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Editorial
See other Editorial Articles

Title: MSNBC Challenge To Rush Limbaugh
Source: Libertysflame.com
URL Source: http://www.libertysflame.com/cgi-bin/readart.cgi?ArtNum=4810
Published: Jan 26, 2009
Author: A K A Stone
Post Date: 2009-01-26 12:35:54 by Old Friend
Keywords: None
Views: 1234
Comments: 68

Rush Limbaugh has been challenged by MSNBC. The fellow they had on said that Rush and Sarah Palin aren't being straight forward with the American people when they challenge Obama on being a socialist. The argument goes like this. Rush Limbaugh has said that he doesn't want Obama to succeed because that would be socialism winning. That as a conservative he isn't for socialism. Rush has asked on his show for people to show him anywhere in the world that socialism has worked. The MSNBC guy says that in fact socialism is everywhere in governments throughout the world. He uses the example of Medicare being socialism, and says that it works. His challenge to Rush Limbaugh is to address his listeners telling them that medicare is socialist and should be eliminated. Do you think Rush willtake up the MSNBC challenge?

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After Bush, Stupid Republicans bemoaning the evils of socialism are not funny but pathetic. They'be jumped on the Nannyist Bandwagon, from DUI roadblocks to the Jihad on Tabak to Surveillance Cameras etc etc as fast as any fucking socialist they claim to criticise.

Thhe only thing that can save their party from utter historical oblivion is a complete breakdown resulting from the policies of the new administration. They may well end up being as bumbling as Bush's people were.

Unless a third force arises, Americans will yield to the temptation to play the two card deck once again and bring them back.

randge  posted on  2009-01-26   15:44:34 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

~ your fun .... ever been homeless? ever tell a prospective employer "No, I will not sign your w-4 form? tell the drivers license folks to shoove their request for your ssn too? tell a school system "No, my child dose not have an ssn?" hospitals now days will not allow you to take your child home till they are registered with one, they'll call the cops, or child services if you refuse ... yes, that is all very wrong ~ kinda wish some of you would direct your anger at 'them' and not the saps waking up to this hellish reality, doing their level best to live in it ~

I have never been homeless, yet. I work without a SSN, and I will never sign a w-2or w-4. I have no driver license. I have no SSN. I never had to tell the school that because I wasn't aware at the time. If I had to do it again I would.

If I were having a child at a hospital these days, I simply wouldn't name it at the hospital. I'd be undecided. No law against not naming the kid at the hospital. No name ... no way to attach a SSN. Most people want the tax deduction, and that's why they stamp their kids with a slave number. (I did it too, and I am sorry).

Finally, one of my best friends has two boys that are hemophiliacs. Their "factor" (clotting factor) would cost her at least $200,000.00 (I think it's actually closer to $500,000.00) per year. She could never obtain it without government assistance. She has no choice, but that doesn't mean she isn't a socialist because she is.

I do have empathy for everyone of us that have been fucked royal by the criminals that have taken over the government. And I would offer that our grand parents and parents have done this to us through their apathy and gullibility. Still, my parents and grand parents are dead. They can't help me undo what they've done. We all need to help each other undo this horseshit.

I'm the first to admit that I'm more stubborn than the next guy. Everyone doesn't have the intestinal fortitude to shake their middle finger at Uncle Sambo.

The one thing they can do is ADMIT THE TRUTH, ALL THE TIME, TO EVERYONE IN THEIR SPHERE OF INFLUENCE ... and that is that WE ARE SOCIALISTS. It has been imposed upon us through the fraud perpetrated upon our parents and grandparents when the government was thought to be honest.

Those days are LONG GONE !

noone222  posted on  2009-01-26   15:55:47 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

yet. I work without a SSN, and I will never sign a w-2or w-4. I have no driver license. I have no SSN. I never had to tell the school that because I wasn't aware at the time.

~ therein lies the rub of conversations like this on-line, basicly friend, from my perspective, you've just told me the sky is green ... you've told me something that I shall only try to accept as being true 'cause this is intended by me to be a conversation ...

1980 in denver - 1982 in Texas - 1987 and 1991 in Pennsylvania, a parent could not leave the hospital with a baby without first naming it and registering for SSN .... child services with police backup were used to hold the 'virtual' gun for the SSN, so, to answer a previous question, no, an ssn person never personally pointed a gun at me

only war I ever managed to win with the system over my children was the fingerprinting, and that was because I walked in and demanded them back, took them from a rather surprised young cop's hand with a thank you ... they let me have that one, I figure 'cause they already made a copy

way kewl that you've managed to survive without any of these trappings ... maybe you could write a book and tell us all how ya did it ~ peas 2u

I don't feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use. (Galileo Galilei)

Amandil  posted on  2009-01-26   16:06:33 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

222, this sort of rejection of the system has to start at an early age. You can not slash cut people from their only source of income. If you have a humane way of doing so, let's hear it.

