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Title: Candidates differ on female draft
Source: [None]
URL Source: http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/0828 ... 82-470.stm?cmpid=elections.xml
Published: Oct 13, 2008
Author: Jerome L. Sherman
Post Date: 2008-10-13 13:04:07 by christine
Keywords: None
Views: 415
Comments: 40

Even as the U.S. confronts two long wars, neither Sen. John McCain nor Sen. Barack Obama believes the country should take the politically perilous step of reviving the military draft.

But the two presidential candidates disagree on a key foundation of any future draft: Mr. Obama supports a requirement for both men and women to register with the Selective Service, while Mr. McCain doesn't think women should have to register.

Also, Mr. Obama would consider officially opening combat positions to women. Mr. McCain would not.

"Women are already serving in combat [in Iraq and Afghanistan] and the current policy should be updated to reflect realities on the ground," said Wendy Morigi, Mr. Obama's national security spokeswoman. "Barack Obama would consult with military commanders to review the constraints that remain."

According to his campaign, Mr. McCain supports the current Department of Defense restrictions on women in combat units, including armor, field artillery and special forces.

In 1980, President Jimmy Carter revived the Selective Service system, which compiles a list of nearly all men in the U.S. between 18 and 25 in case a crisis forces the government to undertake a massive expansion of the military.

Both Congress and the Supreme Court have exempted women from registration because of the combat rules.

For years, that position has rankled some women's rights groups and men who face penalties for not registering -- including loss of employment with the federal government -- at a time when female soldiers regularly find themselves in dangerous situations in Iraq and Afghanistan, both conflicts without defined battlefields.

Mr. McCain, a decorated former Navy pilot who spent five years as a prisoner of war in Vietnam, speaks often of how his military service has helped prepare him for the role of commander in chief and how his time as a captive in Hanoi reinforced his love of country.

Yet he doesn't want to see a return to mandatory service, for men or women, according to his presidential campaign.

"Sen. McCain strongly believes that an all-volunteer force is preferable to a conscripted force," said Paul Lindsay, a spokesman for the campaign. "The tools available to recruiters have historically enabled the all-volunteer force to attract sufficient numbers of qualified recruits."

His views are echoed by many high-ranking officers in the military, who prefer a force of motivated volunteers. But some of the same officers have also expressed concerns about the strains of more than six years of sustained combat in Afghanistan and Iraq, especially if the U.S. commitment in both countries doesn't end in the near future.

Mr. Obama has said repeatedly that he will draw down the U.S. military presence in Iraq if he becomes president, but he has also said he would increase the number of troops in Afghanistan, where Taliban forces have seen a resurgence in recent years.

During a CNN/YouTube debate for Democratic presidential candidates last year, he said he doesn't "agree" with the draft.

But he did say women should be expected to register with the Selective Service, comparing the role of women to black soldiers and airmen who served during World War II, when the armed forces were still segregated.

"There was a time when African-Americans weren't allowed to serve in combat," Mr. Obama said. "And yet, when they did, not only did they perform brilliantly, but what also happened is they helped to change America, and they helped to underscore that we're equal.

"And I think that if women are registered for service -- not necessarily in combat roles, and I don't agree with the draft -- I think it will help to send a message to my two daughters that they've got obligations to this great country as well as boys do."

Elaine Donnelly, a former member of President Bill Clinton's Commission on the Assignment of Women in the Armed Forces, dismissed Mr. Obama's comparison of the roles of women and black soldiers, arguing that males and females, in general, aren't equal on the battlefield.

"There are differences between men and women where physical strength is an issue," said Ms. Donnelly, who heads the nonpartisan Center for Military Readiness. "There are a lot of civilian feminists who are making unreasonable demands on the military."

Nancy Duff Campbell, co-president of the National Women's Law Center, argues that women should have a chance to compete for any position in the armed forces.

"I hope a new president will revisit the restrictions," she said.

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#1. To: christine, nikki, RidinShotgun, Jethro tull, lodwick (#0)

Mr. Obama supports a requirement for both men and women to register with the Selective Service,

I am with Obama on this one, make all the ladies at 18 register. Then when he passes a draft make all ladies to age 65 register for the draft.

Wonderful idea. I am considering voting for Obummer.

Cynicom  posted on  2008-10-13   13:16:49 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#2. To: Cynicom (#1)

Does anybody besides me wonder when they'll load on the last straw?

RidinShotgun  posted on  2008-10-13   13:23:09 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#3. To: Cynicom (#1)

Have a universal draft for ages 55 - 85 and see how wars would be fought.

