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Title: What are people doing about the cost of medical insurance?
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Published: Mar 11, 2007
Author: me
Post Date: 2007-03-11 10:26:59 by Jethro Tull
Keywords: None
Views: 2747
Comments: 72
My daughter and son-in-law are contemplating a move and a change in life style. They're in NJ and the corporate rat race is insane. Together they make good money, more than $120k, but they still find the cost of living here ridiculous. Their plan is to downsize and change careers. With a 2-year old son, their major concern is medical insurance. I can’t believe the quotes for private medical insurance they’re received. Two questions: 1) does anyone know a decent plan that isn’t a budget buster, and 2) what is the answer to this insanity? Thanks in advance for any suggestions.
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Here's the future of Health Care in the US, when the boomers are all 70 yo. If they smoke, do what I do. I used to pay for my own health insurance, but when cigarette taxes were raises to $2 or more a pack, to "cover the health expenses" we smokers cause the state, I figured I'd cost the state some health expeneses, and cancelled my insurance. Fuck em.
There is a first rate scam if there ever was one. That money is gone.
Oh, don't I know it. lol Get this, New York wants to raise the tax again because they are getting less and less money from it. I guess people are quitting, and now the fat pigs are used to having the revenue for the general fund.
Just what th insurance companies, doctors, and hospitals want you to beleive as the reason for high medical insurance costs and medical treatment costs. The real culprit is GREED plain and simple. We were all told to turn our thermostats down to a lower temperature to save natural gas/home heating oil and guess what. As we used less, the profits dwindled and we saw the doubling, trippling, and even higher prices. Price goughing!!!! This holds true for many othr products and services as well including auto insurance. Those in control are gonna get theirs| regardless of what we do. Afterall, doctors, hospital administrators, and insurance CEO's gotta have their big Mercedes, multi-million dollar homes, vacation hide-a-ways They are the elites or at least think they are. I believe they also see the high salaries of pro sports figures and somehow believe they are being shortchanged and opt to bankrupt the masses, the very same people who foolishly put those athletes on a pedistal and pay those exorbinant fees to attend sporting events. The average Joe Bagofdonuts is his own worst enemy. When the bottom finally falls outta everything and total bankruptcy becomes the norm, things may get better. Until then, as long as you got a buck in your pocket they'll find a way to get it from you. Now we can really see there is a real validity to the term sheeple in Amerika. Apparently we love getting sheard.
What is the title of that painting? "Homos in Hell"?
Maybe the one on the right is Andrew Cunanan? I read about him the other day, that was an extremely creepy story.
The insurance company didn't care, didn't know and paid the $650. Indeed it is a f'n racket. My mom had neck surgery a couple of years ago and they provided her with a neck brace. I just happen to be looking over the billing statements and notice they charged her $380 for this device. I went to the web and found I could buy the exact same brace for $49.95. Nope, the system is broken and something will have to be done as more and more employers are dropping coverage and the number of uninsured climbs.
I went to the web and found I could buy the exact same brace for $49.95. The system is just run this way. It's disgusting.
Victory means exit strategy, and it’s important for the President to explain to us what the exit strategy is. ~George W. Bush I have heard that this country is in debt, like a person who has maxed out their credit cards. If that is the case, then is our govt getting futher into debt, borrowing money from somewhere, spending money they don't really have to pay for this war and their many govt programs associated with their war on terror? I was confused the other day when Michael Reagan said that our economy is in great shape, better than ever. Because I know this whole war thing is costing a lot of money, though a select few such as armament and oil companies might be making some profit from it though they are private industry. I know Micheal Reagan is most likely lying, as neocons see nothing wrong with dishonesty and will tell the people anything to suit their agenda. Also this unemployment rate of 4.7% strikes me as odd, as there is so much competition for jobs and wages are very low. So what is going on? Is it true then that our country is in fact broke, and all this money is like spending credit cards, borrowing from somewhere, and if so, where? And what happens then when it can no longer continue? I just wonder what is going to happen. At least where I live there are jobs because no one in their right minds (except for non-conformists like me) would want to live in a place that has no amenities, and is not connected to the highway system. I have to wonder if the neocons are looting this country like the Oligarchs did to Russia under Yeltsin. And when it can no longer continue, then what? I guess it's good that I'm living this life-style now as I'm in practice for doing without a lot of material goods. We don't even have cell phones out here, and internet, dial-up is $50, high- speed internet is $100 a month, as is cable tv. So I have no tv and only dial-up internet. And as you know most the meat I get is salmon and moose which we get free from the land, and is much healthier anyway. I just don't understand how they can continue to spend so much money that apparently does not exist.
The murder in Chicago was right down the street from me. It's a complex of gray brick townhouses, with gated entrances about 15 feet high and the only access to the parking garage is cardkey access only. Pretty clear he was a trick of this guy, who was a big deal in Chicago's social circle. His wife still is. As for the "don't get sick" strategy, my brother tried that. He got mouth cancer, and it cost him $200K, everything he had, to get treatment. And that was only after surgeons gave him a big discount. He's going to be doing one guy's taxes for the rest of his life.
A lot of the 'equipment' in hospitals is just cheap plastic crap.
