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Title: Why did God command the extermination of the Canaanites, women and children included?
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URL Source: http://www.gotquestions.org/Canaanites-extermination.html
Published: Jan 19, 2009
Author: www.gotquestions.org
Post Date: 2009-01-19 15:27:56 by AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt
Keywords: None
Views: 2221
Comments: 164
Why did God command the extermination of the Canaanites, women and children included? Question: "Why did God command the extermination of the Canaanites, women and children included?" Answer: In 1 Samuel 15:2-3, God commanded Saul and the Israelites, “This is what the LORD Almighty says: 'I will punish the Amalekites for what they did to Israel when they waylaid them as they came up from Egypt. Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy everything that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys.'" God ordered similar things when the Israelites were invading the promised land (Deuteronomy 2:34; 3:6; 20:16-18). Why would God have the Israelites exterminate an entire group of people, women and children included? This is honestly a very difficult issue. We do not fully understand why God would command such a thing, but at the same time we trust God that He is just – and recognize that we are incapable of fully understanding a sovereign, infinite, and eternal God. As we look at difficult issues such as this one, we have to remember that God’s ways are higher than our ways and His thoughts are higher than our thoughts (Isaiah 55:9; Romans 11:33-36). We have to be willing to trust God and have faith in Him even when we do not understand His ways. Unlike us, God knows the future. God knew what the results would be if Israel did not completely eradicate the Amalekites. If Israel did not carry out God’s orders, the Amalekites would come back to “haunt” the Israelites again and again. Saul claimed to have killed everyone but the Amalekite king Agag (1 Samuel 15:20). Obviously Saul was lying…just a couple of decades later there were enough Amalekites to take David and his men’s families captive (1 Samuel 30:1-2). After David and his men attacked the Amalekites and rescued their families, 400 Amalekites escaped. If Saul had fulfilled what God had commanded him, this never would have occurred. Several hundred years later, a descendant of Agag, Haman, tried to have the entire Jewish people exterminated (see the book of Esther). So, Saul’s incomplete obedience almost resulted in Israel’s destruction. God knew this would occur, so He ordered the extermination of the Amalekites ahead of time. In regard to the Canaanites, God commanded, “However, in the cities of the nations the LORD your God is giving you as an inheritance, do not leave alive anything that breathes. Completely destroy them — the Hittites, Amorites, Canaanites, Perizzites, Hivites and Jebusites — as the LORD your God has commanded you. Otherwise, they will teach you to follow all the detestable things they do in worshiping their gods, and you will sin against the LORD your God” (Deuteronomy 20:16-18). The Israelites failed in this mission as well, and exactly what God said would happen occurred (Judges 2:1-3; 1 Kings 11:5; 14:24; 2 Kings 16:3-4). God did not order the extermination of these people to be cruel, but rather to prevent even greater evil from occurring in the future. Probably the most difficult part of these commands from God is that God ordered the death of children and infants as well. Why would God order the death of innocent children? (1) Children are not innocent (Psalm 51:5; 58:3). (2) These children would have likely grown up as adherents to the evil religions and practices of their parents. (3) By ending their lives as children, God enabled them to have entrance into Heaven. We strongly believe that all children who die are accepted into Heaven by the grace and mercy of God (2 Samuel 12:22-23; Mark 10:14-15; Matthew 18:2-4). Again, this answer does not completely deal with all the issues. Our focus should be on trusting God even when we do not understand His ways. We also have to remember that God looks at things from an eternal perspective, and that His ways are higher than our ways. God is just, righteous, holy, loving, merciful, and gracious. How His attributes work together can be a mystery to us – but that does not mean that He is not who the Bible proclaims Him to be. Recommended Resource: Show Them No Mercy: 4 Views on God and Canaanite Genocide. Related Topics: Why is God so different in the Old Testament than He is in the New Testament? How do I get the image of God as imposing and angry out of my mind? Did God create evil? Why is God a jealous God? Is it wrong to question God? poster comment: Deu 7:1 — When the LORD thy God shall bring thee into the land whither thou goest to possess it, and hath cast out many nations before thee, the Hittites, and the Girgashites, and the Amorites, and the Canaanites, and the Perizzites, and the Hivites, and the Jebusites, seven nations greater and mightier than thou; http://www.blueletterbible.org/s...k.cfm?b=Deu&c=7&v=1&t=KJV Deuteronomy 7:1-26 Deu 7:2 And when the LORD thy God shall deliver them before thee; thou shalt smite them, [and] utterly destroy them; thou shalt make no covenant with them, nor shew mercy unto them: Deu 7:3 Neither shalt thou make marriages with them; thy daughter thou shalt not give unto his son, nor his daughter shalt thou take unto thy son. Deu 7:4 **** For they will turn away thy son from following me, that they may serve other gods: so will the anger of the LORD be kindled against you, and destroy thee suddenly........ http://www.blueletterbible.org/Bible.cfm?b=Deu&c=7&v=1 ...Jos 23:12 Else if ye do in any wise go back, and cleave unto the remnant of these nations, [even] these that remain among you, and shall make marriages with them, and go in unto them, and they to you: Jos 23:13 Know for a certainty that the LORD your God will no more drive out [any of] these nations from before you; but they shall be snares and traps unto you, and scourges in your sides, and thorns in your eyes, until ye perish from off this good land which the LORD your God hath given you. Jdg 3:2 Now these [are] the nations which the LORD left, to prove Israel by them, [even] as many [of Israel] as had not known all the wars of Canaan; Jdg 3:2 Only that the generations of the children of Israel might know, to teach them war, at the least such as before knew nothing thereof; Jdg 3:3 [Namely], five lords of the Philistines, and all the Canaanites, and the Sidonians, and the Hivites that dwelt in mount Lebanon, from mount Baalhermon unto the entering in of Hamath. Jdg 3:4 And they were to prove Israel by them, to know whether they would hearken unto the commandments of the LORD, which he commanded their fathers by the hand of Moses. Jdg 3:5 And the children of Israel dwelt among the Canaanites, Hittites, and Amorites, and Perizzites, and Hivites, and Jebusites: Jdg 3:6 And they took their daughters to be their wives, and gave their daughters to their sons, and served their gods. Jdg 3:7 And the children of Israel did evil in the sight of the LORD, and forgat the LORD their God, and served Baalim and the groves...... 1Ki 11:2 Of the nations [concerning] which the LORD said unto the children of Israel, Ye shall not go in to them, neither shall they come in unto you: [for] surely they will turn away your heart after their gods: Solomon clave unto these in love. Ezr 9:1 Now when these things were done, the princes came to me, saying, The people of Israel, and the priests, and the Levites, have not separated themselves from the people of the lands, [doing] according to their abominations, [even] of the Canaanites, the Hittites, the Perizzites, the Jebusites, the Ammonites, the Moabites, the Egyptians, and the Amorites. Ezr 9:2 For they have taken of their daughters for themselves, and for their sons: so that the holy seed have mingled themselves with the people of [those] lands: yea, the hand of the princes and rulers hath been chief in this trespass......... http://www.blueletterbible.org/s...k.cfm?b=Deu&c=7&v=3&t=KJV 1Ki 11:1 But king Solomon loved many strange women, together with the daughter of Pharaoh, women of the Moabites, Ammonites, Edomites, Zidonians, [and] Hittites; 1Ki 11:2 Of the nations [concerning] which the LORD said unto the children of Israel, Ye shall not go in to them, neither shall they come in unto you: [for] surely they will turn away your heart after their gods: Solomon clave unto these in love. 1Ki 11:3 And he had seven hundred wives, princesses, and three hundred concubines: and his wives turned away his heart. 1Ki 11:4 For it came to pass, when Solomon was old, [that] his wives turned away his heart after other gods: and his heart was not perfect with the LORD his God, as [was] the heart of David his father. 1Ki 11:5 For Solomon went after Ashtoreth the goddess of the Zidonians, and after Milcom the abomination of the Ammonites...... Eze 16:3 And say, Thus saith the Lord GOD unto Jerusalem; Thy birth and thy nativity [is] of the land of Canaan; thy father [was] an Amorite, and thy mother an Hittite. http://www.blueletterbible.org/s...k.cfm?b=Jdg&c=3&v=6&t=KJV Jer 11:10 They are turned back to the iniquities of their forefathers, which refused to hear my words; and they went after other gods to serve them: the house of Israel and the house of Judah have broken my covenant which I made with their fathers....... Jer 11:13 For [according to] the number of thy cities were thy gods, O Judah; and [according to] the number of the streets of Jerusalem have ye set up altars to [that] shameful thing, [even] altars to burn incense unto Baal. http://www.blueletterbible.org/B...?b=Jer&c=11&v=10&t=KJV#10 http://www.blueletterbible.org/s...cfm?b=Jer&c=11&v=10&t=KJV
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#1. To: AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt (#0)
God didn't "command" it.
Outstanding information and post !
4um Traitor Hey, the Cards are only one game out. How do you think they'll do in the Superbowl?
Lev 18:28 so that the land will not spew you out, should you defile it, as it has spewed out the nation which has been before you. That's why. A better question is: "Why are WE still here"? We are just as bad, if not much worse, than any heathen tribe in the Bible. I went to that site, and, as a test, read "Did God create evil? ". Since they cannot even answer that correctly, why go to them for other answers? .
Click for Privacy and Preparedness files Nehemiah 4:14 And I looked and arose and said to the nobles and to the officials and to the rest of the people, “Do not be afraid of them. Remember the Lord, who is great and awesome, and fight for your brothers, your sons, your daughters, your wives, and your homes.”
Is that the one where they throw the oblong ball or the one where they bounce the ball?
Because we have THE everlasting covenant that was promised in the Old Testament. God has a work to accomplish in us, FOR HIS HOLY NAME'S SAKE, not because we are so wonderful [or not]: Eze 37:26 Moreover I will make a covenant of peace with them; it shall be an everlasting covenant with them: and I will place them, and multiply them, and will set my sanctuary in the midst of them for evermore. www.blueletterbible.org/B...?b=Eze&c=37&v=26&t=KJV#26 Hbr 13:20 Now the God of peace, that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant, www.blueletterbible.org/B...?b=Hbr&c=13&v=20&t=KJV#20 Eze 39:24 According to their uncleanness and according to their transgressions have I done unto them, and hid my face from them. Eze 39:25 Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD; Now will I bring again the captivity of Jacob, and have mercy upon the whole house of Israel, and will be jealous for my holy name; Eze 39:26 After that they have borne their shame, and all their trespasses whereby they have trespassed against me, when they dwelt safely in their land, and none made [them] afraid. Eze 39:27 When I have brought them again from the people, and gathered them out of their enemies' lands, and am sanctified in them in the sight of many nations; Eze 39:28 Then shall they know that I [am] the LORD their God, which caused them to be led into captivity among the heathen: but I have gathered them unto their own land, and have left none of them any more there. Eze 39:29 Neither will I hide my face any more from them: for I have poured out my spirit upon the house of Israel, saith the Lord GOD. Isa 9:7 Of the increase of [his] government and peace [there shall be] no end, upon the throne of David, and upon his kingdom, to order it, and to establish it with judgment and with justice from henceforth even for ever. The zeal of the LORD of hosts will perform this. www.blueletterbible.org/B...JV&x=55&y=4&b=Isa&c=9&v=7 I went to that site, and, as a test, read "Did God create evil? ". Since they cannot even answer that correctly, why go to them for other answers? I haven't read it, but I don't believe in throwing out the baby with the bath water. I have learned to be discerning, and even a stopped clock is right twice a day.
"...as long as there..remain active enemies of the Christian church, we may hope to become Master of the World...the future Jewish King will never reign in the world before Christianity is overthrown - B'nai B'rith speech http://www.biblebelievers.org.au/luther.htm / http://bible.cc/psalms/83-4.htm
It's the one with the big stripey field. You know the one with all the helmets and negroes with them spandex buns?
You can only say that if you don't accept the Bible as truth. However, it's only fair to warn you, all scriptures are given for example.....and America is the second Israel.
"...as long as there..remain active enemies of the Christian church, we may hope to become Master of the World...the future Jewish King will never reign in the world before Christianity is overthrown - B'nai B'rith speech http://www.biblebelievers.org.au/luther.htm / http://bible.cc/psalms/83-4.htm
Oh yeah. I like the dancing they do when they score a home run.
There's only one Truth from the Bible worth a crap: the two commandments of Jesus. The rest of it can be discarded, per Jesus' Parable of the Pearl. America is the second Israel That's only because a bunch of Jews run the place. It's more like the Greater Israel with colonies in the Mideast and elsewhere.
It's quite simple actually. The God that created this Universe and what lies beyond did NOT order Samuel to say that to King Saul. It was King Saul who WANTED to kill all the men, women, and children of Amalek, so he ordered his scribes to write that God ordered him to do it. It not only gave King Saul free reign to do as he wished, but it's been used by the Jews over several milennia to perpetrate whatever horrendous atrocity they wish against anyone seen as their foe.
I do, Wash the "baby" in mud, and it makes one heck of a mess. Might as well throw out that "baby" and start over. If someone is wrong in one part, everything else is suspect. It means they have no clue what they are talking about. And if they dont have a clue, then they should be honest enough to be able to admit it. But they will never admit it, under any circumstances. .
Click for Privacy and Preparedness files Nehemiah 4:14 And I looked and arose and said to the nobles and to the officials and to the rest of the people, “Do not be afraid of them. Remember the Lord, who is great and awesome, and fight for your brothers, your sons, your daughters, your wives, and your homes.”
God has never spoken to any Jew in the history of the world except Moses and Jesus.
In politics there is no murder.
It is not hard at all. They were evil. Just like the people of today who don't want to hearken to Gods word. They will perish eternally.
That is not accurate. I will just name one. John the Baptist and everyone that was around to hear it.
Your input wont be needed here. You have neither the eyes to see or the ears to hear. You have hardened your heart. You wont get it without genuine repentance.
Not even Einstein?
I trust no one that claims they know the Will of God. You appear to fall into that camp.
The jooish wannabe old friend, the cocksucker who is full of hate crimes disappeared for a few days and sadly is back on here to spew its hatred once again. This prick wants to pit in my face and laugh about it. That is a hate crime. This very same asshole claims that the joos are only killing women and children in Gaza that are Palis and less than human. I have contacted the atty gen to see if the spitting in my face is a hate crime. If it is , it will have to deal with my disdain for hateful ignortant idiots. Anybody with an ounce of intelligence knows that it is the joos who are destruction of our country. Then they wonder why they become unwelcome aroud the globe.
So your one of those liberal faggots that support hate crimes huh. Well go suck Obama off you little prick. I would literally spit in your face if you were in my presence. Then I would urinate on you. Then watch you run away crying. Sissyboy.
I have contacted the atty gen to see if the spitting in my face is a hate crime. Warning you have someone on your site that supports hate crimes. They want to bring the govt in to police your site. This person is Unamerican trash who hates the first amendment obviously.
They used to play dice together. I forgot about that.
In politics there is no murder.
I do, Wash the "baby" in mud, and it makes one heck of a mess. Might as well throw out that "baby" and start over. Well, maybe you better inform Jesus....He didn't believe in throwing out the baby: "...as long as there..remain active enemies of the Christian church, we may hope to become Master of the World...the future Jewish King will never reign in the world before Christianity is overthrown - B'nai B'rith speech http://www.biblebelievers.org.au/luther.htm / http://bible.cc/psalms/83-4.htm
You are pathetic asswipe! Christine isn't your momma. I've been a member on here before you were a gleam in your old mans eye. You have done very little to endear yourself to members on here. I wanted to get you riled up so that members on here could get to see what a phony piece of shit you really are. You took the bait! It is no wonder that ac/dc is your favorite band. You are also ac/dc and a joo loving asshole who believes Palis are sub human and need to be eradicated by the joos so they can continue to hoodwink all of mankind. If I knew how to come face with your sorry ass, I would teach you something about life and human beings. You wanna spit in my face, I'll give your sorry ass the opportunity by my willing to meet you where ever you choose? How anybody can claim to be a Christian and have so much hatred for human beings is beyond my comprehension and beyond the pale. Why anybody feels the need to engage you leaves me shaking my head. I can't come up with enough words that would properly describe such a sorry piece of humanity and I'm stretching to include the words humanity.