Can you say zero?

Iran Truth Now!

Lod  posted on  2008-10-13   13:23:31 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#4. To: RidinShotgun, lodwick (#2)

last straw?

When the draft or mandatory "volunteer service" becomes law, the end is near.

The Camels back will break.

Cynicom  posted on  2008-10-13   13:26:12 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#5. To: lodwick (#3)

Sir Lod...

Correction...I should have said...women...not ladies register.

Not too many ladies around anymore.

Cynicom  posted on  2008-10-13   13:27:39 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#6. To: Cynicom (#4)

The Camels back will break.

While the camel stands there chewing his cud (do camels chew their cud?), patiently waiting for his back to break.

RidinShotgun  posted on  2008-10-13   13:29:58 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#7. To: Cynicom. all (#5)

Women are born: ladies are made.

Iran Truth Now!

Lod  posted on  2008-10-13   13:32:15 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#8. To: RidinShotgun (#6)

The camel is a cud-chewing mammal of the family Camelidae, order Artiodactyla

Cynicom  posted on  2008-10-13   13:33:17 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#9. To: Cynicom (#8)

Artiodactyla

You do and you'll clean it up!

RidinShotgun  posted on  2008-10-13   13:36:06 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#10. To: christine (#0)

Viva La Differance!

However, there is a difference and reality has a way of biting those who try to ignore it.

It is not by accident that human cultures evolved around the protection of women and children. They are both the most vulnerable and the most necessary to the continuance of a society and culture. Not that men are without value, as some lesbian feminazis would like to pretend in their psychotic hatred of men, but that a large percentage of the male population could be wiped out and the culture survives. This has happened over and over again in history where a major percentage of the male population was wiped out in various insane wars and the population into the next generation was still larger. Thus in our culture it has been enshrined that it is the responsibility of the strongest, men, to defend the weakest - women and children. It is a survival characteristic and that is why cultures who follow that expand and those who do not - contract and eventually die. It is not, as lesbian feminazis would contend (and per member census 50% of the membership of "N.O.W." are lesbians), that it is done with intent to make women subservient, although that is one result within some social groups - but is not the original reason, but to practice the most survivable arrangement.

However, perversely if a draft and forced conscription were revived equality of opportunity for enslavement in uniform would be most excellent. Why? Because the level of opposition would be all that much greater.

"The difference between an honorable man and a moral man is that an honorable man regrets a discreditable act even when it has worked and he is in no danger of being caught." ~ H. L. Mencken

Original_Intent  posted on  2008-10-13   13:38:31 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#11. To: lodwick, Cynicom, all (#7)

Women are born: ladies are made.

Made?

"The difference between an honorable man and a moral man is that an honorable man regrets a discreditable act even when it has worked and he is in no danger of being caught." ~ H. L. Mencken

Original_Intent  posted on  2008-10-13   13:40:41 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#12. To: Original_Intent (#11)

Made?

OI...

Shame on you, dont go there.

Cynicom  posted on  2008-10-13   13:41:39 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#13. To: Original_Intent (#11)

Well, that too.

I should have put a 'non-Biblical' disclaimer in there.

Iran Truth Now!

Lod  posted on  2008-10-13   13:42:47 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#14. To: Original_Intent (#11)

Women are born: ladies are made. Made?

Seems to me that too many female types think they have to be made UP in order to qualify as ladies. Fakeness from head to toe.

RidinShotgun  posted on  2008-10-13   13:47:52 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#15. To: lodwick, Original_Intent (#13)

I should have put a 'non-Biblical' disclaimer in there.

OI should have to sit in the corner for that one. Cap and all.

Cynicom  posted on  2008-10-13   13:48:12 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#16. To: Cynicom (#12)

OI...

Shame on you, dont go there.

Thank you. I resemble that remark.

"The difference between an honorable man and a moral man is that an honorable man regrets a discreditable act even when it has worked and he is in no danger of being caught." ~ H. L. Mencken

Original_Intent  posted on  2008-10-13   13:49:20 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#17. To: Cynicom, lodwick (#15)

OI should have to sit in the corner for that one. Cap and all.

Hee, hee, hee.

"The difference between an honorable man and a moral man is that an honorable man regrets a discreditable act even when it has worked and he is in no danger of being caught." ~ H. L. Mencken

Original_Intent  posted on  2008-10-13   13:50:32 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#18. To: RidinShotgun (#14)

Seems to me that too many female types think they have to be made UP in order to qualify as ladies. Fakeness from head to toe.

