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Title: Obama Must Stand Up Now or Step Down
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URL Source: http://www.newswithviews.com/Vieira/edwin84.htm
Published: Oct 29, 2008
Author: Edwin Vieira
Post Date: 2008-10-29 13:46:02 by christine
Keywords: None
Views: 4023
Comments: 201
America is facing potentially the gravest constitutional crisis in her history. Barack Obama must either stand up in a public forum and prove, with conclusive documentary evidence, that he is “a natural born Citizen” of the United States who has not renounced his American citizenship—or he must step down as the Democratic Party’s candidate for President of the United States—preferably before the election is held, and in any event before the Electoral College meets. Because, pursuant to the Constitution, only “a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States at the time of the Adoption of th[e] Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President” (Article II, Section 1, Clause 4). And Obama clearly was not “a Citizen of the United States at the time of the Adoption of th[e] Constitution.” Whether the evidence will show that Obama is, or is not, “a natural born Citizen” who has never renounced his American citizenship is an open question. The arguments on both sides are as yet speculative. But Obama’s stubborn refusal to provide what he claims is “his own” country with conclusive proof on that score compels the presumption that he knows, or at least strongly suspects, that no sufficient evidence in his favor exists. After all, he is not being pressed to solve a problem in quantum physics that is “above his pay grade,” but only asked to provide the public with the original copy of some official record that establishes his citizenship. The vast majority of Americans could easily do so. Why will Obama not dispel the doubts about his eligibility—unless he can not? Now that Obama’s citizenship has been seriously questioned, the burden of proof rests squarely on his shoulders. The “burden of establishing a delegation of power to the United States * * * is upon those making the claim.” Bute v. Illinois, 333 U.S. 640, 653 (1948). And if each of the General Government’s powers must be proven (not simply presumed) to exist, then every requirement that the Constitution sets for any individual’s exercise of those powers must also be proven (not simply presumed) to be fully satisfied before that individual may exercise any of those powers. The Constitution’s command that “[n]o Person except a natural born Citizen * * * shall be eligible to the Office of President” is an absolute prohibition against the exercise of each and every Presidential power by certain unqualified individuals. Actually (not simply presumptively or speculatively) being “a natural born Citizen” is the condition precedent sine qua non for avoiding this prohibition. Therefore, anyone who claims eligibility for “the Office of President” must, when credibly challenged, establish his qualifications in this regard with sufficient evidence. In disposing of the lawsuit Berg v. Obama, which squarely presents the question of Obama’s true citizenship, the presiding judge complained that Berg “would have us derail the democratic process by invalidating a candidate for whom millions of people voted and who underwent excessive vetting during what was one of the most hotly contested presidential primary in living memory.” This is exceptionally thin hogwash. A proper judicial inquiry into Obama’s eligibility for “the Office of President” will not deny his supporters a “right” to vote for him—rather, it will determine whether they have any such “right” at all. For, just as Obama’s “right” to stand for election to “the Office of President” is contingent upon his being “a natural born Citizen,” so too are the “rights” of his partisans to vote for him contingent upon whether he is even eligible for that “Office.” If Obama is ineligible, then no one can claim any “right” to vote for him. Indeed, in that case every American who does vote has a constitutional duty to vote against him.
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#13. To: Sam Houston (#7)
You're comparing apples to oranges. There are No Questions about the citizenship of BOTH of John McCain's parents John McCain's Father was on Active Duty with the US Navy when John was born AND The Canal Zone was a US Possession. There is NO Question about the eligibility of John McCain to run for President. He is considered a Natural Born American On the other hand.....obama has problems and REFUSES to produce a simple document like his Birth Certificate. Why? Why? Why?
It's the second mouse that gets the cheese
Like it or not McCain is a natural born citizen under terms of US law covering US citizen military stationed in the Panama Canal Zone and their children born there. But Obama might not be a natural born US citizen because of his mother's age and where she gave birth to him and also because they both later moved to Indonesia with Obama's step-father and took up Indonesian citizenship. Obama needs to provide the FEC his original birth certificate. And fyi, the suit against Obama and the Dem Party was filed by a long-standing Dem supporter, Philip Berg, because he did not want his party blindly promoting a non-citizen as their candidate for the WH.