In what way???
Click for Privacy and Preparedness files Nehemiah 4:14 And I looked and arose and said to the nobles and to the officials and to the rest of the people, “Do not be afraid of them. Remember the Lord, who is great and awesome, and fight for your brothers, your sons, your daughters, your wives, and your homes.”
Lies like this is why you should have your ass kicked.
Why anybody feels the need to engage you leaves me shaking my head. http://freedom4um.com/cgi-bin/latestcomments.cgi?Fm=lacumo&To=&SNSearch=+Go+&PNU= What have we here. Oh yes your posting history. Seems you speak to me more then anyone. lol Change your name to windbag.
I speak no lies. You are the one who calls the Palis sub human and the one who is cheering on the evil joos killing women and children in the bombings in Gaza. If I could see your face, I bet you are lathering at the mouth in support of the jooish zionists. Why I bet you beleive the government 9-11 comission lies and cover-up. Well do you? I've been thinking why you have so much hatred for other human beings. After much thought, I have come to realize just how much you have been deranged by the christianity you have been raised under. Your favorite pastor, teddy haggard has not been the best mentor for someone as prone to believe the falsehoods that have been crammed into your head. I bet you believe gw bushkie is a genius. Then you have become overwhelmed by the jesus hating john hagee who is hoping for armegeddon. Jimmy swigert and kenny copeland along with benny hen have short circuited whatever brain function you were born with. Add on the jooish msm and man, you are way over the top and there is no turning back. There is hope for you however, because they are looking for someone to appear as a contestant on I'm Smarter Than a Fifth Grader.
Look shit kisser. You have now said that about 4 times. Put up or shut up. Provide a link or shut the fuck up with your lies. Got it.
I have a website called libertysflame.com I go by A K A Stone I have a 911 section. Right here http://libertysflame.com/cgi-bin/headlines.cgi You can easily see what I believe about 911 there.
You know nothing of me. Here I will humor you for a second wind bag. Er shit kisser. Haggard....Never heard of him until he was outed as a fag. John Hagee....I have heard some things from him that are not right. Jimmy Swaggart....He sinned and was humuliated for it nationally. I know he has a new ministry now but I have only seen a couple of minutes of it over the years. I don't know if he is genuine in his repentance but I think he likely is. We have all sinned. Kennith Copeland... A name it and claim it preacher. I don't subscribe to his theology. He also said unbiblical things like we are little Jesus's. Benny Hinn.......A definate fake. Jesus couldn't even heal people in his own town because they lacked faith. I don't think Hinn had more success then Jesus. He is a fake. Got it shitkisser.
Then why don'y you go there and stay there. Maybe you could call it freakish flames or something. By the way, are you ashamed to admit that you masturbate daily?
How about this shit kisser. Give yourself a swirley next time your going down.
It is not hard at all. They were evil. Just like the people of today who don't want to hearken to Gods word. They will perish eternally. In regard to the Canaanites, God commanded, “However, in the cities of the nations the LORD your God is giving you as an inheritance, do not leave alive anything that breathes. Completely destroy them — the Hittites, Amorites, Canaanites, Perizzites, Hivites and Jebusites — as the LORD your God has commanded you. Do you agree these people were evil, and needed to be destroyed as well?
"...as long as there..remain active enemies of the Christian church, we may hope to become Master of the World...the future Jewish King will never reign in the world before Christianity is overthrown - B'nai B'rith speech http://www.biblebelievers.org.au/luther.htm / http://bible.cc/psalms/83-4.htm
Do you agree these people were evil, and needed to be destroyed as well? I think there is evil or potential evil in everyone. We all deserve to be destroyed. Thank God he sent his son to pay our price.
Oh. I apologize. I meant the seven churches....He reproved them....He didn't throw them out. "...as long as there..remain active enemies of the Christian church, we may hope to become Master of the World...the future Jewish King will never reign in the world before Christianity is overthrown - B'nai B'rith speech http://www.biblebelievers.org.au/luther.htm / http://bible.cc/psalms/83-4.htm
Yes. That is very true, but do you agree with God that the Canaanites etc. should have been destroyed?
"...as long as there..remain active enemies of the Christian church, we may hope to become Master of the World...the future Jewish King will never reign in the world before Christianity is overthrown - B'nai B'rith speech http://www.biblebelievers.org.au/luther.htm / http://bible.cc/psalms/83-4.htm
God said they should be. So yes. Are you now going to try to make the case that Israel should be destroyed? I think you are and I don't think they should. Remember Romans 11.
Someone just sent me this. They ask me if I knew what old friend stood for. Of course I didn't know. They said: Old Friend stands for: Original Lying Deceitful Faggot Requesting Israhelli Engineered Nuclear Destruction of all mankind starting with the Palis. Are they right suckmeister?
No. I used to post here as stone. Then I came back and I thought. Old Friend. It's that simple. Also no one sent you that. You've spent the last 20 minutes trying to come up with something cute. You lack creativity. Get a life.
Wrong joo lover! If you only knew who sent me that it would give you nervous male prostitution if you are a male. You definitely are a joo or a jooish wannabe who is cheering on the complete ethnic cleansing of the Palis in Gaza who you claim are sub human.
I go by A K A Stone Charming fellow.
Thank you sir.
/sarcasm ..............
I'll be back....have to take care of something first. To all of us: bible.cc/galatians/5-22.htm
"...as long as there..remain active enemies of the Christian church, we may hope to become Master of the World...the future Jewish King will never reign in the world before Christianity is overthrown - B'nai B'rith speech http://www.biblebelievers.org.au/luther.htm / http://bible.cc/psalms/83-4.htm
Let me get this straight. The Israelites that were "ordered" to murder all the children including infants, along with all of the men and women of an entire civilization were the "good guys" and their victims are the "evil ones", eh? The more I read here the more I realize that if there IS an entity such as a devil, it is THAT entity that "spoke" to the prophets if they indeed "saw" or "heard" what they claim. In reality the "prophets" were probably either imaginary or existed solely to "prophesize" what the kings wanted the people to THINK came from "God". There is no other explanation for a "God" that incites hate, intolerance, and ultimately murder. Isn't one of the commandants "THOU SHALL NOT KILL"? There seems to be a MAJOR contradiction between the words of the commandants in relation to the words of the prophets. In fact, say that there IS a God that "spoke" to prophets, do you think that God would order a mass genocide of largely innocent people, where actual people would be doing the butchering, rather than him simply sending an epidemic or a natural disaster to kill those people? I'd say it is those who have chosen the path of evil, hate, and destruction who should be in fear for their eternal soul, not those who have chosen the path of love and peace.
God knows their hearts. God knows the world from end to beginning. They were obviously a threat to the christ who was to come.
Look retard. God ordered the killing including the women and children and it was your jooish friends that not only was a threat to Jesus, but the very ones who put him to death. I don't know what is more evil, your words or your love for hateful joos. Tell us professor dork! Or should that be professor schmuck?
They weren't innocent. They were doing great evil. God destroys enbelievers such as yourself. I hope you repent. Sincerely I do.
The Romans killed Christ.
They were obviously a threat to the christ who was to come. The mortals were a threat to a god on earth, and your all powerful god was afraid of them so he incited another group of mortals to kill them all? Uh Huh.
"Satan / Cheney in "08" Uh Huh. God wasn't afraid of them. He knew that if they were left alive their evil would spread and condemn many more to hell. So it got stomped out. You should thank them for it. They gave you and I a chance.
Go read Deuteronomy.
Hate to break it to you. But you can't spell shit kisser. It isn't spelled joo. It is Jew. Damn your stupid.
Very Christlike. You are such a fraud.
I shall not vote for evil, lesser or otherwise. You are such a fraud. I'm not perfect. None of us are. But I would piss on that shit kisser. The little faggot would run away crying.
Are you upset that Jesus was crucified?
It doesn't matter what I think. My thoughts won't change a thing. I do know that old friend is about as far from being a christian as michael jackson and ted bundy. It pretends to know so much about the bible and says so many unchristian things and so much hatred spews from its mouth. This creep has proven over and over that it is in love with the joos and is constantly calling for the irridication of the Palis who this sorry twit proclaims are sub human. A real lesson in christianity. Constantly shames itself and christianity with such ugly vulgar hatred. This moron claims he/she is also aka as stone. Lucifer is more like it! Truly despicable.
/sarcasm .............. Yeah. Still, I prefer him over yukon or Byteshredder or e_type_jag. If Old Friend's the worst 4um has, this isn't so bad.
He didn't. God is merciful, not malicious, vengeful or wrathful. That is all a myth. Imagine a perfect earthly father. He would have none of those characteristics. Our heavenly father is even more perfect and exceedingly more loving. He tears up when folks view him as being capable of those actions. Trust me, I talk to Him every day and I know Him well.
I think you are reading from the book of Ludicrous . <;}>
"Satan / Cheney in "08" You are entitled to your opinion. To me,it is a loud mouthed hateful joo or jooish wannabe who knows slightly more about christianity than my sister's cat. Haven't you been reading this non-entity's swill it posts on here? Cheering on israhell's killing of the Palis in Gaza who this freak says are sub human.
Imagine a perfect earthly father. He would have none of those characteristics. Our heavenly father is even more perfect and exceedingly more loving. He tears up when folks view him as being capable of those actions. Trust me, I talk to Him every day and I know Him well. Well said.
Just curious. One just needs to remember that it wasn't the Jews or the Romans who determined that He would be crucified. I makes no sense to say Jews did it or Romans did it. Matthew 26: 48 Now he that betrayed him gave them a sign, saying, Whomsoever I shall kiss, that same is he: hold him fast. 49 And forthwith he came to Jesus, and said, Hail, master; and kissed him. 50 And Jesus said unto him, Friend, wherefore art thou come? Then came they, and laid hands on Jesus and took him. 51 And, behold, one of them which were with Jesus stretched out his hand, and drew his sword, and struck a servant of the high priest's, and smote off his ear. 52 Then said Jesus unto him, Put up again thy sword into his place: for all they that take the sword shall perish with the sword. ******************************************************************************** 53 Thinkest thou that I cannot now pray to my Father, and he shall presently give me more than twelve legions of angels? 54 But how then shall the scriptures be fulfilled, that thus it must be? 55 In that same hour said Jesus to the multitudes, Are ye come out as against a thief with swords and staves for to take me? I sat daily with you teaching in the temple, and ye laid no hold on me. ******************************************************************************** 56 But all this was done, that the scriptures of the prophets might be fulfilled. Then all the disciples forsook him, and fled.
Why do you want to kill all the Jews? Are you hitler jr? Such hatred for Jews is irrational. I suggest suicide.
Why do you want to make lampshades out of Jews?
Of course you are correct Jesus gave himself willingly. I was just referencing that the Romans in fact did the deed, not the Jews.
Talk about dopey ideas.
Oh come on Jethro, your a good guy. Think back to your childhood and rediscover that faith i'm sure you used to have. Don't let the actions of men and us sinners take away from the actions and words of christ.
The faith of a good Christian that tells his adversaries to consider suicide and write posts that tell us "Hitler was right!"
You can't read can you. Show me anything that I WROTE where I said Hitler was right? Go on do it you illiterate.
Every single man and woman will stand before God and either have Christ as an advocate or not. No others will be standing with us, just us and God. And hopefully Jesus as an advocate. Life's full of choices.
4um Traitor Your "Hitler was right" was uber sarcasm I thought ?
4um Traitor I'm not disagreeing with you, just trying to make light of it.
I didn't write it. I posted it. Not only that but I commented that I didn't agree with it. Some people just see what they want to see.
Go back and read that thread. There is neither irony nor sarcasm in it. I may be wrong, and if I am, please drop me a note. I thought it was deadly serious. Couldn't believe ir when I saw it.
Was it a sarcastic posting by you or not ?
4um Traitor A lot of people sincerely agree with Hitler right down to the ovens.
4um Traitor Such hatred for Jews is irrational. I suggest suicide. OF, I suggest you stfu.
A lot of people sincerely agree with Hitler right down to the ovens. I don't know if it was sarcastic. But it was to draw out those who as you say here " sincerely agree with Hitler right down to the ovens. "
The average jew is no better or worse than the average North AmeriKan. It's the governments run by luceriferian world orderists that have the blood orgy going on and through propaganda have coopted entire populations.
4um Traitor Thanks.
4um Traitor Cheering on israhell's killing of the Palis in Gaza who this freak says are sub human. LACUMO posted on 2009-01-19 20:52:30 ET Reply Trace Private Reply Why don't you tell shit kisser to STFU! He keeps lying about me calling them sub human. About 8 times now. He should put up a link proving it (he can't because I didn't say it) or STFU as you say.
My bad, I read it as you being the author, O.F. I just checked and indeed it is posted as "Author: thenewworldorder.org" My fault for not checking. But dammit, you should post a disclaimer in the comments when you post from Stormfront or wherever the hell you got this. I was so shocked by the deadpan way you posted this I nearly crapped a brick. That was a nutty thing to do BTW.
Really? Do you know what their crime was? SOME of the Amaleks had attacked the Israelite stragglers at the rear when the Israelites left Egypt. So in order to enact revenge, God ordered the heroic "chosen people" to slaughter the "suckling infants", and the men, women, and children of Amalek, showing them no mercy. Seems to me this "god" in that verse is EVIL, ever more so than the innocent babies he ordered butchered. That is, IF it was actually "God" that ordered such a massacre. That's why I'm saying it was simply Saul who wanted to take revenge upon the Amalek nation for what they did to the Israelites. Perhaps he lost some friends or family to those Amalek bandits, and in traditional barbaric fashion he decided to butcher the entire race of people for revenge. He would just need to order his "prophet" or scribes that wrote under the prophet's name to write that God ordered him to do it. Can you prove that it was God that ordered him to do it?
I know of no such people here. You admit that you are just a troll here with that comment. O.F. you are just an old shit-stirrer.
Evil babies.
They get phosphorous.
Own damned fault.
This software allows for a comment section under the article section. It isn't set up that way. It makes it easier to post comments as they automatically get put in italics. Anyways on this site I usually put my comments right after I post the article. I'm not a stormfronter. I shouldn't have called you illiterate we all miss stuff like that.
No others will be standing with us, just us and God. And hopefully Jesus as an advocate. Life's full of choices. Imagine the surprise you'll have when things turn out a bit different than you expected. Thing is, IF you truly accept GOD into your heart, you'll know it. If you simply go to Church on Sundays, and think that just because you believe something written in a book you're salvation is guaranteed, then as I said, you might have a bit of a surprise when the time comes. But don't let me pop your balloon, just keep on thinking all is well.
You admit that you are just a troll here with that comment. O.F. you are just an old shit-stirrer. I can post from at least 2 people who said we should nuke Israel. That would be more then killed in the holocaust. And its even kinda like an oven.
Oh well, you meant well, didn't you. I always mean well when I post about hitler. Do you know he only had one ball??
You're nuking this entire forum. Honestly, it's a bummer. WTF is Turtle?
Are you talking to your god? You know the one without definition your own personal custom religion. Can you tell us about it?
It's appalling that people DO actually believe that. And it's even MORE appalling that there are those who act accordingly, ie. the Israeli government and it's military forces.
Honestly, it's a bummer. How is that? I'm just here debating and giving my opinions. I can name names and pull up links if you want if you think I am lying.
It hurts, don't it? The world is full of apalling stuff. Good night to you, Lurker. Don't let them get you down. I'm out for the count.
My God? My God is the Creator of All. You see, we all have a choice to side with Good, or side with Evil. Those who CLAIM they are religious yet have seething hate and disregard for life are self-deluded and have chosen evil to guide their lives. Those who are at peace with themselves, feel love for ALL creatures, and reject violence have chosen good. There is much we do not and simply CAN NOT understand. I do not pretend to understand all that there is, but I also know that others have even less understanding than I. I certainly don't believe men who claim to be the mouthpieces of God, especially when much of their words and deeds are evil. The only way to truly begin to understand God is to pray, and not for worldly or material wealth, but for spiritual growth.
