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Title: Saturday funnies: What We Are Competing Against - we stay globalistic and we lose
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Published: Oct 18, 2008
Author: Me, Me, Me
Post Date: 2008-10-18 15:42:53 by a vast rightwing conspirator
Keywords: None
Views: 352
Comments: 16

These are real figures people so, take a look at them and explain how we get to keep our jobs in this country, for the natives. I only have the figures for IT but I doubt it's a lot different in other areas.

An average 'data center' IT worker can be had for about $40,000/year if it's off-shore or $60,000/year if the worker is brought into the US - that's what the company pays to the Indian outsourcer. And that's it. For off-shored 'help' there's no expense of office, health care, pension, social security, whatever. The on-shore dudes are usually crammed 2 into a 8ft by 7ft cube and the Indian outsourcer buses them in and out of work and stores them at some dormitories overnight.

The average equivalent native IT worker costs $150,000-250,000/year, which includes, of course, health insurance, pension, 401k, social security, office space... whatever.

Is there any wonder why I am not allowed to hire a native for the open position I have now and I am forced to either accept an Indian or go without?

Question is: if we are to stay globalistic, we either all go on Welfare or we learn to live while making half or one third as much as we do now. Now, what are the advantages of globalism again?

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#1. To: a vast rightwing conspirator (#0)

Question is: if we are to stay globalistic, we either all go on Welfare or we learn to live while making half or one third as much as we do now. Now, what are the advantages of globalism again?

what about your change artist? have you given up "hope?"

Do You Know What Freedom Really Means? Freedom4um.com

christine  posted on  2008-10-18   15:50:35 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#2. To: a vast rightwing conspirator (#0)

I know a Filipina, still in the Philippines, who sits all day in a 3X4 cubicle talking to people on the telephone. She has a college degree, and that's her job.

Of course, she hates it. She also hates going home and sharing one room with two other women.

I think she makes about $200 a month.

Freepers: hearts full of hate and cowardice, and skulls full, to quote a favorite saying of one of their favorite cowards, of mush.

Turtle  posted on  2008-10-18   16:09:41 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#3. To: christine (#1)

Thank you for the sarcasm.

I don't need hope. I've always been able to provide for myself and my family and I am likely to survive a McCain disaster as I watched the Clintons and the Bushes come and go.

Yes, I do believe that Obama in the White House is preferable to McCain by orders of magnitude. He may be tilting left vs. McCain tilting toward the nuthouse but he's an open-minded, intelligent and well-meaning person. But, I was suggesting a somewhat different topic. As for Obama, you better pray that it's he who gets the job. Can you even contemplate 'president Palin'?

Antiparty - find out why, think about 'how'

a vast rightwing conspirator  posted on  2008-10-18   16:12:14 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#4. To: Turtle (#2)

I suppose that's what's coming to us, very, very slowly so us 'frogs' don't jump off the pot before we're fully cooked.

Antiparty - find out why, think about 'how'

a vast rightwing conspirator  posted on  2008-10-18   16:14:30 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#5. To: a vast rightwing conspirator (#3)

Yes, I do believe that Obama in the White House is preferable to McCain by orders of magnitude.

All credibility shot in one sentence.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is in prison.

Henry David Thoreau

noone222  posted on  2008-10-18   16:17:54 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#6. To: noone222 (#5)

I only shared my belief, which I stated clearly. If you wish to share yours please do so but, keep in mind, this should not be the topic of this thread.

Antiparty - find out why, think about 'how'

a vast rightwing conspirator  posted on  2008-10-18   16:24:25 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#7. To: a vast rightwing conspirator (#6)

I only shared my belief, which I stated clearly. If you wish to share yours please do so but, keep in mind, this should not be the topic of this thread.

You sound depressed.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is in prison.

Henry David Thoreau

noone222  posted on  2008-10-18   16:29:10 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#8. To: a vast rightwing conspirator (#0)

Now, what are the advantages of globalism again?

1. We can buy cheap, poisoned crap from China.

2. Corporations can move off-shore and escape taxes here.

3. We can learn pidgin-english whenever we call customer 'service.'

4. We can learn spanish and french whenever we go shopping.

I'm sure that there are many more benefits, but right now, they escape me.

Iran Truth Now!

Lod  posted on  2008-10-18   16:39:51 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#9. To: a vast rightwing conspirator (#3)

I've always been able to provide for myself and my family

then, as you said, you better get used to doing it with 1/3 to 1/2 of what you're doing now. no sarcasm.

Do You Know What Freedom Really Means? Freedom4um.com

christine  posted on  2008-10-18   18:13:51 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#10. To: christine. all (#9)

then, as you said, you better get used to doing it with 1/3 to 1/2 of what you're doing now. no sarcasm.

We've been doing this for a long time now, with inflation, and the devaluation of our fiat bucks.

This crappy loan scam has just brought it to the attention of the entire world.

I read a blurb on ino.com that smirk is going to host a conference of 'world leaders' to figger it all out - beam me up, time on this one.

Iran Truth Now!

