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Title: Sarah Palin's pastor exorcises witches, condemns Jew Bankers Source: YT/MSNBC URL Source: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=esSAVnn2ye0 Published: Oct 4, 2008 Author: AntiConformist911/Olberman Post Date: 2008-10-04 16:06:49 by buckeye Keywords: NoneViews: 1054 Comments: 74
Palin once blessed to be free from 'witchcraft' video surfaced Wednesday showing Sarah Palin being blessed in her hometown church three years ago by a Kenyan pastor who prayed for her protection from "witchcraft" as she prepared to seek higher office. The video shows Palin standing before Bishop Thomas Muthee in the pulpit of the Wasilla Assembly of God church, holding her hands open as he asked Jesus Christ to keep her safe from "every form of witchcraft." "Come on, talk to God about this woman. We declare, save her from Satan," Muthee said as two attendants placed their hands on Palin's shoulders. "Make her way my God. Bring finances her way even for the campaign in the name of Jesus. ... Use her to turn this nation the other way around." Palin filed campaign papers a few months later, in October 2005, and was elected governor the next year. Unlike most other Christians including most evangelicals Pentecostals believe in "baptism in the Holy Spirit." That can manifest itself through speaking in tongues, modern-day prophesy and faith healing, which includes the laying on of hands. On a visit to the church in June 2008, Palin spoke fondly of the Kenyan pastor and told a group of young missionaries that Muthee's prayers had helped her to become governor. "Pastor Muthee was here and he was praying over me, and you know how he speaks and he's so bold," she said. "And he was praying 'Lord make a way, Lord make a way' ... He said, 'Lord make a way and let her do this next step.' And that's exactly what happened." The Rev. Zipporah Ndiritu, who studied under Muthee in the Kiambu, Kenya-based Word of Faith Church, said the bishop is revered among evangelicals there. In a phone interview from Mombasa, Kenya, she said church doctrine focuses on ridding the world of demons and witches. "Even in the days of Jesus Christ, according to the Bible there were witches who were manifesting through demonic forces," she said. "You can seek from the Lord, and if you find demonic forces you cast them out." http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5gv... Sarah Palin has a new problem with Jewish voters. Ive written before about the appearance of Jews for Jesus leader David Brickner at Palins Wasilla Bible Church and how on August 17, 2008, with Palin in the audience, Brickner described terrorist attacks on Israelis as Gods judgment of unbelief on Jews who have not converted to Christianity. Ive also written about the video of Kenyan witch-hunter Thomas Muthee exorcising witches from Sarah Palin at her church, showing Muthee praying over Sarah Palin and calling on God to make her Alaskas governor, drive away the witches who are attacking her, and saying that the Devil himself is behind the opposition to Palin in the Alaska gubernatorial election. Now video has surfaced of Rev. Muthee at Palins church again with Palin present and in the video telling the congregation that the Christians need to take over control of the business world, especially banking, from the Jews ("Israelites"). Heres what Muthee said in his sermon where he told the church congregation "the reasons why" they needed to "pray for Sarah": The second area whereby God wants us, wants to penetrate in our society is in the economic area. The Bible says that the wealth of the wicked is stored up for the righteous. Its high time that we have top Christian businessmen, businesswomen, bankers, you know, who are men and women of integrity running the economics of our nations. Thats what we are waiting for. Thats part and parcel of transformation. If you look at the you know if you look at the Israelites, thats how they work. And thats how they are, even today. When we will see that, you know, that the top transporters (?) in the lands, we see, you know, the bankers, we see the people holding the parts (?), they are believers, we will not have the kind of corruption that we are hearing in our societies." http://open.salon.com/content.php?cid... Poster Comment:Nothing follows.
Palin once blessed to be free from 'witchcraft' video surfaced Wednesday showing Sarah Palin being blessed in her hometown church three years ago by a Kenyan pastor who prayed for her protection from "witchcraft" as she prepared to seek higher office.
The video shows Palin standing before Bishop Thomas Muthee in the pulpit of the Wasilla Assembly of God church, holding her hands open as he asked Jesus Christ to keep her safe from "every form of witchcraft."
"Come on, talk to God about this woman. We declare, save her from Satan," Muthee said as two attendants placed their hands on Palin's shoulders. "Make her way my God. Bring finances her way even for the campaign in the name of Jesus. ... Use her to turn this nation the other way around." Palin filed campaign papers a few months later, in October 2005, and was elected governor the next year.
Unlike most other Christians including most evangelicals Pentecostals believe in "baptism in the Holy Spirit." That can manifest itself through speaking in tongues, modern-day prophesy and faith healing, which includes the laying on of hands.
On a visit to the church in June 2008, Palin spoke fondly of the Kenyan pastor and told a group of young missionaries that Muthee's prayers had helped her to become governor.
"Pastor Muthee was here and he was praying over me, and you know how he speaks and he's so bold," she said. "And he was praying 'Lord make a way, Lord make a way' ... He said, 'Lord make a way and let her do this next step.' And that's exactly what happened."
The Rev. Zipporah Ndiritu, who studied under Muthee in the Kiambu, Kenya-based Word of Faith Church, said the bishop is revered among evangelicals there. In a phone interview from Mombasa, Kenya, she said church doctrine focuses on ridding the world of demons and witches.
"Even in the days of Jesus Christ, according to the Bible there were witches who were manifesting through demonic forces," she said. "You can seek from the Lord, and if you find demonic forces you cast them out." http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5gv... Sarah Palin has a new problem with Jewish voters. Ive written before about the appearance of Jews for Jesus leader David Brickner at Palins Wasilla Bible Church and how on August 17, 2008, with Palin in the audience, Brickner described terrorist attacks on Israelis as Gods judgment of unbelief on Jews who have not converted to Christianity.
Ive also written about the video of Kenyan witch-hunter Thomas Muthee exorcising witches from Sarah Palin at her church, showing Muthee praying over Sarah Palin and calling on God to make her Alaskas governor, drive away the witches who are attacking her, and saying that the Devil himself is behind the opposition to Palin in the Alaska gubernatorial election.
Now video has surfaced of Rev. Muthee at Palins church again with Palin present and in the video telling the congregation that the Christians need to take over control of the business world, especially banking, from the Jews ("Israelites").
Heres what Muthee said in his sermon where he told the church congregation "the reasons why" they needed to "pray for Sarah":
The second area whereby God wants us, wants to penetrate in our society is in the economic area. The Bible says that the wealth of the wicked is stored up for the righteous. Its high time that we have top Christian businessmen, businesswomen, bankers, you know, who are men and women of integrity running the economics of our nations. Thats what we are waiting for. Thats part and parcel of transformation. If you look at the you know if you look at the Israelites, thats how they work. And thats how they are, even today. When we will see that, you know, that the top transporters (?) in the lands, we see, you know, the bankers, we see the people holding the parts (?), they are believers, we will not have the kind of corruption that we are hearing in our societies." http://open.salon.com/content.php?cid...
