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Title: McCain/Palin vs. Obama/Biden - how they compare academically
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Published: Aug 31, 2008
Author: Various
Post Date: 2008-08-31 00:08:49 by a vast rightwing conspirator
Keywords: None
Views: 1822
Comments: 109
Palin McCain Biden Obama
- Bachelors of Arts in Sports Journalism from Idaho.
- Bachelors from Naval Academy rank 5th from the bottom of his class of 800.
- BA University of Delaware in both History and Political Science.
- Juris Doctor (JD) from Syracuse University College of Law.
- BA in International Relations form Columbia University.
- Juris Doctor (J.D.) Magna Cum Laude from Harvard in 1991. (That’s top of his class at arguably the best school in the country/world.) While at Harvard he was also president of the Harvard Law Review.
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#69. To: a vast rightwing conspirator (#66)
McCain: bottom of class. Palin: degree in sports journalism with a minor in chocolate chip cookies. Bill Gates ... dropped out !
"Every effort has been made by the Federal Reserve Board to conceal its power but the truth is the Federal Reserve Board has usurped the Government of the United States." "Mr. Chairman, the people of the United States did not perceive that a world system was being set up here that the United States was to be lowered to the position of a coolie country. . and was to supply financial power to an international superstate -- a superstate controlled by international bankers and international industrialists acting together to enslave the World for their own pleasure."
I don't hardly think so. I know that to get elected and to be an effective leader you cannot live or work in a vacuum. I see Barack Obama as an agent of change that inspires the best in people, who cares about them and this country and who will do right by it. I don't see that with McCain, who is more of the same toxic same poising us and destroying this country. If you are claiming it takes living in a cave and talking to no one to be an effective POTUS, it is you who has a cognitive problem here, not me. I am voting for Obama and leaving in five minutes to do some canvassing for him. Have a good one.
McCain posing as the "family values" ticket is a real hoot. Here's a guy who left his wife in a time of need (she was seriously injured and hospitalized) to shack up with a trophy heiress. No wonder he picked a VP with a wholesome- looking family life to wave in people's faces. I want nothing to do with Obummer, who'll no doubt prove to be a darker version of Ted Kennedy when it comes to politics, but BHO seems to be ten times the family man that Mad Dog could hope to be.
Then make that your argument. Saying he is going to use the same world-class idiots who have created the mess we're in now negates the "change agent" argument. As a Northwesterner, you should know the draw of "a mom in tennis shoes" and that new blood is needed. The "world class" people are the same group of twinks who have delivered us unto the wreck we're in currently.
"A leader, for a change." - Jimmy Carter, 1976 campaign slogan. Sound familiar? Here it comes again!
Both are anti-white families.
Affirmative Action. Also, per Wikipedia: He graduated with a Juris Doctor (J.D.) magna cum laude from Harvard in 1991 Not summa cum laude as you stated. That means a 3.3-3.5 GPA.
"A leader, for a change." - Jimmy Carter, 1976 campaign slogan. Sound familiar? Here it comes again!
Correct me if I'm wrong, but affirmative action is applied to admissions and hiring. I am completely unaware of an affirmative action practice of inflating the grades of 'minorities' for the purpose of helping them graduate as first in their class.
Antiparty - find out why, think about 'how'
Love the tagline.
What is really screwed up. Is this election they are going to add 5 percent to Obamas total. Because of Affirmative action. It isn't right. ;)
I believe that this is correct. Obama graduated as MAGNA CUM LAUDE, not SUMMA CUM LAUDE. The source that cites 'SUMMA' is not as credible as several other sources that mention MAGNA. That's not too bad, when compared with Palin's degree in sports commentary and McCain at the very bottom of his class.
Antiparty - find out why, think about 'how'
Obama did not graduate first in his class. He graduated with honors, but not as Valedictorian, which would indicate he was "first in his class". Also, honors at Harvard are given only to people who choose the thesis option. Those who choose the non-thesis option can not graduate with honors, but can graduate with a higher GPA. And yes, Affirmative Action strikes grading because schools and universities want to have a high "minority" graduation rate. That is one of the problems with the education system as it exists currently. I know this all too well from relatives in the Ed Biz. In Obama's biography on Wikipedia, it says he went to Occidental College in Los Angeles for two years before transferring to Columbia. That says his grades were not good enough to get into Columbia even with Affirmative Action and so he had to work to get them up to where he could get in even with the preference. Come on, man, your argument doesn't even stack up against the known facts.
"A leader, for a change." - Jimmy Carter, 1976 campaign slogan. Sound familiar? Here it comes again!