I started exiting the system earlier but was out completely by age 39 and had 2 children to raise. I modified my life and decided I could and would live on less money if I could avoid financing international kiddy murder. My motives were spiritual, I trusted God to help me all the way ... and he has, every step of the way. I admit to having reservations and fear in the beginning. I had to learn stuff that no one should have to learn. In the end it depends upon how motivated you are.

I raised my kids (as a single parent) from the time they were 14 and 8 until they were grown / out of the house, by working for myself. I learned the laws necessary for survival. I had quite a bit of interaction with my son's schools. I wouldn't allow them to do things with my son that they were doing with the other children. They send stuff home for the parent to sign, because most of it is your waiver of rights to allow crap that would otherwise be illegal. Most parent don't even read the stuff, and simply sign it.

I vowed poverty if necessary, and would admit to some inconvenience but not a lot. Again, the trade-off for me was not funding the genocide.

When I was in the system I made over 100K per year. And that was a lot of years ago ... when the dollar was still a quarter ! (Supposed to be funny).

We, all of us, must take the time to become very vocal. Resist at every opportunity. The enemy is within the gates and destroying everything in sight. We may delay the impact but we can't avoid it by remaining silent. We have a chance if we stand up !

The people in Iceland are banging pots and pans 24/7. They have shut down two governments in weeks. We MUST unify to shut down the FED Bank ... without the FED Bank the federal government is really a paper tiger - a house of cards.

If there is a judgment day, God isn't going to listen to a bunch of bullshit about I couldn't have a bank account or a credit card if I didn't take this number.

The Bible says that many will claim on judgment day, we have healed the sick and removed demons from people in Jesus' name, to which Jesus' response will be "depart from me you workers of iniquity for I have NEVER known you".

Edit: I meant to make this point. The people collecting Social Security today aren't guilty of anything, they paid their dues unwittingly, and have a right to their monies. I am more concerned about people paying it today because it goes into the general fund and pays for bombs and guns among other things.

noone222  posted on  2009-01-26   16:41:09 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

222, I totally love your story. There is no one size fits all fix, and there is no doubt I know you see that.

But, to exit the system requires some planning and blaming people for funding that which they did not see, war/genocide/self destruction... is a process that requires the truth getting to them and through to them. The media won't do it, the church?, what other forms are there to reach masses of people that MIGHT understand.

Doing what is right is also a subjective argument for some.

We can see what is right, but it's on the other side of the lake. Before we can get there, we have to build a boat.

So, how do we do that?

But as an aside, all of this could be a moot point when the government declares bankruptcy. It all comes to a full stop. Then, perhaps targeted groups will receive 'help'. Others will be left to die.

"We don't know who discovered water, but we are certain it wasn't a fish." -- John Culkin (1928-1993) American media scholar and critic, educator, writer and consultant

OliviaFNewton  posted on  2009-01-26   16:52:51 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

.

HOUNDDAWG  posted on  2009-01-26   17:10:29 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

I have never been homeless, yet. I work without a SSN, and I will never sign a w-2or w-4. I have no driver license. I have no SSN. I never had to tell the school that because I wasn't aware at the time. If I had to do it again I would.

I understand your point. We are all a little bit weak and should resist the situation more. I don't know that it makes us socialists or something else. But your point is taken.

When it comes to the time when the mark of the Beast is in effect. Your strict adherance will be necessary.

Old Friend  posted on  2009-01-26   17:22:40 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

Communitarianism (Idea and Movement in politics) - "With the demise of true socialism as a viable intellectual force, communitarianism is now the most active philosophical opposition to libertarianism. Communitarianism is usually presented in a vague terms, but it is probably best understood as a mild form of collectivism or "democratic socialism."

"We establish for the moment a new world order. 11 September 2001 everything changed."

Promoting global government: The Communitarians creating a supra-national system of "values" that over-rules all national law

"[communitarianism is] a notion that years of celebrating individual freedom have weakened the bonds of community, and that the rights of the individual must be balanced against the interests of society as a whole. Inherent in the philosophy is a return to values and morality, which, the school of thought believes, can best be fostered by community organizations." (Robert Putnam of Harvard University and a Bush speechwriter, explaining President Bush's belief in the communitarian philosophy for The Washington Post, 2002)

nord.twu.net/acl/etzioni.html

bush_is_a_moonie  posted on  2009-01-26   17:29:12 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

I am more concerned about people paying it today because it goes into the general fund and pays for bombs and guns among other things.