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#27. To: James Deffenbach (#21) What if the politicians could get it through their head that the Constitution esn't authorize them to dole out foreign aid TO ANYONE? Of course it doesn't allow for foreign aid to any country but since when do our pols follow the Constitution and govern by it. Regardless, they keep greasing the palms of the joos in Israel and that doesn't sit well with the rest of the countries in the middle east. By the way james, if you keep nitpicking what I write, I'm gonna have christine make you thechecker,exchecker or something on this forum. LACUMO posted on 2008-10-05 6:57:02 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #28. To: LACUMO (#25) (Edited) A person of lesser intelligence than you probably wouldn't have caught my errors. It is good that we have someone with a little gray matter between the ears on here to keep us straight. I am always happy to help out the less fortunate. You're welcome. Liberty is not a means to a higher political end. It is itself the highest political end. Lord Acton James Deffenbach posted on 2008-10-05 12:01:33 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #29. To: buckeye (#26) You can make all the changes you wish....but until the heart/conscience of mankind is changed, it will be only superficial and last but moments in time. What you would change to suit your way of thinking, the next guy will come along and change it to something else --I'm sure you're aware that simply because a law is written this year does not guarantee it will last forever (nor a constitution, for that matter)--the next congress can change that law, or any other law at their whim. As I noted, what good is a 'no central bank' system if people are killing each other right and left over any reason, every reason, or simply no reason? Ya wanna say, hey, we've got a great no central banking system and when the people quit killing each other, they'll realize thats a good thing?Makes no sense to me.I can understand well your desire to have a nation that is even half- based on the Constitution upon which it is supposed to operate. I'd love that, too.........but you know what they say about that damned barn door and the horse! I'm not going to let it get to me, to let it eat me alive, to make me hateful and bitter. The nation has made its bed (sold its soul seemingly), so now it has to lie in it (suffer the consequences)........that it goes under is not the end of the world, though it could be IF God decides it is. BUt I ain't gonna worry about that, either. Que sera, sera. rowdee posted on 2008-10-05 12:08:57 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #30. To: buckeye (#26) I think we need to think on the four-step agenda over the long haul. It's really just getting started, and momentum could take decades to achieve. Bless your heart, buckeye.........I'm glad someone has all those decades in which they want to work at changing government. How old are you.....17? 18? I can't say that.......I'm at the other end of the spectrum, and I don't plan to spend whatever 'decades' I have left trying to get sheeple to wake up--at least not in any sort of activist role. Those days are behind me. I no longer consider putting important value on 'man made'...... rowdee posted on 2008-10-05 12:13:15 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #31. To: RickyJ (#24) God's judgment on unbelievers has NOT occurred yet, if it had they would know it. God punished unblieving Israelites all the time in the O/T. I think Brickner's statement is a bit of a stretch as it regards 'because they didn't convert to chr5istianity, because the Bible indicates they will when Messiah returns.They were unbelieving and disobeying God's instructions--that is why they went thru so many diasporas. And from my reading of Scripture and other materials, they still owned the land, but God refused to let them possess it. rowdee posted on 2008-10-05 12:20:21 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #32. To: rowdee (#29) As I noted, what good is a 'no central bank' system if people are killing each other right and left over any reason, every reason, or simply no reason? Usury at a federal level leverages the ability to kill to a massive level. Individuals may deviate from the norm, and you may read about it in the papers or see it on TV. But when the Federal Reserve funds a war, millions can die. Hundreds of thousands can be raped, and scores of thousands of children can suffer terribly. This is on our conscience. I know you're getting tired, but thankfully you're not too tired to stop in and advise us when we get too anxious. Dum spiro spero. buckeye posted on 2008-10-05 12:21:51 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #33. To: rowdee (#31) God punished unblieving Israelites all the time in the O/T Punishment and judgment are two different things. The present state of Israel has experienced neither. Dead Jews can't convert to Christianity and I see nowhere in the Bible where it says all the live ones will convert to Christianity when Jesus returns. Also the Bible is referring to real Jews, not the pretenders in Israel today. God is always good! RickyJ posted on 2008-10-05 12:27:08 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #34. To: buckeye (#32) So without the federal reserve, we wouldn't be killing in other countries........yet it would continue nonstop here, just as others in other countries would continiue the killing there.Changing a banking system is not going to change the heart of mankind.......where there is a chance to grab power, there are many waiting for the chance. And power is, in the hands of man, generally not good--might be for a few, but by and large not. Money is nto the only way to obtain power.......but it is a powerful aphrodesiac. rowdee posted on 2008-10-05 12:27:55 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #35. To: rowdee (#34) Changing a banking system is not going to change the heart of mankind... The point of our constitutional government was to limit the excesses of men, and it indeed worked for a time. We have a system for magnifying them in the Fed. These things have consequences. Men will be men, but when we give them fractional reserve banking and unlimited access to credit, all hell breaks loose. It's a worthy fight, even if it's only going to result in small reforms. buckeye posted on 2008-10-05 12:31:37 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #36. To: rowdee (#34) (Edited) Building the military necessary to (attempt) world dominance requires currency that can be created instantly, and lots of it. I think you're right that it (killing in general) could (and in most cases would) continue on a much more local level. Only a change in the people's thinking will stop wars. noone222 posted on 2008-10-05 12:35:04 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #37. To: RickyJ (#33) I don't presume to know what blood flows through each and every Jew in Israel....nor do I presume to know their heart. To be punished, God would have judged that they did not do as they were supposed to do.......otherwise it would be an odd God that would punish first, doncha think? Of course, this is not the final judgement."Real Jews".........was Jesus a real Jew? I ask because he came along long after the diaspora to Babylon, and certainly the Assyrian diaspora.Furthermore, there were jewish communities in many cities all over the place before the Khazar storyline. So exactly how do you determine who has the right 'blood'.......and are you speaking religiously or ethnically/racially? And lets see your proof that each and every one of them are not 'jews'. rowdee posted on 2008-10-05 12:37:54 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #38. To: buckeye (#35) Do you truly believe you can recapture the early days of the Constitution? Truly? Because if you do, I'll sell you the London Bridge pretty cheap-- special deal cause you're a friend and all that.......... rowdee posted on 2008-10-05 12:40:21 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #39. To: noone222 (#36) I would imagine a corp of private contractors would work nicely...... :) rowdee posted on 2008-10-05 12:45:50 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #40. To: rowdee (#38) I believe we can improve our situation if we try. I believe that not trying is not an option. buckeye posted on 2008-10-05 12:46:44 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #41. To: rowdee (#39) Private contractors would rely upon "ready" funds ... the inter-connected central banks ability to create and issue currency out of thin air and "choose" who gets funded are directly responsible for global bullying. noone222 posted on 2008-10-05 12:56:03 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #42. To: rowdee (#38) Do you truly believe you can recapture the early days of the Constitution? Imagine the critics the founding fathers faced. The British Empire had never been defeated, not really. It was a Leviathan, and functioned like a well-oiled machine when it encountered resistance. Only a small percentage of the colonists wanted to separate from it. They were ridiculed, taunted, and punished at first. But they persisted. buckeye posted on 2008-10-05 12:56:21 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #43. To: rowdee (#37) And lets see your proof that each and every one of them are not 'jews'. The relevant point would be whether they were ISRAELITES/HEBREWS ... most "jews" today are actually gentiles (ashkenazi descendants of Japeth) that have converted to Judaism, have no ethnic relationship to Abraham (who was not a Jew) or Jacob/Israel (who was not a Jew) ... and are not entitled to claim the inheritance belonging to Israelites. noone222 posted on 2008-10-05 13:00:15 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #44. To: buckeye (#42) The British Empire had never been defeated, not really. It was a Leviathan, and functioned like a well-oiled machine when it encountered resistance. There are some that might say the Brits weren't defeated here either. That they simply employed a different strategy. noone222 posted on 2008-10-05 13:01:47 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #45. To: noone222 (#43) Superstition. I don't know of any valid genetic proof. In fact, Kevin MacDonald says that there is proof to the contrary. All groups making generally accepted claims to a Jewish heritage have common Jewish genetic markers. buckeye posted on 2008-10-05 13:02:55 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #46. To: noone222 (#44) That they simply employed a different strategy. If this theory is true, then I'd say it was ineffectual, despite their meddling in our civil war, until the Fed was created. buckeye posted on 2008-10-05 13:04:24 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #47. To: buckeye (#42) We had a different breed of men--and women--back then, buckeye. I can't fault you, for wanting to try. We've all been through or will go through the 'fire', so to speak, as we try to plot/change the course of rightness/wrongness--at least those who care will.Stay with your dreams, and hopes. rowdee posted on 2008-10-05 13:19:50 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #48. To: noone222 (#43) I've not closed the book on this assertion, as I continue to read and study. There is much confusion and bs because of how the words have been intermingled all these years, i.e., Israelite/Hebrew/Jew.And stick in there ashkenazi and sephardic and khazar and yiddish and all other sorts of 'stuff', like diasporas of both the northern and southern kingdoms--and more than one. And there's a lot to sort through.In the meantime, I'll refrain from hating and despising, nor will I gush with pride and wishful desire to be a part of the mess.....thats been my position all along. I'm on a quest for truth, as far as I can determine it. rowdee posted on 2008-10-05 13:30:52 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #49. To: rowdee (#16) I'm sickened to death ...all...who lay every friggin thing that ever went wrong in this old world on the shoulders of Jews...or Israelites. I find this fascinating. Clearly any investigation of the subject matter implictates zionist jewry as having a despicable hand in the thievery of this nation and other nations in this world and in the advancement of its ills. Read about the Rothschilds or Trotsky. Without understanding why and how events transpired, action toward fixing things is futile as it doesn't address the core of the problem. That's why the internet is so valuable to the people and so dangerous to the criminals. angle posted on 2008-10-05 13:40:37 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #50. To: buckeye (#45) There has certainly been lots of time for inter-breeding between sephardic and ashkenazic people. noone222 posted on 2008-10-05 14:23:56 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #51. To: rowdee (#48) (Edited) Genesis 10 2The sons of Japheth; Gomer, and Magog, and Madai, and Javan, and Tubal, and Meshech, and Tiras. 