BTW OF, did you read what I had posted concerning the Essenes?
Do you eat meat?
Good night to you also randge, and I'll never feel myself down when I have truth on my side.
What if you did something violent 10 years ago but since then you have been good. Then what? What if you have been good and yesterday did something violent. Then tomorrow you die. What then? What do you base these beliefs on? Are you in personal communication with this "god"?
No.
Do you reject the God that Jesus prayed to?
Well you should. It explains quite a few things about my beliefs.
What kind of trick question is this. Something on the trinity i'm guessing? No I don't reject God.
Well by believing the New Testament you are rejecting what Jesus actually said, as the NT is opposite what he taught. It was written by Paul and his Roman masters, after they had eradicated the Essene Nazarene Christians, ie. the order that the TRUE apostles belonged to, along with all of their writings. Much of what Jesus and the Essenes taught is in conflict with the Old Testament as well, where the Essenes were extremely non-violent people who would never harm one of God's creatures. They were vegetarian in fact, and would not offer blood sacrifices. There are things beyond the book known as the Torah that speak of the true God. It is simply a matter of finding those sparks of truth amongst a swarm of deceipt.
Your full of shit. The old testament is gods word hidden. The new testament is gods word revealed.
No. In previous articles published in The Essene Path, I have briefly touched on the topic of how Paul, the self-proclaimed Apostle, violently opposed the original vegetarian Essene Christianity of Jesus, first by killing and imprisoning its leaders, then by infiltrating the movement and leading a schism. The schism led by Paul -- a meat-eating version of Christianity -- replaced the teachings of Jesus with the teachings of Paul. As briefly described in previous articles, "Paulianity" evolved into the Roman Catholic Church and gave birth to all of what is considered mainstream Christianity today, Catholic, Eastern Orthodox, and Protestant. Whereas I have briefly touched on this topic in previous articles, it is the purpose of this article to deal with it in great depth. I will begin by setting the stage; I will describe early Christianity as it existed prior to the advent of Paul. What were the main tenets of this pre-Pauline, Essene Christianity? What was the early Christian doctrine of salvation? Having set the stage, I will describe in detail the schism led by Paul which evolved into modern Christianity. I will conclude this expose´ with a call to action: A CALL TO REJECT PAULIANITY AND RETURN TO ESSENE NAZARENE CHRISTIANITY. The choice is simple, yet profound; and every Christian must make it: YAHSHUA (Jesus) OR PAUL? First, some necessary background information must be given. There was an ancient Jewish religion which was very mystical, high and noble. It was a very evolved form of religion, rooted in respect and care for all of creation. This ancient Jewish religion was both very esoteric -- as evidenced by its Kaballah mysticism -- and yet very practical, as evidenced by its emphasis on daily lifestyle disciplines, ecology and communal economics. It was also VERY VEGETARIAN: not only was animal sacrifice forbidden, but so was the eating of animal flesh absolutely condemned. War and slavery had no part in this nonviolent religion. Women were the equals to men; women were entitled -- in fact, encouraged-- to participate in the Priesthood. This Priesthood -- called "The Priesthood of Melki Zadek" -- was governed by God via good angels and the divinely inspired BOOK OF THE ETERNAL COVENANT. Their original founder was Enoch; later, Moses led a major remanifestation of their movement. THIS ENLIGHTENED ANCIENT JEWISH RELIGION WAS KNOWN AS "ESSENE NAZARENE JUDAISM". But Essene Nazarene Judaism was not the only form of Judaism. A violent, flesh- eating form of Judaism based on bloody animal sacrifice became the dominant religion in Israel. The nonviolent, vegetarian Essenes were persecuted by the animal sacrifice cult. Both forms of Judaism expected a Messiah: the sacrificial cult expected the Messiah to be a warrior king; the Essene Nazarenes expected a Messiah of Peace, a spiritual King. And so it was that the Messiah of Peace, the spiritual King of Israel, came to earth through the Essenes; for it was the Essene scriptures and prophecies that proved true. And so it was that the Essene Nazarene Jews, practitioners of the authentic Judaism established by God through Enoch and Moses, BECAME THE VERY FIRST CHRISTIANS! The "first Christians" were not called "Christians"! That term was not used until years later. They were called "Essene Nazarene Ebionites". For short, they were usually referred to simply as "Nazarenes" or "Ebionites". Let us begin our description of early, pre-Pauline Christianity with a look at the meaning of the terms "Nazarene" and "Ebionite". The term "Nazarene" refers to a member of the Essene movement associated with Mount Carmel in Northern Israel. The Essenes considered Mount Carmel to be so holy that none of the natural vegetation growing there could be disturbed: no trees cut, no bushes cleared away, no permanent dwellings built. Some of their priests lived on Mount Carmel in tents (similar to yurts) but no permanent structures were permitted. Even their Temple atop Carmel was a type of large tent, a beautiful yurt with a bloodless altar. Only a small contingent of their priests actually lived atop Mount Carmel, the majority of their membership lived in an Essene cooperative village a couple miles from the southwestern edge of the base of the mountain. That Essene village was called "Nazareth". Those who lived there were called "Nazarenes", as were all members of the Essene sect associated with Mount Carmel. Thus, the fact that Jesus was referred to as "the Nazarene" and his first followers were called "the sect of the Nazarenes" demonstrates the link between early Christianity and the Essene Nazarenes of Mount Carmel. The other term that the first Christians were called was "Ebionite". The word "Ebionite" comes from the Hebrew word "Ebon" which literally means "poor" but implies "THOSE WHO HAVE VOLUNTARILY RENOUNCED WORLDLY MATERIALISM TO ENTER THE ESSENE LIFESTYLE OF SIMPLE LIVING AND RADICAL SHARING IN COMMUNITY." Simply put, an "Ebionite" is an "Essene renunciate", an Essene who has given up materialism to serve God within the context of the communal lifestyle in which all is shared. While all fully initiated Essene Nazarene Ebionites lived in, or were sent out on missions by, the network of Essene Christian communes, there was a large outer-circle of members not yet fully initiated who still lived in private homes. These outer-circle devotees were called "Hearers"; until ready to divest themselves of private wealth and join the communal economy, they studied the teachings and supported the communes by tithing. In the beatitudes of the Sermon on the Mount, Jesus declared "Blessed are the Ebon ("Poor"), for they shall inherit the Earth." He was not pronouncing a general blessing on all poor people; neither was he praising poverty. Rather, he was making specific reference to his sect, the Essene "Ebon" or "Ebionites" gathered around him atop the Mount. The terms "Nazarene" and "Ebionite" are central to a correct understanding of early, pre-Pauline Christianity. Why? Because certain specific beliefs and practices can be identified with those terms. We know from many sources that both terms -- Nazarene and Ebionite -- are associated with: vegetarianism, reincarnation, God as both Father and Mother, communalism, pacifism, an absolute prohibition against slavery, absolute sobriety (no intoxicating drinks or drugs), equality of men and women, holistic health and Essene Yoga. THOSE ARE THE BELIEFS AND PRACTICES OF THE VERY FIRST CHRISTIANS, the beliefs and practices of the ESSENE NAZARENE EBIONITES. And what was the doctrine of salvation of these early, pre-Pauline Christians? They believed that SALVATION IS DEPENDENT UPON FOLLOWING THE SAVING TEACHINGS OF YAHSHUA (Jesus). In a profound contrast with the theology of Paul -- which became orthodox Christianity ("Paulianity") -- the literature of the Essene Nazarene Ebionites NEVER TAUGHT SALVATION VIA BELIEF IN THE SACRIFICIAL DEATH OF JESUS ON THE CROSS. The Pauline doctrine which asserts that you can only be saved by believing that Jesus died for your sins, is called ATONEMENT. The Essene Nazarene Ebionites had a very different doctrine of Atonement; it was AT-ONE-MENT. They believed that to be AT-ONE with God (the goal of religion) one must follow THE SAVING TEACHINGS OF YAHSHUA, not simply believe in his sacrificial death. The Essene Nazarene Ebionites based their doctrine of salvation on the actual instructions they personally received from Yahshua before his crucifixion. Unlike Paul, who NEVER EVEN MET JESUS, the leaders of the Essene Nazarene Ebionites were PERSONALLY TRAINED AND INITIATED BY THEIR SPIRITUAL MASTER, YAHSHUA. In The Essene New Testament, Jesus tells his disciples that blood sacrifice cannot bring salvation: So, Jesus made quite clear that no blood sacrifice -- not even his own -- can provide salvation for your sins; rather, you must quit sinning (repent) and follow his SAVING TEACHINGS. And that was the doctrine of salvation of the Essene Nazarene Ebionites. It should be noted that while the Essene Nazarene Christians did not believe in the remission of sins via Jesus' sacrificial death, THEY DID BELIEVE JESUS PERFORMED A POWERFUL WORK ON THE CROSS. Fallen angels who had become disembodied demons were tampering with the subtle, etheric atmospheres of Planet Earth; especially: 1) the energy vortex involved with the process of exiting the body at death; 2) the purgatorial realm of past life review between incarnations; and, 3) the energy vortex involved with the process of taking new birth. For Jesus to purify and reorganize those subtle, etheric atmospheres of our planet, IT WAS NECESSARY FOR HIM TO DIE AS A HUMAN BEING AND ENTER THOSE SUBTLE REGIONS THROUGH THE ENERGY VORTEX WHICH WAS INFESTED WITH PARASITIC DEMONS. He did so, freeing many souls who were being held captive in the subtle planes (being sucked of life-force by vampire-like disembodied entities) and purified the entire between-lives region and energy vortexes. This took place during the three days after his crucifixion and prior to his reappearance to the disciples at the tomb. Thus, the Essene Christians believed that salvation was dependent on following the savings teachings of Jesus -- not belief in his sacrificial death -- BUT DID BELIEVE HE PERFORMED A MIGHTY WORK BY DYING AS A MAN AND PURIFYING THE BETWEEN-LIVES REGION. But no matter how vital and necessary that deed was, if we simply believe in it and neglect to follow his teachings, we will not experience AT-ONE- MENT with God. AT-ONE-MENT WITH GOD IS ACHIEVED VIA HARMONY WITH THE LAWS OF GOD -- the laws of the universe -- AND THOSE LAWS (and how to be in harmony with them) ARE THE SUBJECT OF THE TEACHINGS OF JESUS. Having set the stage, I will begin now to describe how Paul, the self- proclaimed Apostle, violently opposed the original vegetarian Essene Christianity of Jesus, first by killing and imprisoning its leaders, then by infiltrating the movement and leading a schism. That schism, as I shall describe, evolved into mainstream, meat-eating Christianity. About two decades after the crucifixion of Jesus, we meet Paul. Essene Nazarene Christianity was still true to the teachings of Jesus, being led by James, the brother of Jesus. Paul, an agent of the Jewish puppet-government installed by imperial Rome, then made his first appearance, leading a bloody assault on the Essene Christians in the Temple at Jerusalem. That vicious attack in which many Essene-Christians were murdered by Paul and his henchmen -- an historical fact you won't find in your "Pauline" Christian Bible -- is described by the Apostle Peter in an ancient Essene Christian manuscript titled, THE CLEMENTINE HOMILIES AND RECOGNITIONS; we read: "To him our James began to show, by abundant proof that Jesus is the Christ, and that in Him are fulfilled all the prophecies which related to His humble advent. For, James showed that two advents of Him are foretold: one in humiliation, which He has now accomplished; the other in glory, which is yet to be accomplished.... "And when James had plainly taught the people concerning these things, he added this also, that unless a man be baptized in water, in the name of the threefold blessedness, as the True Prophet taught, he can neither receive remission of sins nor enter the kingdom of heaven: and he declared that this is the prescription of the unbegotten God.... And when James had spoken some more things about baptism, through seven successive days he persuaded all the people and even the high priest that they should hasten straightaway to receive baptism.... "And when matters were at that point that they would all come and be baptized, Paul and his men entered the temple: and Paul cried out: 'Oh men of Israel, why are you so easily influenced by these miserable men?' He began to excite the people and raise a tumult... and drive all into confusion with shouting, and to undo what had been done by James. Paul rebuked the priests for having listened to James, and, like a madman, began to excite the priests and people to murder James and the brethren, saying 'Do not hesitate; grab them and pull them to pieces.' Paul then, seizing a strong brand from the altar, set the example of smiting. Then others also, seeing him, joined in the beating. Much blood was shed. Although James and the brethren were more numerous and more powerful they rather suffered themselves to be killed by an inferior force, than to kill others. Paul attacked James and threw him headlong from the top of the steps; and supposing him to be dead left him." Fortunately, James, the Brother of Jesus and leader of the Essene Christians, was revived by Essene healers. He and the other survivors of Paul's attack left Jerusalem and went to an Essene commune to heal. Paul continued to persecute Essene Christians, going from city to city with secret police agents, arresting and killing many. Then, on the road to Damascus, Paul (this is the point where he changed his name from Saul to Paul) claimed to have a vision of Christ, and supposedly converted to Essene Christianity. By claiming conversion, Paul was entitled to receive initiation into the Essene mystery school (he entered their three year ministerial training program in Damascus) and to learn the various secrets of the group, including their hidden camps and underground church locations. At first, the brethren considered his conversion to be authentic. Later they realized it was no real conversion: IT WAS AN INFILTRATION! Once Paul had infiltrated the group and received ordination, he began to change the teachings of Jesus, especially in regard to vegetarianism. (We will examine the conflict between Paul and the old Apostles on vegetarianism in another section of this article.) Certainly, Paul is entitled to his own opinion on vegetarianism. But a study of all the source material makes clear that Paul did more than simply state his own opinion: he DELIBERATELY and SYSTEMATICALLY replaced the original teachings of Jesus and the "old apostles" with his own very different teachings, not only on vegetarianism but also women's rights, slavery and more. In The Story of Christian Origins, Martin Larson writes: In one of the best books on early Christianity, Those Incredible Christians, Dr. Hugh Schonfield reports: "It was not only the teaching and activities of Paul which made him obnoxious to the Christian leaders: but their awareness that he set his revelations above their authority and claimed an intimacy with the mind of Jesus, greater than that of those who had companied with him on earth and had been chosen by him.... It was an abomination, especially as his ideas were so contrary to what they knew of Jesus, that he should pose as the embodiment of the Messiah 's will.... Paul was seen as the demon-driven enemy of the Messiah.... For the legitimate Church, Paul was a dangerous and disruptive influence, bent on enlisting a large following among the Gentiles in order to provide himself with a numerical superiority with the support of which he could set at defiance the Elders at Jerusalem. Paul had been the enemy from the beginning, and because he failed in his former open hostility he had craftily insinuated himself into the fold to destroy it from within." In the two excerpts given directly above -- the excerpt from Larson's book and the excerpt from Schonfeld's book -- six important assertions are made in regard to Paul: I will now address each of the above six assertions, providing evidence to support them. I will deal with the significance of the first assertion -- that Paul taught it was okay to eat meat offered to idols -- when I address number five because the two are intimately linked. Thus, I begin with assertion number two. We saw above that Martin Larson, in his book The Story of Christian Origins, asserted that whereas Jesus honored women, Paul did not. Larson asserts that Paul taught the inferiority of women, commanding women to submit to men. We need not look far for evidence; simply grab the nearest bible and read Paul's own words; in First Corinthians, Chapter 11, Paul declares: Similarly, Paul declares in Chapter 5 of Ephesians: If you think the above words of Paul are not only egotistical -- "Be imitators of me" -- but also brand him as a male chauvinist, hold onto your hats (especially you women in church!); IT GETS WORSE! In Chapter 14 of First Corinthians, Paul writes: In the above excerpts from the Pauline New Testament -- the New Testament used by every Christian Church in the world today EXCEPT ESSENE CHURCH OF CHRIST (we use The Essene New Testament which has NO WORDS OF PAUL), Paul reveals himself to be biased towards women -- indeed, he seems to hate them -- and to be a megalomaniac. ("Megalomania" is a disease of the mind marked by unwarranted feelings of personal superiority, omnipotence and grandeur.) Probably, most of the older women reading this article remember having to wear hats or veils on their heads at church when they were little girls. That Pauline doctrine