Better luck to release back in the garden and ask her to stay. In the fall after the leaves have dropped, look for the eggsac. Or you might find it in the spring if you leave some older flower and plant debris for her to hide them. Simply cut the branch with the eggsac a few inches above and below and attach to a shrub where it's warm and shaded at least 1 foot above the ground.
Might I add a more proper version? "An AMERICAN would have stood on that podium and denounced everything McCain has ever said, and his ties to the Bush administration, and she would have said, "I decline the invitation."
Thank you for the revision. Agreed.
Ahem... I do charge for editorial work. I did it because I think we agree there is a difference between an American and any person that is part of the system, down to and including the party line voter.
So let's stack up your argument here. Palin got a degree in Sports Journalism, worked as a Sportscaster, and then changed careers. She started in the city council, became mayor, and then became Governor. Sounds like a promotion path to me. Are you claiming that people are not allowed to change careers or something? I don't understand the argument here. Are people supposed to be locked into a job for life? McCain did graduate near the bottom of his class, that is not disputed, and he also got into USNA as a legacy admission. This is also not disputed. I'll throw you another bone. A family member of mine was in the same class at USNA with the Senator's father. I met Admiral McCain and he made quite an impression on me. The son is nothing like the father. Admiral McCain was someone who would blow you out of the water just with his presence. The man had it all together - intelligence, poise, stature, bearing - you name it, he had it. I guess the problem is your issue with Palin who trained for a career she entered and then decided to switch careers. You seem to think that people aren't allowed to change their occupation for some reason. Why is that?
"A leader, for a change." - Jimmy Carter, 1976 campaign slogan. Sound familiar? Here it comes again!
No small potatoes.
I'm not an Obama fan, but your argument is ridiculous. He worked his way through. He has the education. Don't make this an issue when there are plenty to choose from. You discredit yourself.
My great-grandfather got a JD from Harvard. He practiced law for all of 90 days, then decided he couldn't lie for a living and became a newspaper editor. I'm not impressed by lawyers. I have too many in my family from Ivy League law schools for that to count for anything. We've also got multiple Harvard MBAs. Whoop-de-doo. Show me some real world accomplishments and then I'll be impressed.
"A leader, for a change." - Jimmy Carter, 1976 campaign slogan. Sound familiar? Here it comes again!
Perhaps McKooK is more like his Grandfather that was relieved of command late in WW2?
No discredit here. Just a statement of facts. Are you claiming that stating facts discredit an argument? Aren't facts the foundation for an argument? He worked his way through. He has an education. That is NOT in dispute. Why make a dispute of something that is not in dispute? What is in dispute is the value of a degree from a particular institution when racial preferences come into play. That is the only thing that is in dispute and has been in dispute since the day preferences came upon the scene.
"A leader, for a change." - Jimmy Carter, 1976 campaign slogan. Sound familiar? Here it comes again!
What is in dispute is the value of a degree from a particular institution when racial preferences come into play. Then say it straight that the only reason he graduated was that he got in because he is black and he was given the grades because he is black. Then, your argument, although without merit in my eyes, makes your position clear.
We're aligned on that point.
I want nothing to do with Obummer, who'll no doubt prove to be a darker version of Ted Kennedy when it comes to politics, but BHO seems to be ten times the family man that Mad Dog could hope to be. I opted out of the system by expatriating from the "fed" because of insanity just like this ... they're all a bunch of scumbags with less moral fiber than a worm ... the only unknown is Sarah Palin ... kinda like one of those questions regarding What candidate doesn't belong A)McCain B)Obama C)Biden D)PALIN ? I want nothing to do with any of the shit eaters either (and don't) ... but I'm as surprised as most of the REPS and all of the DEMS with this pick for VP because she doesn't appear to belong. The first three names are willing mass murderers, so forget the family values bullshit because it's irrelevant ... but what besides mind control could get a nice wholesome mother of five to hang with this collection of pure scum ?
"Every effort has been made by the Federal Reserve Board to conceal its power but the truth is the Federal Reserve Board has usurped the Government of the United States." "Mr. Chairman, the people of the United States did not perceive that a world system was being set up here that the United States was to be lowered to the position of a coolie country. . and was to supply financial power to an international superstate -- a superstate controlled by international bankers and international industrialists acting together to enslave the World for their own pleasure."
I have no problem with McCain's daddy or with Ms. Palin. Well... I do have a problem with Ms. Palin. She is guilty of allowing McCain to turn her into the 'pony' of his dog and pony show. If she had any principles or deeply-held conservative beliefs she threw it all off the window the moment she became McCain's prop. Now, getting back to the topic of this thread: education-wise, Obama/Biden are showing some serious education credentials. McCain/Palin are not.