Yes, it is true. From the Federal Reserve. The FR is NOT part of our government, it is a privately owned banking corporation (foreign owned, no less). They print the "money" and government borrows it from them. Then our income tax proceeds (what's left after the expenses of running the tax collection agency are taken off the top) go directly to payment of interest on that loan. That interest is now so much that there is no way of even beginning to pay down the principal. Notice I put the word money in quotations above? The reason is because they aren't printing MONEY, they are printing Federal Reserve NOTES. There is a HUGE difference!!! By making the proclamation on each "bill" that it is a NOTE, they change the legal status of that instrument. I have explained this in several threads, but you may have missed it, so I'll re-explain it here (apologies to those that have seen this - I don't intend to be redundant, but I'm sure that there are those that have missed it): Let's say you write a note to the George (the owner of your local grocery store). The note says: You hand the note to Sally, and she runs to the store and gives George the note. George knows you, and that you're an honorable person; so he gives the milk and bread to Sally. Now Sally has the milk and bread, and is on the way back to your house with it. The correct answer (and what EVERY judge in the nation will rule) is (C), YOU are the legal owner. This is crucial to understanding the scam we are involved in. Since all our "money" is nothing more than a NOTE issued by the FR, the reality is that everything we (the agents) purchase with those notes is OWNED by the FED!!!!! Sure, they may allow us "use" of those purchases (equitable interest), BUT actual OWNERSHIP is solely theirs!!! What happens when this is no longer "sustainable" is that we're screwed. It's also why whenever possible, it's far better to use trade and barter as opposed to using FRNs.
No matter how noble the objectives of a government; if it blurs decency and kindness, cheapens human life, and breeds ill will and suspicion - it is an EVIL government. Eric Hoffer
Thanks for the explanation. The question remains, why are they doing this when they know it can only lead to major trouble? I sometimes think this country is being brought down on purpose, maybe that is the answer.
"Homos in Hell"? "Dante and Virgil in Hell", Virgil is the nearer of the onlookers, Dante is behind him.
Greed. In their eyes, we're nothing more than stepping stones to be used anyway they see fit in achieving their objectives.
No matter how noble the objectives of a government; if it blurs decency and kindness, cheapens human life, and breeds ill will and suspicion - it is an EVIL government. Eric Hoffer
"Homos in Hell"? "Dante and Virgil in Hell", Wish Diana could have named that painting - I like her name for it better...
No matter how noble the objectives of a government; if it blurs decency and kindness, cheapens human life, and breeds ill will and suspicion - it is an EVIL government. Eric Hoffer
Thanks for the feed back, guys. It seems lots of people are in the same boat, unfortunately. I've forwarded my daughter some info received here that will be helpful. Thanks again.
Catchy alliteration, I'll grant you that.
Consumers Reports evaluated different health insurance companies in their October 2001 issue - available at all public libraries - though 5 years old, the info about their top recommendations and why the companies were chosen as the top in HMO's ( for example) might still be applicable today. Consumers Reports have also done some shorter more up-to-date articles regarding health insurance - for example - http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/cu-press- room/pressroom/eng0509hlh.htm? resultPageIndex=1&resultIndex=7&searchTerm=health%20insurance "CONSUMER REPORTS® RATES HEALTH INSURANCE PLANS BASED ON HUGE READER SURVEY" CR Ratings and Recommendations: For HMOs, Kaiser Permanente, Northwest (OR,WA), and Capital District Physicians Health Plan (NY) topped our charts in this report as well as in 2003 and received consistently high marks for billing and customer service. For PPOs, Blue Cross Blue Shield plans dominate the top 10 as they did in 2003. Most of these plans had very good scores for choice of doctors. For more detail: http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/health-fitness/health-care/hmos-vs- ppos- 905/ratings/hmos/index.htm
Thanks scrapper. I'm nearly 100% certain any presidential candidate who dangles "Hillary Care" in front of the public in '08 will have a winning issue.
No kidding. Might suggest they look into Medical Savings accounts w/ a high deductable. Allow you to put up to 5250 $ into a nontaxed account to be used for medical issues. So you can reduce your taxable income by either the deductable amount up $5250, put that cash into an Medical Savings Account, whose income is NOT taxable. When you have a medical issue, you can withdraw that $$ for payment totally untaxed. The provisions for a medical issue are fairly liberal, eyeglasses, travel to recieve special treatment etc, but not cosmetic or choice treatments. If you are healthy for a few years, the $$$ in the MSA can easily overtake the high deductable of the policy. Also, by being in an insurance system you buy medical treatments wholesale rather than retail, as noted somewhere above. Prolly the best bet in the current enviroment.
Very cool information. I'm amazed at the overall information our members have regarding this, and other issues. Very, very impressive, not to mention helpful.
Yes, excellent recommendation - especially for younger families where everyone is pretty healthy. The only down side is keeping track of the paper trail - which is imperative. In fact, if your daughter is not too organized, Jethro, what with keeping track of a little on the go 2 year old, it would be wise to buy her a photocopy machine as a gift for the home if she and her husband choose this health savings account option, so she is sure to keep copies of every health bill for her family's records.
I've seen some county and city health insurance premiums that are extremely outrageous. As much as 40% of after-tax income.
my daughter is 23 and has health issues. I've been paying full price for doctors and medications for several years now. we live in alabama and blue cross/blue shield of alabama recently had what they called an *open enrollment* period where you could sign up for coverage for $167. a month. I was paying almost $200. a month for medicine and now I'm paying about $30. there is a $1000. deductible for doctor visits but we will meet that and then the savings will be significant. evidently the coverage goes on forever, until they or we terminate it. it's a really good deal, for us anyway. there is also a program here that covers children. we didn't live here when she was a minor, but my understanding is that all children are eligible, regardless of income.
That murder was the most brutal of all, it really spooked me to read about it, I didn't realize just how sadistic Andrew Cananan was, apparently they still don't know what motivated him, though it's never easy figuring out such people. I wondered whether they had known each other before, the article did say that man was a well-known Chicago real estate magnate. He was tortured badly, more so than the others he killed, as if there was a lot of rage especially for that man. The article didn't mention any possible prior relationship between the two but considering the ferocity and rage associated with that murder it did make me wonder.
Thanks kiki, I'll pass this on to my daughter. I've recently learned the leading cause of bankruptcy is unpaid medical care. The insurance situation is a total cluster...