was enforced in nearly all Christian churches in America up until the women's liberation movement of the 1960's. That Pauline doctrine is still enforced in nearly every Christian church outside of America. Even today in America, especially in the Southern States, women still must wear head coverings in many of the more conservative denominations. Obviously, the Catholic prohibition against women being priests is rooted in this Pauline bias against women. JESUS NEVER SPOKE NEGATIVELY ABOUT WOMEN THE WAY PAUL DID. At spiritual gatherings of his disciples, Mary Magdalene constantly peppered Jesus with spiritual questions, as did another woman named Mary and a woman named Martha. Jesus encouraged them to speak. Jesus' positive viewpoint in regard to women was a natural outgrowth of his understanding of God as both Father and Mother; we read in The Essene New Testament: "Verily, God created mankind in the Divine image male and female, and all nature is in the image of God.... In the beginning, God willed and there came forth the First Beloved Son and the First Beloved Daughter, united as Love and Wisdom, created in the Image and Likeness of the Father-Mother, and of these proceed all the generations of the spirits of God, the Sons and Daughters of the eternal.... "Therefore shall the name of the Father and Mother be equally hallowed, for they are the great powers of God...." Wow! what a vastly different vibratory frequency are the words of Jesus in regard to the feminine energy than Paul's! While Jesus praises the feminine energy as being Divine and calls women "the daughters of God", Paul tells women to cover their heads as a sign of submission to men -- or to have their heads shaved bald as punishment -- and forbids them to speak at church! Hey Ladies, take your pick: Essene Christianity or Paulianity? Next we will examine Schonfield's assertion that Paul permitted Christians to own other Christians in contrast to the absolute prohibition against slavery by the Essenes. Once again, we need look only so far as the nearest Pauline Bible - - the Bible on your bookshelf -- for evidence to support Schonfield; for, once again, Paul's own words condemn him. In chapter 6 of Ephesians, Paul instructs Christian slaves to obey their Christian slave masters as though the slave master were Jesus Christ: Likewise, in chapter 3 of Colossians, Paul orders Christian slaves in another congregation to obey their Christian slave masters: In 1st Timothy chapter 6, Paul instructs his ministerial student, Timothy, in the Pauline doctrine on slavery, and then displays his egotistical megalomania by asserting that anyone who disagrees with him knows nothing: Yes, the above words upholding slavery, like the previous words downgrading women, are printed on the pages of the supposedly "holy" Bible, the book which Pauline Christians call "the Word of God". Fortunately, there does exist a truly "holy" Bible; and, fortunately, that Bible forbids slavery and upholds the dignity of women. That truly holy Bible is The Essene New Testament; and it is indeed worthy of the term "THE WORD OF GOD." Unfortunately, the Pauline fundamentalists don't read it! Thus, the above excerpts from the Pauline bible upholding slavery were used by governmental and religious "authorities" to defend the institution of slavery for nearly 1,900 years. In fact, when Abraham Lincoln first tried to put an end to slavery in America many Christian Churches opposed him AND USED THE ABOVE WORDS OF PAUL TO DEFEND SLAVERY IN AMERICA. The Southern Baptist denomination was formed to defend the practice of slavery in America; their theological defense of slavery was based on the words of Paul. AND EVEN THE KU KLUX KLAN BASED THEIR EARLY PRO SLAVERY PROPAGANDA ON THE ABOVE WORDS OF PAUL. (The Klan was formed three years after the end of the Civil War but hoped to overturn the freedom won by blacks and return to slavery.) How many whipped black backs, stretched black necks (lynchings), cross burnings, (yes the Christian cross burning in front of a black person's home is a symbol of the Pauline Christian Klan) and burnt black churches are directly attributable to the above words of Paul? Larson was certainly correct in his assertion that THE ESSENES ABSOLUTELY FOREBADE THE PRACTICE OF SLAVERY. In fact, as Upton Clairy Ewing points out in his book The Prophet of the Dead Sea Scrolls, the Essenes were the very first people in history to condemn slavery: Philo of Alexandria, a contemporary of the Essenes, wrote: Jesus, the Essene Messiah and founder of the religion Paul claimed to represent, declared: The fact that Paul betrayed the anti-slavery doctrine of Jesus and the Essene Christians is made clear by Ewing; we read in The Prophet of The Dead Sea Scrolls: "The Nazarenes, also called Ebionites, the sect who represented the first Christian congregation at Jerusalem under James, the Lord's brother, abided by the strict ascetic rules of their Essene brethren. They held it to be contrary to the plan of God for anyone to enslave another.... "However, at this point we find a parting of the ways: Palestinian Christianity was to be taken over and changed by the evangelist who labored amongst the Gentiles [Paul]. Materialism succeeded asceticism and human freedom became the first great ethic of Jesus Christ to bow to the carnal customs of the heathen. Paul at this time was, no doubt, under great stress and pain in both body and spirit, for in assuming the Roman custom of slavery, he was in consequence severely criticized and shunned by the old apostles. For this... he was called an 'Apostate'." Please notice above that the Essene Christian's prohibition against slavery was only the first "great ethic of Jesus Christ" to be betrayed by Paul. Paul systematically altered many of the teachings of Jesus, replacing them with his own false gospel. Which brings us face-to-face with the fourth assertion made by Larson and Schonfeld: PAUL, ALTHOUGH HE NEVER MET JESUS, IGNORED THE INSTRUCTIONS OF THE APOSTLES WHO HAD BEEN PERSONALLY TRAINED BY JESUS, REPLACING THE TEACHINGS OF JESUS AND THE APOSTLES WITH HIS OWN VERY DIFFERENT TEACHINGS. That is a strong accusation to make. Do other scholars agree? Let's see. In the excellent book Christ or Paul?, the Rev. V.A. Holmes-Gore wrote: The great theologian Soren Kierkegaard, writing in The Journals, echoes the above sentiment: The brilliant theologian Ernest Renan, in his book Saint Paul, wrote: In the above excerpt a reference is made to the "epistles of Paul". The word "epistle" means "letter". The Letters of Paul became a part of the New Testament; in fact, THERE ARE FAR MORE WORDS OF PAUL IN THE NEW TESTAMENT THAN THERE ARE WORDS OF JESUS! And as we are seeing from our study, the words of Paul are not at all in harmony with the words of Jesus! To continue to drive home that point, I am going to intentionally overwhelm you with an avalanche of quotations from great thinkers! The next is from the great American philosopher, Will Durant; in his Caesar and Christ, he wrote: Robert Frost, winner of the Pulitzer prize for poetry in 1924,1931,1937 and 1943, in his "A Masque of Mercy", wrote: James Baldwin, the most noted black American author of this century, in his book The Fire Next Time, declared: Martin Buber, the most respected Jewish philosopher of this century, wrote in Two Types of Faith: The famous mystic, poet and author, Kahil Gibran, declared in Jesus the Son of Man: Above, the great Gibran, accurately reported something that I noticed when I first read the epistles of Paul as a youngster: PAUL DOES NOT QUOTE FROM THE WORDS OF JESUS! (Even before the gospels were written, all initiated Christians were instructed in the sayings of Jesus.) When you read the epistles of Paul, the Father of mainstream Christianity, all you get is Paul's own ideas; he never quotes the wise sayings of Jesus, he never reports on the life of Jesus. That point is also made by the famous theologian Helmut Koester, in his The Theological Aspects of Primitive Christian Heresy: Although I have amply demonstrated that Schonfeld and Larson's fourth assertion -- that Paul replaced the teachings of Jesus with his own very different teachings -- enjoys the support of many great thinkers, I am going to let the avalanche of supporting quotations continue to fall upon the reader a bit longer. But not without good reason. Because I am going to end this article with a call for Christians to abandon Paulianity and embrace Essene Christianity, I must provide OVERWHELMING SUPPORT FOR THE ASSERTION THAT PAUL BETRAYED THE TRUE TEACHINGS OF JESUS. And since many of the evangelical Christians currently under the yoke of Paul (instead of Jesus) are patriotic Americans, how about the following quotation from Thomas Jefferson, third president of the United States and author of the Declaration of Independence; he wrote in his "Letter to William Short": The renowned English philosopher Jeremy Bentham, in his Not Paul But Jesus, declared: The eminent theologian Ferdinand Christian Baur, in his Church History of the First Three Centuries, wrote: The great Mahatma Gandhi, the prophet of nonviolence who won freedom from England for India, in an essay titled "Discussion on Fellowship", wrote: Carl Jung, the famous Swiss psychiatrist, wrote in his essay "A Psychological Approach to Dogma": As you can see, I am quoting from the intellectual cream of humanity. A few more and I will consider my point to be made. Let us continue with George Bernard Shaw, winner of the Nobel Prize for Literature in 1925; in his Androcles and the Lion, we read: Let us follow that Nobel prize winner with another. Albert Schweitzer, winner of the 1952 Nobel Peace Prize, has been called "one of the greatest Christians of his time." He was a philosopher, physician, musician, clergyman, missionary, and theologian. In his The Quest for the Historical Jesus and his Mysticism of Paul he writes: William Wrede, in his excellent book Paul, informs us: Rudolf Bultman, one of the most respected theologians of this century, wrote in his Significance of the Historical Jesus for the Theology of Paul: Walter Bauer, another eminent theologian, wrote in his Orthodoxy and Heresy in Earliest Christianity: My point has been made. Schonfeld and Larson were quite correct in their assertion that PAUL REPLACED THE TEACHINGS OF JESUS WITH HIS OWN VERY DIFFERENT TEACHINGS. I have supported that assertion with powerful quotations from the intellectual cream of humanity. But before moving on to the next assertion in our list of six from Larson and Schonfeld, I choose to end this section on a humorous note (at least I find it humorous!). This rather humorous and certainly true quotation comes from another Nobel Prize winner; Ernest Hemingway: Do I hear a chuckle? Earlier in this article, I listed six assertions made by scholars Martin Larson and Hugh Schonfeld in regard to Paul, and then began to provide supporting evidence for each assertion. We began with assertion number two because, as I explained at the time, I will address assertion number one when I address assertion number five, as they are intimately linked. We have now reached that point; we will now address numbers two and five. We will deal with the two assertions as a unit. Assertion one is: PAUL TAUGHT THAT IT WAS OKAY FOR CHRISTIANS TO EAT MEAT, EVEN MEAT WHICH HAD BEEN SACRIFICED TO IDOLS. Assertion five: PAUL WAS, IN THE VIEW OF THE ESSENE CHRISTIANS, THE DEMON-DRIVEN ENEMY OF THE MESSIAH. The two assertions are linked in that the Essene Christians believed disembodied demons were responsible for the introduction and continuance of flesh eating and animal sacrifice on our planet THROUGH THE AGENCY OF HUMAN TOOLS. In other words, when Larson stated that the Essene Christians considered Paul to be the "demon driven" enemy of the Messiah, he intended the term "demon-driven" to be taken quite literally, not figuratively. Although some of the modern readers of this article may not believe in disembodied demons, the ancient Essene Christians -- including Jesus -- certainly did. (Jesus performed many exorcisms.) So that the modern reader may understand the ancient Essene Christian belief in demons -- including their belief that the demons introduced flesh eating and animal sacrifice to our planet via human tools like Paul -- I am going to provide extensive background information. Planet earth was, originally, a VEGETARIAN PARADISE. In the first chapter of the first book of the Bible, Genesis, the first humans are told by God: Obviously, something occurred which overturned God's plan for a vegetarian earth. But who -- or what -- would dare oppose the will of God? A host of fallen angels, demonic soldiers of Satan, came to vegetarian earth and instituted bloody sacrificial rites, flesh-eating and warfare. Several ancient manuscripts provide the above information. In The Book of Jubilees, fragments of which were found amongst the Dead Sea Scrolls, we read that fallen angels came to earth and: In The Book of Enoch, also found amongst the Dead Sea Scrolls, we read: These fallen angels mated with earth women and produced a race of half demon half human giants that terrorized the world. Finally, in an attempt to purify the land, Mother Earth and Father Sky responded: A flood was sent. The Book of Jubilees makes clear that the flood was a response to the demon- caused fall of mankind from vegetarianism to flesh eating. Martin Larson, in his excellent book The Essene Heritate (subtitled: "The Teacher of the Scrolls and the Gospel Christ."), writes: Another ancient manuscript, The Clementine Homilies and Recognitions, informs us that NONE OF THE BODIES of the demonic entities survived the flood; BUT THEIR EVIL SOULS DID SURVIVE! And they continued to cause trouble. Because the demonic entities no longer had physical bodies -- and were forbidden by God to incarnate as humans -- they had to get their bloody thrills vicariously. In The Clementine Homilies and Recognitions, the Apostle Peter explains: Peter goes on to give many more "gory" details. Through the flesh diet, the demons are able to decrease the rate of vibration of your aura (energy field around your body) to the point they can pierce it and enter your body. Then, they attach themselves to your mind and "make suggestions" to you, suggestions which you believe are from your own mind. Through the agency of your body -- including your sex organs -- these demons get their vicarious "thrills". Because they feed off of emotional turbulence and pain, they attempt to influence human behavior in such a way as to increase the likelihood of wars, violence and crime. Tens of thousands of these demons "hang out" at such places as slaughter houses, battle fields, brothels and bars, feeding on the negative energy. In order to "cultivate" their "garden of pain", these demons attempt to influence politics, business and religion. Shortly, we will consider how the sentence directly above -- especially the word "religion" -- relates to the false apostle Paul. But first I want to expose you to two more ancient accounts of the fall of humanity from original vegetarianism. The second of the following accounts is especially significant in that it links the fall from vegetarianism to the beginning of demonic, animal (and human) sacrifice in religion. The first of the two accounts is from the Oahspe: The fall from original vegetarianism into flesh eating and then human sacrifice is described in The Covenant of Love (a version of the New Testament revised with help from the Dead Sea Scrolls and published as part of Upton Ewing's, The Essene Christ). We read: "The Tree of Life was rent with pain. Its leaves hung limp in sorrow, its precious fruits fell to the ground in rot, and its stench deplored the sickening deed.... "Fear and foreboding grasped the heart of every living creature. The bold became vicious and the meek fled in terror, and the carcasses of dead beasts became the abomination of carnal appetites.... "Farther and farther man strayed from the truth of God. More and more did his power of choice become dominated by greeds and lusts. Weaker and weaker became his will to resist the cravings of the senses. Greater and greater grew the separation between the way of God and the way of man. And the True Light was obscured by the denseness of man 's own maleficent designs, and he no longer recognized the Divine Presence. Man thereafter began to invent his own god or gods.... [at which point the demons set themselves up to be worshipped as gods.] "They arranged a variety of lewd ceremonials and lurid dances to please the indulgence of a 'sensuous God'. They spilled the blood of virgins, of children, and of the gentle lamb and the faithful ox upon the temple altars to satisfy a lustful God." While the last paragraph of the above excerpt is shocking enough -- dealing with human sacrifice -- Peter, in the Clementine manuscript, makes an additional claim; he declares that the demons not only instituted animal and human sacrifice, but even CANNIBALISM: Although most historians do not believe in fallen angels -- or any other angels -- it is a mater of historical record that animal sacrifice, human sacrifice and cannibalism occurred -- and in some dark corners of the world still occur -- ON TEMPLE ALTERS IN THE NAME OF RELIGION. (There are many traces of that demonic religion in the sections of the Old Testament which were composed by the scribes of the cult of sacrifice; that cult of sacrifice was briefly described in the first pages of this article. The Essenes declared that much of the Old Testament came not from God, but from the fallen priesthood of the sacrificial cult. The Essenes described the Old Testament "Book of Leviticus" as "the work of a wicked angel". In Leviticus -- which you will find in the Pauline "Holy" Bible on your book shelf -- we read such things as: We also read in the "Holy" Bible, Book of Leviticus: Charles Vaclavik, in his book The Vegetarianism of Jesus Christ, accurately reports: Now, let us begin to examine how all the above relates to Paul. You will recall that Martin Larson asserted (assertion #1 on our list of six) that Paul taught IT WAS OKAY FOR CHRISTIANS TO EAT FLESH, EVEN FLESH FROM ANIMALS SACRIFICED TO IDOLS. First, let us see if Larson is correct; did Paul permit the eating of flesh, even flesh sacrificed to idols? As with Paul's upholding of slavery and his downgrading of women, we need not look