I favor the cops in this situation. It is obvious the suspect was quarrelsome with the comment he made to someone out of camera range even as he stood up from the bench seat. The cop with the suspect began to finger print the subject, who was still arguing with someone off camera. When the cop attempting to finger print the subject told him to pay attention, the subject became belligerent, verbally abusive and combative.
If I have any complaint about the cops, it was their ineptness in taking the punk to the ground immediately. Had those three cops been under my supervision, all would have received letters of instruction for their failure to perform. As a retired sergeant with the California Department of Corrections, the very first thing staff are trained to do with such unruly inmates is to get them off their feet, then pile on the squirming test-tube baby, get him in restraint gear and -- if necessary -- body slam the punk into a holding cell.
There is zero evidence to suggest that "[a]ll the first cop had to do (was) treat the guy with a little...respect and the situation would have stayed under control." The subject was argumentative from the git-go and, as evidenced by the recording, just looking for a reason to initiate a physical altercation. Had this punk done that with my team at the prison, the local hospital would have treated him for a lot more than minor injuries.
Bias is powerful and sometimes blinds. Cops and prison guards are bullies that have backup bullies to reinforce their misguided actions leading them to mistakenly believe they are always in the right.
~~~It is obvious the suspect was quarrelsome with the comment he made to someone out of camera range even as he stood up from the bench seat.
Taken out of context, he does appear irritated. We don't know the abuse he received prior to that scene. He may be showing extreme restraint and is trying to control his anger, choosing to respond to the approach from the rear by another officer by engaging him in conversation.
~~~The cop with the suspect began to finger print the subject,
You say that so casually that it seems you are intentionally ignoring the disrespectful manner in which the officer behaves. He does not have to grab. This is more evidence that cops are bullies. And what about the comment, "I can do anything I want to." Hell, that pisses ME off. Fucking bully.
~~~ who was still arguing with someone off camera.
This is exactly why a calmer approach than a hand grab is warranted. When the level on agitation is still verbal, you err when you grab and become physical. Who escalated from verbal to physical. Cops are bullies.
~~~When the cop attempting to finger print the subject told him to pay attention, the subject became belligerent, verbally abusive and combative.
You see what you want to see. "Civilians" are the enemy and cops are the good guys.
~~~If I have any complaint about the cops,
You choose not to see the obvious. The cops moved the situation from verbal to physical. Have you forgetten the grab and the repeated requests to show respect?
~~~it was their ineptness in taking the punk to the ground immediately.
From your perspective, you are correct. Bullies should work closer together when the "punks" resist the abuse. Not only are these uniforms poor police officers but, they are rather sad bullies. It must be quite embarrassing for you to defend such inept officers.
~~~Had those three cops been under my supervision, all would have received letters of instruction for their failure to perform.
I agree. These officers will need more training if they hope to become successful bullies.
~~~As a retired sergeant with the California Department of Corrections, the very first thing staff are trained to do with such unruly inmates is to get them off their feet,
"The very first thing," did you really say that? So, I am curious, do you think the first training might really need to be how to prevent officers from escalating a verbal exchange into a physical altercation? hmmmm By now, I would imagine the bully inside is starting to think I might need a little hands on attention.
~~~then pile on the squirming test-tube baby,
You just made my lack of respect argument. You guys make this too easy.
~~get him in restraint gear and -- if necessary -- body slam the punk into a holding cell.
Restraint gear would clearly be sufficient. The unnecessary body slam is the fun part of the job, I imagine, followed by a group high five.
~~~There is zero evidence to suggest that "[a]ll the first cop had to do (was) treat the guy with a little...respect and the situation would have stayed under control."
Are you serious? It is obvious to all that had the first officer simply apologized for the grabbing and asked for cooperation things might have stayed under control. I wonder how things would have proceeded had the grabbing never occurred. Cops are bullies.
~~~The subject was argumentative from the git-go and, as evidenced by the recording,
Then deal with the argument with reason and patience. Don't escalate the situation to a physical confrontation, duh. Cops are bullies.
~~~just looking for a reason to initiate a physical altercation.
I don't buy it. He asked for respect several times. He could have become physical much earlier and chose not to. He showed patience until the cop got physical. But, a bully won't see or acknowledge this issue.
~~~Had this punk done that with my team at the prison, the local hospital would have treated him for a lot more than minor injuries.
There you go again, showing your true colors. You fucking asshole bully.
Ask yourself this question. Will YOUR attitude change when you are taken down and cop/bullies don't know you used to be one of them.