3And the sons of Gomer; Ashkenaz, and Riphath, and Togarmah. 4And the sons of Javan; Elishah, and Tarshish, Kittim, and Ezekiel 38 (doesn't mention ashkenaz directly, but mentions the rest of the Japethetic lineage, Gomer and Togarmah) 1 The word of the LORD came to me: 2 "Son of man, set your face against Gog, of the land of Magog, the chief prince of [a] Meshech and Tubal; prophesy against him 3 and say: 'This is what the Sovereign LORD says: I am against you, O Gog, chief prince of [b] Meshech and Tubal. 4 I will turn you around, put hooks in your jaws and bring you out with your whole armyyour horses, your horsemen fully armed, and a great horde with large and small shields, all of them brandishing their swords. 5 Persia, Cush [c] and Put will be with them, all with shields and helmets, 6 also Gomer with all its troops, and Beth Togarmah from the far north with all its troopsthe many nations with you. Genesis simply describes the descendants of Japeth, while Ezekiel describes THE ENEMIES OF ISRAEL in the last times ! noone222 posted on 2008-10-05 14:36:06 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #52. To: angle (#49) Oh puleeze............I have read til my eyes have gotten tired. And please note I said 'everything' in this world, not just financial.I have not written the concept off--either way. I have said I'm sick to death of it, and I maintain that I am sick of it, and will continue to be sick of it. I daresay most do not know whereof they speak, and at best many just utter words they've seen elsewhere, without having done their homework.This no way implies that you have or haven't......I'm merely stating my opinion--based on observations I've made over time. rowdee posted on 2008-10-05 15:46:40 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #53. To: noone222 (#51) noone, I've read this............I believe it. And Genesis also says, in 9:27 that God would enlarge Japeth and he would live in the tents of Shem--this was after Shem and Japeth clothed Noah's nakedness. Thus a familial relationship developed between these two tribes.That said, I've also read where when the kingdoms split that NOT ALL the northern tribes went into exile via Assyria==they went elsewhere, and they went southward, like as towards Judea.Furthermore, as trade developed, one saw Israelites, including Judeans, forming communities all over the known world..and that was before Christ was born. Do you have information that none of the Judeans went into Europe? Do you have information showing there was no intermarriage between 'shirttail relatives'. Can you prove that everyone in Israel is NOT of the tribe of Judah? Recall that Abraham, as well as Isaac sent for wives for their son(s) or sent the son(s) themselves to marry relatives in PadanAram. Scriptures talk often about 'remnants'....and that God will not forget the remnants. EVen when Nebuchadnezzar took the Judeans away into Babylon, not all Judeans were taken......some escaped into the desert, and some were left behind, and some were out of the area at the time of Jerusalem being taken. rowdee posted on 2008-10-05 16:03:14 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #54. To: buckeye (#10) Evangelical Christians put George W. Bush in the White house twice. That's assuming that the vote was an honest one. Ahmadinejad in 2008! bluegrass posted on 2008-10-05 16:22:04 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #55. To: bluegrass (#54) it was as honest as bush's declaration of born again christianity. Do You Know What Freedom Really Means? Freedom4um.com christine posted on 2008-10-05 16:51:24 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #56. To: christine (#55) LOL! Ahmadinejad in 2008! bluegrass posted on 2008-10-05 17:04:13 ET (1 image) Reply Trace Private Reply #57. To: bluegrass (#54) Evangelical Christians put George W. Bush in the White house twice. That's assuming that the vote was an honest one. Well enough of them brought him close enough anyway. I was stunned to see people in the community have McPalin signs on their front yard, today. Wow, what a mindset. angle posted on 2008-10-05 17:43:25 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #58. To: bluegrass (#56) Can you add a propeller to the Bush beanie??? He was a pilot you know during Vietnam war. Cynicom posted on 2008-10-05 17:45:09 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #59. To: angle, christine, Cynicom, Tauzero, Lady X (#57) I was stunned to see people in the community have McPalin signs on their front yard, today. In my part of the country, the cities nearby are Obama territory with the occasional McCain sign but all of the rural areas sport 100% McCain/Palin signs. Ahmadinejad in 2008! bluegrass posted on 2008-10-05 17:58:43 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #60. To: Cynicom (#58) Bush thinks they're wearing Mouseketeer hats. Ahmadinejad in 2008! bluegrass posted on 2008-10-05 18:00:01 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #61. To: rowdee (#53) (Edited) And Genesis also says, in 9:27 that God would enlarge Japeth and he would live in the tents of Shem--this was after Shem and Japeth clothed Noah's nakedness. Thus a familial relationship developed between these two tribes. This has absolutely nothing to do with Abraham or promises made to his descendants. [Older Bibles used to have a map that showed Ham locating in Africa, Shem in the Middle-East and Japeth in Eastern Europe/Asia]. Ezekiel 38 is end times prophecy, and this book names the enemies of (true) Israel and it's not likely that the enemy of Israel would be Israel itself, is it ??? You ask for proof that inter-marriages didn't occur. We can assume that they did occur. The better question regarding "proof" should be asked of those that have invaded and have committed genocide against the Palestinians for the sake of installing some Eastern European/Russian people calling themselves Jews there. These People should have had PROOF that they descended from Abraham if they were to be given land Biblically promised to his descendants. [However, you're mentioning the tribe of Judah indicates that you're thinking that the State of Israel should have been instituted for the benefit of one tribe (maybe 2 if you count Benjamin) of 12 that were to share the promise doesn't it ]? Can you name one other nation founded by international force in support of a biblical claim ??? International Law has never upheld scriptural claims by force. The UN (God's enemy) has never supported scripture, but mandated this Jew fraud. Yes, Japeth does reside in the tents of Shem. That's why the Ashkenazi Jews (Japethites) are all over our government. No one can definitively say that inter-marriages didn't occur. It is pretty common knowledge that they were frowned upon clear up until this generation in America. Marriage licenses were instituted in America to LEGALIZE inter- marriage between blacks and whites, even though there were marriages between Indians and American settlers that weren't LICENSED. The establishment of the State of Israel should have required definitive proof of the claim made that these people were RETURNING to a land they or their ancestors once occupied. This proof was never required and has never been demonstrated even though millions have died. The Ashkenazi branch weren't converted to Judaism until 750 AD. Lastly, to institute/impose a SECULAR NATION STATE by invasion and warfare against an indigenous population that can prove they have lived there for well over a thousand years, based upon a religious determination contained in the Torah/Bible, a RELIGIOUS belief system NOT SHARED UNIVERSALLY, based upon an UNWITNESSED PROMISE, made by an INVISIBLE GOD, to a man 4000 years ago IS BEYOND LUDICROUS and most certainly an international CRIME committed by an international bully called the U.S. and Britain. However, to be completely truthful, Britain had a legitimate claim as the British (Brit-Ish means covenant man in Hebrew) are descendants of Abraham through Isaac, Israel, Judah. I believe they lost their claim based upon promises made to Abraham just like any other nation would if they departed the area for whatever reason. noone222 posted on 2008-10-05 19:36:33 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #62. To: Cynicom (#58) Can you add a propeller to the Bush beanie??? He was a pilot you know during Vietnam war. ROTFLMAO! rowdee posted on 2008-10-05 20:50:25 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #63. To: noone222 (#61) Believe as YOU wish, noone........And a lot of good it does to sit here some 60 odd years later and debate what should/shouldn't/could/couldn't/would/wouldn't be done is what is ludricous. They didn't as you nor I what should have been done, did they?YOu should recall that Doc said so many times that God has his own way of doing things, and that they are not mans ways. As vehemently as you fight it, there is the chance that this is, indeed, God's will being worked in one of those 'mysterious' ways. He certainly won't be asking you or I for our approval or agreement. Why, we might evene have gotten that damnable Dubya because God was trying to get a point across, or something...........geeze.......imagine that. rowdee posted on 2008-10-05 20:58:52 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #64. To: buckeye, blugrass (#0) Bernhardt would get a kick out of this. I wasn't going to vote for McCain anyway, but... I simply can't imagine having a funny-talking African pastor. ...Both methods yielded similar results, which support the previous findings; that is, of all modern human samples, sub-Saharan Africans again exhibit the closest phenetic similarity to various African Plio-Pleistocene hominins... Ancient teeth and modern human origins: An expanded comparison of African Plio-Pleistocene and recent world dental samples, Journal of Human Evolution Volume 45, Issue 2, August 2003, Pages 113-144 Tauzero posted on 2008-10-06 1:46:06 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #65. To: rowdee (#8) And now that you brought it up, what exactly is wrong with getting all the prayers that you can? Admonishing us not to be like the heathens with their vain repetitions, who think they will be heard for their much speaking -- for the Lord knows of what ye have need before ye ask -- Jesus gave one prayer, today known as the Lord's Prayer. All else is heathen, IMO. ...Both methods yielded similar results, which support the previous findings; that is, of all modern human samples, sub-Saharan Africans again exhibit the closest phenetic similarity to various African Plio-Pleistocene hominins... Ancient teeth and modern human origins: An expanded comparison of African Plio-Pleistocene and recent world dental samples, Journal of Human Evolution Volume 45, Issue 2, August 2003, Pages 113-144 Tauzero posted on 2008-10-06 1:51:31 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #66. To: rowdee (#29) but until the heart/conscience of mankind is changed N.B. There is no word for that in Hebrew, and the Bible says that the nations will be redeemed, not some amorphous mass. ...Both methods yielded similar results, which support the previous findings; that is, of all modern human samples, sub-Saharan Africans again exhibit the closest phenetic similarity to various African Plio-Pleistocene hominins... Ancient teeth and modern human origins: An expanded comparison of African Plio-Pleistocene and recent world dental samples, Journal of Human Evolution Volume 45, Issue 2, August 2003, Pages 113-144 Tauzero posted on 2008-10-06 2:03:11 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #67. To: rowdee (#63) And a lot of good it does to sit here some 60 odd years later and debate And a lot of good it does to sit here some 60 odd years later and debate what