far for evidence to confirm Larson's assertion in regard to Paul and meat; the nearest Pauline Bible will suffice. In his Epistle called "Romans", Paul wrote: Later, after Paul had led an outright schism against the "old Apostles" (i.e. against those who had actually known, walked with, and been trained by Jesus), he went so far as to call vegetarianism a doctrine "taught by demons"; in 1st Timothy (the same epistle in which he ordered Christian slaves to work extra hard for their Christian slave masters), Paul declared: Shortly we shall see that Paul even encouraged the eating of meat sacrificed to idols. But before doing so, we need to compare the above words of Paul with those of Jesus. After all, Paul has asserted that those whose "faith is weak eat only vegetables" and that "every animal created by God is good for eating". He has even gone so far as to call vegetarianism a doctrine taught by "hypocritical liarers" and "demons". QUESTION: Does Paul consider Jesus to be a "hypocritical liar" or "demon"? For, consider the following words of Jesus on vegetarianism; in the Essene New Testament we read: Jesus said: "God giveth the grains and the fruits of the earth for food; and for righteous man truly there is no other lawful sustenance for the body.... "Wherefore I say unto all who desire to be my disciples, keep your hands from bloodshed and let no flesh meat enter your mouths, for God is just and bountiful, who ordained that man shall live by the fruits and seeds of the earth alone." Of course, Jesus practiced what he preached: he was himself a vegetarian. In The Gospel of the Holy Twelve, we read: Jesus said: In another verse of the same manuscript, Jesus declares: Immediately prior to the above quotations of Jesus, I listed two excerpts which prove Paul upheld the eating of animals; but what about meat sacrificed to idols? In his epistle called "Corinthians" (the same epistle in which he ordered women to keep their heads covered as a sign of submission to their husbands -- or have their heads shaved bald as punishment -- and never to speak in church), Paul wrote: Compare the above words of Paul with the following words of Peter; in The Clementine Homilies, Peter declared: In the Clementine manuscript, Peter repeatedly uses the terms "table of the Lord" and "table of the demons." The term "table of the Lord" is used to indicate all vegetarian foods. The term "table of the demons" is used to indicate all non-vegetarian foods, all types of meat. IMPORTANTLY (very important in that it serves as a MAGIC KEY to unlock the true meaning of important passages in The New Testament), Peter asserts that anyone who eats any meat from any source is guilty of eating meat offered to demonic idols -- whether or not any sort of demonic ritual was connected to that particular piece of meat. That is so, insists Peter, because the practice of eating animal flesh was originally introduced by demons to humanity as a sacrificial rite. In reality it still is exactly that, according to Essene- Ebionite Peter, whether or not the flesh eater is aware of that fact. Thus, Peter concludes, "eating any animal flesh is always a tribute to the demons," is a "direct link" to various demonic rituals including "human sacrifice and cannibalism" and constitutes "EATING THINGS OFFERED TO IDOLS" -- a clear violation of the commandment against idol worship. All potential converts to Essene-Ebionite Christianity (original Christianity) were told they must choose between the table of the Lord or the table of the demons. There was no room for compromise. In regard to the Essene Christian belief that Paul was "demon-driven" in his effort to subvert the teachings of Jesus (assertion number five in our list of six), consider the following words of Peter in The Clementine Homilies: We see from the above that Paul, according to Essene Peter, may have been influenced by demons without knowing it. According to Peter, any human that eats meat becomes susceptible to demonic influence -- WHICH IS THE VERY REASON THE DEMONS INTRODUCED THE MEAT DIET TO HUMANITY IN THE FIRST PLACE. To the Essene Christians, how suspicious it must have seemed that: Again, I realize it may be difficult for some modern readers of this article to believe in disembodied demons. But I will confess here and now that I believe the Essene Christians were correct in their analysis: PAUL WAS UNWITTINGLY INFLUENCED BY DISEMBODIED NEGATIVE ENTITIES. I am not alone in my agreement with the early Essene Christians in this regard; consider the following words of Rev. V.A. Holmes-Gore, a respected scholar. In his book Christ or Paul, he writes: "It is clear from his own Epistles that Paul was the victim of evil forces and received his visions from an unreliable source, for in II Corinthians, he says: .... 'I will come to visions and revelations of the Lord.... And by reason of the exceeding greatness of the revelations... there was given me a thorn in the flesh, a messenger of Satan to buffet me....' Thus, Paul admits that his visions and revelations came to him from... a very unreliable source.... Had he been caught up into the seventh heaven, or into the Angelic world his evidence might have been trustworthy but that was not possible for one who befogged his spiritual vision by eating flesh and drinking wine.... "Various other sayings of Paul suggest that it was some kind of possession by the powers of evil.... Thus he speaks of having to wrestle against something not physical.... This passage and the reference to the 'thorn in the flesh' as the 'messenger of Satan' sent to buffet him show that Paul was the victim of the evil powers, and it is therefore easy to understand how, WITHOUT REALIZING IT OR EVER INTENDING IT, he became a vehicle of those influences which were determined to betray the Master's teachings and defeat His mission. "It is evident that when the principalities and powers failed to exterminate Christianity by accomplishing the Master's crucifixion through agents such as Caiaphas, Herod and Pontius Pilate, they tried another way of accomplishing their object. When they saw that the Gospel could not be exterminated they devised a more cunning means of rendering it ineffective. They used false teachers, of whom Paul is the most famous, to popularize the Gospel and rob it of its power to redeem mankind.... Thus did the evil powers use Paul as their Chief Apostle to defeat the very religion which he believed he was especially chosen to promote." We come now to the last in our list of six assertions from Schonfield and Larson. Assertion six is: PAUL HAD BEEN THE ENEMY OF ESSENE - CHRISTIANITY FROM THE BEGINNING, AND BECAUSE HE FAILED IN HIS FORMER OPEN HOSTILITY HE HAD CRAFTILY INFILTRATED THE MOVEMENT TO DESTROY IT FROM WITHIN, LEADING A SCHISM WHICH BECAME NUMERICALLY STRONG ENOUGH TO SUBDUE THE ORIGINAL CHURCH. In the course of dealing with the first five assertions from Schonfeld and Larson, we have already amply demonstrated the truth of the first portion of assertion six -- that Paul had been the enemy of Essene Christianity from the beginning -- and have at least touched on the other aspects of assertion six. But there is yet some fresh and fascinating material to consider in regard to this sixth and final assertion. Perhaps the most intriguing of our yet to be introduced material is found in the book, The Dead Sea Scrolls Deception (the book documents how the Catholic church conspired to suppress the explosive contents of the Dead Sea Scrolls). In Chapter 16 of that book, a Chapter titled "Paul: Roman Agent or Informer", the authors, Michael Baigent and Richard Leigh, provide evidence to support our assertion that Paul "craftily infiltrated" the Christian movement to "destroy it from within": "Startling though the suggestion may be, it does seem... that Paul was some species of Roman 'agent'. Eisenman was led to this conclusion by the scrolls themselves, then found the references in the New Testament to support it.... Does Paul, then, belong in the company of history's 'secret agents'? Of history's informers?.... But in any case... the movement entrusted to the 'early Church' and the Qumran community was effectively hijacked and converted into something that could no longer accommodate its progenitors." Baigent and Leigh's reference above to "Eisenman", is in regard to a scholar named Robert Eisenman. Eisenman's research indicates that although most of the Dead Sea Scrolls were written prior to Christianity, at least one of them -- the "Habakkuk Commentary" -- was written by early Essene Christians and concerns Paul. In that Scroll, Paul is referred to as "the Man of Lies"! In regard to the suggestion by Baigent and Leigh that Paul was some species of Roman "agent", they offer strong evidence in support, including: "These are not the only suspicious elements looming in the background of Paul 's biography. From the very beginning, his apparent wealth, his Roman citizenship and his easy familiarity with the presiding establishment have differentiated him from... other members of the 'early church'. Obviously, he has influential connections with the ruling elite. How else could so young a man have become the high priest's hatchet man? In his letter to the Romans (16:11), moreover, he speaks of a companion strikingly named 'Herodian' -- a name obviously associated with the ruling dynasty.... And Acts 13:1 refers to one of Paul's companions in Antioch as 'Manaen, who had been brought up with Herod the Tetrarch'.... "Paul's heavily escorted departure from the city, his sojourn in luxury at Caesarea, his mysterious and utter disappearance... these things find a curious echo in our own era. One is reminded of beneficiaries of the 'Witness Protection Program'.... He consents to give evidence and testify.... Having cooperated with the authorities, he would then be given a 'new identity' and... resettled somewhere.... Does Paul, then, belong in the company of history's 'secret agents'? Of histories informers?" The reader may choose between two theories on the motive of Paul: 1) He was unwittingly influenced by negative, disembodied demons; 2) He was a secret agent planted by the Roman police, working in league with the Jewish puppet- government and high priest installed by Rome. My own opinion -- and this was the opinion of the Essene Christians -- is that both the above are true: Paul was unknowingly influenced by disembodied demonic powers and, also, worked knowingly with corrupt worldly powers. But regardless of Paul's motive, all of the sources in this article are in agreement in regard to the following: PAUL CRAFTILY INFILTRATED THE CHRISTIAN MOVEMENT AND SUBVERTED IT. Jesus, himself had warned of this; we read in Rev. V.A. Holmes-Gore's Christ or Paul: "This warning fits Paul, who taught that entry into the kingdom of Heaven depends upon faith, i.e. by calling Jesus "Lord, Lord", and did not teach the pure way of life by which alone man can enter the kingdom. And if we apply to Paul the test 'by their fruits ye shall know them' it is abundantly clear that he was a false prophet. We have seen that it was he who founded the Pauline Church in spite of the true Apostles' opposition. It was he who formulated its doctrines.... "The Christianity which the nations claim to follow is the religion of Paul, who is admittedly the chief and almost the only theologian that the Church recognizes. Because of his betrayal of the Master's teachings, the vision of true Christianity has been so dimmed that men have been able to defend war and a host of other evils, such as flesh eating and slavery, on the authority of the Bible. Had the teachings of the Master come down to us in their true form such misinterpretation would have been unthinkable.... "We may well grieve that Christians have failed to give more heed to the Master's warnings against false prophets...." Paul's schism -- "Paulianity"-- became numerically larger than the stricter, revolutionary, vegetarian, pro-woman, anti-slavery Essene Christianity. In fact, Paul's church became the Roman Catholic Church; in Chris Bennett's Green Gold the Tree of Life: "The... Roman Catholic Church (the Paulist Church) erased and reinterpreted much of the information regarding Christ's true gospel." Also supporting the assertion that Paul's church grew in size and eventually became the Roman Catholic Church is Gene Savoy; in his The Essaei Document, we read: "We see, then, that Paul was the father of Pagan Christianity [Roman Catholicism] a movement based on a concept completely foreign to Jesus, James, Peter and the Essaei community.... "It should be remembered that Paul persecuted the Essaei. He was armed with commissions and authority of the chief priests and took great pains to imprison as many as he could find.... "The theology that Paul created is not the religion of the Essaei.... Rome assumed control over it when the Roman emperor embraced Pauline Christianity.... "Palestinian Christianity [Essene Christianity] was displaced by Roman Christianity. The teachings of Jesus the Messiah were overshadowed by the teachings of Paul." Although Paul's Christianity -- "Paulianity" -- grew to be much larger than Essene Christianity (because it was so 'worldly' and watered-down it was easier for the masses to accept; they could continue to eat meat, own slaves and control wives), Essene Christianity did continue to exist. Up until the fourth century both types of Christianity existed as separate religions: Essene Nazarene Christianity and "Catholic Paulianity". But then, in the fourth century, the Catholic Church -- by then a large state-run religion -- sent their army to exterminate (as heretics!) the Essene Nazarenes. Nearly all the Essene Nazarenes were killed and most of their books (which contain the unadulterated teachings of Jesus) were burned. From that time on, Essene Nazarene Christianity existed only in small numbers as a hidden, underground religion, while Paulianity spread all over the planet. We have now concluded our examination of the six assertions made by Schonfeld and Larson. We found overwhelming evidence in support of each of the six assertions. Our supporting quotations came from the intellectual cream of humanity; thinkers such as: Thomas Jefferson, Carl Jung, Mahatma Gandhi, Robert Frost, Albert Schweitzer, Ernest Hemingway, Kahil Gilbran, Soren Kierkegaard, Will Durant, Martin Buber, George Bernard Shaw, and a host of others. We learned that Paul at first openly murdered Essene Christians -- even attempted to kill James, the Brother of Jesus -- and then faked a conversion so that he could infiltrate the movement. He then altered the teachings of Jesus and led a schism which evolved into the Roman Catholic Church and gave birth to all mainstream Christian denominations. We learned that Paul upheld slavery and downgraded women. We learned that Paul is responsible for the removal of Jesus' doctrine on vegetarianism from Christianity. We learned that Paul replaced Jesus' doctrine of salvation -- which was based on following his SAVING TEACHINGS -- with the Pauline doctrine of BELIEF IN JESUS' SACRIFICIAL DEATH. In essence, we learned that the religions of Jesus and Paul are as different as light and darkness, and that all of mainstream Christianity is the religion of Paul, not Jesus. (This does not mean that there are no "good" or "true" things in the letters of Paul; neither does it mean that mainstream Christianity is completely void of goodness. If the powers behind Paul had overtly preached only bad, dark things, they could not have convinced millions of souls to give their hearts and minds to Paulianity. No, they are much too sophisticated for that! The words of Paul are a mixture of good and evil, of truth and falsehood, of light and darkness. And so is mainstream Christianity such a mixture. Thus, in 1st Corinthians, sandwiched between Paul's upholding of slavery and downgrading of women, we find a beautiful poem on love [albeit the poem on love was lifted from The Essene Gospel of Peace and Paul recites it as if he wrote it himself!]. No, the powers behind Paul were experts in the field of propaganda and knew how to mix enough truth with their lies to keep people fooled. The speech writers of Hitler did the same. And most of the "good" things done by mainstream Christianity are attributable to the fact that the powers behind Paul were not completely successful in removing the words of Jesus from the New Testament.) Paul -- and the unseen powers that pulled his strings -- were not entirely successful. They did not succeed in completely eliminating the words of Jesus from the Bible. But it must be admitted that they did accomplish their main objective: to water-down the revolutionary message of Yahshua ha Mashiakh (Jesus the Christ). By removing vegetarianism from the New Testament, the powers behind Paul accomplished three things: Yes, the Pauline army won a battle. However, to win a battle is not to win a war. AND JESUS CHRIST DOES NOT LOSE A WAR. Love is not conquered by hate. Light is not defeated by darkness. Jesus is not vanquished by Paul. In fact, the tide of the battle has already turned: Jesus predicted these manuscripts would come to light when the world was ready to receive them; AND THAT TIME HAS COME! We read those words of prophecy in The Essene New Testament: Jesus said: In another section of the same ancient manuscript, Jesus prophesied: Jesus also said: The BLESSED DAY of the restoration of the true teachings of Jesus Christ has NOW COME! Truly, this is a time of great blessing, BUT IT IS ALSO A TIME OF CHOOSING. Every Christian must make a choice: I hereby issue a call to all Christians: REJECT PAULIANITY AND EMBRACE JESUS CHRIST! The first step is to give up eating meat; until then, the unseen powers behind Paul will whisper in your ear. And the flesh-eating Priests and Pastors of Paul will do more than whisper in your ear; they will scream in it! (And thump their Pauline Bibles more than a few times!) But their day is rapidly fading. A new day has dawned. The table of the Lord has been prepared; You are simply ignorant and misguided. Do a bit of reading of what I just posted, look up what it claims, and then honestly try to say it's shit.
BTW, just because you and your pastor make that claim doesn't make it so.
Your a heretic.
The old testament said that a redeemer would come in Genesis. Isiah talked about him. And other places. When Christ came he revealed who he was.