If Berg is the mensch that he claims he is, he should identify the traitorous person who accepted Obama's registration and challenge that traitorous enemy to prove that Obama met the qualifications. I am sorry to say, but you are falling for the dogs and ponies shows. All this agitation means nothing and leads nowhere because there no 'where' for it to go. And, one more thing. Do note that McCain did beat Paul and all the other GOPs running, fair and square. You may not like it and I don't like it for sure but, McCain earned his GOP nomination and so did Obama earn his Demo nomination, beating the crap out of Hillary. If you disagree with the 2-party system or with the system we call 'representative democracy' or 'democratic republic' that's fine. I do too. But, trust me, Obama showing or not showing his birth certificate to Berg is not going to solve a thing.
Antiparty - find out why, think about 'how'
Spoken like a true Obama idolatress, rather than a Constitutionalist.
We have had them install the fatherless son of an Arkansan prostitute, the most intellectually deficient spawn of the Bush crime family and now they are intending an even greater insult to the American people, the installation of an African Muslim Marxist type political puppet who is, in all likelihood, not even eligible to be president under the Constitution. Do you think the owners of this government are laughing their arses off at the present response of the American people as a whole?
travel.state.gov/passport/get/first/first_830.html The certified birth certificate requirements for a U.S. passport are clear. Shouldn't the requirements to be President of the United States be at least as stringent as the requirements for a passport? *A certified birth certificate has a registrar's raised, embossed, impressed or multicolored seal, registrar’s signature, and the date the certificate was filed with the registrar's office, which must be within 1 year of your birth. Please note, some short (abstract) versions of birth certificates may not be acceptable for passport purposes. ---------------------------------------------- What did Obama use to get a passport? Has anyone asked? The non-elected rulers that will be selecting the next president don't give a damn about the United States Constitution. Selecting a man born and raised outside the United States is just another slap in the face to every man and woman that supports the U.S. Constitution. People get the kind of government they deserve.
The difference between having Obama president or Biden is so small in policy terms as to be meaningless. And if McThuselah has everything lined up to steal it anyway, what difference does it make?
“I would give no thought of what the world might say of me, if I could only transmit to posterity the reputation of an honest man.” - Sam Houston
O good a food fight heres my take first off a google search shows it is pretty much the "fringe" web sites that are still pushing this, I did however find a story in Newsweek from August now I'm not saying Newsweek does not lean left but it was the closest I could find of a main stream media source covering this story....for what it's worth this is what they say..... In June, the Obama campaign released a digitally scanned image of his birth certificate to quell speculative charges that he might not be a natural-born citizen. But the image prompted more blog-based skepticism about the document's authenticity. And recently, author Jerome Corsi, whose book attacks Obama, said in a TV interview that the birth certificate the campaign has is "fake." We beg to differ. FactCheck.org staffers have now seen, touched, examined and photographed the original birth certificate. We conclude that it meets all of the requirements from the State Department for proving U.S. citizenship. Claims that the document lacks a raised seal or a signature are false. We have posted high-resolution photographs of the document as "supporting documents" to this article. Our conclusion: Obama was born in the U.S.A. just as he has always said.
Just keep in mind that 'them' us very much 'us', because it's been a majority of those of 'us' who voted that got 'their' pick elected. Oh, yes... the elections were rigged, I forgot. And so were ALL of them polls that were showing, even before the votes were cast, that a majority or a near majority of Americans were willing to vote for and get those awful people elected and then, RE-ELECTED. It's very interesting.
Antiparty - find out why, think about 'how'
Oh, please don't do that. But, anyway, the quote you provided came from 'THEM' so we are still in the gravest Constitutional crisis of them all - the possibility that the US Americans might end up electing a capable, intelligent, decent man to run their executory branch of government. This is NOT acceptable.
Antiparty - find out why, think about 'how'
Heads up in no way do I think Obama is qualified to be President decent nice guy yes President no!