OK DAMMIT, I've resisted for 2 days, and CAN'T any longer. THE ANSWER IS SCRIPTURE!!!!! There are ONLY 18 (count 'em folks) HEALTH Laws in Scripture. IF YOU'LL FOLLOW THESE 18 THINGS, YOU ARE GUARANTEED TO LIVE A HEALTHY LIFE FOR AT LEAST 70 YEARS!!!!! Why do you need insurance??? The Creator's promises aren't good enough?????? But you won't. It would mean you can't have bacon at breakfast, or shrimp for dinner. You can't screw the ol lady while she's on her period, or the "landscaper or milkman, or the hottie down the street" and you damn sure can't be enjoyin the hershey highway or playin lickety split (same gender respective) So the second best recommendation there is - go buy the most expensive health care available (you get what you pay for, and you're gonna need it).
No matter how noble the objectives of a government; if it blurs decency and kindness, cheapens human life, and breeds ill will and suspicion - it is an EVIL government. Eric Hoffer
Me too... Amazed that if someone survives "terminal cancer" for 29 years by rejecting "doctors' treatments" and treating it via Holistically and naturally - that others would even still consider doctors and their "treatments" over recommendations by the survivor. Follow the money trail. Who benefits??? How many "long term" cancer survivors do YOU know????? When it comes to "Big Brother", this forum is ALL (except BAC) are in agreement that it's a hoax. When it comes to "medicine" they don't see a hoax... Well, they may CLAIM to, BUT - lets see a raise of hands. WHO'S NOT BEEN TO THE DOCTOR IN THE LAST 5 YEARS?????? My guess is that about 2 hands raised. Perplexing. But I'm sure BAC and his ilk are in approval.
No matter how noble the objectives of a government; if it blurs decency and kindness, cheapens human life, and breeds ill will and suspicion - it is an EVIL government. Eric Hoffer
I'm happy (honestly) for you if your faith acts as your illness shield, but I don't buy a word written in the good book. My first name is Thomas so perhaps that explains the doubt I have regarding scripture. When god (I'll take anyone's version) sends a sign that is unmistakable, He'll get my attention. Until then it doesn't make a lick of sense that He has apparently gone fishing while the decent folks on His creation suffer the acts of madmen and fools.
Cunanan was a kept boy who was passed around by a ring of really wealthy, generally heavily closeted gay men, generally really old. Andrew felt they weren't taking care of him the way they promised. The murder of his roommate in Minneapolis, the first murder, was extremely brutal too. Lee Miglin, the guy he killed here, was a really well-known socialite. His wife still runs a very exclusive apparel store on Oak St., which was renamed Lee Miglin Way for a while. The prostitution ring evidently set these young guys up in business or got them really good jobs. Not to mention cash and presents. Cunanan may have thought one of them gave him AIDS, but I think, from the local coverage here, he was upset because others were getting more from these old men.
Here's a document written by an MD about pork, just in case God is on the back nine at the moment. http://www.giveshare.o rg/Health/porkeatdanger.html PORK — OR THE DANGERS OF PORK-EATING EXPOSED By J. H. KELLOGG M.D. GOOD HEALTH PUBLISHING COMPANY BATTLE CREEK, MICHIGAN 1897 Retypeset from the original 1897 edition. ABOUT THE AUTHOR John Harvey Kellogg was born in l852 in Livingston County, Michigan, to John P. Kellogg, a prominent member of the Seventh-day Adventist Church. Growing up in the Seventh-day Adventist Church, J.H. Kellogg was, quite naturally, interested in proper diet and health. This interest would not only lead to a degree in medicine, but a desire to travel around the world to learn from the best medical men of the day. But J.H. Kellogg developed another keen interest: he shunned many of the medical remedies of the time and sought to find natural cures for man’s ills. This, in turn, led to his understanding about preventive medicine. His unique program of preventive medicine and natural cures soon made Dr. Kellogg quite famous around the world: "Rich and poor, high and low, including royalty, came from far and near to be treated by him."1 Besides his advocacy of natural cures, Dr. Kellogg promoted vegetarianism. This led to his development of the corn flake and other breakfast cereals that still bear his name. "In addition to being an able physician and a famous surgeon he was also a great writer. He wrote more than 50 books, most of them large scientific works . . . He was also an interesting instructive lecturer on health and temperance and a good preacher."2 As a lifelong seventh-day Sabbath-keeper, Dr. Kellogg was well acquainted with the Old Testament and undoubtedly took very seriously the admonition of God not to eat pork. Additionally, he obviously understood the old addage that "you are what you eat." After reading the results of Dr. Kellogg’s research, few thinking individuals would want to have pig meat as a part of their bodies!3 [Dr. Kellogg remained a Sabbath-keeper all his life, but left the Seventh-day Adventist Church in 1907. He died in Battle Creek, Michigan, on Dec. 14, 1943.] PORK -- OR THE DANGERS OF PORK-EATING EXPOSED Pork-raising has come to be one of the great industries of this country; and since the supply is wholly regulated by the demand, it may be taken as a proper index of the prodigious quantities of swine’s flesh which are daily required to satisfy the gustatory demands of the American people. No other kind of animal food is so largely used as pork in its various forms of preparation. The Yankee makes his Sunday breakfast of pork and beans, while the same article is a prominent constituent of at least two meals each day during the remainder of the week. Pork and hominy is almost the sole element of the Texan farmer; while in the Western States pork and potatoes constitute the most substantial portion of the farmer’s bill of fare. The accompanying dish may be hominy, beans, or potatoes, but the main reliance is pork in each case. In the case of no other animal is so large a portion of the dead carcass utilized as food. It seems to be considered that pork is such a delicacy that not a particle should be wasted. The fat and lean portions are eaten fresh, or carefully preserved by salting or smoking, or both. The tail is roasted; the snout, ears, and feet are pickled and eaten as souse; the intestine and lungs are eaten as tripe or made into sausages; black pudding is made of the blood; the liver, spleen, and kidneys are also prized; the pancreas and other glands are considered great delicacies; while even the skin is made into jelly. In fact, nothing is left of the beast, not even the bristles, which the shoemaker claims. Surely it must be quite an important matter, and one well deserving attention, if it can be shown that an animal which is thus literally devoured, and that in such immense quantities, is not only unfit for food, but one of the prime causes of many loathsome and painful maladies. Let us examine the hog a little, and see what can be determined respecting his real nature, and his office in the economy of nature, if he has any. A Live Hog Examined Look at that object in