You: "Bias is powerful and sometimes blinds. Cops and prison guards are bullies that have backup bullies to reinforce their misguided actions leading them to mistakenly believe they are always in the right."
I: You people, through your representatives, pass laws that cops and prison guards must infor5ce. If you don't want us to enforce those laws, tell your representative to stop legislating them.
You: "Taken out of context, he does appear irritated. We don't know the abuse he received prior to that scene. He may be showing extreme restraint and is trying to control his anger, choosing to respond to the approach from the rear by another officer by engaging him in conversation."
I: Taken in context, it is obvious that the suspect was not in mechanical restraint gear (hand cuffs), which indicates that he was not considered a threat to the safety of the officers. The suspect proved otherwise when he attacked the booking officer.
You: "You say that so casually that it seems you are intentionally ignoring the disrespectful manner in which the officer behaves. He does not have to grab. This is more evidence that cops are bullies. And what about the comment, "I can do anything I want to." Hell, that pisses ME off. Fucking bully."
I: The suspect was told to pay attention to the finger-printing process. When he failed to comply, the officer turned the suspect to the bench seat to lock him up. At that point the violent criminal attacked the officer. Yes, the officer does have to grab the suspect; indeed, he must keep the suspect under physical constraint at all times. What about the comment by the cop. "I can do anything that I want?" I've used the same expression when processing convicted felons into the prison where I worked. These people are under arrest. The state has taken control of them. They will do as they are instructed or else the state will force them into compliance. That is where I come in. I am there to force them to comply with the law.
You: "This is exactly why a calmer approach than a hand grab is warranted. When the level on agitation is still verbal, you err when you grab and become physical. Who escalated from verbal to physical. Cops are bullies."
I: Cops are not there to coddle people suspected of committing crimes. They are there to apprehend suspected criminals and process them into the system to stand trial. If the suspect chooses to get physical, or resist processing -- as the punk in the video did, then the cops have legal authority to force compliance. If that amounts to bullying in your opinion, then I would like to read your alternative to brute force when it comes to dealing with violent criminals.
You: "You see what you want to see. "Civilians" are the enemy and cops are the good guys."
I: I see what is obvious for anyone to see: the punk got physical and the cops did what they had to do to gain control of the criminal who raped your wife. If that "civilian" is the kind of person who you want to continue living next door to you and your wife, then continue defending him.
You: "From your perspective, you are correct. Bullies should work closer together when the "punks" resist the abuse. Not only are these uniforms poor police officers but, they are rather sad bullies. It must be quite embarrassing for you to defend such inept officers. "
I: From my perspective, when thugs ran rampant, the guardians of society, cops, should pat the murderers, rapists and bullies on the head, tell them they are misunderstood and let them rape your mother. If trying to stop such creatures from criminally butt fuking your brother, sister, father, first cousin is an embarrassment, I stand righteously accused. So tell me, fool, what have you done to stop such creatures; humm?
Enough of this nonsense!
If you have a better way of dealing with the animals who would prey on you for their own benefit, I would like to read it. More to the point, I would like to see it in action. So let's stop theorizing and start bringing your concepts into actual play. Show me where your idiocy has ever worked; okay, kid?
I've been in the trenches. I've tasted my own blood that was spilled keeping your whiny azz safe from criminals. If you have a better way based on EXPERIENCE, then post it to this board. Until then, you're just another sniveling geek who spends more time thinking than actually doing.
You: "Bias is powerful and sometimes blinds. Cops and prison guards are bullies that have backup bullies to reinforce their misguided actions leading them to mistakenly believe they are always in the right."
I: You people, through your representatives, pass laws that cops and prison guards must infor5ce. If you don't want us to enforce those laws, tell your representative to stop legislating them.
Remember that, oh punk w/badge.
That defense worked wonderfully at Nuremberg. Got the nazis off the hook...
I: From my perspective, when thugs ran rampant, the guardians of society, cops, should pat the murderers, rapists and bullies on the head, tell them they are misunderstood and let them rape your mother. If trying to stop such creatures from criminally butt fuking your brother, sister, father, first cousin is an embarrassment, I stand righteously accused. So tell me, fool, what have you done to stop such creatures; humm?
You thugs are running rampant. For now. Remember though, you are outnumbered, severely, and you live at our discretion and kind heartedness. That will end shortly.
And to call them "guardians of society"? Now that is almost funny. But if you want to depend on other punks with badges to protect your precious butt from criminal "fuking", be my guest.