As I recall, it has ALWAYS gone into the general fund. That isn't something that just happened in the last few years.

Social Security benefits are not guaranteed.

They are not guaranteed legally because workers have no contractual or property rights to any benefits whatsoever. In two landmark cases, Flemming v. Nestor and Helvering v. Davis, the U.S. Supreme Court ruled that Social Security taxes are not contributions or savings, but simply taxes, and that Social Security benefits are simply a government spending program, no different than, say, farm price supports. Congress and the president may change, reduce, or even eliminate benefits at any time.

Social Security's Sham Guarantee

Liberty is not a means to a higher political end. It is itself the highest political end.
Lord Acton

James Deffenbach  posted on  2009-01-26   17:44:55 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

Further, when we are continually admonished that ignorance of the law is no excuse ... we should investigate the law and set things right.

So how do we go about setting things right? What are you personally doing to set things right because you believe social security is wrong? Action speakes louder than words. How about taking up a leadership role by going public in a dramatic way so that we can follow you? Somebody with good sense needs to be out front and leading the way.

LACUMO  posted on  2009-01-26   17:46:04 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

When it comes to the time when the mark of the Beast is in effect. Your strict adherance will be necessary.

Cincinnati company, CityWatcher.com, which stores surveillance-camera footage, earlier this year implanted employees with chips to allow them access to high-security areas, Big Brother opponents went ballistic.

www.smartmoney.com/invest...-off-the-old-block-19568/

WND Exclusive 'Digital Angel' set to fly soon Implant technology to be beta tested on humans Posted: June 14, 2001 1:00 am Eastern

© 2009 WorldNetDaily.com

Beginning July 15, Applied Digital Solutions will begin beta testing on humans an implant technology capable of allowing users to emit a homing beacon, have vital bodily functions monitored and confirm identity when making e-commerce transactions.

The first production run of "Digital Angel?" devices has begun, the Florida-based, NASDAQ-traded company has announced.

While the manufacturers of the technology bill it as a potential lifesaver, others fear the advent of the device threatens personal privacy – and even raises the ugly specter of the Bible's "mark of the beast." Applied Digital Solutions, an e-business-to-business solutions provider, acquired the patent rights to the miniature digital transceiver it has named "Digital Angel?." The company plans to market the device for a number of uses, including as a "tamper-proof means of identification for enhanced e-business security."

Digital Angel? sends and receives data and can be continuously tracked by global positioning satellite technology. When implanted within a body, the device is powered electromechanically through the movement of muscles and can be activated either by the "wearer" or by a monitoring facility.

"We believe its potential for improving individual and e-business security and enhancing the quality of life for millions of people is virtually limitless," said ADS Chairman and Chief Executive Officer Richard Sullivan. "Although we're in the early developmental phase, we expect to come forward with applications in many different areas, from medical monitoring to law enforcement. However, in keeping with our core strengths in the e-business to business arena, we plan to focus our initial development efforts on the growing field of e-commerce security and user ID verification."

www.wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=23232

A skin-embedded computer chip is not required to undergo testing by the Food and Drug Administration and will thus be available soon, the company that designed the product said. The company, Applied Digital Solutions, has publicized the device, called Verichip, as a substitute for medical tags, saying that wireless readers could be used with it to get information like the pacemaker model or drug allergies of a person brought to a hospital. In reality, however, the chips would only contain identification codes that would refer to a database of medical information. Applied Digital Solutions said because the chip would not contain medical information, the product was able to avoid F.D.A. review. The company has said it will begin distributing equipment to read the chips to hospitals in Palm Beach and Broward Counties in Florida. Applied Digital Solutions has struggled financially in the last two years, and recently laid off all but 200 of its 1,600 employees. Shares of Applied Digital rose 4 cents, to 52 cents. Scott Silverman, the chief executive, said it was shifting its focus from the information technology business to emerging technologies like Verichip.

query.nytimes.com/gst/ful...63DF936A35757C0A9649C8B63

MICROCHIPed Population

www.ministryoflies.com/in...ction=displaycat&catid=52

bush_is_a_moonie  posted on  2009-01-26   17:46:38 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

But as an aside, all of this could be a moot point when the government declares bankruptcy.

I think they already did that in 1933. They just didn't tell us and initiated the fiat system to replace the system we had so that they could collateralize then steal the land we live on through UN World Heritage Sites, and international biospheres.

I do realize everyone's situation is different and moral judgements vary. I have a very good friend that watched me go through the political process from conservative Republican/Pat Buchanan supporter to total resistance and exit. He's a millionaire or was ... that has lived off of stocks for as long as I've known him. When we talk, I jokingly tell him that he's the enemy because he's buying the guns the feds will use to kill me.