should/shouldn't/could/couldn't/would/wouldn't be done is what is ludricous. They didn't ask you nor I what should have been done, did they? There are still people being slaughtered and WW III looms large because of the State of Israel. Palestinian kids throwing rocks at tanks proves that the debate isn't over. Maybe we should ASK even though they haven't asked us. Taxpayers are expected to financially support this foreign state and should have a voice. My generation is supposed to stand still for the mistakes of those prior generations ??? I think the Federal Reserve System, The Income Tax and the State of Israel are just three examples of errors we have a duty to correct. What about future generations being forced to accept our errors ? $850 Billion or more bailout of criminal bankers comes immediately to mind. YOu should recall that Doc said so many times that God has his own way of doing things, and that they are not mans ways. As vehemently as you fight it, there is the chance that this is, indeed, God's will being worked in one of those 'mysterious' ways. He certainly won't be asking you or I for our approval or agreement. Why, we might evene have gotten that damnable Dubya because God was trying to get a point across, or something...........geeze.......imagine that. This last comment referencing Doc is of a fatalist nature . The conditions causing so much dissatisfaction today exist because so many were willing to accept or go along to get along with bad decisions made in their name. My vehement fight is against those claiming that the State of Israel is fulfillment of scripture. My prayers conclude with "your (God's) will be done, not mine" ... so, please don't confuse my position as one opposed to God's because it is in opposition to those claiming a scriptural basis for establishing the State of Israel. (Doc also said that we needn't leave our brain at the door). Doc tip-toed around this (Jewish) issue and probably for very good reasons. Being tagged as a proponent of "British- Israelism" or "Christian Identity" being the primary one, in my opinion. He did say "don't throw the baby out with the bath water". [Here I agree with Doc, and am not a Christian Identity or British-Israelism proponent, just a Bible student that thinks it important that we separate God's Will from what scripture states because by confusing the two things we may be imposing our will based upon a false understanding of scripture.] Truth being the all important issue for me since God said "I am Truth". Whether the State of Israel is God's will or not (which it very well might be) has no bearing upon what the BIBLE ACTUALLY SAYS or what people believe or what's acceptable according to man's secular (International) law. If one is to believe the Bible is God's word, then one should believe what it "actually" says. The end times prophecy of Ezekiel leaves very little room for interpretation as regards who are the enemies of Israel and it happens that they are primarily Japeth's descendants along with the Arabs. To think that these named enemies of Israel are at the same time Israel itself is an impossibility and NOT BIBLICAL. The scripture that most Christians resort to when confronted about this subject is one where God tells Abraham that anyone cursing "HIS DESCENDANTS" (here most Christians insert the word Jews, which isn't Biblical and Abraham's descendants weren't Jews with the possible exception of the single tribe of Judah) will be cursed. This one scripture being misinterpreted causes many people to ignore the terrible deeds done by the so-called Jews, when Jesus instructed his followers to judge them (everyone) by their deeds. Judge the tree by its fruit. If this is applied to the State of Israel as we know it today it is a poison apple, instituted through fraud and murder by men not God. The conclusion being drawn amongst Christian/Zionist supporters of the State of Israel while unproven is that modern day Jews are actually descended from Abraham (which according to Christ/God would mean that they would hear Christ's voice but can't because they are not of his and are primarily atheists) and at best would make-up only two of the twelve tribes given the promise. These disputations relative to scripture should be based upon solid scriptural evidence and not upon interpretations of men. Even then, these scriptural determinations between Christians, even if agreed upon, shouldn't have any more effect upon International Law than other religious writings that are sometimes believed by more people than believe the Bible. In other words, the my God is bigger than your God theory would rule the day and the religious choice of the victor would (and has been) be imposed upon non-believers. [What people choose to believe and what is truth are very often two completely different things aren't they ?] Let me be clear in what I'm saying. If you were to ask me if I believe that the State of Israel's existence is God's Will, I would answer "it exists so it must be God's Will" with this caveat, it exists by and through fraud contrary to traditional practices of law, defies logic, has man's finger prints all over it, has been a boil upon mankind since its inception, and I don't think it has a basis in scripture. That is not to say it isn't God's Will. Why, we might evene have gotten that damnable Dubya because God was trying to get a point across No argument from me about this statement at all. If something exists its difficult, if not impossible, to say it does so in opposition to God's Will. However, just because something might be God's Will doesn't make it scriptural. We are admonished to study the scriptures to "show ourselves approved". When the issue of Abrahamic Covenant vs. The State of Israel is thoroughly studied we can hardly avoid noticing that the people we call Jews today haven't fulfilled any of the promises contained therein. The tendency within Christianity is to simply accept the teachings of men to the exclusion of scripture. Simply put, God's Will is one thing and Scriptural (documentation) evidence is another. If, as in your case, you want to believe that the State of Israel is God's Will I wouldn't argue for a second. If you said that the State of Israel as we see it today is scriptural, I'd say I think you're wrong. noone222 posted on 2008-10-06 5:01:40 ET Reply Trace Private Reply . . . Comments (68 - 74) not displayed. Top Page Up Full Thread Page Down Bottom/Latest
What if the politicians could get it through their head that the Constitution esn't authorize them to dole out foreign aid TO ANYONE? Of course it doesn't allow for foreign aid to any country but since when do our pols follow the Constitution and govern by it. Regardless, they keep greasing the palms of the joos in Israel and that doesn't sit well with the rest of the countries in the middle east. By the way james, if you keep nitpicking what I write, I'm gonna have christine make you thechecker,exchecker or something on this forum.
What if the politicians could get it through their head that the Constitution esn't authorize them to dole out foreign aid TO ANYONE?
Of course it doesn't allow for foreign aid to any country but since when do our pols follow the Constitution and govern by it. Regardless, they keep greasing the palms of the joos in Israel and that doesn't sit well with the rest of the countries in the middle east.
By the way james, if you keep nitpicking what I write, I'm gonna have christine make you thechecker,exchecker or something on this forum.
LACUMO posted on 2008-10-05 6:57:02 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
A person of lesser intelligence than you probably wouldn't have caught my errors. It is good that we have someone with a little gray matter between the ears on here to keep us straight. I am always happy to help out the less fortunate. You're welcome.
A person of lesser intelligence than you probably wouldn't have caught my errors. It is good that we have someone with a little gray matter between the ears on here to keep us straight.
I am always happy to help out the less fortunate. You're welcome.
Liberty is not a means to a higher political end. It is itself the highest political end. Lord Acton
James Deffenbach posted on 2008-10-05 12:01:33 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
You can make all the changes you wish....but until the heart/conscience of mankind is changed, it will be only superficial and last but moments in time. What you would change to suit your way of thinking, the next guy will come along and change it to something else --I'm sure you're aware that simply because a law is written this year does not guarantee it will last forever (nor a constitution, for that matter)--the next congress can change that law, or any other law at their whim. As I noted, what good is a 'no central bank' system if people are killing each other right and left over any reason, every reason, or simply no reason? Ya wanna say, hey, we've got a great no central banking system and when the people quit killing each other, they'll realize thats a good thing?Makes no sense to me.I can understand well your desire to have a nation that is even half- based on the Constitution upon which it is supposed to operate. I'd love that, too.........but you know what they say about that damned barn door and the horse! I'm not going to let it get to me, to let it eat me alive, to make me hateful and bitter. The nation has made its bed (sold its soul seemingly), so now it has to lie in it (suffer the consequences)........that it goes under is not the end of the world, though it could be IF God decides it is. BUt I ain't gonna worry about that, either. Que sera, sera.
As I noted, what good is a 'no central bank' system if people are killing each other right and left over any reason, every reason, or simply no reason? Ya wanna say, hey, we've got a great no central banking system and when the people quit killing each other, they'll realize thats a good thing?
Makes no sense to me.
I can understand well your desire to have a nation that is even half- based on the Constitution upon which it is supposed to operate. I'd love that, too.........but you know what they say about that damned barn door and the horse! I'm not going to let it get to me, to let it eat me alive, to make me hateful and bitter. The nation has made its bed (sold its soul seemingly), so now it has to lie in it (suffer the consequences)........that it goes under is not the end of the world, though it could be IF God decides it is. BUt I ain't gonna worry about that, either. Que sera, sera.
rowdee posted on 2008-10-05 12:08:57 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
I think we need to think on the four-step agenda over the long haul. It's really just getting started, and momentum could take decades to achieve. Bless your heart, buckeye.........I'm glad someone has all those decades in which they want to work at changing government. How old are you.....17? 18? I can't say that.......I'm at the other end of the spectrum, and I don't plan to spend whatever 'decades' I have left trying to get sheeple to wake up--at least not in any sort of activist role. Those days are behind me. I no longer consider putting important value on 'man made'......
I think we need to think on the four-step agenda over the long haul. It's really just getting started, and momentum could take decades to achieve.
Bless your heart, buckeye.........I'm glad someone has all those decades in which they want to work at changing government. How old are you.....17? 18? I can't say that.......I'm at the other end of the spectrum, and I don't plan to spend whatever 'decades' I have left trying to get sheeple to wake up--at least not in any sort of activist role. Those days are behind me. I no longer consider putting important value on 'man made'......
rowdee posted on 2008-10-05 12:13:15 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
God's judgment on unbelievers has NOT occurred yet, if it had they would know it. God punished unblieving Israelites all the time in the O/T. I think Brickner's statement is a bit of a stretch as it regards 'because they didn't convert to chr5istianity, because the Bible indicates they will when Messiah returns.They were unbelieving and disobeying God's instructions--that is why they went thru so many diasporas. And from my reading of Scripture and other materials, they still owned the land, but God refused to let them possess it.