Oh puhleaze. McCain beat Ron Paul unfairly because Ron Paul got little face time in the debates and the MSM portrayed Ron Paul as an isolationist who hung out with "kooky" truthers. As to beating the other candidates, I can't even remember who they were, so that's who McCain "beat" ie. empty shells, forgetable RINO ghosts. As for Obama beating Hillary fair and square - what a joke! Were it not for John Edwards taking Hillary on relentlessly in the Dem debates, Hillary would have the Dem candidacy wrapped up. Obama sat through those debates like a sleepy head speechless dolt with big ears, a spectator who watched Edwards tear Hillary apart.
If Obama is so decent and capable and intelligent as you paint him to be then he should do the right thing by the electorate and by the Constitution and produce his original birth certificate to demonstrate without any doubt that he is eligible to run for the highest elected office in the land.
Why don't you state berg's real reason. He was and is, and will always be a hitlery supporter til death. As for obanger, yes he should clear this up before the election. Funny though, Jesus Christ could produce obanger's 'real' birth certificate and you neo con commie- socialists would scream its a fraud. I hope he isn't a natural born citizen, but that still doesn't help us out of the dilema we face with two un-American candidates.
How could you forget that? That was secondary however to the fact that the choice was dumb puppet or dumb puppet.
Interesting that factcheck.org is registered to the Annenberg Public Policy Center. Um. see the link? Annenberg. Bill Ayers? Naw. its just a coincidence. In other words, the site you gave as being nonpartisan is PARTISAN!
It's the second mouse that gets the cheese
Obama could not get a U.S. passport using this document, but Americans are supposed to believe it is sufficient to meet the requirements of the Constitution. Passport requirement *A certified birth certificate has a registrar's raised, embossed, impressed or multicolored seal, registrar’s signature, and the date the certificate was filed with the registrar's office, which must be within 1 year of your birth. Please note, some short (abstract) versions of birth certificates may not be acceptable for passport purposes.
The 2-party system and the uber-powerful state seem to be your enemies, not the individuals that emerge in top positions of power while following the existing rules. If that's the case, you should probably focus on transforming or destroying the above. I wish you good luck and I may even lend you a hand but, trust me, going after some guy's birth certificate or fighting windmills solves NOTHING.
Antiparty - find out why, think about 'how'
And that means what exactly? Hello, anyone home? When did the staffers of FactCheck.org ( an organization funded by the Annenberg Foundation cough, cough) become synonymous with THE FEDERAL ELECTIONS COMMISSION? Sheesh.
Bingo!!! So, you're saying, it's none of Berg's business to peek at Obama's papers. Thank you.
Antiparty - find out why, think about 'how'
Shouldn't it be enough for you that Obummer has graced us with his willingness to set aside his community organizing to be our humble leader??
oh, i know they are. it's just sad and maddening for me to see so many not only falling for it, but doing their part to ensure more of it.
It takes only one herder and two dogs to herd a thousand sheep and we have our share of the ...herded...here.
So, you're saying, it's none of Berg's business to peek at Obama's papers. Thank you. No I'm not saying "that" which you allege. Philip Berg is a Democratic Party member and he is a US citizen and voter and he has every right to question Obama's eligiblity to run for President as the Dem Party's candidate. FactCheck staffers do not have standing to assure Philip Berg or for that matter the electorate at large that they have seen Obama's original birth certificate and it looked okay by them. Who cares about what "staffers of FactCheck" claim to have seen or not seen? It's obvious that you and other Obamphiles are terrified that Obama is in fact ineligible to run for office.
Yes, you're right. The Saviour is our new, Maximum Leader. I stand at his ready.
Are you saying that the FactCheck people are not US citizens and voters and, quite possibly, members of the Demo party? I can't see the difference. Other than they asked nicely and were allowed to see something to which they were not entitled to see while Berg's show was, most likely, for the sake of publicity. As you noted, it's not the FactCheck's or Berg's business to check Obama's papers. That is FEC's business.
Antiparty - find out why, think about 'how'
Our Left Wing Nut friends here at 4um are all in distress over a predetermined "election" in which they are the nose to tail sheep. All are non thinkers, programmed to follow the playbook at all costs, and it shows. Left Wing Logic... Anyone not supporting Obama is a racist...and McKooK supporter. Anyone supporting no one...is a closet McKooK supporter. McCain wins by one length, it is a stolen election warranting resistance. Obama wins by a nose, fair and square election for good Americans.