I wish a bankruptcy would be declared openly and people could decide whether they wished to participate or not in the next fraud. Truth is we are bankrupt, there isn't any money only credit and debt notes that are meaningless promises to pay.

Maybe people don't "think" it's over yet ... but what's transpiring right before our eyes is what happens similarly when an Apartment House starts getting run down. The slum lords get worse as time goes on until the building is condemned, demolished or collapses.

I don't know exactly how to make things easier on others. I do think the sooner we roll up our sleeves and get started the sooner we turn things around. Thugs aren't easily convinced to become saintly. The Magna Carta required the blade of a sword be pressed firmly against the Kings throat.

I'm a firm believer in calling a spade a spade. Hi, I'm Doug, and I'm a SOCIALIST. It's been 30 days since I accepted a social benefit or donated to the government war fund.

noone222  posted on  2009-01-26   17:54:48 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

LOL !

::sigh::

4um Traitor
"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara  posted on  2009-01-26   17:57:34 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

When it comes to the time when the mark of the Beast is in effect. Your strict adherance will be necessary.

This was my primary motivation.

The SSN is the number of a man's name. I've read hundreds of commentaries on it and my conclusion is that it is the mark. I completely understand others that think it's a physical mark yet to come. I hope they're right. Allow me another paragraph.

Today, we are still supposed to live in a free society. Even though we know better or admit that our freedoms have diminished considerably, the political jackals would never come out and say "you're not free, you're a slave".

My position is this: If I haven't got the testicles to say no while I'm alleged to be free and threatened only with jail, what are my chances of holding up under real tyranny and the threat of death ?

noone222  posted on  2009-01-26   18:04:34 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

The SSN is the number of a man's name. I've read hundreds of commentaries on it and my conclusion is that it is the mark.

It isn't. It isn't global. The mark says every person on earth. Every tongue. The social security card is limited to the United States. So it can't possibly be the mark of the beast. That doesn't mean it isn't evil though. The bible also warned about merely counting people.

Old Friend  posted on  2009-01-26   18:06:48 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

It could well be that the feral reserve (IMF / World Bank / some new agency) will distribute a global security ID to every soul on the planet.

Since many don't even have pockets, their number will have to be injected with a chip. And of course to be fair everyone has to do it that way.

4um Traitor
"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara  posted on  2009-01-26   18:09:34 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

As I recall, it has ALWAYS gone into the general fund. That isn't something that just happened in the last few years.

We see it the exact same way. I meant that most of us didn't always know that it went to the general fund. Many thought for years that they had an account with their name on it, or that it was a Trust fund set aside for them.

I'm aware of those cases sites. If there's a subject that I think I have a grasp of this is it.

noone222  posted on  2009-01-26   18:09:38 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

It could well be that the feral reserve (IMF / World Bank / some new agency) will distribute a global security ID to every soul on the planet.

I could see that happening. Then they will call you a terrorist and cut your head off if you refuse and they can catch you.

Old Friend  posted on  2009-01-26   18:10:48 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

You White Christian hater you ! lol

You're spot on. For those that believe the Bible is the holy inspired Word of God we know what's coming. The stages keep getting worse then it's beast or Jesus baby.

4um Traitor
"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara  posted on  2009-01-26   18:12:32 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

It isn't. It isn't global. The mark says every person on earth. Every tongue. The social security card is limited to the United States. So it can't possibly be the mark of the beast. That doesn't mean it isn't evil though. The bible also warned about merely counting people.

Please don't think me just argumentative. Jesus said that he came "only for the lost sheep of the House of Israel". "Only" being the operative word. (Jesus said it, not me.)

If one were of the belief that the ten lost tribes (the House of Israel) were the settlers or descendants of the western European nations such as Norway, Britain, Ireland, Scotland, Germany, France, Sweden, Switzerland, Denmark, Canada, Australia, New Zealand, etc., it isn't difficult to discover that they ALL HAVE SOCIAL SECURITY NUMBERS and SS Systems just like ours.

noone222  posted on  2009-01-26   18:23:32 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

IMHO only, the best way to sum up your personal choices, is in an old saying I try to live by:

For Evil to succeed, Good Men need do nothing.. And I can't sit back and do nothing either..

Refinersfire  posted on  2009-01-26   18:40:22 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

Action speakes louder than words. How about taking up a leadership role by going public in a dramatic way so that we can follow you?

I have quit their system. I do not fund their wars. It's kind of threatening if you stand up against the US government alone, but not so much if you're certain about your God and your values.