This is true, and it can be done tastefully, or tastelessly.

However, if a woman is using most standard cosmetics she is poisoning herself with their use.

Reference: "Beauty to Die For" by Carol Selmon

"The difference between an honorable man and a moral man is that an honorable man regrets a discreditable act even when it has worked and he is in no danger of being caught." ~ H. L. Mencken

Original_Intent  posted on  2008-10-13   13:54:49 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#19. To: lodwick, RidinShotgun (#13)

Ancient History...(Lod and me)

When FDR came out with the draft in 1940, I think the cutoff age was 40 or such. My Grandfather was a great FDR fan. Then when the age was upped to 65, Grandfather was 63 and had to register. FDR was then a rotten SOB.

If you look around on gubmint internet you can find where your parents and grandparents had to register. Registration is also there for WW1.

I know worthless info but I found many names in reading the lists.

Cynicom  posted on  2008-10-13   14:04:37 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#20. To: Original_Intent (#18)

Agree completely, its the whole beauty is only skin deep philosophy that encourages women to discount their health and plaster it on.

On the other hand, I'm sure all those lovely new recruits would want to look their best while killing off all of our imagined enemies far and wide with big manly rifles.

RidinShotgun  posted on  2008-10-13   14:17:47 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#21. To: Cynicom (#19)

My grandparents died of old age long before I came along, but not too many of my direct line were ever listed on any military rolls. Maybe they were just lucky, or maybe they were lovers, not fighters.

FDR was a rotten SOB, period, right down to the bone. Just because your grandfather wised up to him a little too late had nothing to do with it. Its just another case of too soon old, too late smart and we're all subject to learning hard lessons the hard way.

RidinShotgun  posted on  2008-10-13   14:30:29 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#22. To: RidinShotgun (#21)

Its just another case of too soon old, too late smart...

One of my late mother's very favorite sayings...I'm now olde enough to concur.

Iran Truth Now!

Lod  posted on  2008-10-13   14:35:36 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#23. To: lodwick (#22)

One of my late mother's very favorite sayings...I'm now olde enough to concur.

Mine too. Me too.

RidinShotgun  posted on  2008-10-13   14:37:13 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#24. To: RidinShotgun (#20)

Agree completely, its the whole beauty is only skin deep philosophy that encourages women to discount their health and plaster it on.

Unfortunately true - one need only look at "Women's Magazines" to see the massive bombardment of women with Psychologically Designed advertising to make them feel inadequate unless they are wearing the latest "War Paint and Feathers".

On the other hand, I'm sure all those lovely new recruits would want to look their best while killing off all of our imagined enemies far and wide with big manly rifles.

I can see it on the cover of "Cover Girl" now: "The Fall BDU Collection".

"The difference between an honorable man and a moral man is that an honorable man regrets a discreditable act even when it has worked and he is in no danger of being caught." ~ H. L. Mencken

Original_Intent  posted on  2008-10-13   14:42:58 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#25. To: christine (#0)

But the two presidential candidates disagree on a key foundation of any future draft: Mr. Obama supports a requirement for both men and women to register with the Selective Service, while Mr. McCain doesn't think women should have to register.

LOL! They're really reaching to look for ANY differences.

Obama wants to bomb Pakistan. McCain wants to bomb Iran. There's a huge difference. : )

Ahmadinejad in 2008!

bluegrass  posted on  2008-10-13   14:47:38 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#26. To: bluegrass (#25)

LOL! They're really reaching to look for ANY differences.

Obama wants to bomb Pakistan. McCain wants to bomb Iran. There's a huge difference. : )

The united war party has really lost its touch if they can't figure out a way to get their enemies to attack each other.

RidinShotgun  posted on  2008-10-13   15:28:32 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#27. To: RidinShotgun (#26)

I think the world has finally caught onto the "let's you and him fight" technique.

Ahmadinejad in 2008!

bluegrass  posted on  2008-10-13   15:39:12 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#28. To: bluegrass (#27)

Well maybe that's true except for americans who still march off to fight Israel's enemies for them.

RidinShotgun  posted on  2008-10-13   15:43:37 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#29. To: bluegrass, nikki, RidinShotgun, lodwick (#25)

Obama wants to bomb Pakistan. McCain wants to bomb Iran. There's a huge difference. : )

I will vote for the hero that wants to BOMB Washington. (With all the criminals in residence)

Cynicom  posted on  2008-10-13   15:52:14 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#30. To: Cynicom (#29)

I'll second that!