a filthy mud hole by the roadside. At first, you distinguish nothing but a pile of black, slimy mud. The dirty mass moves! You think of a reptile, a turtle, some uncouth monster, reveling his Stygian filth. A grunt! The mystery is solved. The sound betrays a hog. You avert your face and hasten by, sickened with disgust. Stop, friend, admire your savory ham, your souse, your tripe, your toothsome sausage in its native element. A dainty beast, isn’t he! Gaze over into that sty, our pork-eating friend. Have you done so before? And would you prefer to be excused? Quite likely; but we will show you a dozen things you did not observe before. See the contented brute quietly reposing in the augmented filth of his own ordure! He seems to feel quite at home, doesn’t he? Look a little sharper, and scrutinize his skin. Is it smooth and healthy? Not exactly so. So obscured is it by tetter, and scurf, and mange, that you almost expect to see the rotten mass drop off as the grunting creature rubs it against any projecting corner which may furnish him a convenient scratching- place. As you glance around the pen, you observe that all such conveniences have been utilized until they are worn so smooth as to be almost inefficient. Rouse the beast, and make him show his gait. See how he rolls along, a mountain of fat. If he were human, he would be advised to chew tobacco for his obesity, and would be expected to drop off any day of heart disease. And so he will do, unless the butcher forestalls nature by a few days. Indeed, not long ago a stout neighbor of his was quietly taking his breakfast from his trough, grunting his infinite satisfaction, when, without a moment’s warning or a single premonitory symptom, his heart ceased to beat, and he instantly expired without finishing his meal, much to the disappointment of his owner, who was anticipating the pleasure of quietly executing him a few hours later, and serving him up to his pork-loving patrons. Suppose his death had been delayed a few hours, or rather, suppose the butcher had got the start of nature a little, as he generally contrives to do! But we have not yet finished the examination of our hog. If you can possibly prevail upon yourself to sacrifice your taste in the cause of science, pork- loving friend, just clamber over into the reeking sty, and take a nearer view of the animal that is destined to delight the palates of some of your friends, perhaps your own. Make him straighten out his fore legs. Now observe closely. Do you see the open sore or issue, a few inches above his foot on the inner side? Do you say it is a mere accidental abrasion? Find the same on the other leg; it is rather a wise and wonderful provision of nature. Grasp the leg high up and press downward. Now you see its utility, as a mass of corruption pours out. That opening is the outlet of a sewer. Yes, a scrofulous sewer; and hence the offensive, ichorous matter which discharges from it. Should you fill a syringe with mercury or some colored injecting fluid, and drive the contents into this same opening, you would be able to trace all through the body of the animal little pipes communicating with it. What must be the condition of the body of an animal so foul as to require a regular system of drainage to convey away its teeming filth? Sometimes the outlet gets closed by the accumulation of external filth. Then the ichorous stream ceases to flow, and the animal quickly sickens and dies unless the owner cleanses the parts, and so opens anew the feculent fountain, and allows the festering poison to escape. What dainty morsels those same feet and legs make! What a delicate flavor they have, as every epicure asserts! Do you suppose the corruption with which they are saturated has any influence upon their taste and healthfulness? Perhaps you are thoroughly disgusted now, and would like to leave the scene. Pause a moment. Now let us look at the inside of this wonderfully delicious beast! A Dead Hog Examined Do you imagine that the repulsiveness of this loathsome creature is only on the outside? That within everything is pure and wholesome? Vain delusion! Sickening, disgusting, as is the exterior, it is, in comparison with what it covers, a fair cloak, hiding a mass of disease and rottenness which grows more superlatively filthy as we penetrate deeper and deeper beneath the skin. What Is Lard? Just under the foul and putrid skin we find a mass of fat from two to six inches in thickness, covering a large portion of the body. Now what is this? Lard, says one; animal oil; an excellent thing for consumptives; a very necessary kind of food in cold weather. Lard, animal oil, very truly; and, we will add a synonym for disease, scrofula, torpid liver. Where did all that fat come from, or how happened it to be so heaped up around that poor hog? Surely it is not natural; for fat is only deposited in large quantities for the purpose of keeping the body warm in winter. This fat is much more than is necessary for such a purpose, and is much greater in amount than ever exists upon the animal in a state of nature. It is evidently the result of disease. So gross have been the habits of the animal, so great has been the foulness of its body, that its excretory organs--its liver, lungs, kidneys, skin, and intestines--have been entirely unable to carry away the impurities which the animal has been all its life accumulating. And even the extensive system of sewerage with its constant stream, which we have already described, was insufficient to the task of purging so vile a body of the debris which abounded in every organ and saturated every tissue. Consequently this great flood of disease, which made its way through the veins and arteries into the tissues, and there accumulated as fat! Delectable morsel, a slice of fat pork, isn’t it? Concentrated, consolidated filth! Then the fatter the hog, the more diseased he is? Certainly. A few years ago, there were on exhibition at the great cattle show in England a couple of hogs which had been stuffed with oil cake until they were the greatest monsters of obesity ever exhibited. Of course they took the first premium; and if a premium had been awarded to the animals which were capable of producing the most disease, it is quite probable that they would have headed the list still. Lard, then, obtained from the flesh of the hog by heating, is nothing more than extract of a diseased carcass! Who that knows its character would dare to defile himself with this "broth of abominable things?" Disgusting Developments Now let us take a little deeper look, prepared to find disease and corruption more abundant the deeper we go. Observe the glands which lie about the neck. Instead of being of their ordinary size, and composed of ordinary gland structure, we find them surrounded by large masses of scrofulous tissue. Perhaps tuberculosis degeneration had already taken place. If so, the soft, cheesy, infectious mass is ready to sow broadcast the seeds of consumption and premature death. For, according to some excellent authorities, tuberculosis disease is capable of communication by means of tubercles. If the animal is of sufficient age, the further process of ulceration will have occurred. Now take a deeper look still, and examine the lungs of this