Antiparty - find out why, think about 'how'
That's the problem with Affirmative Action. We don't know if he got in because he checked "African American" on the box or not. We know that schools and colleges have set goals to graduate "more" minorities, but we don't know if Obama was a recipient of such things or not. Thus, the program taints people so you just don't know if they were qualified or if they got in on a set-aside. A friend of mine who is black has been having to deal with this all of his life; he refuses to take quotas but everyone still views him through the "Oh, he only got in because he is black" lenses. Its a nasty thing and the problem with the program is - you just don't know which is which and what is what. So, its impossible to say one way or another; that's the tainting that Affirmative Action and set-aside programs tar people with, no pun intended.
"A leader, for a change." - Jimmy Carter, 1976 campaign slogan. Sound familiar? Here it comes again!
So let me ask a question - why is this important? The best IT people I've ever hired came either from no-name Universities or had degrees in liberal arts. The best tech writer I know has a high school diploma, but he has been at it for more than 30 years and can document anything in such a manner that you will know everything you need to about it quickly. The single best systems integrator I know has a GED and "some" college, but not even enough to claim two years. So is education or ability more important? In the tech industry, I've seen people from Harvard who can't think their way out of a wet paper bag that had in the instructions written on the inside. On the reverse, anyone from Brown seems to be top-notch. I've also seen people coming from working on oil derricks who taught themselves networking at night and could rewire your car in a heartbeat, but no college degree. The best IT architect I know got a CS degree from U Idaho in Moscow. He got four promotions in three years, setting a new promotion record (breaking mine of four in four years) in the department. So what's the deal here? Why is it so important? Is education more important than ability? If so, why?
"A leader, for a change." - Jimmy Carter, 1976 campaign slogan. Sound familiar? Here it comes again!
John McCain: Conservative or Gun-Grabber? GOA Ratings For John McCain 2000 - C- 2002 - C- 2004 - F- 2006 - F-
You are asking why education and academic performance are important? Hmmm... I don't know. Maybe they aren't but, I believe, we've already established that Palin's advanced degree in photo journalism and McCain's not failing to graduate are way better than a magna cum laude at Harvard. So, education is important.
Antiparty - find out why, think about 'how'
Now you're heading into an argument my schoolteacher mom uses all the time :) Bear with me, I'm going to just throw facts here and then ask for your reaction. Bill Gates dropped out. Was education important? George W. Bush has a Harvard MBA. How does that education work out for him? Is he a competent manager or not? Now take a high school kid on a 504 (behavior modification) and an IEP with a 40% modification. That means the kid can blow 40% and still get an "A". Also throw into the IEP that the kid gets 8 hours of individual attention per day AND make him Hispanic so he gets more special programs just to get him through the system because the district is under fire for their Hispanic dropout rate. The kid then gets a 4.0 but the diploma doesn't say he had a modified plan. Is that kid any more qualified than Joe Average who got a 3.5 GPA with no help whatsoever? The point is, these days, with Affirmative Action, legacy admissions, graduation rate goals, modifications, and individual education plans (and yes, you can do 'independent study' at a University; friend of mine did that for 75% of her degree) - educational qualifications become less relevant than talent. Now, let's look at the business world where to be a manager in most shops, you not only have to have a BS in "something" but also a PMP Certificate. A PMP Certificate is a "Project Management Professional" certification. I have one of those. You file your resume' saying you've done some number of hours of PM work, read a study guide, take a multiple choice exam, pay your $500, and you get the certificate. So what does the certificate mean? It means you jumped through hoops and crammed for a multiple-choice exam which you passed with 60%. It doesn't mean you really know how to manage a project. It doesn't mean you're any good at managing projects either. So, what good are credentials nowadays other than just to show you can jump through hoops?
"A leader, for a change." - Jimmy Carter, 1976 campaign slogan. Sound familiar? Here it comes again!
I agree that applying education on dumbasses such as W or McCain is not as good as applying lipstick on a pig's ass. I understand that Bill Gates and Edison were not well schooled but they are exceptions. I am not suggesting that education is everything but academic achievements could be good indicators of one's intellectual abilities. By no means do they completely measure one's humanity or one's abilities. I just heard on the news that one of Palin's daughters is in high school, 17 and pregnant. What does this tell you about her parenting skills?
Antiparty - find out why, think about 'how'
Are you saying Obamas mother sucked?