RidinShotgun  posted on  2008-10-13   15:54:44 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#31. To: Cynicom (#29)

The rest of the world agrees with you.

Iran Truth Now!

Lod  posted on  2008-10-13   15:59:40 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#32. To: christine (#0)

It's the end. That one isn't even listed here under the injustices we would have to endure:

1 Samuel 8:11
And he said, This will be the manner of the king that shall reign over you: He will take your sons, and appoint them for himself, for his chariots, ... bible.cc/1_samuel/8-11.htm

The only countries that make their women cannon fodder are communist countries and Israel...but then I repeat myself.

"...as long as there..remain active enemies of the Christian church, we may hope to become Master of the World...the future Jewish King will never reign in the world before Christianity is overthrown - B'nai B'rith speech http://www.biblebelievers.org.au/luther.htm / http://bible.cc/psalms/83-4.htm

AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt  posted on  2008-10-13   16:22:09 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#33. To: christine (#0)

But the two presidential candidates disagree on a key foundation of any future draft: Mr. Obama supports a requirement for both men and women to register with the Selective Service, while Mr. McCain doesn't think women should have to register.

My daughter will neither register for - or submit to slavery -

Paris / Rihanna 2008

WhiteGuy  posted on  2008-10-13   20:12:57 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#34. To: Cynicom (#1)

I am with Obama on this one, make all the ladies at 18 register. Then when he passes a draft make all ladies to age 65 register for the draft.

Wonderful idea. I am considering voting for Obummer.

I figure he has a targeted plan for jews and whites. He'll be following Rev. Wrights influences there. Remember when he removed Wright from his staff after the BIG RACE SPEECH THAT CHANGED THE WORL'?

Unless Wright was just fibbing about hating just for the money, then I suspect his spiritual nature will weasel through. I mean it was some high profile type that said he was speaking for God. (Who does that remind you of?)

Was it Mr. Tinglelegs Matthews?? What happens if you are half and half, or thereabouts? Would they draft you by skin color? Do light blacks go, but dark ones recieve a get out of war free card? How is this going to work?

Ladies first? Ah, the manly state of Commander in Heels and his manbride MissHell.

Lots to think about.

nikki  posted on  2008-10-13   20:17:25 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#35. To: nikki (#34)

Lots to think about.

Obummer says we must have 94,000 more grunts. McKooK say we must have 140,000 more grunts.

That makes me want to vote Obummer????

Cynicom  posted on  2008-10-13   20:40:32 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#36. To: christine (#0)

Mr. Obama supports a requirement for both men and women to register with the Selective Service,

so do I but for different reasons I'm sure. Men are not disposable and should not be treated as such!


I believe that banking institutions are more dangerous to our liberties than standing armies. If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their currency, first by inflation, then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around [the banks] will deprive the people of all property until their children wake-up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered. The issuing power should be taken from the banks and restored to the people, to whom it properly belongs. —Thomas Jefferson, 1802

farmfriend  posted on  2008-10-13   20:43:13 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#37. To: WhiteGuy (#33)

neither will my son

Do You Know What Freedom Really Means? Freedom4um.com

christine  posted on  2008-10-13   20:46:12 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#38. To: Cynicom (#35) (Edited)

Obummer says we must have 94,000 more grunts. McKooK say we must have 140,000 more grunts.

That makes me want to vote Obummer????

Well now, I couldn't say. He has this whole thing about social justice, and I just want to know how that translates with is spiritual training and affirmative action policies. This is all about a new world or as he says .. a perfected world. And opportunity. Thats why ACORN registered what 1.3 million for him and Obama paid them 800K to do so? Maybe Obama votes are automatic service volunteers? If that's the case, then McCain and drop the schtick and let Obama just move his base straight to Afghanistan.

nikki  posted on  2008-10-13   20:46:43 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#39. To: Cynicom (#35)

Obummer says we must have 94,000 more grunts. McKooK say we must have 140,000 more grunts.

That makes me want to vote Obummer????

Oh hell, why don't we vote both of them in and get it over with. Who wants to be nickel and dimed to death?

RidinShotgun  posted on  2008-10-13   20:49:47 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#40. To: christine (#37)

neither will my son

One person standing on principle has never worked.

No one goes, we win. A few refuse, the government wins and the few go off to prison, or worse.

Eddie Slovik refused to fight and Ike had him shot. Americans cheered.

This government today is much worse.

Cynicom  posted on  2008-10-13   20:56:34 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


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