Those who killed the original Christians and burned their books are the heretics, and you follow them.
More rubbish.
Of course the Romans can say whatever they wanted Christ to say, for one he was dead, and for two they killed all the people that knew him.
Actually, THAT is even in the King James Version of the Bible if you look closely with more than just an empty gullible mind.
I think you are talking about in the greek. There is some kind of reference to that. It isn't saying that God is female though.
Jesus gave people fish to eat. I am done with your trash article.
In the rewritten ROMAN version sure, it says a LOT of things that are in conflict with the true nature of what Jesus taught. If you truly wish to ignore the truth and turn your back on God, that is up to you. If you wish to believe the words of ONE book over what can be fairly well proven by historical evidence, then that is your perogative. But try to understand that the true Jesus did not teach hate, he did not condone or encourage brutality and violence, yet that is what YOU do.
No, I'm talking about Genesis. In Hebrew it's quite clear, but in English (especially when translated by men who were quite determined to make the words say what they wanted them to say), it takes a bit more thought. You actually have to read the part that says, "in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them." You see, God is seen as both male AND female, where the highest manifestation of God in this Universe is Unity between them, where they have become One. Genesis 1:27 New American Standard Bible (©1995) GOD'S WORD® Translation (©1995) King James Bible American King James Version American Standard Version Bible in Basic English Douay-Rheims Bible Darby Bible Translation English Revised Version Webster's Bible Translation World English Bible Young's Literal Translation Much of what Jesus and the Essenes taught is in conflict with the Old Testament as well, where the Essenes were extremely non-violent people who would never harm one of God's creatures. They were vegetarian in fact, and would not offer blood sacrifices. There are things beyond the book known as the Torah that speak of the true God. It is simply a matter of finding those sparks of truth amongst a swarm of deceipt. Makes sense.
I find it laughable that you didn't get past the first paragraph before you decided it was rubbish. I bet you never did well in literature did you. Let me ask you this. Do you think you know all about the Essenes?
Yeah lets just make up what Jesus said and we can all have our own customizable religion.
Actually I quoted from two other places that are in contraciction to the word. Go ahead believe what you want. No skin off my back.
Thanks. It's almost as if I was guided to the info I found just this past week concerning the Essenes. It simply reinforced what I already felt in my heart to be true.
Do you know the story of Paul? Did you know that he never met Jesus, and that he tried to have James (the brother of Jesus) killed?
Which word are you talking about?
3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; 4 And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables. 5 But watch thou in all things, endure afflictions, do the work of an evangelist, make full proof of thy ministry.
The word of God. You know the Bible. Quit predending.
Seems like you're guilty of that, eh Old Friend? You justify your lust for blood with your fables, and turn your back upon the truth.
Excellent stuff.
YOUR words made no sense. You keep relying upon a book to prove that the book is right and that it's the Word of God simply because those men who wrote it say it is. And you act as if ANY other source has to be lying, because that is what the book says. What a wonderfully evil way of keeping the gullible from looking for the truth, simply by telling them doing so will get them into trouble. Of course, back in the old days they'd simply torture you to death, burn you at the stake, annihilate your civilization, etc. if you didn't go along with what the Roman masters or Jewish kings ordered. Now, READ the facts presented in the article I posted. You can look up any reference or claim it makes, it is supported by fact.
Sorry, Old Friend, but I have to disagree with you. We are never told the Amalekites suffered eternally for their sin. In fact, Revelation 5 says there will be a multitude standing before God of every race, nation, kindred, family, people and tongue. God had his children among the Amalekites. Yes, God would punish his own children. How many Israelites did God strike down for gross abandonment of his word? I Corinthians 10 tells us many thousand. How many Israelites died when Israel and Judah fell? Many.
The rest of it (Bible) can be discarded, per Jesus' Parable of the Pearl. An interesting observation, considering how in error it is. Fully twenty-five percent of everything that Jesus ever said was a quotation from the Old Testament, including His two Great Commandments. When Jesus says, "you shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, and all your mind," he is quoting Deuteronomy 6:5. When He says, "and the second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as yourself, Jesus is quoting Leviticus 19:18. You also are in error by thinking that Jesus held the Old Testament in contempt. In fact, Matthew 5:17-18 makes it abundantly clear that Jesus came to fulfill the Law and the Prophets. Your claim that the Parable of the Pear supports your claim is dubious, at best. The pearl is the church -- the body of the Christ. The merchant is the lost soul who, having found the Christ, sells all that he owns to possess the kingdom of God. RO
I'm aware of that. That means that 75% wasn't. You also are in error by thinking that Jesus held the Old Testament in contempt. Maybe he didn't. I do. The pearl is the church -- the body of the Christ. The pearl represents whatever is of great value to its possessor. It's different things to all of us.
Sorry, Old Friend, but I have to disagree with you. We are never told the Amalekites suffered eternally for their sin. In fact, Revelation 5 says there will be a multitude standing before God of every race, nation, kindred, family, people and tongue. God had his children among the Amalekites. Yes, God would punish his own children. How many Israelites did God strike down for gross abandonment of his word? I Corinthians 10 tells us many thousand. How many Israelites died when Israel and Judah fell? Many. I actually wasn't commenting on the Amalekites eternal destination. Sorry I didn't word it right. With that said I'm not saying they are going to heaven or hell. But I would suspect the later.
which fable would that be?
Nice post. Nice to meet you.
Here is the substance of the NT. Everything else is pretty much historical reference. He repeatedly reminds them of why they were given "The Law" Mark 10: 1 And he arose from thence, and cometh into the coasts of Judaea by the farther side of Jordan: and the people resort unto him again; and, as he was wont, he taught them again. 2 And the Pharisees came to him, and asked him, Is it lawful for a man to put away his wife? tempting him. 3 And he answered and said unto them, What did Moses command you? 4 And they said, Moses suffered to write a bill of divorcement, and to put her away. 5 And Jesus answered and said unto them, FOR THE HARDNESS OF YOUR HEART HE WROTE YOU THIS PRECEPT. Matthew 19: 3 The Pharisees also came unto him, tempting him, and saying unto him, Is it lawful for a man to put away his wife for every cause? 4 And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female, 5 And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh? 6 Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder. 7 They say unto him, Why did Moses then command to give a writing of divorcement, and to put her away? 8 He saith unto them, Moses BECAUSE OF THE HARDNESS OF YOUR HEARTS suffered you to put away your wives: but from the beginning it was not so. And HE reminds them of what a person needs to do to meet all of the 10 Commandments. Matthew 22: 34 But when the Pharisees had heard that he had put the Sadducees to silence, they were gathered together. 35 Then one of them, which was a lawyer, asked him a question, tempting him, and saying, 36 Master, which is the great commandment in the law? 37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. 38 This is the first and great commandment. 39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. 40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets. Don't think HE could make it more clear/obvious.
The men who wrote those words in the OT were projecting their own base and greedy desires onto "God".
gnostics and others believe the 'god' of the old testament was an archon, a being that posed as god, a 'system lord'. monroe writes of a creator being that created the earth as a type of farm for the harvesting of emotional energy. this ties in with blood sacrifice and war, in which great quantities of emotional energy are produced, and parallels black magic's sacrifice. as well, this 'god' demanded blood sacrifice from animals, and war, a ritualized sacrifice. put the pieces together, and it fits pretty well. the new testament is such a slap in the face of the ot doctrine of eye for eye, it can easily be seen that Christs mission was 'to set the captives free', in other words, to deny the archonic beings their energy source on the farm. forgiveness is the one single key which would make emotional energy farming obsolete. much of the jewish old testament is merely rehashed babylonian myth, noah, gigamesh, etc...and other parts are copied straight out of the egyptian book of the dead. religions are tools of control used by these archonic beings to manage the farm, in terms of allowing continued emotional energy harvesting. so Christ came to say there was no need for religion, that no intercessor was necessary, no franchise needed. that He called the jews a synagogue of satan was further proof in this direction, but hardly anyone wants to have the courage to doubt that ninety percent of the bible is engineered horseshit. captives....farm...etc.
if a people will not prosecute officials who subvert and violate the constitution, then the constitution has no authority over officials. Gengis Gandhi, Troubled Genius
They were obviously a threat to the christ who was to come. What about the cattle, sheep, camels and donkeys?
Perhaps God didn't want them to profit from it.
So your opinion is the Bible is a fraud?
You are under delusion.
thats what all fundamentalists say. fortunately for me, i pay them the same regard they pay ideas which do not conform to their rigid, unchanging belief systems. jehovah's witless, muslims, bible belters, its all the same. long on ritual, short on wisdom and insight. anyway, i wasnt talking to you, since i realize you are a fundamental patient.
if a people will not prosecute officials who subvert and violate the constitution, then the constitution has no authority over officials. Gengis Gandhi, Troubled Genius
That is a lie. Is it deliberate or an accident? He didn't call the Jews the synagogue of satan. He called a small sect that.
Tell that to the fossil record WHICH COULD ONLY BE CREATED BY A WORLDWIDE FLOOD! Fossils of sea creatures in the desert. Fossils of sea life in the highest mountains. You don't want the truth or you would know of that. Gilgamesh is obviously a tale that was passed down for generations after the flood and became distorted over time. It is significant that it does confirm that there was a flood as the Bible teaches.
if a people will not prosecute officials who subvert and violate the constitution, then the constitution has no authority over officials. Gengis Gandhi, Troubled Genius
Can't counter that argument huh. I guess that's the best you got.
The men who wrote those words in the OT were projecting their own base and greedy desires onto "God". Hi Diana! Long time no see....good to see you again. I was too tired after doing an errand last night to attack this, and it's going to take me quite a while to go through all this and still keep from crashing my computer. Your comment is one I have heard before, and is one I am currently mulling in my mind, but as much as I hate all the killing, I think we would be mistaken to believe that this was not part of God's plan. I woke up this morning thinking of what I think FormerLurker said, that God would not have his children kill his other children. However, they are not all His children....not all are called to be the children of God. Some are the children of the devil, and He alluded to this in Genesis 3:15. God intends to destroy the works of the devil, and He uses people to accomplish His plans. My computer is really dragging, and I am going to have to go and make some choices on my windows, but remember that Jesus Himself said He would have people kill other people: John 19:27 But those enemies of mine who did not want me to be king over them - bring them here and kill them in front of me. Mat 21:40 When the lord therefore of the vineyard cometh, what will he do unto those husbandmen? 41 They say unto Him, He will miserably destroy those wicked men, and will let out His vineyard to other husbandmen, which shall render him the fruits in their seasons. Mar 12:9 What shall therefore the lord of the vineyard do? he will come and destroy the husbandmen, and will give the vineyard unto others. I'm still trying to go through all this, and don't know if anyone has mentioned this or not.
"...as long as there..remain active enemies of the Christian church, we may hope to become Master of the World...the future Jewish King will never reign in the world before Christianity is overthrown - B'nai B'rith speech http://www.biblebelievers.org.au/luther.htm / http://bible.cc/psalms/83-4.htm
Yes, God knows all things, but he proclaimed thou shalt not kill, and then he says kill. Contradiction? It appears so. God also says he regrets making man in Genesis 6. But if he knew all things before he did them, then why did he make man at all if he knew he was going to regret it? I believe in God, but these contradictions in the Bible are troublesome.
God is always good!
Well I strongly do not believe this, at all. If this were the case, then to save the world just kill everybody as children and all would then go to heaven. Very bad logic. No, all who die young are not going to heaven. Why? Because God knows all who are his, he knew them before he created anyone. We don't know who are his, so we are commanded to spread the gospel to all, but God knew them before he created anything that we know about.
God is always good!
So with this same logic if the Nazis were trying to exterminate the "Jews", which I don't believe they were, then they might have been following God's orders to prevent greater evil in the future. We now know how evil they are indeed, so who knows?
God is always good!
I'm not sure. There are too many things in there that contradict, such as the commandment not to kill. I have a very hard time with a god who orders human beings to slaughter other humans, including children. I also find it strange that God would want all the animals killed too. How could the slaughtered people benefit from their livestock if they are dead? I really don't know, but the blood sacrifice always did seem unfair to me, as was mentioned in an earlier post, it makes no sense to kill an innocent creature to atone for the sins of a human, in my opinion that is a copout and an act of cowardice. If anything the man who sinned should shed some of his own blood, although that would be barbaric too. Repenting for his sins by making ammends and sincere apologies makes more sense.
It not only gave King Saul free reign to do as he wished, but it's been used by the Jews over several milennia to perpetrate whatever horrendous atrocity they wish against anyone seen as their foe. That might be right. To think that we have the original word of God is to think that Satan would in no way try to write it his way. Would God allow this? I think so. God's people can figure out what is from him and what is from Satan. Those deceived would have believed whatever they wanted to anyway.
God is always good!
cruel is what it is. i began a study of the OT years ago. i didn't get very far. it was a turn off because of the death and destruction stories. that, and to me, much of it read like someone's LSD trip or psychotic delusion.
The OT is about the Hebrew war god. Jesus overthrew him completely, using the term Abba to describe God, which translate as "Daddy." The OT should not be considered the word of God, but a history of the Jews. And there is no "Judeo-Christianity."
In politics there is no murder.
#2. To: AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt (#0)
"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams
#3. To: bluegrass (#1)
#4. To: AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt (#0)
Why would God have the Israelites exterminate an entire group of people, women and children included?
#5. To: randge (#3)
Superbowl
#6. To: PSUSA (#4)
A better question is: "Why are WE still here"? We are just as bad, if not much worse, than any heathen tribe in the Bible.
#7. To: bluegrass (#5)
#8. To: bluegrass (#1)
God didn't "command" it.
#9. To: randge (#7)
#10. To: AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt (#8)
You can only say that if you don't accept the Bible as truth.
#11. To: AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt (#0)
Why did God command the extermination of the Canaanites, women and children included?
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#12. To: AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt (#6)
I haven't read it, but I don't believe in throwing out the baby with the bath water.
#13. To: bluegrass (#1)
(Edited)
#14. To: AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt (#0)
This is honestly a very difficult issue. We do not fully understand why God would command such a thing,
#15. To: Turtle (#13)
God has never spoken to any Jew in the history of the world except Moses and Jesus.
#16. To: bluegrass (#1)
God didn't "command" it.
#17. To: Turtle (#13)
God has never spoken to any Jew in the history of the world except Moses and Jesus.
#18. To: Old Friend (#16)
#19. To: bluegrass old friend, All (#18)
I trust no one that claims they know the Will of God. You appear to fall into that camp.
#20. To: LACUMO (#19)
#21. To: Christine (#19)
That is a hate crime. This very same asshole claims that the joos are only killing women and children in Gaza that are Palis and less than human.
#22. To: bluegrass (#17)
Not even Einstein?
#23. To: PSUSA (#12)
I don't believe in throwing out the baby with the bath water.
#24. To: Old Friend, All (#20)
Then watch you run away crying. Sissyboy.
#25. To: AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt (#23)
#26. To: LACUMO (#24)
Palis are sub human and need to be eradicated by the joos so they can continue to hoodwink all of mankind.
#27. To: LACUMO (#24)
#28. To: LACUMO (#24)
I wanted to get you riled up so that members on here could get to see what a phony piece of shit you really are. You took the bait!
#29. To: Old Friend (#26)
Lies like this is why you should have your ass kicked.
#30. To: LACUMO, Christine (#29)
You are the one who calls the Palis sub human
#31. To: LACUMO (#29)
Why I bet you beleive the government 9-11 comission lies and cover-up. Well do you?
#32. To: LACUMO (#29)
#33. To: Old Friend (#31)
I have a website called libertysflame.com
#34. To: LACUMO (#33)
#35. To: Old Friend (#14)
This is honestly a very difficult issue. We do not fully understand why God would command such a thing,
#36. To: AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt (#35)
In regard to the Canaanites, God commanded, “However, in the cities of the nations the LORD your God is giving you as an inheritance, do not leave alive anything that breathes. Completely destroy them — the Hittites, Amorites, Canaanites, Perizzites, Hivites and Jebusites — as the LORD your God has commanded you.
#37. To: PSUSA (#25)
In what way???
