I favor the cops in this situation. It is obvious the suspect was quarrelsome with the comment he made to someone out of camera range even as he stood up from the bench seat. The cop with the suspect began to finger print the subject, who was still arguing with someone off camera. When the cop attempting to finger print the subject told him to pay attention, the subject became belligerent, verbally abusive and combative.
If I have any complaint about the cops, it was their ineptness in taking the punk to the ground immediately. Had those three cops been under my supervision, all would have received letters of instruction for their failure to perform. As a retired sergeant with the California Department of Corrections, the very first thing staff are trained to do with such unruly inmates is to get them off their feet, then pile on the squirming test-tube baby, get him in restraint gear and -- if necessary -- body slam the punk into a holding cell.
There is zero evidence to suggest that "[a]ll the first cop had to do (was) treat the guy with a little...respect and the situation would have stayed under control." The subject was argumentative from the git-go and, as evidenced by the recording, just looking for a reason to initiate a physical altercation. Had this punk done that with my team at the prison, the local hospital would have treated him for a lot more than minor injuries.
Bias is powerful and sometimes blinds. Cops and prison guards are bullies that have backup bullies to reinforce their misguided actions leading them to mistakenly believe they are always in the right.
~~~It is obvious the suspect was quarrelsome with the comment he made to someone out of camera range even as he stood up from the bench seat.
Taken out of context, he does appear irritated. We don't know the abuse he received prior to that scene. He may be showing extreme restraint and is trying to control his anger, choosing to respond to the approach from the rear by another officer by engaging him in conversation.
~~~The cop with the suspect began to finger print the subject,
You say that so casually that it seems you are intentionally ignoring the disrespectful manner in which the officer behaves. He does not have to grab. This is more evidence that cops are bullies. And what about the comment, "I can do anything I want to." Hell, that pisses ME off. Fucking bully.
~~~ who was still arguing with someone off camera.
This is exactly why a calmer approach than a hand grab is warranted. When the level on agitation is still verbal, you err when you grab and become physical. Who escalated from verbal to physical. Cops are bullies.
~~~When the cop attempting to finger print the subject told him to pay attention, the subject became belligerent, verbally abusive and combative.
You see what you want to see. "Civilians" are the enemy and cops are the good guys.
~~~If I have any complaint about the cops,
You choose not to see the obvious. The cops moved the situation from verbal to physical. Have you forgetten the grab and the repeated requests to show respect?
~~~it was their ineptness in taking the punk to the ground immediately.
From your perspective, you are correct. Bullies should work closer together when the "punks" resist the abuse. Not only are these uniforms poor police officers but, they are rather sad bullies. It must be quite embarrassing for you to defend such inept officers.
~~~Had those three cops been under my supervision, all would have received letters of instruction for their failure to perform.
I agree. These officers will need more training if they hope to become successful bullies.
~~~As a retired sergeant with the California Department of Corrections, the very first thing staff are trained to do with such unruly inmates is to get them off their feet,
"The very first thing," did you really say that? So, I am curious, do you think the first training might really need to be how to prevent officers from escalating a verbal exchange into a physical altercation? hmmmm By now, I would imagine the bully inside is starting to think I might need a little hands on attention.
~~~then pile on the squirming test-tube baby,
You just made my lack of respect argument. You guys make this too easy.
~~get him in restraint gear and -- if necessary -- body slam the punk into a holding cell.
Restraint gear would clearly be sufficient. The unnecessary body slam is the fun part of the job, I imagine, followed by a group high five.
~~~There is zero evidence to suggest that "[a]ll the first cop had to do (was) treat the guy with a little...respect and the situation would have stayed under control."
Are you serious? It is obvious to all that had the first officer simply apologized for the grabbing and asked for cooperation things might have stayed under control. I wonder how things would have proceeded had the grabbing never occurred. Cops are bullies.
~~~The subject was argumentative from the git-go and, as evidenced by the recording,
Then deal with the argument with reason and patience. Don't escalate the situation to a physical confrontation, duh. Cops are bullies.
~~~just looking for a reason to initiate a physical altercation.
I don't buy it. He asked for respect several times. He could have become physical much earlier and chose not to. He showed patience until the cop got physical. But, a bully won't see or acknowledge this issue.
~~~Had this punk done that with my team at the prison, the local hospital would have treated him for a lot more than minor injuries.
There you go again, showing your true colors. You fucking asshole bully.
Ask yourself this question. Will YOUR attitude change when you are taken down and cop/bullies don't know you used to be one of them.
I despise bullies too and all this talk about "subjects" as if the cops were the kings of England or something pisses me off royally.
In police work, arrested persons are called suspects; but in the prison setting, convicted felons are called "subjects" when referred to on disciplinary reports. After referring to the inmate by name, prison number and housing location, he is subsequently referred to as "subject," as in "the subject of this report...." I do apologize for the confusion. Obviously the subject of the video was not a convicted felon, but simply a suspect.
I dislike bullies, too. I don't like the way they intimidate, hurt and kill innocent citizens. That is one reason why I became a correctional officer. If they wanted to bully someone, then let them try it with me. Although I have bounced my share of inmates off the wall, my usual technique was to "pencil whip" them into compliance. I could write a disciplinary report that would ensure maximum punitive lock-up time for any inmate who violated the Director's Rules and Regulations. In fact, I was legendary for my writing ability at the Correctional Training Facility, the prison where I worked in California.