God's judgment on unbelievers has NOT occurred yet, if it had they would know it.
God punished unblieving Israelites all the time in the O/T. I think Brickner's statement is a bit of a stretch as it regards 'because they didn't convert to chr5istianity, because the Bible indicates they will when Messiah returns.
They were unbelieving and disobeying God's instructions--that is why they went thru so many diasporas. And from my reading of Scripture and other materials, they still owned the land, but God refused to let them possess it.
rowdee posted on 2008-10-05 12:20:21 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
As I noted, what good is a 'no central bank' system if people are killing each other right and left over any reason, every reason, or simply no reason? Usury at a federal level leverages the ability to kill to a massive level. Individuals may deviate from the norm, and you may read about it in the papers or see it on TV. But when the Federal Reserve funds a war, millions can die. Hundreds of thousands can be raped, and scores of thousands of children can suffer terribly. This is on our conscience. I know you're getting tired, but thankfully you're not too tired to stop in and advise us when we get too anxious. Dum spiro spero.
As I noted, what good is a 'no central bank' system if people are killing each other right and left over any reason, every reason, or simply no reason?
Usury at a federal level leverages the ability to kill to a massive level. Individuals may deviate from the norm, and you may read about it in the papers or see it on TV. But when the Federal Reserve funds a war, millions can die. Hundreds of thousands can be raped, and scores of thousands of children can suffer terribly.
This is on our conscience. I know you're getting tired, but thankfully you're not too tired to stop in and advise us when we get too anxious.
Dum spiro spero.
buckeye posted on 2008-10-05 12:21:51 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
God punished unblieving Israelites all the time in the O/T Punishment and judgment are two different things. The present state of Israel has experienced neither. Dead Jews can't convert to Christianity and I see nowhere in the Bible where it says all the live ones will convert to Christianity when Jesus returns. Also the Bible is referring to real Jews, not the pretenders in Israel today.
God punished unblieving Israelites all the time in the O/T
Punishment and judgment are two different things. The present state of Israel has experienced neither. Dead Jews can't convert to Christianity and I see nowhere in the Bible where it says all the live ones will convert to Christianity when Jesus returns. Also the Bible is referring to real Jews, not the pretenders in Israel today.
God is always good!
RickyJ posted on 2008-10-05 12:27:08 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
So without the federal reserve, we wouldn't be killing in other countries........yet it would continue nonstop here, just as others in other countries would continiue the killing there.Changing a banking system is not going to change the heart of mankind.......where there is a chance to grab power, there are many waiting for the chance. And power is, in the hands of man, generally not good--might be for a few, but by and large not. Money is nto the only way to obtain power.......but it is a powerful aphrodesiac.
Changing a banking system is not going to change the heart of mankind.......where there is a chance to grab power, there are many waiting for the chance. And power is, in the hands of man, generally not good--might be for a few, but by and large not. Money is nto the only way to obtain power.......but it is a powerful aphrodesiac.
rowdee posted on 2008-10-05 12:27:55 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
Changing a banking system is not going to change the heart of mankind... The point of our constitutional government was to limit the excesses of men, and it indeed worked for a time. We have a system for magnifying them in the Fed. These things have consequences. Men will be men, but when we give them fractional reserve banking and unlimited access to credit, all hell breaks loose. It's a worthy fight, even if it's only going to result in small reforms.
Changing a banking system is not going to change the heart of mankind...
The point of our constitutional government was to limit the excesses of men, and it indeed worked for a time. We have a system for magnifying them in the Fed. These things have consequences. Men will be men, but when we give them fractional reserve banking and unlimited access to credit, all hell breaks loose. It's a worthy fight, even if it's only going to result in small reforms.
buckeye posted on 2008-10-05 12:31:37 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
Building the military necessary to (attempt) world dominance requires currency that can be created instantly, and lots of it. I think you're right that it (killing in general) could (and in most cases would) continue on a much more local level. Only a change in the people's thinking will stop wars.
I think you're right that it (killing in general) could (and in most cases would) continue on a much more local level. Only a change in the people's thinking will stop wars.
noone222 posted on 2008-10-05 12:35:04 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
I don't presume to know what blood flows through each and every Jew in Israel....nor do I presume to know their heart. To be punished, God would have judged that they did not do as they were supposed to do.......otherwise it would be an odd God that would punish first, doncha think? Of course, this is not the final judgement."Real Jews".........was Jesus a real Jew? I ask because he came along long after the diaspora to Babylon, and certainly the Assyrian diaspora.Furthermore, there were jewish communities in many cities all over the place before the Khazar storyline. So exactly how do you determine who has the right 'blood'.......and are you speaking religiously or ethnically/racially? And lets see your proof that each and every one of them are not 'jews'.
To be punished, God would have judged that they did not do as they were supposed to do.......otherwise it would be an odd God that would punish first, doncha think? Of course, this is not the final judgement.
"Real Jews".........was Jesus a real Jew? I ask because he came along long after the diaspora to Babylon, and certainly the Assyrian diaspora.
Furthermore, there were jewish communities in many cities all over the place before the Khazar storyline. So exactly how do you determine who has the right 'blood'.......and are you speaking religiously or ethnically/racially? And lets see your proof that each and every one of them are not 'jews'.
rowdee posted on 2008-10-05 12:37:54 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
Do you truly believe you can recapture the early days of the Constitution? Truly? Because if you do, I'll sell you the London Bridge pretty cheap-- special deal cause you're a friend and all that..........
rowdee posted on 2008-10-05 12:40:21 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
I would imagine a corp of private contractors would work nicely...... :)
rowdee posted on 2008-10-05 12:45:50 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
I believe we can improve our situation if we try. I believe that not trying is not an option.
buckeye posted on 2008-10-05 12:46:44 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
Private contractors would rely upon "ready" funds ... the inter-connected central banks ability to create and issue currency out of thin air and "choose" who gets funded are directly responsible for global bullying.
noone222 posted on 2008-10-05 12:56:03 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
Do you truly believe you can recapture the early days of the Constitution? Imagine the critics the founding fathers faced. The British Empire had never been defeated, not really. It was a Leviathan, and functioned like a well-oiled machine when it encountered resistance. Only a small percentage of the colonists wanted to separate from it. They were ridiculed, taunted, and punished at first. But they persisted.
Do you truly believe you can recapture the early days of the Constitution?
Imagine the critics the founding fathers faced. The British Empire had never been defeated, not really. It was a Leviathan, and functioned like a well-oiled machine when it encountered resistance. Only a small percentage of the colonists wanted to separate from it. They were ridiculed, taunted, and punished at first. But they persisted.
buckeye posted on 2008-10-05 12:56:21 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
And lets see your proof that each and every one of them are not 'jews'. The relevant point would be whether they were ISRAELITES/HEBREWS ... most "jews" today are actually gentiles (ashkenazi descendants of Japeth) that have converted to Judaism, have no ethnic relationship to Abraham (who was not a Jew) or Jacob/Israel (who was not a Jew) ... and are not entitled to claim the inheritance belonging to Israelites.
And lets see your proof that each and every one of them are not 'jews'.
The relevant point would be whether they were ISRAELITES/HEBREWS ... most "jews" today are actually gentiles (ashkenazi descendants of Japeth) that have converted to Judaism, have no ethnic relationship to Abraham (who was not a Jew) or Jacob/Israel (who was not a Jew) ... and are not entitled to claim the inheritance belonging to Israelites.
noone222 posted on 2008-10-05 13:00:15 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
The British Empire had never been defeated, not really. It was a Leviathan, and functioned like a well-oiled machine when it encountered resistance. There are some that might say the Brits weren't defeated here either. That they simply employed a different strategy.
The British Empire had never been defeated, not really. It was a Leviathan, and functioned like a well-oiled machine when it encountered resistance.
There are some that might say the Brits weren't defeated here either. That they simply employed a different strategy.
noone222 posted on 2008-10-05 13:01:47 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
Superstition. I don't know of any valid genetic proof. In fact, Kevin MacDonald says that there is proof to the contrary. All groups making generally accepted claims to a Jewish heritage have common Jewish genetic markers.
buckeye posted on 2008-10-05 13:02:55 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
That they simply employed a different strategy. If this theory is true, then I'd say it was ineffectual, despite their meddling in our civil war, until the Fed was created.
That they simply employed a different strategy.
If this theory is true, then I'd say it was ineffectual, despite their meddling in our civil war, until the Fed was created.
buckeye posted on 2008-10-05 13:04:24 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
We had a different breed of men--and women--back then, buckeye. I can't fault you, for wanting to try. We've all been through or will go through the 'fire', so to speak, as we try to plot/change the course of rightness/wrongness--at least those who care will.Stay with your dreams, and hopes.
