about the same time as Bush, some eight months before 9-11.

Sharon is a well-known terrorist and genocidaire who has been personally involved in numerous terrorist atrocities, such as the 1982 massacre in Sabra and Shatila refugee camps, in which thousands of innocent people were massacred. Sharon is a Zionist extremist who believes that every Jew should live in Israeli occupied-Palestine.

Realistically, what else besides terrorism and bloodshed should one expect from such fanatical and genocidal terrorists?

The sons and daughters of the original Zionist terrorists now occupy the highest positions of power in the Israeli government. Tzipora Malka "Tzipi" Livni, for example, the current Foreign Minister and Acting Prime Minister of Israel, is the daughter of the former terror chief of the Irgun.

Born in Tel Aviv in July 1958, "Tzipi" is the daughter of Eitan Livni (a.k.a. Yerucham Bzozowitch from Grodno) a Polish-born Irgun terrorist associated with the King David Hotel bombing.

Steven Erlanger, writing about Livni in a New York Times article entitled "Israel's Top Envoy," dated February 5, 2006, said:

Tzipi Livni, 47, is the first woman to serve as Israel's foreign minister since Golda Meir. Some think she may be the first since Ms. Meir to be prime minister.

She is also a deeply Israeli figure, the daughter of Zionist guerrillas - terrorists in some eyes - who met in the Irgun, the underground organization that fought the British and the Arabs, and that blew up the British headquarters in the King David Hotel in 1946, killing 91 people.

Her father, Eitan, was the Irgun's head of operations, and on his gravestone is the map of Greater Israel, extending over both sides of the Jordan River.

Erlanger suggests that blowing up a hotel full of people in Jerusalem and killing 91 is only a terrorist act "in some eyes."

The unprovoked Israeli attack on the USS Liberty in 1967, which killed 34 U.S. servicemen and wounded many more, is another example of Israeli false flag terrorism. Dedicated Zionists will either deny or defend these acts of Israeli false flag terrorism as the "pragmatic" thing to do and attack those who disagree as anti-Semitic.

FALSE FLAG TERROR - AN ISRAELI SPECIALTY

False flag terror acts are an Israeli specialty, as Dr. Kaasem Khaleel points out in his book Wrongly Blamed (2007).

"Public terror was invented by the Israelis," Khaleel wrote citing Christopher Sykes' book Crossroads to Israel:

To achieve their political goals, Zionists are dependent on terror. These terror acts are used as a distraction. Even though the Israelis are the sources, they effectively blame others. The fabricated terror they commit is an assault on people's intelligence. Thus people are being purposely misled regarding the real source of these crimes.

The Zionist-controlled media has "purposely misled" the public about 9-11 for the same reason as the Zionist judges, investigators, and commissioners: to protect the evidence of Israeli involvement from being exposed.

The controlled U.S. media works with the Zionist criminal network and allows it to flourish by failing to investigate, identify, or report on the companies and individuals involved.

THE PLANES OF 9-11

9-11 was an act of false flag terror in which four allegedly "hijacked" airplanes were used as weapons of mass destruction. There are, however, many unanswered questions about the airplanes involved.

There are many observations about these planes which suggest they were not the civilian airliners they are said to have been. The plane that struck the South Tower, for example, had shapes, bulges, and holes which have led many analysts to believe it was a Boeing 767-300 refueling tanker that had been disguised as a 767-200 United Airlines passenger jet.

Durable parts from the two jets that struck the twin towers, such as landing gear and engines, landed on the streets of Manhattan. On these engines and landing gear are many numbered time-tracked parts which could prove precisely which aircraft they had been put on and when they had been serviced, but the FBI has refused to present this evidence to make its case. Why wouldn't the FBI present this evidence if it had it?

The only possible explanation for the FBI's failure to present this evidence is that the evidence does not match the planes they say hit the buildings or "crashed" in Pennsylvania.

If the planes that were involved in the attacks on the World Trade Center were, in fact, not United Airlines Flight 175 and American Airlines Flight 11, but remotely-controlled tankers painted to look like civilian aircraft, who could have produced such disguised planes and inserted them into the NORAD anti-terrorism exercise that was taking place in the airspace of the East Coast on the morning of 9-11?

ISRAEL AIRCRAFT INDUSTRIES (IAI)

Given the evidence of Israeli prior knowledge, the obvious questions are: "Did the Israelis have the means to carry off such a complex operation? And if they had the means, is there a link between their capability and the events of 9-11?"

The answer to both questions is yes.

The Israeli military and intelligence agency have long had the capability to convert and disguise large-body aircraft in the United States and their companies that do this kind of work are connected to ICTS, the Israeli airport security company that is a prime suspect in the "false flag" terrorism. ICTS is also a key defendant in the 9-11 litigation.

The Israeli military has spawned several aircraft leasing and maintenance companies in the United States since the late 1960s. There is, in fact, a network of Israeli-controlled aviation companies operating in the United States which were all started by Israel Aircraft Industries (IAI), now known as Israel Aerospace Industries.

Israel Aircraft Industries is a wholly owned subsidiary of the Israeli Defense Ministry, which produces and maintains planes and missiles.

One of the Israeli military's aviation companies spawned in the United States is, or was an aircraft leasing company named ATASCO, which began operating in the United States in the early 1970s.

I began investigating ATASCO in August 2006. As a matter of fact, I spoke with Shalom Yoran, the Israeli chairman of this now defunct Israeli company, about six hours before three undercover police arrived at my house and, without cause or provocation, TASERed me and broke my elbow in front of my family on August 15, 2006.