It would be ideal if a mass movement would take place, such as should be happening right now when the government is telling the people that they've been robbed by a bunch of banker thugs, their retirements have been looted ... but the people are then ordered in the next breath to shut up, you still have to pay for it through your taxes !!!!!

It definitely takes some resolve. Then it takes some learning of the laws because if you're challenged you must defend yourself. Hiring a lawyer puts you in their jurisdiction and makes you subject to summary judgment.

It's a lot of work in the beginning because you have to formally withdraw from any contract that you've had with any fictional entity, whether governmental or corporate. All licenses, permits, voter registrations, residential mailing addresses, and other things that you have signed must be undone in order to remain free from adhesion.

These things would be a lot easier to do en masse. If you want to stop this monster you have to get off of your ass and just do it.

I never said it would be an easy thing to do because it's not easy. Nor do I think at this time everyone can do it. It depends on how sick you are of living a lie, financing murder, violating your conscience so some paedophile can draft your laws for you, and basically having your soul stolen from you by perverts, thieves and psychopaths.

thoreau.eserver.org/civil.html

noone222  posted on  2009-01-26   18:58:17 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

For Evil to succeed, Good Men need do nothing.. And I can't sit back and do nothing either..

Exactly. Our grand-parents got sucker punched by a bunch of criminal bankers. They've stripped the greatest nation on earth and have us afraid of our own shadows.

Fuck em !

If you're the government don't waste your breath or my time by telling me I'm free and then demand that I contribute to the slaughter of innocent little children.

“Under a government which imprisons unjustly, the true place for a just man is also a prison" ...

noone222  posted on  2009-01-26   19:09:01 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

IMHO only, the best way to sum up your personal choices, is in an old saying I try to live by:

For Evil to succeed, Good Men need do nothing.. And I can't sit back and do nothing either..

I already responded to your post ... but wanted to say thanks too.

noone222  posted on  2009-01-26   19:11:22 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

It would be ideal if a mass movement would take place, such as should be happening right now when the government is telling the people that they've been robbed by a bunch of banker thugs, their retirements have been looted ... but the people are then ordered in the next breath to shut up, you still have to pay for it through your taxes !!!!!

You know the mass movement probably won't ever take place with the sheeple united against a tyranical government. Maybe some day there might be a civil war. That would pit the haves against the havenots with the government taking the side of the haves.

Not only have the bankers robbed us by looting the monies we already paid into savings and retirement accounts, our wonderful government thugs robbed us a second time by their crooked bailout scams. Neither the government nor the bankers are on our side.

LACUMO  posted on  2009-01-26   19:13:21 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

Neither the government nor the bankers are on our side.

Just 300 Million of us wee little people are with ya ... many of us don't know it yet ... but we all will soon.

noone222  posted on  2009-01-26   19:18:25 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

The question being is one a shit-eater if one is forced to eat a shit sandwich at gun point ?

The pressure employed doesn't change the act. You may feel like a coerced socialist ... but you're still a socialist.

Socialism is an economic system, and a socialist is a person who believes in same. One could only be considered a socialist if one espoused principles of socialism. One cannot be forced to believe what is percieved to be untrue, although after a conk on the head with a riot stick I find myself to be all "yessir", at least until I'm pretty sure I'm not gonna get hit again.

180' but it occurred to me that these fink fucks arguing that terroists don't deserve human rights protection because they were out of uniform and weren't fighting for an Existing Nation) (see sneakypete on tosII) would have finked out Ethan Allen to Benny Arnold.

Not trying to start any fights, that was just something that caught my attention.

The ultimate effect of shielding men from the effects of folly, is to fill the world with fools. - Herbert Spencer

Dakmar  posted on  2009-01-26   20:30:54 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

Socialism is an economic system, and a socialist is a person who believes in same.

This is situational ethics. Whether one "believes" in it or not is a matter of faith, not fact. Most communists in China probably don't believe in it.

If a thousand men were not to pay their tax bills this year, that would not be a violent and bloody measure, as it would be to pay them, and enable the State to commit violence and shed innocent blood.

Henry David Thoreau - 1849

noone222  posted on  2009-01-26   20:38:05 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

If you were forced to eat a shit sandwich...

No. If you were forced to sexually abuse a three day old baby, prolly by the same people made you eat a shit sandwich, wouldn't that by your very own logic make you a pedophile?

The ultimate effect of shielding men from the effects of folly, is to fill the world with fools. - Herbert Spencer

Dakmar  posted on  2009-01-26   20:42:52 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel. 25

Then came she and worshipped him, saying, Lord, help me. 26

But he answered and said, It is not meet to take the children's bread, and to cast it to dogs. 27

And she said, Truth, Lord: yet the dogs eat of the crumbs which fall from their masters' table. 28

Then Jesus answered and said unto her, O woman, great is thy faith: be it unto thee even as thou wilt. And her daughter was made whole from that very hour.