Stay with your dreams, and hopes.
rowdee posted on 2008-10-05 13:19:50 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
I've not closed the book on this assertion, as I continue to read and study. There is much confusion and bs because of how the words have been intermingled all these years, i.e., Israelite/Hebrew/Jew.And stick in there ashkenazi and sephardic and khazar and yiddish and all other sorts of 'stuff', like diasporas of both the northern and southern kingdoms--and more than one. And there's a lot to sort through.In the meantime, I'll refrain from hating and despising, nor will I gush with pride and wishful desire to be a part of the mess.....thats been my position all along. I'm on a quest for truth, as far as I can determine it.
And stick in there ashkenazi and sephardic and khazar and yiddish and all other sorts of 'stuff', like diasporas of both the northern and southern kingdoms--and more than one. And there's a lot to sort through.
In the meantime, I'll refrain from hating and despising, nor will I gush with pride and wishful desire to be a part of the mess.....thats been my position all along. I'm on a quest for truth, as far as I can determine it.
rowdee posted on 2008-10-05 13:30:52 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
I'm sickened to death ...all...who lay every friggin thing that ever went wrong in this old world on the shoulders of Jews...or Israelites. I find this fascinating. Clearly any investigation of the subject matter implictates zionist jewry as having a despicable hand in the thievery of this nation and other nations in this world and in the advancement of its ills. Read about the Rothschilds or Trotsky. Without understanding why and how events transpired, action toward fixing things is futile as it doesn't address the core of the problem. That's why the internet is so valuable to the people and so dangerous to the criminals.
I'm sickened to death ...all...who lay every friggin thing that ever went wrong in this old world on the shoulders of Jews...or Israelites.
I find this fascinating.
Clearly any investigation of the subject matter implictates zionist jewry as having a despicable hand in the thievery of this nation and other nations in this world and in the advancement of its ills.
Read about the Rothschilds or Trotsky.
Without understanding why and how events transpired, action toward fixing things is futile as it doesn't address the core of the problem. That's why the internet is so valuable to the people and so dangerous to the criminals.
angle posted on 2008-10-05 13:40:37 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
There has certainly been lots of time for inter-breeding between sephardic and ashkenazic people.
noone222 posted on 2008-10-05 14:23:56 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
Genesis 10 2The sons of Japheth; Gomer, and Magog, and Madai, and Javan, and Tubal, and Meshech, and Tiras. 3And the sons of Gomer; Ashkenaz, and Riphath, and Togarmah. 4And the sons of Javan; Elishah, and Tarshish, Kittim, and Ezekiel 38 (doesn't mention ashkenaz directly, but mentions the rest of the Japethetic lineage, Gomer and Togarmah) 1 The word of the LORD came to me: 2 "Son of man, set your face against Gog, of the land of Magog, the chief prince of [a] Meshech and Tubal; prophesy against him 3 and say: 'This is what the Sovereign LORD says: I am against you, O Gog, chief prince of [b] Meshech and Tubal. 4 I will turn you around, put hooks in your jaws and bring you out with your whole armyyour horses, your horsemen fully armed, and a great horde with large and small shields, all of them brandishing their swords. 5 Persia, Cush [c] and Put will be with them, all with shields and helmets, 6 also Gomer with all its troops, and Beth Togarmah from the far north with all its troopsthe many nations with you. Genesis simply describes the descendants of Japeth, while Ezekiel describes THE ENEMIES OF ISRAEL in the last times !
2The sons of Japheth; Gomer, and Magog, and Madai, and Javan, and Tubal, and Meshech, and Tiras.
3And the sons of Gomer; Ashkenaz, and Riphath, and Togarmah.
4And the sons of Javan; Elishah, and Tarshish, Kittim, and
Ezekiel 38 (doesn't mention ashkenaz directly, but mentions the rest of the Japethetic lineage, Gomer and Togarmah)
1 The word of the LORD came to me: 2 "Son of man, set your face against Gog, of the land of Magog, the chief prince of [a] Meshech and Tubal; prophesy against him 3 and say: 'This is what the Sovereign LORD says: I am against you, O Gog, chief prince of [b] Meshech and Tubal. 4 I will turn you around, put hooks in your jaws and bring you out with your whole armyyour horses, your horsemen fully armed, and a great horde with large and small shields, all of them brandishing their swords. 5 Persia, Cush [c] and Put will be with them, all with shields and helmets, 6 also Gomer with all its troops, and Beth Togarmah from the far north with all its troopsthe many nations with you.
Genesis simply describes the descendants of Japeth, while Ezekiel describes THE ENEMIES OF ISRAEL in the last times !
noone222 posted on 2008-10-05 14:36:06 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
Oh puleeze............I have read til my eyes have gotten tired. And please note I said 'everything' in this world, not just financial.I have not written the concept off--either way. I have said I'm sick to death of it, and I maintain that I am sick of it, and will continue to be sick of it. I daresay most do not know whereof they speak, and at best many just utter words they've seen elsewhere, without having done their homework.This no way implies that you have or haven't......I'm merely stating my opinion--based on observations I've made over time.
I have not written the concept off--either way. I have said I'm sick to death of it, and I maintain that I am sick of it, and will continue to be sick of it. I daresay most do not know whereof they speak, and at best many just utter words they've seen elsewhere, without having done their homework.
This no way implies that you have or haven't......I'm merely stating my opinion--based on observations I've made over time.
rowdee posted on 2008-10-05 15:46:40 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
noone, I've read this............I believe it. And Genesis also says, in 9:27 that God would enlarge Japeth and he would live in the tents of Shem--this was after Shem and Japeth clothed Noah's nakedness. Thus a familial relationship developed between these two tribes.That said, I've also read where when the kingdoms split that NOT ALL the northern tribes went into exile via Assyria==they went elsewhere, and they went southward, like as towards Judea.Furthermore, as trade developed, one saw Israelites, including Judeans, forming communities all over the known world..and that was before Christ was born. Do you have information that none of the Judeans went into Europe? Do you have information showing there was no intermarriage between 'shirttail relatives'. Can you prove that everyone in Israel is NOT of the tribe of Judah? Recall that Abraham, as well as Isaac sent for wives for their son(s) or sent the son(s) themselves to marry relatives in PadanAram. Scriptures talk often about 'remnants'....and that God will not forget the remnants. EVen when Nebuchadnezzar took the Judeans away into Babylon, not all Judeans were taken......some escaped into the desert, and some were left behind, and some were out of the area at the time of Jerusalem being taken.
That said, I've also read where when the kingdoms split that NOT ALL the northern tribes went into exile via Assyria==they went elsewhere, and they went southward, like as towards Judea.
Furthermore, as trade developed, one saw Israelites, including Judeans, forming communities all over the known world..and that was before Christ was born. Do you have information that none of the Judeans went into Europe? Do you have information showing there was no intermarriage between 'shirttail relatives'. Can you prove that everyone in Israel is NOT of the tribe of Judah? Recall that Abraham, as well as Isaac sent for wives for their son(s) or sent the son(s) themselves to marry relatives in PadanAram.
Scriptures talk often about 'remnants'....and that God will not forget the remnants. EVen when Nebuchadnezzar took the Judeans away into Babylon, not all Judeans were taken......some escaped into the desert, and some were left behind, and some were out of the area at the time of Jerusalem being taken.
rowdee posted on 2008-10-05 16:03:14 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
Evangelical Christians put George W. Bush in the White house twice. That's assuming that the vote was an honest one.
Evangelical Christians put George W. Bush in the White house twice.
That's assuming that the vote was an honest one.
Ahmadinejad in 2008!
bluegrass posted on 2008-10-05 16:22:04 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
it was as honest as bush's declaration of born again christianity.
Do You Know What Freedom Really Means? Freedom4um.com
christine posted on 2008-10-05 16:51:24 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
LOL!
bluegrass posted on 2008-10-05 17:04:13 ET (1 image) Reply Trace Private Reply
Evangelical Christians put George W. Bush in the White house twice. That's assuming that the vote was an honest one. Well enough of them brought him close enough anyway. I was stunned to see people in the community have McPalin signs on their front yard, today. Wow, what a mindset.
Well enough of them brought him close enough anyway. I was stunned to see people in the community have McPalin signs on their front yard, today. Wow, what a mindset.
angle posted on 2008-10-05 17:43:25 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
Can you add a propeller to the Bush beanie??? He was a pilot you know during Vietnam war.
He was a pilot you know during Vietnam war.
Cynicom posted on 2008-10-05 17:45:09 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
I was stunned to see people in the community have McPalin signs on their front yard, today. In my part of the country, the cities nearby are Obama territory with the occasional McCain sign but all of the rural areas sport 100% McCain/Palin signs.
I was stunned to see people in the community have McPalin signs on their front yard, today.