I had come across Shalom Yoran's name while researching Amit and Naftali Yoran, the suspicious young Israelis who oversaw cyber-security for the U.S. government and military computers prior to and after 9-11.

Shalom Yoran has an extremely suspicious and unusual profile for an Israeli immigrant to the United States. He was in the original Israeli air force of 1948 and is a founder and former head of Israel Aircraft Industries. Yoran was instrumental in building the IAI into an internationally recognized company and the largest industry in Israel.

Before Yoran emigrated to the U.S., which is very unusual for Israelis of his age and with his high-level military background, he had spent the previous ten years as senior vice president of IAI and as president of IAI's parent company, Bedek. Israelis like Yoran don't come to America as immigrants they are sent there on a mission.

Israel Aircraft Industries was established in 1953 as Bedek Aviation Company, five years after the establishment of the State of Israel. Today, Bedek is the senior group of Israel Aerospace Industries, and specializes in aircraft operation, conversion, maintenance, and overhaul.

In 1975, when Yoran "left" Bedek and IAI at the unusually young retirement age of 50, the corporation had 22,000 employees, of which 4,000 worked in the Bedek Division. In reality, Yoran didn't leave Bedek and IAI at all; he was sent by the Israeli military to the United States to manage one of their most important operations ATASCO.

In his on-line biographies, Yoran says he was appointed to this position: "When he retired at the age of 50 [ca. 1975], he was appointed the President of Atasco, an American Flight company for cargo shipment and maintenance."

His 2003 biography on the website of Tel Aviv University (TAU) has a similar tale: "At the age of 50, Shalom Yoran retired from the Israel Aircraft Industries. In 1978 he moved to the U.S. where he became chairman of ATASCO USA - a private aircraft trading and service company. ATASCO bought and leased airplanes to major airlines around the world. The company also had an aircraft maintenance and modification plant in Smyrna, TN."

"Shalom Yoran continues to be chairman of ATASCO USA," the 2003 TAU entry noted.

How could an Israeli be appointed to be president or chairman of an "American" company, unless the company were actually an Israeli company?

THE ATASCO-BEDEK CONNECTION

ATASCO USA was, of course, created and owned by the Israeli military and connected to the Mossad, but this information is not easily found.

There has only been one article that I have found that mentions what ATASCO has been doing for the past 36 years in the United States, since it was first created by the Israeli Defense Ministry in 1971.

That article, entitled "Ugandan Plane Deal Believed Key to Israeli Spy Operation," was published in the Washington Post of September 11, 1978.

This investigative article, which involved an international team of journalists that included an Israeli, focused on a "mysterious Israeli tycoon and the Mossad, Israeli's intelligence service" and how they had provided the Ugandan dictator Idi Amin with two Boeing 707 jetliners as part of an Israeli effort to spy on Libya.

The "big winner" and tycoon in this Mossad spying operation was Shaul Nehemia Eisenberg (1921-1997), "the reclusive Israeli entrepreneur at its center."

Eisenberg was, as the Washington Post reported in 1978, the central figure in the Mossad spying operation on Libya:

The chief Eisenberg firm in these deals was Aircraft Trading and Services Inc., or Atasco. Headquartered in Asia House, Eisenberg's luxury building in Tel Aviv, Atasco also has branches in the "Eisenberg Building" in New York and in London.

Atasco was put together in 1971 by executives of Israeli Aircraft Industries, a wholly owned subsidiary of the Israeli Defense Ministry that makes planes and missiles.

Eisenberg got into Atasco as an equal partner with Israeli Aircraft for $500,000 in cash. After the 1973 Middle East War, Israeli Aircraft, staggered by scandals, sold its share in Atasco to Eisenberg, leaving him its sole owner.

The rest of Atasco's original capital, $5 million, came from the U.S. Export-Import Bank, which is supposed to make loans to promote American exports.

The Ex-Im Bank certainly found the right man in Eisenberg. He quickly turned into an eager customer for Pan American Airways' used Boeing 707s.

Atasco bought 12 or 15 of the advance series "C" 707s that Pan Am was selling and purchased six out of ten earlier series "C" 707s being sold by the airline.

At its Israeli hangars, currently jammed with 707s bearing obscure markings, Atasco remodels the interiors to suit customers and paints on their proud colors - Iran Air, Tarom of Romania, Uganda Airlines.

In May 1976, Atasco sold the 707 that was once Pan Am's "Clipper Jupiter" to a firm in Zurich, which dealt it on the Amin.

Intelligence sources say that the head of this Zurich firm is a 15-year veteran of Mossad, the Israeli intelligence agency, and the firm is an agency "laundry." It exists, these sources say, to pass on Mossad funds for deals in which the Israeli secret service is interested.

The Washington Post, one of the most important newspapers in the United States, is a leading national newspaper of record. Oddly, however, the extremely important information contained in this article about ATASCO was never repeated in any of the subsequent articles in which this mysterious company was mentioned. For example, when Gerald L. Gitner, a key aviation executive with Pan Am, TWA, and a host of smaller airlines, was appointed Chief Executive Officer (CEO) of ATASCO USA, Inc.

In 1986, when Gitner became CEO of the Israeli-owned company with a documented history of murky business it was simply described as a New York aircraft leasing and brokerage company. ATASCO's previously published history of involvement in Mossad operations was never mentioned.

Gitner, who was CEO of Mossad's "privately held" aircraft leasing and maintenance company until 1990, was involved in the dismemberment and selling off of the assets of the once prosperous airlines Pan Am and TWA.