much-prized animal. If he is more than a few months old, you will be likely to find large numbers of tubercles. If he is much more than a year old, you will be more likely than not to find a portion of the lung completely consolidated. Yet all of this filthy, diseased mass is cooked as a delicious morsel, and served up to satisfy fastidious tastes. If the animal had escaped the butcher’s knife a few years, he would have died of tuberculosis consumption. But what kind of a liver would you expect such an animal to have? Is not excessive fatness one of the surest evidences of a diseased and inactive liver? —infallible! Then a fat hog must have a dreadfully diseased bile manufactory. Make a cut into its substance. In seventy-five cases out of a hundred you will find it filled with abscesses. In a larger percentage still will be found the same diseased products which seem to infest every organ, every tissue, every structure of the animal. Yet these same rotten, diseased, scrofulous livers are eaten and relished by thousands of people who cannot express their contempt for the Frenchman who eats a horse or the China man who dines upon fricasseed puppy. Now just glance at the remaining contents of the abdomen. In every part you notice evidences, unmistakable, of scrofula, fatty degeneration, and tuberculosis masses. Where Scrofula Comes From The word scrofula is derived from the Latin scrofu, which means a sow. The ancient Romans evidently believed that scrofula originated with the hog, and hence they attached the name of the beast to the disease. Saying that a man has scrofula, then, is equivalent to saying that he has the hog disease. After we have seen that the hog is the very embodiment of scrofulous disease, can any one doubt the accuracy of the conclusion of the Romans who named the disease? Origin of the Tapeworm We shall attempt to trace the history of this horrid parasite only so far as concerns its introduction into the human system. With this end in view, let us glance again at the diseased liver. It will be no uncommon thing if we discover numberless little sacs, or cysts, about the size of a hemp seed. These do not present a very formidable appearance, certainly; but as soon as they are taken into the human stomach, the gastric juice dissolves off the membranous sac, and liberates a minute animal, which had been lurking there for months, perhaps, awaiting this very opportunity. This creature, although very small, is furnished with a head and four suckers, attach themselves firmly to the wall of the intestine, and the parasite begins to grow. In a short time an addition to its body is produced posteriorly, attached like a joint. Soon a duplicate of this appears, and then another, and another, until the body attains a length of several yards. Not infrequently tapeworms measuring thirty to one hundred feet in length are found in the intestines of human beings. Under some circumstances the eggs of the tapeworm find entrance into the body, when the disease is developed in another form. The embryonic worms consist of a pair of hooklets so shaped that a twisting motion will cause them to penetrate the tissues after the fashion of a corkscrew. Countless numbers of these may be taken into the system, since a single tapeworm has been found to produce more than two million eggs. By the boring motion referred to, which seems to be spontaneous in the young worm, the parasites penetrate into every part of the body. Penetrating the walls of the blood vessels, they are swept along in the life-current, thus finding their way even to the most delicate structures of the human system. They have been found in all the organs of the body, even the brain and the delicate organs of vision not escaping the depredations of this destructive parasite. When this lively migrating germ gets fully settled in the tissues, it becomes enveloped in a little cell, and remains quiet until taken into the stomach of some other animal, when it is liberated, and speedily develops into a full- grown tapeworm, as already described. But although quiet, the imprisoned parasite is by no means harmless. The cysts formed often attain such a size as to endanger life. When developed in the eye, they occasion blindness; in the lungs or other organs, they interfere with the proper functions of the organs; in the liver, which is the frequent rendezvous of these destructive creatures, a most serious and fatal disease known as hydatids is occasioned by the extraordinary development of the cysts, which are originally not larger than a pea, but by excessive growth assume enormous proportions. The same disease may occur in any other part of the body in which the germs undergo development. The germs of these dreadful animals are found not only in the liver, but in other organs as well. Pork containing them is said to be "measly." Sometimes the condition is discovered; but that such is not always the case is evidenced by the fact that tapeworm is every year becoming more frequent. It has long been common in Germany. In Iceland it has become extremely common. In Abyssinia the occurrence of the worm has become so frequent, owing to the bad dietetic habits of the people, that it has been said that every Abyssinian has a tapeworm. In this country the parasite is most common among butchers and cooks. Some time since, we received from a friend in the South a specimen of pork which was so densely peopled with the germs of this dreadful parasite that every cubic inch of flesh contained more than a score of them. The writer has in his microscopical cabinet specimens of the embryonic worms taken from hydatid tumors of the liver of a patient who died of the disease in Bellevue Hospital, New York. The poor victim who is forced to entertain this unwelcome guest suffers untold agonies, and finally dies, if he cannot succeed in dislodging the parasite. The Terrible Trichina Now, my friend, assist your eyesight by a good microscope, and you will be convinced that you have only just caught a glimpse of the enormous filthiness, the inherent badness, and the intrinsic ugliness of this loathsome animal. Take a thin slice of lean flesh; place it upon the stage of your microscope, adjust the eyepiece, and look. You will see displayed before your eyes hundreds of voracious little animals, each coiled up in its little cell, waiting for an opportunity to escape from its prison walls and begin its destined work of devastation. An eminent gentleman in Louisville has made very extensive researches upon the subject, and asserts that in at least one hog out of every ten these creatures may be found. A committee appointed by the Chicago Academy of Medicine to investigate this subject reported that they found in their examinations at the various packing-houses in the city, one hog in fifty infested with trichina. Other investigations have shown a still greater frequency of the disease. A few years ago I obtained a small portion of the flesh of a person who had died from trichina poisoning. Upon subjecting it to a careful microscopical examination with a good instrument, I discovered multitudes of little worms. Each individual presented the appearance shown in the accompanying accurate engraving. The animal is there seen enclosed in a little cyst, or