In my part of the country, the cities nearby are Obama territory with the occasional McCain sign but all of the rural areas sport 100% McCain/Palin signs.
bluegrass posted on 2008-10-05 17:58:43 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
Bush thinks they're wearing Mouseketeer hats.
bluegrass posted on 2008-10-05 18:00:01 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
And Genesis also says, in 9:27 that God would enlarge Japeth and he would live in the tents of Shem--this was after Shem and Japeth clothed Noah's nakedness. Thus a familial relationship developed between these two tribes. This has absolutely nothing to do with Abraham or promises made to his descendants. [Older Bibles used to have a map that showed Ham locating in Africa, Shem in the Middle-East and Japeth in Eastern Europe/Asia]. Ezekiel 38 is end times prophecy, and this book names the enemies of (true) Israel and it's not likely that the enemy of Israel would be Israel itself, is it ??? You ask for proof that inter-marriages didn't occur. We can assume that they did occur. The better question regarding "proof" should be asked of those that have invaded and have committed genocide against the Palestinians for the sake of installing some Eastern European/Russian people calling themselves Jews there. These People should have had PROOF that they descended from Abraham if they were to be given land Biblically promised to his descendants. [However, you're mentioning the tribe of Judah indicates that you're thinking that the State of Israel should have been instituted for the benefit of one tribe (maybe 2 if you count Benjamin) of 12 that were to share the promise doesn't it ]? Can you name one other nation founded by international force in support of a biblical claim ??? International Law has never upheld scriptural claims by force. The UN (God's enemy) has never supported scripture, but mandated this Jew fraud. Yes, Japeth does reside in the tents of Shem. That's why the Ashkenazi Jews (Japethites) are all over our government. No one can definitively say that inter-marriages didn't occur. It is pretty common knowledge that they were frowned upon clear up until this generation in America. Marriage licenses were instituted in America to LEGALIZE inter- marriage between blacks and whites, even though there were marriages between Indians and American settlers that weren't LICENSED. The establishment of the State of Israel should have required definitive proof of the claim made that these people were RETURNING to a land they or their ancestors once occupied. This proof was never required and has never been demonstrated even though millions have died. The Ashkenazi branch weren't converted to Judaism until 750 AD. Lastly, to institute/impose a SECULAR NATION STATE by invasion and warfare against an indigenous population that can prove they have lived there for well over a thousand years, based upon a religious determination contained in the Torah/Bible, a RELIGIOUS belief system NOT SHARED UNIVERSALLY, based upon an UNWITNESSED PROMISE, made by an INVISIBLE GOD, to a man 4000 years ago IS BEYOND LUDICROUS and most certainly an international CRIME committed by an international bully called the U.S. and Britain. However, to be completely truthful, Britain had a legitimate claim as the British (Brit-Ish means covenant man in Hebrew) are descendants of Abraham through Isaac, Israel, Judah. I believe they lost their claim based upon promises made to Abraham just like any other nation would if they departed the area for whatever reason.
And Genesis also says, in 9:27 that God would enlarge Japeth and he would live in the tents of Shem--this was after Shem and Japeth clothed Noah's nakedness. Thus a familial relationship developed between these two tribes.
This has absolutely nothing to do with Abraham or promises made to his descendants. [Older Bibles used to have a map that showed Ham locating in Africa, Shem in the Middle-East and Japeth in Eastern Europe/Asia].
Ezekiel 38 is end times prophecy, and this book names the enemies of (true) Israel and it's not likely that the enemy of Israel would be Israel itself, is it ??? You ask for proof that inter-marriages didn't occur. We can assume that they did occur.
The better question regarding "proof" should be asked of those that have invaded and have committed genocide against the Palestinians for the sake of installing some Eastern European/Russian people calling themselves Jews there. These People should have had PROOF that they descended from Abraham if they were to be given land Biblically promised to his descendants. [However, you're mentioning the tribe of Judah indicates that you're thinking that the State of Israel should have been instituted for the benefit of one tribe (maybe 2 if you count Benjamin) of 12 that were to share the promise doesn't it ]?
Can you name one other nation founded by international force in support of a biblical claim ???
International Law has never upheld scriptural claims by force. The UN (God's enemy) has never supported scripture, but mandated this Jew fraud.
Yes, Japeth does reside in the tents of Shem. That's why the Ashkenazi Jews (Japethites) are all over our government.
No one can definitively say that inter-marriages didn't occur. It is pretty common knowledge that they were frowned upon clear up until this generation in America. Marriage licenses were instituted in America to LEGALIZE inter- marriage between blacks and whites, even though there were marriages between Indians and American settlers that weren't LICENSED.
The establishment of the State of Israel should have required definitive proof of the claim made that these people were RETURNING to a land they or their ancestors once occupied. This proof was never required and has never been demonstrated even though millions have died. The Ashkenazi branch weren't converted to Judaism until 750 AD.
Lastly, to institute/impose a SECULAR NATION STATE by invasion and warfare against an indigenous population that can prove they have lived there for well over a thousand years, based upon a religious determination contained in the Torah/Bible, a RELIGIOUS belief system NOT SHARED UNIVERSALLY, based upon an UNWITNESSED PROMISE, made by an INVISIBLE GOD, to a man 4000 years ago IS BEYOND LUDICROUS and most certainly an international CRIME committed by an international bully called the U.S. and Britain.
However, to be completely truthful, Britain had a legitimate claim as the British (Brit-Ish means covenant man in Hebrew) are descendants of Abraham through Isaac, Israel, Judah. I believe they lost their claim based upon promises made to Abraham just like any other nation would if they departed the area for whatever reason.
noone222 posted on 2008-10-05 19:36:33 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
Can you add a propeller to the Bush beanie??? He was a pilot you know during Vietnam war. ROTFLMAO!
ROTFLMAO!
rowdee posted on 2008-10-05 20:50:25 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
Believe as YOU wish, noone........And a lot of good it does to sit here some 60 odd years later and debate what should/shouldn't/could/couldn't/would/wouldn't be done is what is ludricous. They didn't as you nor I what should have been done, did they?YOu should recall that Doc said so many times that God has his own way of doing things, and that they are not mans ways. As vehemently as you fight it, there is the chance that this is, indeed, God's will being worked in one of those 'mysterious' ways. He certainly won't be asking you or I for our approval or agreement. Why, we might evene have gotten that damnable Dubya because God was trying to get a point across, or something...........geeze.......imagine that.
And a lot of good it does to sit here some 60 odd years later and debate what should/shouldn't/could/couldn't/would/wouldn't be done is what is ludricous. They didn't as you nor I what should have been done, did they?
YOu should recall that Doc said so many times that God has his own way of doing things, and that they are not mans ways. As vehemently as you fight it, there is the chance that this is, indeed, God's will being worked in one of those 'mysterious' ways. He certainly won't be asking you or I for our approval or agreement. Why, we might evene have gotten that damnable Dubya because God was trying to get a point across, or something...........geeze.......imagine that.
rowdee posted on 2008-10-05 20:58:52 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
Bernhardt would get a kick out of this. I wasn't going to vote for McCain anyway, but... I simply can't imagine having a funny-talking African pastor.
I wasn't going to vote for McCain anyway, but... I simply can't imagine having a funny-talking African pastor.
...Both methods yielded similar results, which support the previous findings; that is, of all modern human samples, sub-Saharan Africans again exhibit the closest phenetic similarity to various African Plio-Pleistocene hominins... Ancient teeth and modern human origins: An expanded comparison of African Plio-Pleistocene and recent world dental samples, Journal of Human Evolution Volume 45, Issue 2, August 2003, Pages 113-144
Tauzero posted on 2008-10-06 1:46:06 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
And now that you brought it up, what exactly is wrong with getting all the prayers that you can? Admonishing us not to be like the heathens with their vain repetitions, who think they will be heard for their much speaking -- for the Lord knows of what ye have need before ye ask -- Jesus gave one prayer, today known as the Lord's Prayer. All else is heathen, IMO.
And now that you brought it up, what exactly is wrong with getting all the prayers that you can?
Admonishing us not to be like the heathens with their vain repetitions, who think they will be heard for their much speaking -- for the Lord knows of what ye have need before ye ask -- Jesus gave one prayer, today known as the Lord's Prayer.
All else is heathen, IMO.
Tauzero posted on 2008-10-06 1:51:31 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
but until the heart/conscience of mankind is changed N.B. There is no word for that in Hebrew, and the Bible says that the nations will be redeemed, not some amorphous mass.
but until the heart/conscience of mankind is changed
N.B. There is no word for that in Hebrew, and the Bible says that the nations will be redeemed, not some amorphous mass.