In October 1986, when Gitner was appointed CEO of the Mossad-run ATASCO U.S.A. Inc., he was or had been a senior executive with PanAm Corp. and TWA. He was the president of Texas Air Corp., the holding company for Continental Airlines and New York Air, when he was appointed president and CEO of ATASCO U.S.A., "a private aviation concern involved in commercial aircraft leasing and heavy aircraft maintenance."

Gitner was also co-founder and president of People Express Airlines. The Houston Chronicle of October 3, 1986, however, only identified ATASCO as "an aircraft leasing and brokerage company."

EISENBERG "WORLD ENTREPRENEUR"

In November 1982, when Eisenberg became involved in the Tregaron deal and tried to take over a large piece of prime real estate in Washington, D.C., the Washington Post wrote about Mossad's "world entrepreneur" and Israel's point man in China and Panama:

Eisenberg was profiled in a 1981 Business Week article as a businessman of enormous wealth, diversity of business interests, and a proclivity for secretiveness in his dealings. He owns a worldwide network of corporations. His largest company, United Development Inc., was set up in Panama in 1960.

Eisenberg essentially acts as a middleman, according to reports on his dealings, assembling consortiums of manufacturers, builders and banks to construct industrial facilities of all types.

Since Eisenberg was the "sole owner" of ATASCO since 1973, the Mossad's "aircraft trading and services" company naturally began its murky business on the American continent in Panama.

In 1978 the Washington Post reported that there were "frequent but unsubstantiated reports that Eisenberg operates mostly from Central America." Eisenberg was the "Panamanian honorary general consul in Tel Aviv," the Post reported.

The first mention of ATASCO other than the 1978 article in the Washington Post was in the New York Times on October 29, 1981, when it reported that Emery Air Freight had purchased a Boeing 727-100 from Atasco-Panama.

IDF - ISRAELI DRUG FORCES?

Israel Aircraft Industries also has a branch in Bogota, Colombia, IAI Sucursal Colombia, a nation known more for the production and distribution of cocaine than aircraft. Why would IAI establish aircraft leasing and maintenance facilities in Colombia and Panama?

Is airlifting drugs a central part of the IAI operations in Latin America? Does the Mossad use IAI facilities in Colombia to run its own drug smuggling routes to fund its operations? Does Mossad drug smuggling involve American politicians and intelligence agencies which it then controls?

There are a number of indications that the Mossad is deeply involved in the Colombian drug trade. The horde of Mossad operatives who were disguised as Israeli art students in the years prior to 9-11 were known to have been targeting the offices and personnel of the U.S. Drug Enforcement Agency (DEA). Why would the Mossad be seeking to penetrate the DEA if it were not involved in drug smuggling?

It is also well known that Israeli gangs are heavily involved in illicit drug smuggling. A disproportionately large number of Israelis have been arrested in Europe and the United States with large amounts of narcotics and synthetic drugs such as Ecstasy. Are these the small fry of a much large Israeli presence in the illegal drug trade?

The rumors about the Bush and Clinton families being involved in large scale drug smuggling operations are legion. From George H.W. Bush's days in the Texas oil business and as head of the CIA to his position as a director of the Prozac giant Eli Lilly and Co., the drug trade is a central part of the Bush family legend.

The allegations about Gov. Bill Clinton's involvement in the drug smuggling operation in Mena, Arkansas are also legion. Aircraft were used to smuggle drugs and weapons through the airport in Mena in the 1980s while Gov. Clinton protected the entire operation.
"Given the scope and implications of the Mena story, it may be easy to understand the media's initial skepticism and reluctance," Sally Denton and Roger Morris wrote in their July 1995 article "The Crimes of Mena":

Mena, from 1981 to 1985, was indeed one of the centers for international smuggling traffic. According to official I.R.S. and D.E.A. calculations, sworn court testimony, and other corroborative records, the traffic amounted to thousands of kilos of cocaine and heroin and literally hundreds of millions of dollars in drug profits. According to a 1986 letter from the Louisiana attorney general to then U.S. attorney general Edwin Meese, [Adler Berriman Seal, or "Barry"] Seal "smuggled between $3 billion and $5 billion of drugs into the U.S."

Seal had been a pilot with TWA from 1966 to 1974, according his on-line biography. Gitner, who began his career at TWA in 1968 was a vice president when he also left TWA in 1974 to join the much smaller Texas International Airlines.

The numerous reports and allegations of involvement in drug smuggling are what the Bush and Clinton families have in common. These are the families which have dominated the executive branch of the United States government since 1981. There has been either a Bush or Clinton in the White House for the past 26 years, since January 1981.

Is the illegal drug business something the Bush's and Clinton's have had a hand in with Israel's Mossad?

If the reports, allegations, and rumors are true, the illegal drug trade is where the interests of the Bush family, the Clintons, the CIA and the Mossad all come together. This would explain the choice to invade and occupy Afghanistan, where opium production is now at record levels after having been nearly eradicated under the Taliban regime.

This would explain the unusual pressure to medicate the 9-11 relatives.
It appears that drug smuggling could very well be the illegal enterprise at the center of the criminal network behind 9-11. This is a subject that certainly deserves further investigation.

"CLIPPER JUPITER" AND ZIMEX AVIATION

In the 1978 article about Eisenberg and the Mossad the Washington Post reported that ATASCO had sold the Boeing 707, which had been Pan Am's "Clipper Jupiter," to a firm in Zurich, which had immediately transferred ownership to Idi Amin in Uganda:

Intelligence sources say that the head of this Zurich firm is a 15-year veteran of Mossad, the Israeli intelligence agency, and the firm is an agency 'laundry.' It exists, these sources say, to pass on Mossad funds for deals in which the Israeli secret service is interested.