You and other nicks at this forum may not like cops, but the sad fact is that they are necessary to a civilized society. Without the police and correctional officers, citizens like you would be at the mercy of every thug who saw you as his prey. That is what people like me try to prevent. We're not always successful, true enough. But in order to keep you safe, we do our best to confront society's criminals -- and we do what must be done to get such scum bags off the street and into prisons, where they belong.
You and other nicks at this forum may not like cops, but the sad fact is that they are necessary to a civilized society. Without the police and correctional officers, citizens like you would be at the mercy of every thug who saw you as his prey. That is what people like me try to prevent. We're not always successful, true enough. But in order to keep you safe, we do our best to confront society's criminals -- and we do what must be done to get such scum bags off the street and into prisons, where they belong.
If you have a better way, I'd like to hear it.
RO
It's been a long time since I have read such a pile of steaming horse shit.
Cops are not a necessity in a civilized society, because they do not prevent criminals from committing crimes. All they can do, when they arent extorting money from citizens for noncrimes, is try and prevent future occurrences. And they rarely do that much.
I dislike bullies, too. I don't like the way they intimidate, hurt and kill innocent citizens. That is one reason why I became a correctional officer. If they wanted to bully someone, then let them try it with me. Although I have bounced my share of inmates off the wall, my usual technique was to "pencil whip" them into compliance. I could write a disciplinary report that would ensure maximum punitive lock-up time for any inmate who violated the Director's Rules and Regulations. In fact, I was legendary for my writing ability at the Correctional Training Facility, the prison where I worked in California.
But you dislike bullies. Right. You admit abusing inmates by "bouncing them off walls", but you dislike bullies. Makes sense to me. You admit playing word games to "ensure maximum punitive lock-up time" (read: lie) , but you hate bullies. Makes sense.
You are also nothing but a punk with a badge. Hope someone shanks you, just because you are a bully with a badge. I'll try not to shed any tears.
Do I have a "better way"? Yep. 1) recognize it is a dangerous world with dangerous people in it. 2) Arm citizens for protection from bullies like you. 3) Kill you if you or any other bully attacks a citizen. No trial, no prison, just a grave.
But that cant happen when punks with badges arrest people for CCW without "permits". Not that they committed a crime, mind you, but took the responsibility for self protection for themselves.
Anyone that dials 911 in the vain hope that a cop will save them is a fool.
Cops are not a necessity in a civilized society, because they do not prevent criminals from committing crimes. All they can do, when they arent extorting money from citizens for noncrimes, is try and prevent future occurrences. And they rarely do that much.
But you dislike bullies. Right. You admit abusing inmates by "bouncing them off walls", but you dislike bullies. Makes sense to me. You admit playing word games to "ensure maximum punitive lock-up time" (read: lie) , but you hate bullies. Makes sense.
Do I have a "better way"? Yep. 1) recognize it is a dangerous world with dangerous people in it. 2) Arm citizens for protection from bullies like you. 3) Kill you if you or any other bully attacks a citizen. No trial, no prison, just a grave.
But that cant happen when punks with badges arrest people for CCW without "permits". Not that they committed a crime, mind you, but took the responsibility for self protection for themselves.
If you don't like the law, change it; until then, obey it -- duh!
I most certainly have bounced inmates off the wall. When they came at inmates or staff with inmate-manufactured weapons, I did everything in my power to preserve life. I have never lied -- period, especially when filling out a disciplinary report. In fact, I have never had one of my disciplinary reports over turned at the Department level, or in any court in California, including the California Supreme Court, which commended me on two of my reports for being "concise, clear and to the point" in documenting inmate misbehavior.
What do you do when your mother has been raped and murdered, kill the cop who shows up to investigate the crime? What do you do when you come home after a hard day of work to find that everything you own has been stolen -- shoot the cop who shows us to investigate the crime? What do you do when when your vehicle is stolen and used in a murder -- shoot the cop who is hunting the animal(s) who committed the crime? So who do you deny a trial? The cop who wants to see the killer of your mother in prison? Or do you just want to shoot cops and let the criminals have their way with you; humm?
If you don't like the law as legislated by your legislature, then have your legislators change it. Cops don't make law; they only enforce it. If you don;t like the law, change it -- DUH!!!!!
I most certainly have bounced inmates off the wall. When they came at inmates or staff with inmate-manufactured weapons, I did everything in my power to preserve life.
OK, if that is true then you were defending yourself. No problem. All you said was that you bounce them off walls. You didnt say why.
If you don't like the law, change it; until then, obey it -- duh!
I obey the laws I agree with. The rest of them I shitcan, where they belong. There is no way I will obey a "law" I don't agree with. Besides, who can possibly know all the laws that have been passed against us?
What do you do when your mother has been raped and murdered, kill the cop who shows up to investigate the crime? What do you do when you come home after a hard day of work to find that everything you own has been stolen -- shoot the cop who shows us to investigate the crime?
I certainly do not depend on cops to investigate anything. By then, it's TOO LATE. I reserve the right to kill the motherfucker that has the audacity to attack me or anyone else within range. The last thing I will do is call 911, that's not even on the radar.
If you don't like the law as legislated by your legislature, then have your legislators change it. Cops don't make law; they only enforce it. If you don;t like the law, change it -- DUH!!!!!
Again, all cops need to remember that. Drill it into your worthless skulls. That "just obeying orders" defense worked so well at Nuremberg. The laws they enforced were completely "legal" too.