Also the Bible says every nation will be represented.

Now back to social security card. How do we receive in in our RIGHT hand or FOREHEAD? Answer we don't. Also it says EVERY KINDRED TONGUE AND NATION will have to receive the mark. So it is global.

Old Friend  posted on  2009-01-26   22:35:13 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

fink fucks arguing that terroists don't deserve human rights protection because they were out of uniform

What about our spies. Are they out of uniform. I suspect er know they are.

Old Friend  posted on  2009-01-26   22:38:19 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel. 25

Then came she and worshipped him, saying, Lord, help me. 26

But he answered and said, It is not meet to take the children's bread, and to cast it to dogs. 27

It is not proper to cast the children's (House of Israel) bread to dogs (not House of Israel). Many people/religious organizations try to ignore this scriptural quote due to its politically incorrect nature.

This is one of those rare occasions where Jesus is shown discriminating in favor of the House(hold) of Israel. The Book of Hosea describes the condition of the two sister households of Judah and Israel. Both Houses piss God off and he tells them how he intends to deal with them in this book.

Like the children's bread spoken of in the quoted scripture above, the cure prescribed for the House of Israel's misbehavior would also be applicable. If Jesus came only unto the Household of Israel why would there be a need or requirement for the DOGS to decide whether or not to have the "Mark".

By the way, there are two marks discussed in scripture. One is the Mark of the Beast, the other is the Mark of God.

When the events discussed in Hosea take place, and the lost tribes find themselves (as they are doing today as we speak) the power of God to determine outcomes 2500-3000 years in advance, in spite of man's obstinance will be born out.

Here's an interesting thing to consider. God made a lot of promises to Abraham and his descendants. They are noted on many websites and can be accessed through google pretty easily. Mentioning just a couple of them here will clearly demonstrate that the people called Jews have never fulfilled even one of the promises made to Abraham and his descendants, but another group has fulfilled the promises.

One Promise was that the heirs to the promises would be so numerous as not to be numbered. (Like the stars etc.,) That certainly wouldn't apply to those we call the Jews that are continually reminding the world of their limited numbers and have been counted by every generation.

God promised that Abraham's descendants through Jacob/Israel would become MANY NATIONS. (The Jews can't really establish even one).

Another Promise is that these people would be a blessing to the entire world. Again, modern Jewry are a curse, not a blessing.

One more here for good measure but there are more. God promised Abraham that his descendants would possess the gates of their enemies. (Not accomplished by the Jews).

Now, find the International Quality of Life Index and determine the 12 Highest quality of life countries on earth. There you will find the EVIDENCE to establish who the people are that have accomplished the promises.

These proofs are God's way of instilling confidence in his children to TRUST him completely when his scriptures say "If God be for me, who can be against me".

Christians today are not followers of Christ at all. The scriptures tell us that people will "worship me with their lips only" ... and ... "they prefer a lie to truth" ... which brings me full circle to my original remarks related to the SSN.

We hear a lot of talk about being a Christian Nation. Modern Christianity has been warped by the same people that have warped our Constitutional Republic. That being said, we should ask, what is Social Security ? It is trusting the government to do God's job. We choose the government to look over us in our old age instead of God. The only thing that a human being can offer God is his trust. The 1st Commandment is for us to have no strange gods and not put ANY god before the Creator.

I suppose I've said enough. I try not to get into debates here on religious issues because many are still interested in the pablum (milk) served up at their church by the liars that have led them away from God. Once in awhile the debate sneaks up on me like this one. The Socialist Security Card represents theft from one person for another. God has never authorized theft. Social Security couldn't exist without the "Federal Reserve Fiat Currency System" which violates God's instruction to keep equal weights and measures.

When these discussions get started sometimes I notice someone struggling with the same questions I have had and usually they have been told things by ministers or preachers that they've semi-accepted that are untrue or contrary to scripture. Most of the time it is futile to enter debate on these subjects and wastes everyone's time. I'd prefer to study or do something productive so that's why I try to avoid the debates and why I have bozo'ed Richard. He wants to preach at people, I don't like it. And I don't like it when I find myself doing the same thing. [One last thing is that non-believers and even non- readers of scripture haven't acquired the relationship of one scripture to the next that's necessary to understanding them. I think God does this purposely so that we learn as much as we're willing to invest ourselves in the learning process.

But, to become entangled in debate with another person that really hasn't studied or whose interest is more about being right, proving someone wrong or embarrassing someone is not something I care to do.

(There are exceptions).