Pan Am's "Clipper Jupiter," with tail registration number N766PA, was sold to a Zurich-based company called Zimex Aviation on May 12, 1976. The same day, Zimex Aviation transferred the plane with a new tail number, 5X-UAL, to Uganda Airlines.

The "15-year veteran of Mossad" would be Hans Ziegler, who headed Zimex as reported in The Oregonian on August 22, 1988:

Charles Hanner, then a Page [Airways] vice president, testified by deposition that he had been introduced to Amin by Hans Ziegler, a veteran agent of Mossad, the Israeli military intelligence service. Ziegler's Swiss company, Zimex Aviation, had sold a number of aircraft to Middle Eastern potentates and to Amin's friend Moammar Khadafy, the Libyan dictator.

ATASCO TIES TO 9-11

Gitner reportedly stayed with ATASCO from October 1986 through December 1989. In 1989, Gitner was appointed to head Presidential Airways of Herndon, Virginia.

Gitner later served on the board of directors of another Mossad-run company, ICTS, which is one of the key defendants in the 9-11 litigation. Along with a handful of senior Israeli Mossad veterans, Gitner was a director of ICTS from at least 1997 through 2005. Most significantly, he was a director of the Israeli parent company which was responsible for airline security and passenger screening at Boston's Logan Airport on 9-11.

International Consultants on Targeted Security (ICTS) International, N.V. is the Mossad-run company that owns Huntleigh USA, the airline security company that oversaw the passenger screening operation at Boston and Newark airports on September 11, 2001.

How would Gitner be a director or CEO of a Mossad-run company like ATASCO or ICTS if he were not working for the Mossad? Has Gerald Gitner from Boston been working with the Israelis since he began at TWA in the late 1960s? Is this the reason he left TWA and began working for Texas International?

BOEING 767 CONVERSIONS - BEDEK'S SPECIALTY

IAI is "a world leader in aircraft conversion and modernization programs, unmanned air vehicles (UAVs), communication programs and defense electronics," according to the company's website.

Shalom Yoran's company, Bedek Aviation Group, reportedly converted its first Boeing 767 from a passenger to cargo jet in early 2000.

The converted passenger jet was the first of 11 767s to be converted for Airborne-Express, according to the Jerusalem Post of April 4, 2000.

"Bedek is one of the world's leaders in plane conversions," the Israeli newspaper reported.

In early 2001, Bedek delivered a refurbished Boeing 707 refueling tanker for the Israeli air force, according to the Jerusalem Post of February 22, 2001.

"The number of [Israeli] refueling tankers is classified," the Post reported. "The first 707 air refueling tanker converted for the Air Force was delivered 20 years ago."

This Israeli report indicates that Bedek has been converting Boeing aircraft into tankers since the early 1980s.

"The main benefit of this present aircraft is in its versatility, its quick conversion from a refueling tanker to a cargo jet. In this way, the aircraft can be used as a cargo plane in times of peace and a refueling tanker in an emergency," an IAI statement said.

IAI IN MIAMI COMMODORE AVIATION

"Boeing has been working with Israel Aircraft Industries Ltd. for 30 years," the Seattle Post-Intelligencer reported in October 1998.

Miami International Airport has long been the site of one of Bedek's maintenance stations, along with Paris, Moscow, Baku and Bajkal, according to the Jerusalem Post of January 13, 1995.

The Bedek operation in Miami was known as Commodore Aviation. IAI and Bedek had "offices in Arlington, Va.; New York City; Princeton, N.J., for its Galaxy Aerospace subsidiary; and in Miami for its Commodore Aviation unit," according to the Seattle Post-Intelligencer article from 1998.

Florida Gov. Jeb Bush made a four-day trade mission to Israel in November 1999 during which he appealed to the state-owned Israel Aircraft Industries to expand their business operations in Florida.

IAI's Miami-based Commodore Aviation was already the largest Israeli business presence in Florida in 1999 with about 500 employees, The Stuart News (Florida) reported.

In 2003, Commodore Aviation, "part of IAI's Bedek Aviation Group," pulled out of Miami, reportedly owing nearly a million dollars to the Miami airport and moved to Rome, New York, where it renamed its operation the "Empire Air Center."

"Commodore has been searching for a new location since June 2002 and owes $800,000 in back rent to Miami International Airport, where it's currently based," South Florida CEO reported in May 2003 when it announced Commodore Aviation's move to New York and name change.

Like ATASCO, Commodore has been funded by the U.S. taxpayer. Commodore Aviation made money by its move to the former Griffis Air Force Base, where it operates in a massive hangar in which B-52 bombers and tankers were once serviced.

The move profited Commodore, which received some $25 million in grants and tax incentives from federal and New York sources, the Jerusalem Post reported on November 21, 2003.

"The whole relocation didn't cost IAI one dollar," said Gerry Stoch, New York state's economic attache in Israel.

http://www.bollyn.info/home/articles/911/solving911ch3/

http://www.bollyn.info/home/audio/podcast/podcast200803/

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#31. To: robin (#29) (Edited)

there is still Watson, and Watson is not Bollyn

Watson does not give a source. I already noted that. You're just messing up the thread with empty-headedness.

nobody  posted on  2008-04-26   12:36:10 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#32. To: Dakmar (#28)

Swiss my ass!

lol!