The Zionists in the Star Chamber made Ame4rica believe Oswald was the lone asswassin of JFK. Obama's citzenship is no problem. Afterall, they control the federal government as well as the media.
Life is a tragedy to those who feel, and a comedy to those who think.
I can't see the difference. Other than they asked nicely and were allowed to see something to which they were not entitled to see while Berg's show was, most likely, for the sake of publicity. As you noted, it's not the FactCheck's or Berg's business to check Obama's papers. That is FEC's business. FactCheck staffers do not represent Philip Berg or the US electorate at large. What FactCheck staffers see or don't see is of significance only to themselves and to those dupes like yourself and robnoel who allow FactCheck staffers' opinions about Obama's eligibility have standing in your lives. Fyi, Philip Berg addressed his suit to the Federal Election Commission as well as the DNC et al. Although the FEC is primarily a regulatory commission with regards to campaign finances, the FEC is also the official gov't receiver and custodian of Statement of Candidacy - FEC Form 2 - and at the bottom of this form it states: "NOTE: Submission of false, erroneous, or incomplete information may subject the person signing this Statement to penalties of 2U.S.C.§437g." When Obama chose to fill out and sign this form, he made himself subject to penalties if he violated our nation's election laws by submitting false or erroneous or incomplete information.
I wouldn't stick my neck out too far with this resource, Robby.
Berg was also an asst. DA for the state of PA for years. He isn't a gadfly, that I can see. His questions were straightforward and easily answered. Only the arrogance of a man (Obama) who places himself above the law could have gotten away with ignoring his suit.
When Obama chose to fill out FEC Form 2, Statement of Candidacy, he made himself subject to our nation's election laws and liable for suffering penalties if he filed false, erroneous, or incomplete information with the FEC. At the bottom of FEC Form 2 it states: "NOTE: Submission of false, erroneous, or incomplete information may subject the person signing this Statement to penalties of 2U.S.C.§437g."
Good, if the guy believes that the process was not followed, that's where he needs to go. Not harass people and demanding that he sees their papers like a Nazi a__hole or some ZOG covert agent. But, it appears that what he's after is making noise and get the more naive among us into some form of frenzied rage.
Antiparty - find out why, think about 'how'
I call BS on that. If he actually has a LEGITIMATE birth certificate, one that shows he was actually born in THIS country (not Kenya), it would solve the problem that some of us have with someone who isn't even a citizen running for the highest public office in this country. Not that the piece of paper would make him worth a d@mn as President but it would prove that he is eligible to run.
Liberty is not a means to a higher political end. It is itself the highest political end. God or someone told ode Vast that Paul could not win, and whoever it was, was correct. Maybe olde Vast has more inside info on this event, might make a buck or two.
I second your opinion.
Where's your birth certificate Barack ?
The FEC is the 2 Party Systems way of keeping out 3rd Party candidates. The FEC didn't exist when the Constitution was written. The FEC is bullshit.
Where's your birth certificate Barack ?
The idiotlogical twins, Tweedledumb and Tweedledumber. Get it right. ;^)
Liberty is not a means to a higher political end. It is itself the highest political end. Maybe olde Vast has more inside info on this event, might make a buck or two. You could well have a point there.
Liberty is not a means to a higher political end. It is itself the highest political end. i've heard that more than 90% of americans do not believe the lone gun tale told by the government. not that it matters since they got away with it. so what's a little thing like citizenship matter?
Where's your birth certificate Barack ? Thanks. And I would like to see that certificate too (not that I think he has a legitimate one to show or he already would have shown it).
Liberty is not a means to a higher political end. It is itself the highest political end.
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Top • Page Up • Full Thread • Page Down • Bottom/LatestI think it's pretty funny, given that McCain was born in the Canal Zone.
#14. To: Sam Houston (#7)
I think it's pretty funny, given that McInsane was born in the Canal Zone.
#15. To: christine (#10)
(Edited)
we consider that that process was most likely abated by the traitorous america hating powers who are in the process of showing us once and for all that they install who they want?
#16. To: a vast rightwing conspirator (#15)
All this agitation means nothing and leads nowhere because there no 'where' for it to go.