sac, which is dissolved by the gastric juice when taken into the stomach. The parasite, being thus set at liberty, immediately penetrates the thin muscular walls of the stomach, and gradually works its way through the whole muscular system. It possesses the power of propagating its species with wonderful rapidity; and a person once infected is almost certain to die a lingering death of excruciating agony. In Helmstadt, Prussia, one hundred and three persons were poisoned in this way, and twenty of them died within a month. It is doubtless not known how many deaths are really due to this cause; for many persons die of strange, unknown diseases, which baffle the doctors’ skill both as to cure and diagnosis. Trichinosis very much resembles various other diseases in some of its stages, and is likely to be attributed to other than its true cause. It is thought by prominent medical men that hundreds of people die of the disease without suspecting its true nature. Pork Unclean Have we not seen that a hog is nothing better than an animated mass of physical defilement? Few who have seen the animal will dispute that his filthiness is a most patent fact. How wise and sanitary, then, was the command of God to the ancient Jews: "It is unclean unto you. Ye shall not eat of their flesh nor touch their dead carcass." Although it may not be said that this law still exists, and is binding as a moral obligation, it is quite plain that the physical basis upon which the law is founded is as good today as at any previous period. Could it be proved that the hog had kept pace with advancing civilization, and had improved his habits, we might possibly feel more tolerance for him; but he is evidently just as unclean as ever, and just as unfit for food. Adam Clarke, when once requested to give thanks at a repast of which pork constituted a conspicuous part, used the following words: "Lord, bless this bread, these vegetables, and this fruit; and if thou canst bless under the gospel what thou didst curse under the law, bless this swine’s flesh." The Mohammedans, as well as the Jews, abstain entirely from the use of pork. Such is also the case with some of the other tribes of Asia and Africa. Evil Effects of Pork-Eating At the head of the list we place scrofula. How almost universally it abounds. How few are entirely untainted by it. How do chronic sore eyes, glandular enlargements, obstinate ulcers, disfigured countenances, unsightly eruptions, including the long list of skin diseases, all proclaim the defilement of the blood with this vile humor. So, too, do the vast army of dwarfed, strumose, precocious children tell the same story. Erysipelas, too, a dreadful scourge, owes more to pork than to any other predisposing cause. Leprosy, that terrible disease, so common in Eastern countries, and now beginning to show itself upon our own shores, is thought by many to be largely attributable to pork-eating. "Biliousness," a name which covers nearly every bad condition for which no appropriate name can be found, is notoriously the result of pork-eating. This is the main reason why so many people complain of biliousness in the spring, after gorging themselves with fat pork all winter. The liver is overworked in attempting to remove from the system such a mass of impurity as is received in the eating of pork. It consequently becomes clogged, congested, torpid. Then follow all the ills consequent upon the irritating effects of the accumulation of biliary matters in the blood. The skin becomes tawny and jaundiced. The kidneys are overworked. Perhaps fever results. A partial clearing out then occurs, which enables the individual to pass along for a time again until some epidemic or contagious disease claims him as its lawful victim. Consumption is another disease which is not easily separable from pork-eating. In fact, scrofula is its great predisposing cause. The narrow chests, projecting shoulders, thin features, and lank limbs of so many young boys and girls are evidence of a consumptive tendency, of which a scrofulous diathesis is the predisposing cause. Dispepsia, that malady of many forms, frequently results from the use of pork, especially when fat and salted or smoked pork, one of the most indigestible of foods, is used. Pork requires between five and six hours for its digestion, while wholesome food will digest in half that time. This is the reason for the notion that salt pork is an excellent thing to "stick by the rib." Tapeworm, we have already mentioned as the result of eating measly pork. It is a very difficult disease to cure, and often baffles the best medical skill for many years. Few ever detect the cysts in the flesh of the hog unless their attention has been directed to the matter. Trichinae produce in man an incurable disease. No remedy can stay the ravages of the parasite. All pork-eaters are in constant danger; for the worm is too small to be seen without the aid of the microscope. However, this disease is not nearly so formidable as the others named; for it is not so common, neither does it entail any weight of suffering upon posterity. Apologies For Pork-Eating Examined On every hand we are met by all sorts of excuses for continuing to make swine’s flesh an article of diet in spite of the striking evidences of its dangerous character. Let us examine a few of the most common of these apologies, and test their value. Pork is Necessary as a Heat-forming Food in Winter — Are there not plenty of more healthful animals than hogs to supply all the animal fat necessary? Certainly there are; and, better still, we have the various grains and farinaceaous vegetables, which are abundantly sufficient to furnish all the heat required by man in any latitude. Our Fathers and Grandfathers Ate Pork, and yet Lived to very Old Age — Ah! yes, my good friend, and you are suffering the penalty of their transgressions. You may not be aware of it yet; but more than likely your old age will not be so free from ills as was theirs. And quite as probably you may even now see in your children the results of your own, as well as your fathers, disregard of the dictates of sound sense in feasting upon the hog. Their frequent sore eyes, sore mouths, tetter, crysipelas, and other eruptions, are all evidences of the scrofula which they have inherited. Neither can you urge the plea, "Pork does not hurt me." No man ever became a drunkard who did not make the same excuse for liquor. You may not feel it now; but the future will expose your delusion. The Hog is Cleanly if You Give Him a Chance to Be so — It is surprising to us that any one who knows anything of the real nature of a hog can make such an assertion. Who has not seen hogs wallowing in the foulest mire right in the middle of a green, fragrant clover pasture? The dirty creature will turn away from the nicest bed of straw to revel in a stagnant, seething mud hole. If one of his companions dies in the lot or pen, he will wait until putrefaction occurs, and then greedily devour the stinking carcass. The filthy brute will even devour his own excrement, and that when not unusually pressed by hunger. The hog is by nature a scavenger, and is especially adapted for that purpose. Let him pursue his natural hunger. Sufficient Heat Will Kill the Trichinae