'Individuals should not take responsibility for their own defense. That’s what the police are for. ... If I oppose individuals defending themselves, I have to support police defending them. I have to support a police state.”' Alan Dershowitz

robin  posted on  2008-04-26   12:36:51 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#33. To: nobody (#31)

just trying to clear up yours, but I've now given up any hope of doing so

'Individuals should not take responsibility for their own defense. That’s what the police are for. ... If I oppose individuals defending themselves, I have to support police defending them. I have to support a police state.”' Alan Dershowitz

robin  posted on  2008-04-26   12:37:42 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#34. To: robin (#29) (Edited)

I gave you the link that is the footnote in wiki for the source of the quote of the mother and it does not appear to be Bollyn.

It "does not appear"? You're not sure??? So back it up with a transcript of the podcast cited by the wiki footnote you introduced to the thread, then.

nobody  posted on  2008-04-26   12:38:42 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#35. To: nobody (#34)

What an ass! Go listen to it or find it yourself. I'm not your home online tutor.

I have no vested interest in what you choose to believe or disbelieve.

'Individuals should not take responsibility for their own defense. That’s what the police are for. ... If I oppose individuals defending themselves, I have to support police defending them. I have to support a police state.”' Alan Dershowitz

robin  posted on  2008-04-26   12:40:33 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#36. To: robin (#33)

just trying ...

Just trying my patience is more like it.

nobody  posted on  2008-04-26   12:41:05 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#37. To: robin (#35) (Edited)

Go listen to it

Already did, Airhead-Apparent. Why force everyone else to stream the file too, just to see if you have a point? Be nice, make a transcript.

nobody  posted on  2008-04-26   12:42:24 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#38. To: nobody, robin (#37)

Well, my work here is done. Sholom!

And they write innumerable books; being too vain and distracted for silence: seeking every one after his own elevation, and dodging his emptiness. - T. S. Eliot

Dakmar  posted on  2008-04-26   12:48:37 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#39. To: robin (#35) (Edited)

I'm not your home online tutor.

No, you're my aspiring link-clicking director.

nobody  posted on  2008-04-26   12:48:42 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#40. To: Dakmar (#38)

Sholom!

Funny boy.

nobody  posted on  2008-04-26   12:49:59 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#41. To: Dakmar, *US is Proxy State For Israel*, *Israeli Espionage* (#0) (Edited)

There are a number of indications that the Mossad is deeply involved in the Colombian drug trade. The horde of Mossad operatives who were disguised as Israeli art students in the years prior to 9-11 were known to have been targeting the offices and personnel of the U.S. Drug Enforcement Agency (DEA). Why would the Mossad be seeking to penetrate the DEA if it were not involved in drug smuggling?

Daniel Hopsicker has loads of related info on this subject.

www.madcowprod.com/08082006.html

The Israeli Connection, Pt. 1

For example, El-Batrawi owns a private company called Genesis Diversified Investments, which is an investor in a company called Aviation Group that in 2001 merged with a British Columbia company called Travelbyus.

Lee Sanders, the chairman of Travelbyus is a director of Holiday. Riley is a former chief executive of Holiday and its largest shareholder. Riley also is among the largest shareholders of Imperial.

Michael Farkas connections to right wing Israeli political parties, and to Israeli Mossad, have already been ably covered by others. Farkas was listed in 2005 as president of Manhigut USA. This is the US branch of the Israeli Manhigut Yehudit, involved in fundraising for the radical settlers who were trying to resist the Gaza withdrawal.

Suffice it to say that he serves as the American representative of an ultra-nationalist Zionist party in Israel; he is also the American sales agent for anti-missile technology developed by Israel Aircraft Industries, and is a Director of spy technology company CCS, along with individuals with histories so colorful that were we to start we could go on about them all day.

Oh, maybe just one example: CCS International's Latin American sales manager, Menachem Cohen, who was convicted in 2002 for illegally exporting passive phone interception equipment to individuals in Colombia conversant with the drug trade.

'Individuals should not take responsibility for their own defense. That’s what the police are for. ... If I oppose individuals defending themselves, I have to support police defending them. I have to support a police state.”' Alan Dershowitz

robin  posted on  2008-04-26   12:56:53 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#42. To: Dakmar (#0)

9-11 was a very sophisticated operation, as Werthebach said, which required the "fixed frame" of a state intelligence organization. It was carefully planned years in advance and carried out for one strategic purpose: to kick-start the Zionist-planned "war on terror."

bttt

I shall not vote for evil, lesser or otherwise.

wbales  posted on  2008-04-26   13:00:30 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#43. To: All (#41)

Meet the Masters of the Universe

What local officials blundered into at a remote airport in the farthest corner of Mexico's Yucatan may have earth-shaking reverberations felt around the world if the true story of what happened there becomes widely known...

The seizure in Ciudad del Carmen has exposed the links of a global narcotics cartel that may be the most powerful political force on the planet.

Based on court documents, SEC filings, records of incorporation, and interviews with eyewitnesses, the elements which comprise this global narcotics cartel all of which will be named and covered in this series include the following:

Rogue U.S. defense contractor Titan Corp in San Diego; CIA proprietary airlines; fugitive Saudi billionaires, Gulf States Sheiks and financiers; the Israeli Mossad and right wing Israeli political parties identified with Jewish settler interests; "retired" officers of the CIA and U.S. military intelligence; Texas Republican kingmakers and private investment banks; member of U.S. organized crime...