Lod  posted on  2008-10-18   18:22:41 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#11. To: christine (#9)

The nature of my job makes it very unlikely for me to lose it for as long as my company remains a US-based corporation. It is also very unlikely that I will see a reduction in compensation. However, inflation can do wonderful things to people's incomes.

Antiparty - find out why, think about 'how'

a vast rightwing conspirator  posted on  2008-10-18   18:22:43 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#12. To: lodwick (#8)

We can do a lot for ourselves, too.

Tomorrow, I make my solar cooker prototype.

I recently replaced a bunch of windows for a guy, and I saved all the old double pane sashes. I am going to make half a dozen solar ovens. When doo doo occurs, I will be the only solar bakery in middleburgh. hehehe

I shall not vote for evil, lesser or otherwise.
Tattoos Middleburgh, NY

Critter  posted on  2008-10-18   18:44:04 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#13. To: a vast rightwing conspirator (#3)

he's an open-minded, intelligent and well-meaning person.

You know this how? Do you have a personal relationship with him?

Unless you know him personally, all you know is what's fed to you via the propaganda organs of his machine.

Ahmadinejad in 2008!
Everyone agrees that unanimity is hard to find.

bluegrass  posted on  2008-10-18   19:00:57 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#14. To: a vast rightwing conspirator, Turtle, Noone222, christine, *Israeli Espionage* (#3)

Now, what are the advantages of globalism again?

The advantage is that when we are impoverished it will be that much easier to enslave us.

Both Obama and McCain support Amnesty for Illegal Aliens which will destroy America. We need to import 100% of the oil legal and illegal immigrants consume. So if we add 50,000,000 people we will increase our demand for imported oil from 4.4 billion barrels of imported oil to 5.4 or more barrels of oil. To bid another billion barrels of oil from China and Japan would require us to go to the President of China and say we cannot afford to ever pay back the 350 billion in our Treasury Notes you hold or to redeem the 1.8 trillion dollars in American dollars your banks hold but we would like to borrow another few hundred billion additional dollars every year until President Obama makes us energy independent with wind and solar energy. We appreciate that when we borrow money from you to bid against you your people must suffer the hardship of paying more every year for oil. We can offer you no monetary compensation but we give your our sincere appreciation for buying our oil for us by extending us credit and for accepting our worthless dollars for everything you sell us at Wal-Mart.

The dollar was designed to crash when the Federal Reserve Act was passed in 1913. But at least then we did not have to import natural resources. Today we do. And that means we have to lower wages until foreigners making $200 a month can afford to buy finished goods from America. That means every ten million immigrants will significantly cut our wages. We have twice as many Americans as we can support without importing oil and other natural resources. Instead of cutting wages every year since 1950 we have been sending increasingly worthless paper dollars overseas. The dollar will crash soon. WHen it does, American wages will be permanently cut 50%.

My original prediction about the date for the collapse of the dollar was made in 1995. I said that by 12-31-2009 after tax wages in real dollars would be cut in half. I stand by that prediction. That is why I am still making plans to permanently leave America.

The Truth of 911 Shall Set You Free From The Lie

Horse  posted on  2008-10-18   19:53:24 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#15. To: Critter (#12)

When doo doo occurs, I will be the only solar bakery in middleburgh. hehehe

That's really cool ! Post some pics after you build it !!!

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is in prison.

Henry David Thoreau

noone222  posted on  2008-10-18   19:57:30 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#16. To: a vast rightwing conspirator (#0)

Your figures are a little bit off based on my experience, but then again, we got burned.

It used to be, back before the world discovered India, that you could get East Indians on sale 4/1, meaning that you got four of them for the salary of one American.

Then you add in infrastructure, time zone issues, remote management issues, rework (because they can't write decent code and have very little creativity) and whatnot and you ended up with only a 20% cost savings and that was back almost a decade ago.

Today, to hire an engineer, it isn't really worth it to go to India. Wages and costs have gone up to where they aren't cost-effective over domestics any longer. Eastern Europe or South America is where its at now if you're desperate to offshore.

If you use a Body Shop here in the US, you end up paying $50-75 an hour for what is still a $35-50k entry-level grunt position. Not worth it. In Silicon Valley, the figures are even more insane. I got a proposal once that a body shop wanted $250/hr for a cluster engineer. The guy's qualifications were that he once took a class in clustering. Couldn't even answer basic technical questions. I hired a domestic for $105k salary ($140k total compensation) and told the body shop to get stuffed.

Then, when you do open a campus in India, you discover that they start heading off to work around 10am and the place is empty by 4.30pm. Also, if you use East Indian management at the campus over there, they hire all their friends and relatives first. When you file a bug they get hacked off over it and argue with you because, of course THEIR code can NEVER have any problems....

We learned this the hard way and got rid of most of that garbage. You may be able to get East Indians 2/1 still, but when you factor in productivity, an American engineer returns 3:1 over an East Indian if you hire carefully, which is the real problem. Lots of managers don't know how to interview and hire properly. They just fill seats and pray.

"A leader, for a change." - Jimmy Carter, 1976 campaign slogan. Sound familiar? Here it comes again!

mirage  posted on  2008-10-22   10:27:59 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


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