Most Christians, in my opinion, do worship God only with their lips. They pretend to believe and show it by living their lives according to convenience (selfishness). The say they believe but their actions prove them liars and rationalizers. If they truly felt that God was in absolute control they wouldn't have any trouble telling Uncle Sambo to shove off and we wouldn't be on the edge of the abyss or the brink of disaster. It took me most of my life to realize this: God is always right and I am usually wrong. ------------------- ----------------------------------------

[Peter asked, "whose laws are we to follow, God's or Man's" ???] Romans 13 notwithstanding.

If a thousand men were not to pay their tax bills this year, that would not be a violent and bloody measure, as it would be to pay them, and enable the State to commit violence and shed innocent blood.

Henry David Thoreau - 1849

noone222  posted on  2009-01-27   3:50:17 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

No. If you were forced to sexually abuse a three day old baby, prolly by the same people made you eat a shit sandwich, wouldn't that by your very own logic make you a pedophile?

Good question.

I think I'd prefer to suffer the penalty whether torture or death. Infinity / eternity is a long time and beyond my comprehension, but I am intent on preserving my soul or whatever it is that makes the trip when this earth mission is accomplished.

EDIT: I had another thought about your question as it relates to the larger question, which is about the value of this thing we call life. If one were to find ones self in the paradoxical condition that you described the real question beyond immediate survival in my estimation would be why survive it ? For what ? Isn't the quality of ones life more important than mere existence in a world of hate, pain, and other atrocious behavior ? We can change things if we decide that we are going to demand a standard of decency/quality in our lives, damn the self-imposed rulers/butchers.

If a thousand men were not to pay their tax bills this year, that would not be a violent and bloody measure, as it would be to pay them, and enable the State to commit violence and shed innocent blood.

Henry David Thoreau - 1849

noone222  posted on  2009-01-27   3:56:57 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

Let's not entertain the premise that because we do something at gunpoint that we accede to the gunmnan's mentality.

VERY well said.

Only thing is we don't have a gun held to our head. The Mexicans live here and disobey it. We could too. If we were willing to go against the flow.

Old Friend  posted on  2009-01-27   8:58:55 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

You keep leaving this part out.

Then Jesus answered and said unto her, O woman, great is thy faith: be it unto thee even as thou wilt. And her daughter was made whole from that very hour.

Even a dog gets scraps.

Old Friend  posted on  2009-01-27   9:01:18 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

Another Promise is that these people would be a blessing to the entire world. Again, modern Jewry are a curse, not a blessing.

I'll just take time to address this point for now.

The Jews brought forth Jesus which was a blessing to the entire world. Also show me somewhere where it says that modern Jewry is a curse. Because Romans chapter 11 says God will NEVER forget his covenant with the Jews and it is foolishness to think so.

Old Friend  posted on  2009-01-27   9:04:41 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

I don't know exactly how to make things easier on others. I do think the sooner we roll up our sleeves and get started the sooner we turn things around.

I agree.

Thugs aren't easily convinced to become saintly.

We're looking at a complete take down of our society. The control over who gets to reorder it, we are told, lies in the hands of the thugs that caused this to begin with. Whether that is what happens or not, we won't know for some period of time.

We have a lot to consider in how best we might help the most, adapt, through the immediate period. There are simply going to be people who can not and will not be able to cope or adjust. In the meantime, I don't think making peoples lives even worse is going to lead to enlightenment before death, nor do I think it makes any larger point to serve as an example.

As caring people, we really should look for humane solutions to address a transition process. It's just the right thing to do, whether the added motivation is to rid ourselves of the perpetual parasite machine or not.

"We don't know who discovered water, but we are certain it wasn't a fish." -- John Culkin (1928-1993) American media scholar and critic, educator, writer and consultant

OliviaFNewton  posted on  2009-01-27   9:06:42 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

You keep leaving this part out.

Then Jesus answered and said unto her, O woman, great is thy faith: be it unto thee even as thou wilt. And her daughter was made whole from that very hour.

Even a dog gets scraps.

I didn't see this portion of that scripture as relevant.

The scripture quoted shows someone outside of the House of Israel receiving a blessing or benefit, not being included in an opportunity for punishment. Even though this scripture doesn't actually offer conclusive evidence of a global mark, I think plenty exists that can be taken exactly the way you state.

My first instinct is to say God is the potter and we're the clay. He can do whatever he pleases. My second thought is to find scripture to support any answer I might try to provide.

The mark of the beast wouldn't have any meaning (regarding the eternal perdition spoken of in the Bible) to the swahili's or the hutu's would it ?

It may very well be that the entire global population will be mandated to receive the mark. The institution of it may simply be starting in the Industrialized Nations ???