#17. To: christine (#0)
America is facing potentially the gravest constitutional crisis in her history. Barack Obama must either stand up in a public forum and prove, with conclusive documentary evidence, that he is “a natural born Citizen” of the United States....
#18. To: christine (#0)
#19. To: scrapper2 (#14)
#20. To: Jethro Tull (#16)
#21. To: eskimo (#17)
#22. To: robnoel (#20)
Our conclusion: Obama was born in the U.S.A. just as he has always said.
#23. To: a vast rightwing conspirator (#22)
#24. To: a vast rightwing conspirator (#15)
Do note that McCain did beat Paul and all the other GOPs running, fair and square. You may not like it and I don't like it for sure but, McCain earned his GOP nomination and so did Obama earn his Demo nomination, beating the crap out of Hillary.
#25. To: a vast rightwing conspirator (#22)
the possibility that the US Americans might end up electing a capable, intelligent, decent man to run their executory branch of government.
#26. To: scrapper2 (#14)
And fyi, the suit against Obama and the Dem Party was filed by a long-standing Dem supporter, Philip Berg, because he did not want his party blindly promoting a non-citizen as their candidate for the WH.
#27. To: a vast rightwing conspirator (#21)
Oh, yes... the elections were rigged, I forgot.
#28. To: robnoel (#20)
We beg to differ. FactCheck.org staffers have now seen, touched, examined and photographed the original birth certificate.
#29. To: All (#18)
#30. To: eskimo (#27)
that the choice was dumb puppet or dumb puppet
#31. To: robnoel (#20)
"FactCheck.org staffers have now seen, touched, examined and photographed the original birth certificate."
#32. To: scrapper2 (#31)
#33. To: Jethro Tull (#11)
Anyone who had as a mother a socialist whore, and a father who abandoned him to the US taxpayers for his homeland of Kenya, needs to show his papers to advance to the office of the president.
-Schweizerische Schuetzenzeitung (Swiss Shooting Federation) April, 1941
#34. To: eskimo (#17)
Do you think the owners of this government are laughing their arses off at the present response of the American people as a whole?
#35. To: christine, eskimo (#34)
#36. To: a vast rightwing conspirator (#32)
(Edited)
Bingo!!!
#37. To: X-15 (#33)
Shouldn't it be enough for you that Obummer has graced us with his willingness to set aside his community organizing to be our humble leader??
#38. To: scrapper2 (#36)
Philip Berg is a Democratic Party member and he is a US citizen and voter and he has every right to question Obama's eligiblity to run for President
#39. To: Jethro Tull (#37)
#40. To: christine (#34)
(Edited)
Do you think the owners of this government are laughing their arses off at the present response of the American people as a whole? oh, i know they are. it's just sad and maddening for me to see so many not only falling for it, but doing their part to ensure more of it.
#41. To: a vast rightwing conspirator, robnoel (#38)
(Edited)
Are you saying that the FactCheck people are not US citizens and voters and, quite possibly, members of the Demo party?
#42. To: robnoel (#20)
FactCheck.org
#43. To: scrapper2 (#41)
#44. To: Jethro Tull (#43)
#45. To: scrapper2 (#41)
#46. To: a vast rightwing conspirator (#15)
Obama showing or not showing his birth certificate to Berg is not going to solve a thing.
Lord Acton
#47. To: James Deffenbach (#46)
#48. To: James Deffenbach (#46)
I call BS on that. If he actually has a LEGITIMATE birth certificate, one that shows he was actually born in THIS country (not Kenya), it would solve the problem that some of us have with someone who isn't even a citizen running for the highest public office in this country. Not that the piece of paper would make him worth a d@mn as President but it would prove that he is eligible to run.
#49. To: a vast rightwing conspirator (#38)
That is FEC's business.
#50. To: eskimo (#27)
How could you forget that? That was secondary however to the fact that the choice was dumb puppet or dumb puppet.
Lord Acton
#51. To: Cynicom (#47)
God or someone told ode Vast that Paul could not win, and whoever it was, was correct.
Lord Acton
#52. To: Zoroaster (#40)
The Zionists in the Star Chamber made Ame4rica believe Oswald was the lone asswassin of JFK. Obama's citzenship is no problem.
#53. To: noone222 (#48)
I second your opinion.
Lord Acton
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