#38. To: Old Friend (#36)
We all deserve to be destroyed. Thank God he sent his son to pay our price.
#39. To: AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt (#38)
Yes. That is very true, but do you agree with God that the Canaanites etc. should have been destroyed?
#40. To: Old Friend (#34)
#41. To: LACUMO (#40)
#42. To: Old Friend (#41)
#43. To: LACUMO, Old Friend, christine, Original_Intent, TwentyTwelve, all (#31)
I have a website called libertysflame.com
"It is like a trance. So what can break a trance? The only thing that can break the trance is the light of truth."
~ Canadian Philosopher John McMurtry as he comments on the psychological warfare that has afflicted us all
#44. To: All (#43)
"It is like a trance. So what can break a trance? The only thing that can break the trance is the light of truth."
~ Canadian Philosopher John McMurtry as he comments on the psychological warfare that has afflicted us all
#45. To: Old Friend (#41)
No. I used to post here as stone. Then I came back and I thought. Old Friend. It's that simple.
Simple people think of simple things
#46. To: wudidiz (#44)
Charming fellow.
#47. To: Old Friend (#46)
Charming fellow.
#48. To: Old Friend (#39)
#49. To: Old Friend (#14)
(Edited)
It is not hard at all. They were evil. Just like the people of today who don't want to hearken to Gods word. They will perish eternally.
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#50. To: FormerLurker (#49)
There is no other explanation for a "God" that incites hate, intolerance, and ultimately murder. Isn't one of the commandants "THOU SHALL NOT KILL"?
#51. To: Old Friend (#50)
They were obviously a threat to the christ who was to come.
#52. To: FormerLurker (#49)
do you think that God would order a mass genocide of largely innocent people,
#53. To: LACUMO (#51)
but the very ones who put him to death.
#54. To: Old Friend (#50)
God knows their hearts. God knows the world from end to beginning.
#55. To: tom007 (#54)
The mortals were a threat to a god on earth, and your all powerful god was afraid of them so he incited another group of mortals to kill them all?
#56. To: tom007 (#54)
#57. To: LACUMO (#51)
Look retard
#58. To: Old Friend (#20)
I would literally spit in your face if you were in my presence. Then I would urinate on you.
Used Tires Albany, NY
#59. To: Critter (#58)
Very Christlike.
#60. To: LACUMO (#51)
#61. To: bush_is_a_moonie, old fart (#60)
(Edited)
Are you upset that Jesus was crucified?
#62. To: LACUMO, Old Friend (#47)
Charming fellow.
"It is like a trance. So what can break a trance? The only thing that can break the trance is the light of truth."
~ Canadian Philosopher John McMurtry as he comments on the psychological warfare that has afflicted us all
#63. To: bluegrass (#1)
Why did God command the extermination of the Canaanites, women and children included?
#64. To: Old Friend (#56)
Go read Deuteronomy.
#65. To: wudidiz (#62)
If Old Friend's the worst 4um has, this isn't so bad.
#66. To: wakeup (#63)
He didn't. God is merciful, not malicious, vengeful or wrathful. That is all a myth.
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#67. To: LACUMO (#61)
#68. To: LACUMO (#61)
#69. To: LACUMO (#65)
#70. To: bush_is_a_moonie (#67)
Romans did it.
#71. To: Old Friend (#70)
Of course you are correct Jesus gave himself willingly
#72. To: Jethro Tull (#71)
#73. To: Old Friend (#72)
#74. To: randge (#73)
#75. To: randge, ALL (#73)
"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams
#76. To: Old Friend (#74)
"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams
#77. To: LACUMO (#65)
"It is like a trance. So what can break a trance? The only thing that can break the trance is the light of truth."
~ Canadian Philosopher John McMurtry as he comments on the psychological warfare that has afflicted us all
#78. To: Rotara (#76)
(Edited)
Your "Hitler was right" was uber sarcasm I thought ?
#79. To: Rotara (#76)
#80. To: Old Friend (#78)
"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams
#81. To: randge (#79)
"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams
#82. To: Old Friend, LACUMO, all (#68)
Why do you want to kill all the Jews? Are you hitler jr?
"It is like a trance. So what can break a trance? The only thing that can break the trance is the light of truth."
~ Canadian Philosopher John McMurtry as he comments on the psychological warfare that has afflicted us all
#83. To: Rotara (#81)
Was it a sarcastic posting by you or not ?
#84. To: wudidiz (#82)
"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams
#85. To: Old Friend (#83)
"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams
#86. To: wudidiz (#82)
OF, I suggest you stfu
#87. To: Old Friend, Rotara, All (#83)
(Edited)
#88. To: Old Friend (#52)
They weren't innocent. They were doing great evil.
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#89. To: Old Friend (#83)
But it was to draw out those who as you say here " sincerely agree with Hitler right down to the ovens. "
#90. To: FormerLurker (#88)
#91. To: FormerLurker (#88)
#92. To: FormerLurker (#88)
#93. To: randge, christine (#87)
My fault for not checking. But dammit, you should post a disclaimer in the comments when you post from Stormfront or wherever the hell you got this.
#94. To: Rotara (#75)
Every single man and woman will stand before God and either have Christ as an advocate or not.
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#95. To: randge (#89)
I know of no such people here.
#96. To: Old Friend (#93)
#97. To: Old Friend (#95)
#98. To: FormerLurker (#94)
(Edited)
Thing is, IF you truly accept GOD into your heart, you'll know it.
#99. To: randge (#90)
Evil babies.
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#100. To: randge (#97)
You're nuking this entire forum.
#101. To: FormerLurker (#99)
#102. To: Old Friend (#98)
(Edited)
Are you talking to your god? You know the one without definition your own personal custom religion. Can you tell us about it?
My God is He and She that created the rules of the Universe and gave it Life.
My God is not a man, nor a tyrant, nor did he or she write a book.
My God is Beyond what we know or understand.
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#103. To: Old Friend (#98)
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#104. To: FormerLurker (#102)
Those who are at peace with themselves, feel love for ALL creatures,
#105. To: randge (#101)
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#106. To: FormerLurker (#102)
reject violence have chosen good.
#107. To: FormerLurker (#103)
BTW OF, did you read what I had posted concerning the Essenes?
#108. To: Old Friend (#106)
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#109. To: Old Friend (#107)
(Edited)
BTW OF, did you read what I had posted concerning the Essenes?
No.
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#110. To: FormerLurker (#108)
Do you reject the God that Jesus prayed to?
#111. To: Old Friend (#110)
No I don't reject God.
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#112. To: FormerLurker (#111)
#113. To: Old Friend (#107)
BTW OF, did you read what I had posted concerning the Essenes?
YAHSHUA OR PAUL?
ESSENE CHRISTIANITY VERSUS PAULIANITY
AN EXPOSE´ AND CALL TO ACTION
by Rev. Brother Nazariah, D.D.
"Paul was the first corrupter of the doctrines of Jesus"
-- Thomas Jefferson
Jesus was teaching his disciples in the outer court of the Temple and one of them said unto him, "Master, it is said by the priests that without shedding of blood there is no remission of sins. Can blood offerings take away sin?" Jesus answered, "No blood offering of beast or bird or man can take away sin. For how can the conscience be purged from sin by the shedding of innocent blood? Nay, it will increase the condemnation.... For sins against the Law of God there can be no remission, except by repentance and amendment."
"... the high priest of the Jewish Temple in Jerusalem had often sent priests to ask us that we might discourse with one another concerning Jesus: when it seemed a fit opportunity, and it pleased all of our church, we accepted the invitation and went up to the temple. It was crowded with people who had come to listen, many Jews and many of our own brethren. First the high priest told people that they should listen patiently and quietly.... Then, he began exalting with many praises the rite of animal sacrifice for the remission of sins and found fault with the baptism given by our Jesus to replace animal sacrifice....
"Paul declares that... the Elect may even eat meat sacrificed to idols.... Whereas Jesus honored women and found in them His most devoted followers, Paul never tires of proclaiming their inferiority. He declares that, man is the head of the woman and she must always submit to his will.... Whereas the Essenes proclaimed equality among the Brethren [the Essenes were the first people on earth to condemn and forbid the practice of slavery], Paul repeatedly declares that Christian slaves must be obedient to their Christian masters."
"For the Apostolic Church much that Paul taught was grievous error not at all in accord with the mind and message of the Messiah. The original Apostles could urge that the truth was known by them. But Paul had never companied with Jesus or heard what he said day after day [remember: Paul had never even met Jesus], and Paul's visions were the delusions of this own misguided mind....
"Be imitators of me.... I commend you because you remember me in everything.... But I want you to understand that while the head of every man is Christ, the head of every woman is her husband.... And any woman who prays with her head uncovered dishonors her husband; if a woman will not cover her head with a veil, then her hair should be shaved off.... For a man ought not to cover his head, since he is the image and glory of God; but woman is the glory of man.... Neither was man created for woman, but woman for man. That is why a woman ought to have a veil on her head, as a sign of submission to her husband that all men and angels will see.... And if anyone disagrees with me about his, they must be told to obey; for nothing else is acceptable in churches of God."
"Wives be subject to your husbands, as to the Lord. For the husband is the head of the wife in the same way that Christ is the head of the church. As the church is subject to Christ, so must wives be subject to their husbands in everything."
"In all Christian churches, the women should keep silent whenever in church. For they are not permitted to speak, but should be subordinate.... If there is anything they desire to know, let them ask their husbands at home. For it is shameful for a woman to speak in church.... If any one thinks he is a prophet or spiritual, he must acknowledge that what I am writing to you is true and from the Lord God."
Jesus said, "God is both male and female, not divided but the Two in One.... In God the masculine is not without the feminine, nor is the feminine without the masculine.... In God the masculine powers and feminine powers are perfectly united as One.
"Slaves, be obedient to your masters, with fear and trembling, as to Christ."
"Slaves, obey in everything those who are your earthly masters, fearing the Lord."
"Christian slaves must work hard for their owners and regard their owners as worthy of all honor.... If their owner is a Christian, that is no excuse to slow down their labor; rather, they should labor all the harder because a brother in the faith is profiting from their toil.... Timothy teach this truth and demand that all obey. For if anyone disagrees or teaches otherwise... he is puffed up with conceit and knows nothing. Timothy some may deny that this is the sound message of Jesus Christ... and may dispute over the meaning of Christ's words. These arguers have warped minds, are stupid and depraved."
"The Essenes were the only sect in their part of the world who opposed the custom of slavery. They seem to have been the first people on earth to condemn slavery."
"Least of all were any slaves to be found among them, for they saw in slavery a violation of the law of nature which made all people free."
"The Spirit of God is upon me. God has sent me to help the brokenhearted, TO PROCLAIM LIBERTY TO THE CAPTIVES!"
"When Jesus said: 'whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even to them', he, in effect, challenged the slave owner to extend freedom to others if he would himself be free....
"Let the reader contrast the true Christian standard with that of Paul and he will see the terrible betrayal of all that the Master taught.... For the surest way to betray a great Teacher is to misrepresent his message.... That is what Paul and his followers did, and because the Church has followed Paul in his error it has failed lamentably to redeem the world.... The teachings given by the blessed Master Christ, which the disciples John and Peter and James, the brother of the Master, tried in vain to defend and preserve intact were as utterly opposed to the Pauline Gospel as the light is opposed to the darkness."
"In the teachings of Christ, religion is completely present tense: Jesus is the prototype and our task is to imitate him, become a disciple. But then through Paul came a basic alteration. Paul draws attention away from imitating Christ and fixes attention on the death of Christ The Atoner. What Martin Luther, in his reformation, failed to realize is that even before Catholicism, Christianity had become degenerate at the hands of Paul. Paul made Christianity the religion of Paul, not of Christ. Paul threw the Christianity of Christ away, completely turning it upside down, making it just the opposite of the original proclamation of Christ."
"True Christianity, which will last forever, comes from the gospel words of Christ not from the epistles of Paul. The writings of Paul have been a danger and a hidden rock, the causes of the principal defects of Christian theology."
"Paul created a theology of which none but the vaguest warrants can be found in the words of Christ.... Through these interpretations Paul could neglect the actual life and sayings of Jesus, which he had not directly known.... Paul replaced conduct with creed as the test of virtue. It was a tragic change."
"Paul, he's in the Bible too. He is the fellow who theologized Christ almost out of Christianity. Look out for him."
"The real architect of the Christian church was not the disreputable, sunbaked Hebrew (Jesus Christ) who gave it its name but rather the mercilessly fanatical and self-righteous Paul."
"The Jesus of the Sermon on the Mount is completely opposed to Paul."
"This Paul is indeed a strange man. His soul is not the soul of a free man. He speaks not of Jesus nor does he repeat His Words. He would strike with his own hammer upon the anvil in the Name of One whom he does not know."
"Paul himself stands in the twilight zone of heresy. In reading Paul, one immediately encounters a major difficulty. Whatever Jesus had preached did not become the content of the missionary proclamation of Paul.... Sayings of Jesus do not play a role in Paul 's understanding of the event of salvation.... Paul did not care at all what Jesus had said.... Had Paul been completely successful very little of the sayings of Jesus would have survived."
"Paul was the first corrupter of the doctrines of Jesus."
"It rests with every professor of the religion of Jesus to settle within himself to which of the two religions, that of Jesus or that of Paul, he will adhere."
"What kind of authority can there be for an 'apostle' who, unlike the other apostles, had never been prepared for the apostolic office in Jesus' own school but had only later dared to claim the apostolic office on the basis on his own authority? The only question comes to be how the apostle Paul appears in his Epistles to be so indifferent to the historical facts of the life of Jesus.... He bears himself but little like a disciple who has received the doctrines and the principles which he preaches from the Master whose name he bears."
"I draw a great distinction between the Sermon on the Mount of Jesus and the Letters of Paul. Paul's Letters are a graft on Christ's teachings, Paul's own gloss apart from Christ's own experience."
"Saul's [Paul's name before his conversion] fanatical resistance to Christianity... was never entirely overcome. It is frankly disappointing to see how Paul hardly ever allows the real Jesus of Nazareth to get a word in."
"There is not one word of Pauline Christianity in the characteristic utterances of Jesus.... There has really never been a more monstrous imposition perpetrated than the imposition of Paul's soul upon the soul of Jesus.... It is now easy to understand how the Christianity of Jesus... was suppressed by the police and the Church, while Paulinism overran the whole western civilized world, which was at that time the Roman Empire, and was adopted by it as its official faith."
"Paul... did not desire to know Christ.... Paul shows us with what complete indifference the earthly life of Jesus was regarded.... What is the significance for our faith and for our religious life, the fact that the Gospel of Paul is different from the Gospel of Jesus?.... The attitude which Paul himself takes up towards the Gospel of Jesus is that he does not repeat it in the words of Jesus, and does not appeal to its authority.... The fateful thing is that the Greek, the Catholic, and the Protestant theologies all contain the Gospel of Paul in a form which does not continue the Gospel of Jesus, but displaces it."
"The obvious contradictions in the three accounts given by Paul in regard to his conversion are enough to arouse distrust.... The moral majesty of Jesus, his purity and piety, his ministry among his people, his manner as a prophet, the whole concrete ethical-religious content of his earthly life, signifies for Paul's Christology nothing whatever.... The name 'disciple of Jesus' has little applicability to Paul.... Jesus or Paul: this alternative characterizes, at least in part, the religious and theological warfare of the present day."
"It is most obvious that Paul does not appeal to the words of the Lord in support of his.... views. When the essentially Pauline conceptions are considered, it is clear that Paul is not dependent on Jesus. Jesus' teaching is -- to all intents and purposes -- irrelevant for Paul."
"If one may be allowed to speak rather pointedly, the Apostle Paul was the only Arch-Heretic known to the apostolic age."
"That Saint Paul.... He's the one who makes all the trouble!"
"Behold I have given you every herb bearing seed which is upon the face of all the earth, and the fruit of the trees, for you it shall be for meat. And to every beast of the earth, and to every fowl of the air, and to every thing that creepeth on the earth, wherein there is life, I have given every green herb for meat: and it was so."
Answer: THE FALLEN ANGELS OF THE LUCIFERIAN REBELLION.