Did any of Obama's sisters get pregnant as a teen? I just don't know. Anyways, Obama's mother is not a public figure and she is completely out of scope as far as this discussion is concerned.
Antiparty - find out why, think about 'how'
I heard a similar rumor about her latest kid, that her daughter was pregnant for two years and that Palin covered it up. I did some quick math and determined that it was BS unless an evolutionary leap had been made where human females can gestate for two years instead of the usual nine months. As for the teenage pregnancy just announced, with the current laws in place, you can't force a kid to do anything anymore. All you can do is tell them what's going on but you can't actually punish them. Child Protective Services has been called before when a parent has taken a Nintendo away from a kid. So....parenting skills go out the window because the Government gets involved. That's what I think. I also think that because we subsidize teenage pregnancies, provide nurseries in public schools (which is done everywhere BTW) and - in New England not too long ago, a couple hundred girls got into a "pregnancy pact" that the problem is larger than just one family. That's what I think.
"A leader, for a change." - Jimmy Carter, 1976 campaign slogan. Sound familiar? Here it comes again!
Alright, so let's do the summary: - Palin is better educated than Obama This entire discussion could be scripted as some absurd Monty Python sketch and it would make lots of people laugh. Parenthetically speaking, I have kids too but I never heard from the child protection or anyone else. So far, I was able to do my best to prepare them for life and no one interfered. Do you think that Palin was under some child protection watch that prevented her from explaining the facts of life to her daughter.
Antiparty - find out why, think about 'how'
That I don't know, but I do know that kids tend to buck their parents. Have you noticed that the kids of Preachers or Police tend to be pretty badly behaved or that the kids of psychologists and psychiatrists tend to be screwed up? I don't really understand why but it seems that is the case. As a society, we give approval to teenage pregnancies because we subsidize it and provide them with free daycare so that the teen moms don't have to actually suffer consequences for their actions. To get back to your first point, nobody will disagree that Obama has an education. But does he have talent? Where is the executive experience? Has he ever run a business, been a mayor, been a governor, or ... ? That's the question. A freshly minted PhD has a lot of academic knowledge, but no real-world experience. Do you hire a 28 year old freshly minted PhD for CEO or do you find someone with real management experience? Your line of commentary seems to indicate that academic credentials are all that is needed. If that is the case, then Ben Bernanke will be the finest Fed Chairman of all time, the economy will hum along with no problems, there will never be a banking crisis, and inflation will be nonexistent forever. How's Bernanke working out?
"A leader, for a change." - Jimmy Carter, 1976 campaign slogan. Sound familiar? Here it comes again!
I didn't say that academic achievement is everything. It's only one aspect of one's makeup. I do find statements that 'Obama is a moron' or that 'Palin is more qualified to be prez' somewhat absurd.
Antiparty - find out why, think about 'how'
No offense intended, but Palin does have more real-world executive experience than Obama does. Heck the mayor of Clover SC (population 120) has more executive government experience than Obama does. Let's not kid ourselves; Obama has never been a manager and he has never been an executive of anything. NONE of our candidates currently in the race with the exception of Ralph Nader have any significant executive experience. NONE of them.
"A leader, for a change." - Jimmy Carter, 1976 campaign slogan. Sound familiar? Here it comes again!
No, she does NOT. She is qualified to run Alaska because she was voted by the people there to be their governor. Maybe you didn't notice, but Obama did run a national campaign (his own) for the past couple of years. He did represent his state in the senate and his neighborhood - larger than Palin's town - in the state assembly. While Palin was busy fishing and neglecting her daughter's education, Obama was defeating Hillary. He DID get some 20 million votes while at it, traveled all over the country, met with hundreds of thousands of Americans. What did Palin do to qualify her for a national level executive job?
Antiparty - find out why, think about 'how'
Running a political campaign now qualifies one to be President because of the "experience" garnered in it? Okay. Then that means Karl Rove beats Obama. Rove managed two large campaigns and won both times. Should we not put him up instead or launch a write-in campaign because he has more experience than the rest of them combined? Its your argument, not mine. Rove beats Obama in terms of experience by that argument.
"A leader, for a change." - Jimmy Carter, 1976 campaign slogan. Sound familiar? Here it comes again!
Rove is free to run for office like anyone else. As for executive experience, I don't believe that Rove was the chief executive of W's campaign. It was W or maybe Cheney who was the boss. Obama was the boss of his national campaign. He defeated all the Democrats that were competing for the Demo nomination and, in the process, he got to know the country by interacting with all kinds of people. Palin, as the mayor of an Alaska town and the governor of her state must have a good understanding of her town and her state. I have no doubt that she could beat Obama on a debate focused on shooting wolves from airplanes and she may even beat Obama if they were to debate ANWAR. But she's a lot less prepared to run the executive branch of the US gov't. In a recent interview she asked the interviewer what exactly the US VP was supposed to do. That's how prepared she is.