and Incipient Tapeworms — Surely, dead worms cannot kill any one; but it must be delightful for the pork-eater to contemplate his ham or sausage with the reflection that he is partaking of a diet of worms. The Frenchman sometimes eats earthworms; the African relishes lizards; and one philosopher so far overcame his natural prejudices as to eat spiders. "How disgusting!" you say, and you shut your eyes and swallow a million monsters at a meal, because they are cooked and so cannot bite. The louse-eating Patagonian cannot equal that. But it should be remembered that in order that the parasite should be killed, every part of the meat must be subjected to a heat of at least 2l2° which is quite difficult to do, and is seldom accomplished. A whole family was poisoned by eating pork-chops, which were well cooked upon the outside. What Shall We Do With the Hog? Stop raising him. Turn him loose. He will soon find his place, like the five thousand which ran down into the sea in the days of Christ. If he must be raised, use him for illuminating our halls and houses. Lubricate our car and wagon with his abundant fat. Do anything with him but eat him. It would be dangerous to adopt the principle that we must devour everything which is in the way, or which cannot be otherwise utilized. Adam Clarke thought of one appropriate use to make of the hog. He said that if he was going to make an offering to the devil, he would employ a hog stuffed with tobacco. Reader, what will you do? Can you continue to use as food such an abominable article as pork, and in so doing run so many risks as you must do? And if you decide that the animal is unfit to claim a place upon your own table, can you conscientiously raise and sell him to your neighbors’ injury? Cases of Trichina Poisoning The reported cases of death from this terrible cause have become so frequent that we are no longer startled by them. Ten years ago the description of the death of a person literally infested with worms, and tortured to death by their inroads upon the system, would have excited feelings of the deepest horror; but these accounts have now become so common that little interest is shown in them, and death from this cause is one of the regular causes of additions to the mortuary list. Nevertheless, the disease is divested of none of its real horrors by its common occurrence. No one is safe; any one who uses swine’s flesh as food in any form is liable to the disease. Salting, smoking, and the other ordinary means of curing pork do not destroy the parasite. A few years ago, Dr. Germer, health officer of Erie, Pa., was sent for in haste to see a patient who was supposed to be suffering from the cholera. He hastened to the bedside, and found a whole family sick with the symptoms much resembling those of cholera, though the season was then midwinter. Suspecting the possible cause, he secured a specimen from the pork barrel, and hastened to his office. Upon making a careful microscopic examination, he found myriads of the loathsome parasites in every part of the flesh examined. The writer prepared numerous microscopic specimens of the worm in various aspects from a portion of the infected meat kindly furnished by the doctor. These have been shown to hundreds of persons who were skeptical respecting the existence of such a pest. In this case the hog had been fattened on the premises, having been purchased when quite young by the owner, a German, from a drove of hogs which passed through the city. It was known that, previous to the purchase of the hog, two of the drove had died on the road, and had been devoured by their scavenger companions. No doubt the deaths were the result of trichinosis; and by devouring the victims the whole herd became infected. It would be difficult to estimate what an amount of suffering and death was entailed by the consumption of this great herd of trichinous hogs. Several members of the German family died, together with several of the neighbors. Those who survived the acute stages of the disease escaped only to linger out a painful existence in the chronic and incurable state of the malady. Some three years later the writer received a specimen of pork from a gentleman in Wisconsin who requested an examination of the same, stating that he procured it from the pork barrel of a neighbor whose family were suffering from a disease which the doctors called cholera infantum. Several of the children had died, and other members of the family were still dangerously ill. The pork had been suspected and examined, but no trichinae were found by the observers, though several physicians had inspected it. Upon making a careful microscopical inspection of the specimen, it was found to be alive with young trichinae. If you "EVER" eat Pork again you will at least know that it's suicidal.
This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come. For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy, Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good, traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God;
God isn't on the back nine. He's been missing for the last 2,000 years or so the tale goes. I come from a long line of pork eaters and we're in rather remarkable health. My dad reached 90 and mom is still around at 93, albeit slowing down fast. That said, serve me up the bacon. The only other person I remember warning me about pork was Michael Schwartz and he died early in a non- related pork incident.
http://www.mum.org/kellogg1.htm
Trichinosis has been virtually wiped out in the U.S. There have been hogs found with the disease, but they were being fed garbage, which is a bad idea. If they get vegetarian feed, there is no danger.
hell, we're all gonna go shooting it out with the tyrants attempting to haul us off to the galags long before the pork gets us, so eat, drink, and be merry while you can! ;)
Of all the things out here to fret about, a ham on rye is
very low on my list.
La dolce vita! Pass me the Italian hot sausage, a few less years on this prison planet sounds wonderful.
Ok, but I gotta have a cigarette with my drink !!!
This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come. For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy, Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good, traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God;
I read about a healthy dog in its 20s who has been feed an all veggie (high protein) diet.
Victory means exit strategy, and it’s important for the President to explain to us what the exit strategy is. ~George W. Bush 
#33. To: Jethro Tull (#0)
(Edited)
I don't want to be a martyr, I want to win! - Me
#34. To: Critter (#33)
raises to $2 or more a pack, to "cover the health expenses" we
#35. To: tom007 (#34)
I don't want to be a martyr, I want to win! - Me
#36. To: who knows what evil (#10)
A CFO of a local hospital once told me that he was of the opinion that 85 PER CENT of the "patients" that come to the emergency room could have treated their maladies at home. You are correct that many are just seeking attention from someone they perceive as an "expert".
#37. To: tom007 (#32)
#38. To: tom007 (#32)
#39. To: tom007 (#2)
He couldn't believe it, called the insurance company and told them $100 was more than fair for the procedure.