Also... stock swindlers in Vancouver, Canada responsible for multi-billion dollar financial fraud; officials from the party of Mexican President Vicente Fox; Colombian and Mexican drug cartels; Florida air charter companies which enjoy as did the Florida aviation companies associated with the terrorist hijackers apparent official immunity from prosecution; and Lebanese "industrialists" in Mexico known to the Mexican press as the Narco-Pederastas, for their penchant for molesting children, with apparent immunity from prosecution, both boys and girls, as young as four.

--------------------------------

'Individuals should not take responsibility for their own defense. That’s what the police are for. ... If I oppose individuals defending themselves, I have to support police defending them. I have to support a police state.”' Alan Dershowitz

robin  posted on  2008-04-26   13:02:03 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#44. To: robin (#41)

I always figured Bush I invaded Panama because Noriega was keeping too much of the cut for himself. Turns out I was both essentially correct and shockingly naive.

And they write innumerable books; being too vain and distracted for silence: seeking every one after his own elevation, and dodging his emptiness. - T. S. Eliot

Dakmar  posted on  2008-04-26   13:02:12 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#45. To: All (#41) (Edited)

http://www.madcowprod.com/102204issue.htm

Sunday Herald November 2, 2003:

A French intelligence agency noted “according to the FBI, Arab terrorists and suspected terror cells lived in… Hollywood, Florida, from December 2000 to April 2001 in direct proximity to the Israeli spy cells”. The report contended that Mossad agents were spying on Mohammed Atta and Marwan al-Shehi, two of leaders of the 9/11 hijack teams. Jim Margolin, an FBI spokesman in New York, implied that the public would never know the truth, saying: “If we found evidence of unauthorised intelligence operations that would be classified material.”

http://ww1.sundayherald.com/37707

BBC October 2, 2002:

German newspaper Die Zeit… uncovered details of a major Israeli spy ring involving some a 120 agents for the intelligence service Mossad operating across America and some masquerading as arts students. The ring was reportedly hard on the heels of at least four members of the hijack gang, including its leader Mohammed Atta. But the Israeli agents were detected by their American counterparts and thrown out of the country, it says. Just a month before the deadly attacks, the paper said, Mossad handed over to the Americans a detailed report naming several suspects they believe were preparing an attack on the United States.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/world/europe/2294487.stm

'Individuals should not take responsibility for their own defense. That’s what the police are for. ... If I oppose individuals defending themselves, I have to support police defending them. I have to support a police state.”' Alan Dershowitz

robin  posted on  2008-04-26   13:03:29 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#46. To: Dakmar (#44)

That was very astute of you and so early on too.

'Individuals should not take responsibility for their own defense. That’s what the police are for. ... If I oppose individuals defending themselves, I have to support police defending them. I have to support a police state.”' Alan Dershowitz

robin  posted on  2008-04-26   13:05:22 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#47. To: robin (#45)

First thing I'd ask in flight school is how do I land this mutha?

And they write innumerable books; being too vain and distracted for silence: seeking every one after his own elevation, and dodging his emptiness. - T. S. Eliot

Dakmar  posted on  2008-04-26   13:05:50 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#48. To: robin (#46)

That was very astute of you and so early on too.

Well, as a regular reader of High Times...

And they write innumerable books; being too vain and distracted for silence: seeking every one after his own elevation, and dodging his emptiness. - T. S. Eliot

Dakmar  posted on  2008-04-26   13:06:47 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#49. To: Dakmar (#24) (Edited)

I've always refrained from commenting on technical aspects of 9/11 because I'm not an engineer, architect, chemist, or aircraft aficianado.

I'm an electrical engineer (for over 20 years, now) with two years of a chemical engineering degree and a strong life-long (over 30 years now) interest in organic and inorganic chemistry and all types of physics.

The evidence of an official and media coverup regarding 9/11 is astoundingly manifest.

nobody  posted on  2008-04-26   13:07:01 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#50. To: nobody (#49)

So you would know if jet fuel burns hot enough to melt steel?

And they write innumerable books; being too vain and distracted for silence: seeking every one after his own elevation, and dodging his emptiness. - T. S. Eliot

Dakmar  posted on  2008-04-26   13:09:20 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#51. To: Dakmar, *Black Ops - Psyops*, *Israeli Espionage* (#48)

This one is pretty good too.

Rudy Cites 5 Mossad False Flags as Evidence of Islamic Terrorism

'Individuals should not take responsibility for their own defense. That’s what the police are for. ... If I oppose individuals defending themselves, I have to support police defending them. I have to support a police state.”' Alan Dershowitz

robin  posted on  2008-04-26   13:09:31 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#52. To: Dakmar (#50) (Edited)

So you would know if jet fuel burns hot enough to melt steel?

Not in the WTC in under two hours (or ever, really), for you'd need a well- designed oven hidden inside there for that.

But you might think you're just settting me up for the melt vs. soften argument. Believe me, you aren't. The fuel fire and reasonably expectable secondary fires were not enough to soften it appreciably, either.

nobody  posted on  2008-04-26   13:12:48 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#53. To: nobody (#52)

Then that rules out anything other than controlled demolition, am I correct?

And they write innumerable books; being too vain and distracted for silence: seeking every one after his own elevation, and dodging his emptiness. - T. S. Eliot

Dakmar  posted on  2008-04-26   13:15:47 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#54. To: nobody (#52)

But you might think you're just settting me up for the melt vs. soften argument.

No, I'm just kinda buzzed and asking questions.