Tauzero posted on 2008-10-06 2:03:11 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
And a lot of good it does to sit here some 60 odd years later and debate And a lot of good it does to sit here some 60 odd years later and debate what should/shouldn't/could/couldn't/would/wouldn't be done is what is ludricous. They didn't ask you nor I what should have been done, did they? There are still people being slaughtered and WW III looms large because of the State of Israel. Palestinian kids throwing rocks at tanks proves that the debate isn't over. Maybe we should ASK even though they haven't asked us. Taxpayers are expected to financially support this foreign state and should have a voice. My generation is supposed to stand still for the mistakes of those prior generations ??? I think the Federal Reserve System, The Income Tax and the State of Israel are just three examples of errors we have a duty to correct. What about future generations being forced to accept our errors ? $850 Billion or more bailout of criminal bankers comes immediately to mind. YOu should recall that Doc said so many times that God has his own way of doing things, and that they are not mans ways. As vehemently as you fight it, there is the chance that this is, indeed, God's will being worked in one of those 'mysterious' ways. He certainly won't be asking you or I for our approval or agreement. Why, we might evene have gotten that damnable Dubya because God was trying to get a point across, or something...........geeze.......imagine that. This last comment referencing Doc is of a fatalist nature . The conditions causing so much dissatisfaction today exist because so many were willing to accept or go along to get along with bad decisions made in their name. My vehement fight is against those claiming that the State of Israel is fulfillment of scripture. My prayers conclude with "your (God's) will be done, not mine" ... so, please don't confuse my position as one opposed to God's because it is in opposition to those claiming a scriptural basis for establishing the State of Israel. (Doc also said that we needn't leave our brain at the door). Doc tip-toed around this (Jewish) issue and probably for very good reasons. Being tagged as a proponent of "British- Israelism" or "Christian Identity" being the primary one, in my opinion. He did say "don't throw the baby out with the bath water". [Here I agree with Doc, and am not a Christian Identity or British-Israelism proponent, just a Bible student that thinks it important that we separate God's Will from what scripture states because by confusing the two things we may be imposing our will based upon a false understanding of scripture.] Truth being the all important issue for me since God said "I am Truth". Whether the State of Israel is God's will or not (which it very well might be) has no bearing upon what the BIBLE ACTUALLY SAYS or what people believe or what's acceptable according to man's secular (International) law. If one is to believe the Bible is God's word, then one should believe what it "actually" says. The end times prophecy of Ezekiel leaves very little room for interpretation as regards who are the enemies of Israel and it happens that they are primarily Japeth's descendants along with the Arabs. To think that these named enemies of Israel are at the same time Israel itself is an impossibility and NOT BIBLICAL. The scripture that most Christians resort to when confronted about this subject is one where God tells Abraham that anyone cursing "HIS DESCENDANTS" (here most Christians insert the word Jews, which isn't Biblical and Abraham's descendants weren't Jews with the possible exception of the single tribe of Judah) will be cursed. This one scripture being misinterpreted causes many people to ignore the terrible deeds done by the so-called Jews, when Jesus instructed his followers to judge them (everyone) by their deeds. Judge the tree by its fruit. If this is applied to the State of Israel as we know it today it is a poison apple, instituted through fraud and murder by men not God. The conclusion being drawn amongst Christian/Zionist supporters of the State of Israel while unproven is that modern day Jews are actually descended from Abraham (which according to Christ/God would mean that they would hear Christ's voice but can't because they are not of his and are primarily atheists) and at best would make-up only two of the twelve tribes given the promise. These disputations relative to scripture should be based upon solid scriptural evidence and not upon interpretations of men. Even then, these scriptural determinations between Christians, even if agreed upon, shouldn't have any more effect upon International Law than other religious writings that are sometimes believed by more people than believe the Bible. In other words, the my God is bigger than your God theory would rule the day and the religious choice of the victor would (and has been) be imposed upon non-believers. [What people choose to believe and what is truth are very often two completely different things aren't they ?] Let me be clear in what I'm saying. If you were to ask me if I believe that the State of Israel's existence is God's Will, I would answer "it exists so it must be God's Will" with this caveat, it exists by and through fraud contrary to traditional practices of law, defies logic, has man's finger prints all over it, has been a boil upon mankind since its inception, and I don't think it has a basis in scripture. That is not to say it isn't God's Will. Why, we might evene have gotten that damnable Dubya because God was trying to get a point across No argument from me about this statement at all. If something exists its difficult, if not impossible, to say it does so in opposition to God's Will. However, just because something might be God's Will doesn't make it scriptural. We are admonished to study the scriptures to "show ourselves approved". When the issue of Abrahamic Covenant vs. The State of Israel is thoroughly studied we can hardly avoid noticing that the people we call Jews today haven't fulfilled any of the promises contained therein. The tendency within Christianity is to simply accept the teachings of men to the exclusion of scripture. Simply put, God's Will is one thing and Scriptural (documentation) evidence is another. If, as in your case, you want to believe that the State of Israel is God's Will I wouldn't argue for a second. If you said that the State of Israel as we see it today is scriptural, I'd say I think you're wrong.
And a lot of good it does to sit here some 60 odd years later and debate And a lot of good it does to sit here some 60 odd years later and debate what should/shouldn't/could/couldn't/would/wouldn't be done is what is ludricous. They didn't ask you nor I what should have been done, did they?
And a lot of good it does to sit here some 60 odd years later and debate what should/shouldn't/could/couldn't/would/wouldn't be done is what is ludricous. They didn't ask you nor I what should have been done, did they?
There are still people being slaughtered and WW III looms large because of the State of Israel. Palestinian kids throwing rocks at tanks proves that the debate isn't over. Maybe we should ASK even though they haven't asked us. Taxpayers are expected to financially support this foreign state and should have a voice.
My generation is supposed to stand still for the mistakes of those prior generations ??? I think the Federal Reserve System, The Income Tax and the State of Israel are just three examples of errors we have a duty to correct.
What about future generations being forced to accept our errors ? $850 Billion or more bailout of criminal bankers comes immediately to mind.
This last comment referencing Doc is of a fatalist nature . The conditions causing so much dissatisfaction today exist because so many were willing to accept or go along to get along with bad decisions made in their name. My vehement fight is against those claiming that the State of Israel is fulfillment of scripture. My prayers conclude with "your (God's) will be done, not mine" ... so, please don't confuse my position as one opposed to God's because it is in opposition to those claiming a scriptural basis for establishing the State of Israel.
(Doc also said that we needn't leave our brain at the door). Doc tip-toed around this (Jewish) issue and probably for very good reasons. Being tagged as a proponent of "British- Israelism" or "Christian Identity" being the primary one, in my opinion. He did say "don't throw the baby out with the bath water". [Here I agree with Doc, and am not a Christian Identity or British-Israelism proponent, just a Bible student that thinks it important that we separate God's Will from what scripture states because by confusing the two things we may be imposing our will based upon a false understanding of scripture.] Truth being the all important issue for me since God said "I am Truth".
Whether the State of Israel is God's will or not (which it very well might be) has no bearing upon what the BIBLE ACTUALLY SAYS or what people believe or what's acceptable according to man's secular (International) law.
If one is to believe the Bible is God's word, then one should believe what it "actually" says. The end times prophecy of Ezekiel leaves very little room for interpretation as regards who are the enemies of Israel and it happens that they are primarily Japeth's descendants along with the Arabs. To think that these named enemies of Israel are at the same time Israel itself is an impossibility and NOT BIBLICAL.
The scripture that most Christians resort to when confronted about this subject is one where God tells Abraham that anyone cursing "HIS DESCENDANTS" (here most Christians insert the word Jews, which isn't Biblical and Abraham's descendants weren't Jews with the possible exception of the single tribe of Judah) will be cursed. This one scripture being misinterpreted causes many people to ignore the terrible deeds done by the so-called Jews, when Jesus instructed his followers to judge them (everyone) by their deeds. Judge the tree by its fruit. If this is applied to the State of Israel as we know it today it is a poison apple, instituted through fraud and murder by men not God.
The conclusion being drawn amongst Christian/Zionist supporters of the State of Israel while unproven is that modern day Jews are actually descended from Abraham (which according to Christ/God would mean that they would hear Christ's voice but can't because they are not of his and are primarily atheists) and at best would make-up only two of the twelve tribes given the promise.
These disputations relative to scripture should be based upon solid scriptural evidence and not upon interpretations of men. Even then, these scriptural determinations between Christians, even if agreed upon, shouldn't have any more effect upon International Law than other religious writings that are sometimes believed by more people than believe the Bible. In other words, the my God is bigger than your God theory would rule the day and the religious choice of the victor would (and has been) be imposed upon non-believers. [What people choose to believe and what is truth are very often two completely different things aren't they ?]
Let me be clear in what I'm saying. If you were to ask me if I believe that the State of Israel's existence is God's Will, I would answer "it exists so it must be God's Will" with this caveat, it exists by and through fraud contrary to traditional practices of law, defies logic, has man's finger prints all over it, has been a boil upon mankind since its inception, and I don't think it has a basis in scripture. That is not to say it isn't God's Will.
Why, we might evene have gotten that damnable Dubya because God was trying to get a point across
No argument from me about this statement at all. If something exists its difficult, if not impossible, to say it does so in opposition to God's Will. However, just because something might be God's Will doesn't make it scriptural.
We are admonished to study the scriptures to "show ourselves approved". When the issue of Abrahamic Covenant vs. The State of Israel is thoroughly studied we can hardly avoid noticing that the people we call Jews today haven't fulfilled any of the promises contained therein. The tendency within Christianity is to simply accept the teachings of men to the exclusion of scripture. Simply put, God's Will is one thing and Scriptural (documentation) evidence is another.
If, as in your case, you want to believe that the State of Israel is God's Will I wouldn't argue for a second. If you said that the State of Israel as we see it today is scriptural, I'd say I think you're wrong.
noone222 posted on 2008-10-06 5:01:40 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
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