#40. To: Brian S (#39)
they charged her $380 for this device.
(About the quote: Speaking on the war in Kosovo.)
#41. To: tom007 (#31)
The future. Basically being put on the US credid card. So much for the "conservative" republicans.
#42. To: Diana (#38)
Maybe the one on the right is Andrew Cunanan?
#43. To: Brian S (#39)
I went to the web and found I could buy the exact same brace for $49.95.
Remember...G-d saved more animals than people on the ark. www.siameserescue.org
#44. To: Diana (#41)
So what is going on? Is it true then that our country is in fact broke,
and all this money is like spending credit cards, borrowing from somewhere, and if so, where?
I just don't understand how they can continue to spend so much money that apparently does not exist.
George, please let Sally (your neighbor) get a gallon of milk and a loaf of bread for me, and I'll pay you for it the next time I'm in the store.
Diana
Legal question - at this given moment in time, who is the legal owner of the milk and bread? Is it:
(A) George, since he has not yet been "paid" for the goods?
(B) Sally, since she is the one in possession of the goods at the moment?
(C) You, since you are the one that made (or issued) the note?
George USED to be the owner, but relinquished his rights of ownership when he accepted the note and gave the goods to Sally.
Sally is merely an agent acting on YOUR behalf. Granted, she may have some "equitable interest" in the goods (you may give her a quart of the milk for her going after it), but it doesn't legally belong to her.
You are the legal owner. You are the issuer of the NOTE - the "promise to pay".
#45. To: innieway (#44)
#46. To: Diana (#37)
What is the title of that painting?
#47. To: Diana (#45)
why are they doing this
#48. To: tom007 (#46)
What is the title of that painting?
#49. To: All (#0)
#50. To: innieway, diana (#48)
Wish Diana could have named that painting - I like her name for it better...
#51. To: Jethro Tull (#49)
#52. To: scrapper2 (#51)
#53. To: Jethro Tull (#52)
m nearly 100% certain any presidential candidate who dangles "Hillary Care" in front of the public in '08 will have a winning issue.
#54. To: tom007 (#53)
#55. To: tom007, Jethro Tull (#53)
Might suggest they look into Medical Savings accounts w/ a high deductable. Allow you to put up to 5250 $ into a nontaxed account to be used for medical issues. So you can reduce your taxable income by either the deductable amount up $5250, put that cash into an Medical Savings Account, whose income is NOT taxable.
#56. To: robin (#21)
or state or county govt, so they have reasonably priced insurance?
#57. To: Jethro Tull (#0)
#58. To: Mekons4 (#42)
The murder in Chicago was right down the street from me. It's a complex of gray brick townhouses, with gated entrances about 15 feet high and the only access to the parking garage is cardkey access only. Pretty clear he was a trick of this guy, who was a big deal in Chicago's social circle. His wife still is.
#59. To: kiki (#57)
#60. To: Jethro Tull (#0)
2) what is the answer to this insanity?
#61. To: Jethro Tull (#54)
(Edited)
I'm amazed at the overall information our members have regarding this,
#62. To: innieway (#61)
(Edited)
#63. To: Diana (#58)
I wondered whether they had known each other before, the article did say that man was a well-known Chicago real estate magnate. He was tortured badly, more so than the others he killed, as if there was a lot of rage especially for that man.
#64. To: Jethro Tull (#62)
He has apparently gone fishing while the decent folks on His creation suffer the acts of madmen and fools.
#65. To: noone222 (#64)
(Edited)
If you "EVER" eat Pork again you will at least know that it's suicidal.
#66. To: noone222 (#64)
(Edited)
About your source, Dr. Kellogg.
Vegetarianism, "natural foods," anti-smoking, etc.:
Plain Facts for Old and Young:
Embracing the Natural History and Hygiene of Organic Life,
by J. H. Kellogg, M. D. (1892, Burlington, Iowa, U.S.A.)
IntroductionDr. John Harvey Kellogg was the staff physician at the Battle Creek Sanitarium, Battle Creek, Michigan, U.S.A., for many years, an advocate of vegetarianism (the Kellogg in Kellogg's corn flakes is his), foe of smoking and a respected surgeon. You might have seen the American movie about him. He passionately advocated enemas, as you will read here and there in these excerpts, and I wonder if he isn't one of the inspirations for the "high- colonic" fad in the U.S.A. He was maybe half a quack, but who can say today what will be seen as silly tomorrow?
He even more than the other authors on this site despised masturbation, even resorting to operating on a 10-year-old girl to stop her habit (as you will read, he betrays his doubts about whether he should have done it or not). He epitomizes the anti-masturbation mania.
By the way, read the whole book here in html form. Isn't the 'Net great - when it works?
I jump into the middle of the masturbation discussion; most of it repeats what Dr. Pierce and others, in the links above, have to say.
I trimmed the margins of the pages to speed down load.
SarahAnne Hazlewood generously donated this book to the museum.
NEXT
What characterizes children as masturbators? - effects of masturbation in females - cure - how to behave during menstruation - American social customs tend to evil; moon-light rides; fast girls - Men take improper liberties; getting a husband; old maids better than "helpless, good-for- nothing, sickly wives"
NEXT
What characterizes children as masturbators? - effects of masturbation in females - cure - how to behave during menstruation - American social customs tend to evil; moon-light rides; fast girls - Men take improper liberties; getting a husband; old maids better than "helpless, good-for- nothing, sickly wives"
#67. To: Jethro Tull (#65)
#68. To: Jethro Tull, noone222, innieway (#65)
#69. To: Mekons4 (#67)
Trichinosis has been virtually wiped out in the U.S.
#70. To: christine (#68)
#71. To: christine (#68)
so eat, drink, and be merry while you can! ;)
#72. To: Mekons4 (#67)
(About the quote: Speaking on the war in Kosovo.)
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