And they write innumerable books; being too vain and distracted for silence: seeking every one after his own elevation, and dodging his emptiness. - T. S. Eliot

Dakmar  posted on  2008-04-26   13:16:47 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#55. To: Dakmar (#53) (Edited)

Then that rules out anything other than controlled demolition, am I correct?

Yes, but I loathe to have to point out here that it's not a demolition controlled by hitting the building with a plane and the subsequent expectable secondary effects of that.

nobody  posted on  2008-04-26   13:19:07 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#56. To: wbales (#42)

to kick-start the Zionist-planned "war on terror."

Clinton on Iran: We would "totally obliterate them". ("IF I'M THE PRESIDENT, WE WILL ATTACK IRAN")

Isn't it so exciting!?

'Individuals should not take responsibility for their own defense. That’s what the police are for. ... If I oppose individuals defending themselves, I have to support police defending them. I have to support a police state.”' Alan Dershowitz

robin  posted on  2008-04-26   13:19:46 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#57. To: robin (#51) (Edited)

I remember watching that debate and thinking how much I wanted to get Dr Paul an earpiece like Mittsy and Guiboyardee had.

And they write innumerable books; being too vain and distracted for silence: seeking every one after his own elevation, and dodging his emptiness. - T. S. Eliot

Dakmar  posted on  2008-04-26   13:19:51 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#58. To: nobody (#55)

Yes, but I loathe to have to point out here that it's not a demolition controlled by hitting the building with a plane and the subsequent secondary effects of that.

That was a given, I guess my definition of Controlled Demolition is more textbook than yours.

And they write innumerable books; being too vain and distracted for silence: seeking every one after his own elevation, and dodging his emptiness. - T. S. Eliot

Dakmar  posted on  2008-04-26   13:22:09 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#59. To: Dakmar (#57)

But Dr. Paul doesn't need an earpiece! He really was good in this one. Do check the analysis below the youtube.

BALI
Rudy refers to attacks on the Kuta Beach area in Bali in October 2002. Australian investigator Joe Vialls concluded that due to the extent of the damage, the bomb was placed in a sewer pipe in the roadbed. The only bomb that could fit and could cause that much damage would be a micro-nuke (SADM) which is only possessed by 5 countries; America, Britain, France, Israel & Russia. The Muslim world does not have access to the type of device detonated in Bali. He concludes; “the attack seems aimed at shifting Australian public opinion towards an attack on Iraq, or even an attack on Islam in general.” It was more than likely a device constructed in Dimona and detonated by Mossad.

LONDON
The 2nd attack Rudy mentions is the 7/7 London bombings, which stink of Mossad False Flag from the get go. Like on 9/11, there were ‘drills’ being conducted which had terrorists sneaking fake bombs onto subways that morning. Meanwhile, innocent Muslim kids were no doubt recruited to participate in the fake terror attacks and carry live time bombs on the train. When the kid on the Bus realized what he had he tried to get away but too late.

MADRID
Moderator Charlie Watson throws in ‘Madrid’ at this point, helping to pile on Paul, even though he’s supposed to be an objective moderator. Madrid was a textbook Mossad operation.

MUNICH ATTACKS
Rudy then mentions that Olympics attack in Munich in 1972, which was Absolutely a documented Mossad False Flag operation.

ACHILLES LAURO
Leon Klinghoffer was a Jewish man thrown overboard to elicit sympathy for Israel. Guess what? Yes another Mossad False flag operation… in fact, here is a list of all the different ways Mossad has conducted war through Deception.

Ron Paul is trying to cut off the billions of dollars we send Israel each year. Rudy, John McCain, Obama, Clinton and basically everyone else running for office are Israel’s darlings. The difference is that Ron Paul wants to put America first, not some foreign nation that wants America to be a bankrupt warfare state.

'Individuals should not take responsibility for their own defense. That’s what the police are for. ... If I oppose individuals defending themselves, I have to support police defending them. I have to support a police state.”' Alan Dershowitz

robin  posted on  2008-04-26   13:24:55 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#60. To: Dakmar (#58) (Edited)

I guess my definition of Controlled Demolition is more textbook than yours

I just break it down into two words and apply the broadest reasonable definition. It's somewhat of a redundant combination of words unless one can think in terms of an uncontrolled demolition, which is not a clear concept if one assumes, in the typical manner that I am accustomed to, that "demolitions" are always done on purpose. Also, if the buildings were designed to fall upon impact by the jets used then it would perhaps be a "controlled demolition" in a much stronger sense, but no one has discussed the design on this thread up to this point, so it's somewhat being compelled by you. It should be clear at this point that I am not a big fan of the phrase "controlled demolition."

nobody  posted on  2008-04-26   13:26:47 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#61. To: robin (#59)

But Dr. Paul doesn't need an earpiece! He really was good in this one.

Ok, then I wish I could have gotten him a mace. Let's see Rudy get all smug and giggly in the face of real opposition.

See why I refuse to become a party delegate?

Just wouldn't work.

And they write innumerable books; being too vain and distracted for silence: seeking every one after his own elevation, and dodging his emptiness. - T. S. Eliot

Dakmar  posted on  2008-04-26   13:31:24 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#62. To: nobody (#60)

no one has discussed the design on this thread up to this point, so it's somewhat being compelled by you.

Didn't know I had it in me.