"... the way of life of every creature became corrupted; and they began to devour one another."
"The fallen angels... began to injure birds, beasts, reptiles, and fishes, to eat their flesh and drink their blood. Moreover, they taught men to make swords, knives, shields, and breastplates...."
"... it was basic Essene doctrine that sin did not derive from Adam but from the activities of the fallen angels known as the Watchers.... Some of the lower angels came to this earth to give instruction.... They became degenerate and could no more ascend to heaven. This was the Fall, precisely as we learn in Enoch and Jubilees.... This, according to Essene-Ebionite doctrine, was the origin of that dreadful impiety, the eating of meat. Blood, thus shed, polluted the air with noxious vapors; mankind was filled with diseases; and death came prematurely and in agony."
"But the reason why the demons delight in entering into men's bodies is that, being disembodied spirits and having perverted desires after meat and sex, but not being able to partake of these due to being spirits, and wanting organs fitted for their enjoyment, they enter the bodies of men in order to gain organs with which to satisfy their lusts, both meat and sex."
"And in that same time the Beast rose up before man, and spake to him saying: 'Whatsoever thou findeth to eat, be it fish or flesh, eat thou thereof taking no thought of tomorrow.' And man ate fish and flesh, becoming carnivorous, and darkness came upon him and he neither heard the voice of God or believed in Him."
"And God said to man: 'Behold I have given you every herb bearing seed and every tree in the garden... to you it shall be for meat....' But alas!.... The will of God was no longer obeyed. Divine principles were overcome by sensual desires.... The most sacred of trusts of all time was annulled by the lusts of the appetite, and the blood of an innocent creature stained the hands of man....
"... these bastard men tasted also human flesh. For it was not a long step to the consumption of flesh like their own, having first tasted it in other forms." "He shall lay his hand on the head of the victim and it will be accepted on his behalf to make expiation for him. He shall slaughter the bull before God, and the priests shall present the blood and fling it against the altar all around the entrance.... He shall then flay the victim and cut it up.... The priests shall arrange the pieces, including the head and suet, on the wood on the altar fire, the entrails and shins.... And the priest shall burn it all on the altar... a soothing odor to God."
"This is the law of the guilt-offering: it is most sacred. The guilt- offering shall be slaughtered... and its blood shall be flung against the altar. The priest shall cut out the entrails, the two kidneys, the haunches and the long lobe of the liver. The priest shall burn these pieces on the altar as an offering to God."
"The altar of the ancient Judaic Temple was a slaughter house, butcher shop, and barbecue pit. The Essenes were absolutely opposed to the sacrificial cult of Judaism; they considered it -- and the eating of animal flesh -- to be of demonic origin."
"... he whose faith is weak eats only vegetables.... For meat destroys not the work of God."
"The spirit clearly warned me that in latter times some would abandon the faith and follow deceiving spirits and things taught by demons. Such teachings come through hypocritical liars... commanding people to abstain from meats, which God created to be eaten with thanksgiving.... For every animal created by God is good for eating, and none are to be refused if received with Thanksgiving."
"Verily I say unto you, they who partake of benefits which are gotten by wronging one of God's creatures, cannot be righteous; nor can they understand holy things, or teach the mysteries of the kingdom, whose hands are stained with blood, or whose mouths are defiled with flesh.
"Of the fruits of the trees and the seeds of the herbs alone do I partake, and these are changed by the Spirit into my flesh and my blood. Of these alone and their like shall ye eat who believe in me, and are my disciples, for of these, in the spirit, come life and healing unto man."
"I am come to end the sacrifices and feasts of blood, and if ye cease not offering and eating of flesh and blood, the wrath of God shall not cease from you, even as it came to your fathers in the wilderness, who lusted for flesh, and they ate to their content, and were filled with rottenness, and the plague consumed them."
"As to eating meat offered in sacrifice unto idols, it makes no difference to God whether you eat such meat."
"But you are still ignorant of this law, that everyone who worships demons or their idols, or sacrifices to them, or partakes with them of their table, shall become subject to them and receive all punishment from them, as being under wicked lords. And you who, on account of ignorance of this law, have been corrupted beside their altars, and have been satiated with food offered to them, have come under their power, and do not know you have been in every way injured in respect of your bodies. But you ought to know that the demons have no power over any one, unless first he be their table-companion; since not even their chief can do anything contrary to the law imposed upon them by God wherein the demons have no power over any one who does not worship them by being their table-companions in the eating of flesh.... But you, being ignorant of the foreordained law, are under the power of the chief of demons through evil deeds, wherefore you are polluted in body and soul, and in the present life you are tyrannized over by sufferings and demons.... If therefore, ye wish to be the vesture of the Divine Spirit,.... neither believe in idols, nor partake with them of the impure table...."
"Many not knowing how they are influenced, consent to evil thoughts suggested by the demons, as if they were the reasoning of their own souls.... For as fire serpents draw sparrows to them by their breath, so also these demons draw to their own will those who partake of their table of flesh meats."
"Let the reader contrast the true Christian standard with that of Paul and he will see the terrible betrayal of all that the Master taught.... The powers of evil which failed to defeat the Master's mission by bringing about the crucifixion, partly achieved their object by working through Paul and his friends to alter the teachings and give them a false interpretation.
"... his [Paul 's] teachings -- which become the foundation of later Christianity -- are a flagrant deviation from the 'original' or 'pure' form extolled by the leadership.... James, the Lord's brother... knew Jesus personally. So did most of the other members of the community or 'early church' in Jerusalem -- including, of course, Peter. When they spoke, they did so with first-hand authority. Paul had never had such personal acquaintance with the 'Savior'. For Paul to arrogate authority to himself... is, to say the least, presumptuous. It also leads him to distort Jesus' teachings beyond all recognition -- to formulate, in fact, his own highly individual and idiosyncratic theology, and then to legitimize it by spuriously ascribing it to Jesus.... Paul knows full well what he is doing. He understands... the techniques of religious propaganda....
"While in Caesarea, he [Paul] hobnobs in congenial and intimate fashion with the Roman procurator... he is also intimate with the procurator's brother-in- law, Herod Agrippa II and with the king's sister -- later the mistress of Titus, the Roman commander who will destroy Jerusalem and eventually become emperor.
"The triumph of Paul's Gospel is all the more remarkable in view of the Master's repeated warnings that false teachers would arise immediately after his 'going away'. Thus we read in Matthew: 'Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly are ravening wolves. By their fruits ye shall know them.... Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but the corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.... Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter the kingdom, of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.'
"Their systems were cannibalized and absorbed into... the Roman Catholic Church -- the Church of Paul....
"Paul's Christianity is another matter. He taught a different kind of theology than that shared by the original disciples, who were schooled under Jesus.... Moreover, James, Peter and the disciples were members of the Essaei community, which Paul most assuredly was not....
THE ANCIENT MANUSCRIPTS CONTAINING THE UNADULTERATED TEACHINGS OF YAHSHUA HA MASHIAKH HAVE COME TO LIGHT!
"But the time cometh when darkness shall cover the earth, and gross darkness the people, and the enemies of truth and righteousness shall rule in my name, and set up a kingdom of this world and oppress the peoples... putting for my doctrines the opinions of men, and teaching in my name that which I have not taught and darkening much that I have taught by their traditions. But be of good cheer, for the time will also come when the truth they have hidden shall be manifested and the light shall shine, and the darkness shall pass away and the true kingdom shall be established which shall be in the world but not of it, and the word of righteousness and love shall go forth from the Center...."
"There shall arise after you, men of perverse minds who shall through ignorance or through craft, suppress many things which I have spoken unto you, and lay to me things which I never taught.... Woe is the time when the spirit of the world entereth into the Church, and my doctrines and precepts are made void through the corruptions of men and women.... But the time cometh when the things which they have hidden shall be revealed and made known, and the truth shall make free those which were bound"
"They shall make alliance with the kings and rulers of the world and seek earthly power, and riches, and domination, and put to death by fire and sword those who seek the truth, and therefore are truly my disciples. And in their days, I, Jesus, shall be crucified afresh and put to open shame, for they will profess to do these things in my name. As I shall be nailed to the cross, so also shall my Church in those days, for she is my Bride and one with me. But the day shall come when this darkness shall pass away, and the true light shall shine.... And my Church shall be filled with Light and give Light unto all nations of the earth...."
YAHSHUA OR PAUL? ESSENE CHRISTIANITY (the religion of Jesus) or PAULIANITY?
-- Brother Nazariah
APPENDIX: A COMPARISON CHARTTopics of Comparison ESSENE
CHRISTIANITYTEACHINGS
OF PAUL Women permitted to speak in church YES NO Women required to wear head covering as
as sign of submission to their husbandsNO YES Women required to submit to the authority
of their husbands as if their husbands were
Jesus ChristNO YES Women were created for men
Men were not created for womenNO YES Women and men have equal rights YES NO God is both Father and Mother YES NO God is only Father, not Mother NO YES Okay to eat meat NO YES Okay to eat meat that has been
sacrificed to demonic idolsNO YES Slavery is permitted NO YES Christians can even own other
Christians as slavesNO YES Christians slaves must work extra
hard if their slave master is a ChristianNO YES
Chart Continued on next page.Topics of Comparison ESSENE
CHRISTIANITYTEACHINGS
OF PAUL Salvation is dependent on following
the saving teachings of JesusYES NO Salvation is dependent on belief in the
sacrificial death of Jesus on the CrossNO YES Belief in reincarnation in the context
of a cosmic school systemYES NO Based on this life only, you will either go
to heaven (if you believe in Jesus's sacrificial
death) or will burn in hell for eternityNO YES Teachings based on the words of Jesus YES NO Teachings based on the ideas of Paul NO YES Use a New Testament with many more
words of Paul than JesusNO YES
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#114. To: Old Friend (#112)
Your full of shit.
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#115. To: Old Friend (#112)
The old testament is gods word hidden. The new testament is gods word revealed.
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#116. To: FormerLurker (#113)
Women were created for men Men were not created for women NO
#117. To: FormerLurker (#115)
BTW, just because you and your pastor make that claim doesn't make it so.
#118. To: Old Friend (#116)
Your a heretic.
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#119. To: FormerLurker (#113)
God is both Father and Mother YES
#120. To: Old Friend (#117)
When Christ came he revealed who he was.
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#121. To: Old Friend (#119)
More rubbish.
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#122. To: FormerLurker (#121)
Actually, THAT is even in the King James Version of the Bible if you look closely with more than just an empty gullible mind.
#123. To: FormerLurker (#113)
It was also VERY VEGETARIAN: not only was animal sacrifice forbidden, but so was the eating of animal flesh absolutely condemned
#124. To: Old Friend (#123)
Jesus gave people fish to eat. I am done with your trash article.
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#125. To: Old Friend (#122)
I think you are talking about in the greek. There is some kind of reference to that. It isn't saying that God is female though.
God created man in His own image, in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them.
So God created humans in his image. In the image of God he created them. He created them male and female.
So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.
So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.
And God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.
And God made man in his image, in the image of God he made him: male and female he made them.
And God created man to his own image: to the image of God he created him: male and female he created them.
And God created Man in his image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.
And God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.
So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.
God created man in his own image. In God's image he created him; male and female he created them.
And God prepareth the man in His image; in the image of God He prepared him, a male and a female He prepared them.
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#126. To: FormerLurker (#111)
Well by believing the New Testament you are rejecting what Jesus actually said, as the NT is opposite what he taught. It was written by Paul and his Roman masters, after they had eradicated the Essene Nazarene Christians, ie. the order that the TRUE apostles belonged to, along with all of their writings.
"It is like a trance. So what can break a trance? The only thing that can break the trance is the light of truth."
~ Canadian Philosopher John McMurtry as he comments on the psychological warfare that has afflicted us all
#127. To: Old Friend (#123)
I am done with your trash article.
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#128. To: wudidiz, Former Lurker (#126)
Well by believing the New Testament you are rejecting what Jesus actually said,
#129. To: FormerLurker (#127)
I find it laughable that you didn't get past the first paragraph before you decided it was rubbish. I bet you never did well in literature did you.
#130. To: wudidiz (#126)
Makes sense.
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#131. To: Old Friend (#128)
(Edited)
Yeah lets just make up what Jesus said and we can all have our own customizable religion.
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#132. To: Old Friend (#129)
Actually I quoted from two other places that are in contraciction to the word.
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#133. To: FormerLurker (#130)
Thanks. It's almost as if I was guided to the info I found just this past week concerning the Essenes.
#134. To: FormerLurker (#132)
Which word are you talking about?
#135. To: Old Friend (#133)
For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; 4 And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#136. To: FormerLurker, Original_Intent, TwentyTwelve, christine, Horse, noone222, scrapper2, IndieTX, gengis gandhi, Cynicom, lodwick, LACUMO, ALL (#113)
"It is like a trance. So what can break a trance? The only thing that can break the trance is the light of truth."
~ Canadian Philosopher John McMurtry as he comments on the psychological warfare that has afflicted us all
#137. To: Old Friend (#134)
(Edited)
The word of God. You know the Bible. Quit predending.
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#138. To: Old Friend (#14)
(Edited)
It is not hard at all. They were evil. Just like the people of today who don't want to hearken to Gods word. They will perish eternally.
#139. To: bluegrass (#10)
There's only one Truth from the Bible worth a crap: the two commandments of Jesus.
#140. To: ReallyOrnery (#139)
Fully twenty-five percent of everything that Jesus ever said was a quotation from the Old Testament
#141. To: echo5sierra (#138)
It is not hard at all. They were evil. Just like the people of today who don't want to hearken to Gods word. They will perish eternally.
#142. To: FormerLurker (#135)
You justify your lust for blood with your fables, and turn your back upon the truth.
#143. To: ReallyOrnery (#139)
#144. To: ReallyOrnery (#139)
#145. To: AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt (#0)
God commanded Saul and the Israelites, “This is what the LORD Almighty says: 'I will punish the Amalekites for what they did to Israel when they waylaid them as they came up from Egypt. Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy everything that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys.'"
#146. To: wudidiz (#136)
#147. To: Old Friend, Former Lurker (#50)
God knows their hearts. God knows the world from end to beginning.
#148. To: Diana (#147)
What about the cattle, sheep, camels and donkeys?
#149. To: Diana (#145)
The men who wrote those words in the OT were projecting their own base and greedy desires onto "God".
#150. To: gengis gandhi (#146)
#151. To: Old Friend (#150)
#152. To: gengis gandhi (#146)
that He called the jews a synagogue of satan
#153. To: gengis gandhi (#146)
noah, gigamesh,
#154. To: Old Friend (#153)
#155. To: gengis gandhi (#154)
#156. To: Diana (#145)
God commanded Saul and the Israelites, “This is what the LORD Almighty says: 'I will punish the Amalekites for what they did to Israel when they waylaid them as they came up from Egypt. Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy everything that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys.'"
#157. To: AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt (#0)
#158. To: AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt (#0)
By ending their lives as children, God enabled them to have entrance into Heaven. We strongly believe that all children who die are accepted into Heaven by the grace and mercy of God (2 Samuel 12:22-23; Mark 10:14-15; Matthew 18:2-4).
#159. To: AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt (#0)
(Edited)
God did not order the extermination of these people to be cruel, but rather to prevent even greater evil from occurring in the future.
#160. To: Old Friend (#149)
So your opinion is the Bible is a fraud?
#161. To: FormerLurker (#11)
It's quite simple actually. The God that created this Universe and what lies beyond did NOT order Samuel to say that to King Saul. It was King Saul who WANTED to kill all the men, women, and children of Amalek, so he ordered his scribes to write that God ordered him to do it.
#162. To: gengis gandhi (#146)
"It is like a trance. So what can break a trance? The only thing that can break the trance is the light of truth."
~ Canadian Philosopher John McMurtry as he comments on the psychological warfare that has afflicted us all
#163. To: Diana (#160)
I really don't know, but the blood sacrifice always did seem unfair to me, as was mentioned in an earlier post, it makes no sense to kill an innocent creature to atone for the sins of a human, in my opinion that is a copout and an act of cowardice.
#164. To: christine, diana (#163)
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