Antiparty - find out why, think about 'how'
OBAMA: SUMMA CUM LAUDE at HARVARD.
#70. To: mirage (#63)
"You just made the case against Obama as a change agent, Mike..."
"You only have power over people so long as you don't take everything away from them. But when you've robbed a man of everything he's no longer in your power -- he's free again. Alexander Solzhenitsyn
#71. To: noone222 (#67)
(Edited)
#72. To: Ferret Mike (#70)
I see Barack Obama as an agent of change that inspires the best in people, who cares about them and this country and who will do right by it.
#73. To: Rupert_Pupkin (#71)
#74. To: a vast rightwing conspirator (#66)
(Edited)
Need we say more?
#75. To: mirage (#74)
#76. To: Ferret Mike (#62)
"You only have power over people so long as you don't take everything away from them. But when you've robbed a man of everything he's no longer in your power -- he's free again." Alexander Solzhenitsyn
#77. To: a vast rightwing conspirator (#75)
#78. To: mirage (#74)
He graduated with a Juris Doctor (J.D.) magna cum laude from Harvard in 1991
#79. To: a vast rightwing conspirator (#75)
I am completely unaware of an affirmative action practice of inflating the grades of 'minorities' for the purpose of helping them graduate as first in their class.
#80. To: Rupert_Pupkin (#65)
I caught one of those in my garden the other day. I think it's a gravid female, and I'm keeping her in a jar and feeding her crickets with the hope of getting an egg case and a brood of young mantises in the spring.
#81. To: buckeye (#64)
A decent woman would have stood on that podium and denounced everything McCain has ever said, and his ties to the Bush administration, and she would have said, "I decline the invitation."
#82. To: Cynicom (#81)
#83. To: buckeye (#82)
#84. To: a vast rightwing conspirator (#78)
That's not too bad, when compared with Palin's degree in sports commentary and McCain at the very bottom of his class.
#85. To: mirage (#74)
He graduated with a Juris Doctor (J.D.) from Harvard in 1991
#86. To: mirage (#79)
so he had to work to get them up to where he could get in even with the preference.
#87. To: angle (#85)
No small potatoes.
#88. To: mirage (#84)
I met Admiral McCain and he made quite an impression on me.
#89. To: angle (#86)
I'm not an Obama fan, but your argument is ridiculous. He worked his way through. He has the education. Don't make this an issue when there are plenty to choose from. You discredit yourself.
#90. To: mirage (#89)
#91. To: mirage (#87)
I'm not impressed by lawyers.
#92. To: Rupert_Pupkin (#71)
(Edited)
McCain posing as the "family values" ticket is a real hoot. Here's a guy who left his wife in a time of need (she was seriously injured and hospitalized) to shack up with a trophy heiress. No wonder he picked a VP with a wholesome- looking family life to wave in people's faces.
#93. To: mirage (#84)
#94. To: angle (#90)
Then say it straight that the only reason he graduated was that he got in because he is black and he was given the grades because he is black.
#95. To: a vast rightwing conspirator (#93)
Now, getting back to the topic of this thread: education-wise, Obama/Biden are showing some serious education credentials. McCain/Palin are not.
#96. To: Elliott Jackalope (#3)
#97. To: mirage (#95)
So let me ask a question - why is this important?
#98. To: a vast rightwing conspirator (#97)
So, education is important.
#99. To: mirage (#98)
#100. To: a vast rightwing conspirator (#99)
What does this tell you about her parenting skills?
#101. To: Old Friend (#100)
#102. To: a vast rightwing conspirator (#99)
I just heard on the news that one of Palin's daughters is in high school, 17 and pregnant. What does this tell you about her parenting skills?
#103. To: mirage (#102)
- She is totally ready to act as the prez of the US [because]
- She has more experience
- She is also a very good mother who educated her daughter wonderfully
- McCain picked the best possible VP because... see above
#104. To: a vast rightwing conspirator (#103)
Do you think that Palin was under some child protection watch that prevented her from explaining the facts of life to her daughter.
#105. To: mirage (#104)
#106. To: a vast rightwing conspirator (#105)
I do find statements that 'Obama is a moron' or that 'Palin is more qualified to be prez' somewhat absurd.
#107. To: mirage (#106)
#108. To: a vast rightwing conspirator (#107)
#109. To: mirage (#108)
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