And they write innumerable books; being too vain and distracted for silence: seeking every one after his own elevation, and dodging his emptiness. - T. S. Eliot

Dakmar  posted on  2008-04-26   13:34:11 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#63. To: Dakmar (#62) (Edited)

It's an easy thing to just toss out a cliche without much thought. I've done it too. Precision in communication is more desirable when the object is to make mutual progress.

nobody  posted on  2008-04-26   13:38:13 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#64. To: nobody (#63)

You're expecting a reasoned rebuttal but I've already told you I have no basis for such on these technical matters, I was just asking your opinion.

And they write innumerable books; being too vain and distracted for silence: seeking every one after his own elevation, and dodging his emptiness. - T. S. Eliot

Dakmar  posted on  2008-04-26   13:42:08 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#65. To: Dakmar (#64) (Edited)

I was just asking your opinion.

I know.

nobody  posted on  2008-04-26   13:47:01 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#66. To: Dakmar (#64) (Edited)

I was just asking your opinion.

I answered and also felt compelled to critique the question. Don't let my griping about being so compelled bother you. It's my problem, obviously not yours.

nobody  posted on  2008-04-26   13:47:14 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#67. To: Dakmar (#50)

So you would know if jet fuel burns hot enough to melt steel?

The Fires' Impact How the Towers' Fires Affected the Structural Steel

As an exercise let's set aside all of the evidence about the actual severity of the Twin Towers' fires, and imagine that the fires were incredibly intense and widespread. Let's imagine that the jets were full tankers and spilled 80,000 gallons of fuel into each tower. Let's imagine that there was a strong wind giving the fires plenty of air. Let's imagine that the the fires engulfed over 10 floors in each tower, saturating the capacity of the steel buildings to draw away the heat. Let's imagine the fires burned intensely for hours, completely gutting several stories of each tower. Would that cause them to collapse? Not according to people who have studied steel structures subjected to such stresses. The following passage is from Appendix A of FEMA's World Trade Center Building Performance Study. In the mid-1990s British Steel and the Building Research Establishment performed a series of six experiments at Cardington to investigate the behavior of steel frame buildings. These experiments were conducted in a simulated, eight-story building. Secondary steel beams were not protected. Despite the temperature of the steel beams reaching 800-900° C (1,500-1,700° F) in three of the tests (well above the traditionally assumed critical temperature of 600° C (1,100° F), no collapse was observed in any of the six experiments).

This graph represents strength as a function of temperature, which is expressed in degrees Celsius (C).

At temperatures above 800° C structural steel loses 90 percent of its strength. 1 Yet even when steel structures are heated to those temperatures, they never disintegrate into piles of rubble, as did the Twin Towers and Building 7. Why couldn't such dramatic reductions in the strength of the steel precipitate such total collapse events?

* High-rise buildings are over-engineered to have strength many times greater than would needed to survive the most extreme conditions anticipated. It may take well over a ten-fold reduction in strength to cause a structural failure. * If a steel structure does experience a collapse due to extreme temperatures, the collapse tends to remain localized to the area that experienced the high temperatures. * The kind of low-carbon steel used in buildings and automobiles bends rather than shatters. If part of a structure is compromised by extreme temperatures, it may bend in that region, conceivably causing a large part of the structure to sag or even topple. However, there is no example of a steel structure crumbling into many pieces because of any combination of structural damage and heating, outside of the alleged cases of the Twin Towers and Building 7.

2 References

1. Effect of temperature profile, corusconstruction.com, [cached] 2. Fire Resistance of Steel Framed Car Parks, corusconstruction.com, [cached]

"Satan / Cheney in "08" Just Foreign Policy Iraqi Death Estimator

tom007  posted on  2008-04-26   18:11:53 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#68. To: tom007, Dakmar, *9-11*, *Israeli Espionage* (#67)

Following Zakheim and Pentagon trillions to Israel and 9-11

'Individuals should not take responsibility for their own defense. That’s what the police are for. ... If I oppose individuals defending themselves, I have to support police defending them. I have to support a police state.”' Alan Dershowitz

robin  posted on  2008-04-27   14:51:29 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#69. To: robin, Dakmar, *Big Pharma* (#68)

Is the illegal drug business something the Bush's and Clinton's have had a hand in with Israel's Mossad?

If the reports, allegations, and rumors are true, the illegal drug trade is where the interests of the Bush family, the Clintons, the CIA and the Mossad all come together. This would explain the choice to invade and occupy Afghanistan, where opium production is now at record levels after having been nearly eradicated under the Taliban regime.

I do not know why I missed this post, but thanks for pinging 9-11, robin.

Dak, thanks for the post. Confirms everything I have come to understand about 9-11, and really leaves little to be surprised about anymore. The United States really is infested with murderers, thieves and scum.

As to the drug connection, I would have been surprised if that were not the case. After all, the love of money is the root of all evil, and there is a LLLLOOOOTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTT of money in drugs, legal or illegal.

As to the Clintons and Bushs, well, after the queen is inaugerated, add the 8 years, and they will have been in charge for some 35 years within the United States. Nothing defines corruption quite so well as that.

When a man who is honestly mistaken hears the truth, he will either quit being mistaken or cease to be honest. ++++++++++ Attention, Shrub; A life of evil is ultimately a life of wretchedness.

richard9151  posted on  2008-04-27   17:29:36 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#70. To: richard9151, *9-11* (#69)

More good 9/11 reminders...

9/11 - Prior Knowledge - Put-Options

September 11, 2001: Unusual volumes on Put Options just before the attack. Swiss study

'Individuals should not take responsibility for their own defense. That’s what the police are for. ... If I oppose individuals defending themselves, I have to support police defending them. I have to support a police state.”' Alan Dershowitz

robin  posted on  2008-04-27   17:38:38 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


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