I've admitted that I have many questions too. I think that all too often we humans try to reduce God's mind to our level of comprehension. The Scriptures tell us that God doesn't think like we do, our wisdom is foolishness.

If a thousand men were not to pay their tax bills this year, that would not be a violent and bloody measure, as it would be to pay them, and enable the State to commit violence and shed innocent blood.

Henry David Thoreau - 1849

noone222  posted on  2009-01-27   10:01:27 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

It may very well be that the entire global population will be mandated to receive the mark. The institution of it may simply be starting in the Industrialized Nations ???

I've admitted that I have many questions too. I think that all too often we humans try to reduce God's mind to our level of comprehension. The Scriptures tell us that God doesn't think like we do, our wisdom is foolishness.

We all have questions and none of us know it all. But think the text is quite clear when it says "all tongues" "all nations" "all people free and bond"

To me it is quite clear. I take the words for their true meaning.

Old Friend  posted on  2009-01-27   10:03:51 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

The Jews brought forth Jesus which was a blessing to the entire world. Also show me somewhere where it says that modern Jewry is a curse. Because Romans chapter 11 says God will NEVER forget his covenant with the Jews and it is foolishness to think so.

God's covenant was with Abraham (who was NEVER A JEW) through Isaac (who was NEVER A JEW) through Jacob (who was NEVER A JEW) through the 12 Tribes of Jacob (AKA ISRAEL) of which ONE TRIBE WERE OF JUDAH, which tribe most Christians accurately believe were the ancestors of Jesus, who was a Judahite/Israelite for sure but may or may NOT have been a JEW).

I know you're freaking out because you are (like I was too at one time) so indoctrinated into group-think that you haven't noticed the geneology written in Matthew 1. (OR GENESIS 10:3 which when understood demonstrates that 90% of modern Jewry are not descendants of Abraham and therefore not entitled to inherit the promises made to Abraham including the LAND. JEWS ARE ASHKENAZIS not ISRAELITES 90% of the time).

Did Jesus not tell us that you may know the tree by its fruit. Do you really think Jesus came from the rotten tree of Babylonian Talmudism ??? The tree that slaughters innocent infants ? (Woe unto him that would hurt one of these little ones, for it would be better that a millstone be tied about his neck and he be tossed into the lake of fire).

I digress. Go to Matthew 1 and study the geneology through Judah, who thought he was buying a whore after sheering his sheep, but was actually responsible for impregnating his daughter-in law. She had twins (Pharez and Zarah) and this is noted relative only to this one set of twins, all other cases only noted the eldest son or heir. Ya gotta ask yourself why ? (The sons of Zarah are noted as writers of some Psalms and said to be as wise as Solomon). There is a lot of fascinating history related to the Zarah side of the family. (I'm not trying to write a history book though).

I know why ... but you need to know why. When Jacob (AKA Israel) blessed his sons, Judah was awarded the scepter (kingship) and the Law making authority over ALL OF THE TRIBES as his birthright. This is explained in Genesis (49:10). The question is this, and nearly impossible to know for a certainty, when the House of Israel and the House of Judah separated did a Judahite King take his place among the ten northern tribes as their King?

If you follow the geneology and the teachings of Christ himself, you cannot ignore the fruit of the tree admonishment. Good fruit comes from good trees, bad fruit from bad trees, it's that simple.

As close as I'm willing to commit myself to your belief that Jesus was in fact a Jew is to say he was definitely a Judahite/Israelite. God cannot lie, otherwise he wouldn't be God.

Also show me somewhere where it says that modern Jewry is a curse.

Ray Charles is dead and blind and he is able to see that modern Jewry are a curse. They've been expelled from 100 countries for their exploits. I know, someone told you that everyone was prejudiced against them, hated their religious beliefs, etc., ... if you believe that the entire world is made up of bigots that first allowed the "Jews" sanctuary from their claimed oppressors only to demonstrate their prejudice by expelling them, then your logic skills are challenged. The only other group to have suffered a similar fate are the Jesuits, also for good reason.

The world is perched upon the edge of a nuclear catastrophe because of events that have escalated in the middle-east ever since the "JEWS" invaded Palestine with the assistance of Britain and America. This cannot be considered a blessing in my book. The scam known as zionism is unadulterated fraud, perpetrated upon idiots by the masters of deceit. There is not one iota of evidence or proof to support this genocidal takeover or the claims upon which the fraud was originated.

If a thousand men were not to pay their tax bills this year, that would not be a violent and bloody measure, as it would be to pay them, and enable the State to commit violence and shed innocent blood.

Henry David Thoreau - 1849

noone222  posted on  2009-01-27   11:16:01 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

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